English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Xanne

00:12

The Russians need to learn to take either the elevator or the stairs.

Robusto

01:38

@jlliagre Number agreement not working.

Laurel

02:00

@Robusto He means "read a thousand books"

Robusto

Ha, I read it as "teen books" ... ya know, the Young Adult category.

Today's generation is so selfish, because everything is "meme" ...

And here I am trying to debug some code that works perfectly on one page but fails on an identical page. Everything else is the same. I hate coding sometimes.

Clearly the event listener is not getting attached. But why is the same code attaching it on the other page then?

Well, back to the piano then.

Laurel

03:12

@Robusto That's only a difference of a factor of 10

alphabet

So I've lost a few pounds & seem to be doing well on my new modi-milk diet. I get lunch at work & have milk for breakfast and dinner. Drinking about 1/3 of a gallon a day.

I have truly discovered the secret to health.

tchrist

Lactism: Whitely lording it over the lacto-challenged peoples of the Earth.

alphabet

I have entered lactosis.

tchrist

Try listerine.

alphabet

Question: if your main food source is milk, do you get hungry or just thirsty?

Truly a puzzle.

tchrist

03:27

Only hungry; water slakes your thirst but not your hunger.

alphabet

It's also surprisingly cheap. If you live on milk it's like $5 a day max.

tchrist

03:42

Imagine drinking anything but milk with a peanut-butter and jelly sandwich.

Cerberus

Is that all your eat in a day?

I hope you get enough vitamins and minerals from your work luncheon.

How many litres of milk do you drink each day?

tchrist

He said a third of a gallon.

Rather than a quart. :)

I leave converting thirds to quarts as an exercise for the reader.

Cerberus

Oh I thought that was a type of jerrycan or similar in this context.

tchrist

No, it's the standard measurement for milk. Four quarts to a gallon. And a quart is a liter. In America. The UK uses different measurements because they were trying to cheat us.

Cerberus

03:58

So it is 4 litres?

And 1/3 of that is 1.3.

That is slightly more than I drink.

tchrist

mac(tchrist)% units gallon liter
	* 3.7854118
	/ 0.26417205
mac(tchrist)% units gallon/3 liter
	* 1.2618039
	/ 0.79251616
mac(tchrist)% units gallon/4 liter
	* 0.94635295
	/ 1.0566882

@Cerberus Same.

mac(tchrist)% units gallon quart
	* 4
	/ 0.25

Cerberus

But I drink fatless milk.

tchrist

Just as well.

Cerberus

Yeah.

tchrist

Ours comes as 0% or 1% or 2% or full 3.3% or whatever it is.

Cerberus

04:02

And I have heard actual researchers say that those who drink lots of milk are at an increased risk of getting Parkinson's.

Probably also milk products.

So he advised to drink 'biological' milk, which is milk with much less pesticide in it.

So that is what I have been doing.

There is 'strong evidence', though not yet proof, of the conexion.

tchrist

Consuming less pesticide is a good thing.

The butterflies in your stomach will thank you.

Regular milk is about $3 per gallon. "Organic" is usually two to three times that.

Cerberus

This profession-researcher mentioned specifically milk.

Not vegetables, because the concentration in milk is far, far higher. The cow concentrates it.

tchrist

Yep.

alphabet

Whole milk here isn't real whole milk. Actual from-the-cow whole milk is IIRC closer to 4% milk fat. Here they just reconstitute it with an arbitrary percentage around 3.25%

Actually, it turns out that only low-fat milk is linked to Parkinson's: ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5496517

Of course this is probably some sort of spurious correlation, but who knows

Cerberus

Hmm have we had that discussion before?

Or do I have a déjà-vu?

alphabet

04:08

Not about Parkinson's I don't think

But I have tried to sell people on the health benefits of high-milk diets

tchrist

Basing point

A basing point is a geographical site used to establish minimum fluid milk prices for federal milk marketing orders. Generally, minimum fluid farm milk prices increase according to the distance from the basing point. When federal milk marketing orders began in the 1930s, Eau Claire, Wisconsin was viewed as the principal surplus milk production region in the nation and hence served as the basing point for most milk priced under federal milk marketing orders. Generally, the further a region is from the Upper Midwest, the higher that region's minimum price for fluid farm milk. Some have argued that...

alphabet

Can (adult) raccoons drink milk? I assume not, because they don't have lactase persistence

tchrist

They'd try.

It would not agree with them.

Same with adult cats and dogs.

alphabet

Fair enough. Have you tried the all-trash diet?

tchrist

One of my cats likes a little bit of ice cream or cottage cheese now and then, and he will drink the milk left in my cereal bowl when I'm done.

He'll even eat cheese.

I figure he's trying to make his breath smell more enticing to the mice.

> There’s an old adage in the dairy industry that “only five people in the world know how milk is priced in the U.S. – and four of them are dead.” Milk pricing regulations in Federal Milk Marketing Orders (FMMO) are among the most complicated commodity pricing regimes across all of agriculture.

alphabet

04:12

Yep. The milk diet is only possible because of federal subsidies

tchrist

I imagine that in Europe, just as with gasoline, there their milk costs as much for a quart as it does here for a gallon.

alphabet

Although they have that shelf-stable UHT kind, don't they? I'm guessing that that makes it cheaper to distribute

Cerberus

The cheapest milk at my supermarket.

90 cents for a litre of skinny milk.

What do you pay?

tchrist

It's about $3/gallon or so, maybe $3.50. So close to the same.

I don't buy it by the quart because it's more expensive that way.

alphabet

Huh. Here a gallon is closer to $5-6

Cerberus

04:25

Interesting.

And this includes 6% VAT.

alphabet

@Cerberus So that's about $1/liter, $4/gallon

tchrist

@alphabet Organic, sure.

Cerberus

@alphabet But it includes tax.

tchrist

Oh, you're farther from Eau Claire. :)

@Cerberus You pay tax on fresh produce? That's evil.

Cerberus

6% on all food.

Why evil?

The state needs money.

tchrist

04:28

Bullshit. It's evil to demand tax for fresh food.

People have to live.

Grocery taxes by state.

alphabet

Cerberus

An odd approach to government.

alphabet

My local supermarket. That's the cheap brand

Downtown boston has a rather high cost of living

No sales tax on it, though

tchrist

alphabet

Lucky you.

tchrist

04:30

You pay tax for restaurant food and things like prepared food at the deli. You do not pay tax on raw materials.

That would be evil and wrong.

Candy and pop are taxed.

> Colorado – grocery items are exempt from state tax, though local areas can levy a tax. Also, certain items are taxable, including carbonated water, chewing gum, seeds and plants to grow food, prepared salads and salad bars, cold sandwiches, deli trays, candy, soft drinks and hot/cold beverages served in unsealed cups through a vending machine.

> Wisconsin – grocery items are tax exempt, though some snack foods are excluded from this exemption.

It is abnormal to tax grocery items in this country.

alphabet

There's actually a cheaper brand for $4.69/gallon but I demand quality. I'm not shelling out for the organic stuff though.

Cerberus

Not so much odd as random, one might say.

tchrist

> Maryland – grocery items are tax exempt

Massachusetts – grocery items are tax exempt

Michigan – grocery items are tax exempt

Minnesota – grocery items are tax exempt

alphabet

The organic milk here is $12/gallon. (Or rather $6 per half-gallon.)

For $14/gallon (!!) you can get milk from grass-fed cows

tchrist

I can't understand why your milk costs the double of ours.

alphabet

04:37

Technically the cheapest brand here is $4.69/gal but I want the better of the non-organic brands

tchrist

The cheapest here in like $2.50/gallon.

alphabet

I suspect it's because real estate here is expensive, so the cost of owning a store is high, and that gets passed on to consumers

tchrist

You could subscribe to the milkman.

Cerberus

Do you taste any difference between milks, apart from the fat percentage?

alphabet

There actually is a dairy business around here that does that, i.e. delivers you fresh milk daily. I don't think they do it for apartment complexes, though, it's a whole system

@Cerberus I actually do taste a difference. There's one brand around here (Garelick Farms) that is utterly disgusting

tchrist

04:40

Growing up we always had milk delivered, but not daily. Here you can sign up for it, but I have not.

alphabet

Hood is good, though a bit sweeter than the others

tchrist

Local example.

Cerberus

@alphabet Odd.

tchrist

It's home delivery, not just for institutions.

Cerberus

They taste the same here. It's just milk.

alphabet

04:41

Maybe you haven't done a detailed comparison of different brands, like I have

tchrist

Here's another Colorado home delivery service.

alphabet

@Cerberus Do you have the UHT milk that can be stored on shelves unrefrigerated? IIRC that's common in Europe but not in the US

tchrist

@alphabet Not tasty.

alphabet

@tchrist Here they sell it in those chocolate milk things (cartons?) parents send their kids to school with. The chocolate covers up the burnt taste.

Cerberus

@alphabet It exists, sterilised milk.

But nobody drinks that.

Does it tasted burned to you?

alphabet

04:46

"Sterilized" milk is something completely different here, that's milk that's been heated so much it turns a weird color

I'm guessing you mean what we'd call UHT milk

Yeah it tastes off

Cerberus

No idea, we call it sterilised, as opposed to regular milk, which is pasteurised, I believe.

tchrist

Sounds right.

Cerberus

It looks just like normal milk, but the flavour is just slightly meh.

I wouldn't call it burned, though.

tchrist

What is shelf-stable milk?

alphabet

@Cerberus Yeah, here that's usually called "UHT milk" or "UHT pasteurized."

MetaEd

04:49

Wordle 741 4/6

⬛🟨🟨🟨⬛
⬛⬛⬛⬛🟨
🟩🟨🟨⬛🟨
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

tchrist

The cartons we got as kids twice a day at school were simple half-pints, not UHT.

Got an extra milk ration outside lunch. Can't remember what that was called.

Cerberus

I know nothing about abbreviations.

alphabet

^ I'm talking about those things. They're UHT. Good for packing in kids' lunchboxes. Usually sold in big boxes.

UHT = Ultra High Temperature (pasteurization)

tchrist

The dairy delivered the half-pint cartons every day to schools. Kept cold.

"Milk break".

So you'd usually get a full pint of milk at school each day, one cup for the milk break and another at lunch.

> The School District of Reedsburg participates in the Wisconsin Milk Day Program which provides free milk break milk for Elementary and Intermediate students

Still happens.

Seems to be $0.40 per 8-oz carton now in my home town.

So weird to see it also in Spanish now. There were no Spanish speakers in the school system 50 years ago.

alphabet

Only in Wisconsin

tchrist

04:59

No, Iowa has it too, still.

And Illinois.

Some reports that Oregon and Washington may still have school milk breaks.

Google up "which states still have milk break in schools?".

PA, VT.

There must be federal money involved.

MN.

> The Minnesota Kindergarten Milk Program (MKMP) is a state-funded program that provides cash reimbursement for milk at a rate of 20 cents per half-pint per day ...

Dairy states may have state moneys involved. Unclear.

That's what they look/looked like. Oh how cute, it's even in metric.

Xanne

06:59

The left coast, especially the San Francisco Bay Area, seems to be enthusiastic about plant-based milk, especially almond milk. It seems to have a longer shelf life. And it makes you feel virtuous.

@Mitch The archival work, four brutal days, has been to figure out how some of the National Security Decision Directives were developed during the early Reagan Administration. The directive on U.S. goals and plans for responding to a Soviet first strike surprised me.

But then it turned out the NSDD was based in good part on a couple similar ones in the (earlier) Carter Administration. Continuity here, with an NSDD that gets revised every few years.

My interest was finding out how and how much the President himself interacted in this sort of policy development. So I learned a lot.

I managed four days of reading docs under strict rules. Quite a lot is still classified, and I filed some declassification requests, which are slow—maybe years to get a response.

Wordle 741 3/6

🟨⬜⬜⬜⬜
🟩⬜⬜🟨⬜
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

Finally a bit of fun that turned out well.

CowperKettle

07:44

OMG. The 6 yo boy who "got lost" and was searched by hundreds of volunteers, was really beaten by a large metal shoehorn by his adoptive mother, and then died. She hid the body in a garage, and announced him lost. e1.ru/text/criminal/2023/06/30/72448637

jlliagre

13:26

@Laurel Right. Mine flow like an arroyo though.

2 days ago, by jlliagre

tchrist

@Xanne "Milk of the poppy, Lord Varys?"

jlliagre

Wordle 741 5/6

⬜⬜⬜⬜🟨
⬜🟨⬜🟩⬜
🟨⬜⬜🟩🟨
🟩🟩🟩🟩⬜
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

Daily Quordle 522
8️⃣5️⃣
7️⃣4️⃣
m-w.com/games/quordle/

Robusto

13:46

@Laurel I nominate it for the National Order of Magnitude Award then.

jlliagre

Daily Octordle #522
🔟3️⃣
5️⃣🕚
🕛9️⃣
8️⃣4️⃣
Score: 62

Robusto

#Worldle #525 1/6 (100%)
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩🎉
⭐⭐
https://worldle.teuteuf.fr

🌎 Jun 30, 2023 🌍
🔥 15 | Avg. Guesses: 4.46
🟨⬜🟥🟥🟩 = 5

globle-game.com
#globle

Wordle 741 4/6

🟨⬛⬛⬛⬛
🟩🟩⬛🟨⬛
🟩🟩🟩🟩⬛
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

Daily Quordle 522
6️⃣8️⃣
4️⃣3️⃣
m-w.com/games/quordle/

jlliagre

14:04

#Worldle #525 1/6 (100%)
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩🎉
⭐🏙️
https://worldle.teuteuf.fr

🌎 Jun 30, 2023 🌍
🔥 1 | Avg. Guesses: 6.32
🟨⬜🟨🟧🟥🟥🟩 = 7

globle-game.com
#globle

Robusto

@jlliagre I hate these. My strategy for approximation and triangulation puts me in the right area quickly, but then there are too many choices within a small area.

Daily Octordle #522
9️⃣3️⃣
4️⃣7️⃣
🕚🔟
8️⃣🕛
Score: 64

jlliagre

@Robusto Yes. I was lucky to guess it. I didn't even know that country existed before I played these games.

Robusto

My knowledge of geography was pretty good before starting these games, but it's gotten really good over time.

Michael Rybkin

14:35

Please tell me if these sentence sound fine to your ears:

The two oxidation-reduction reactions listed above only occur when electrical charge can be transported through the external circuit. The additional, open-circuit reaction can be observed by the formation of bubbles at the zinc electrode under open-circuit.

Robusto

14:53

@MichaelRybkin Fine, but take out the comma after "additional."

Michael Rybkin

15:03

@Robusto Thank you very much for your help.

CowperKettle

15:31

Curio

15:55

<<All those journals I filled with an eye towards stand-up comedy...but you were telling the truth!>>

What does this sentence mean?

jlliagre

16:56

> Oh, Miles. All the times I called you delusional and mocked you to my friends behind your back, all those journals I've filled with an eye towards stand-up comedy…but you were telling the truth! I'm so sorry. You're the best son any father could dream of having.

Vikas

#Worldle #525 1/6 (100%)
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩🎉
https://worldle.teuteuf.fr

CowperKettle

17:39

55 yo woman had been thinking that she was dead and in Heaven. After some medical tests, she was brought back to Earth with the help of dialysis. psychiatrist.com/pcc/psychiatry/…

Dialysis removed the excess of 9-carboxymethoxymethylguanine from her system.

The only compound known to elicit Cotard delusion en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9-Carboxymethoxymethylguanine

MetaEd

@CowperKettle I am sure I will be dead. Does that count?

CowperKettle

@MetaEd No, with Cotard delusion, you must be sure that you are already dead

MetaEd

@CowperKettle sometimes in a movie a person is fatally injured and they say something intelligent like "you have killed me" or "I'm a dead man walking"

given that I know I will die of being human, I could say with reasonable accuracy that I am already dead but just haven't stopped breathing yet

Are you saying I can't put Cotard delusion on my resume?

Robusto

19:33

@CowperKettle What a bummer, to be in heaven and then to be "brought out of it."

But it would be interesting to see if she figured it out by herself. "Wow, I expected a little more from heaven, to be quite honest. Don't tell St. Peter, mind you, but ..."

MetaEd

20:13

@Robusto When your brain activity is that screwed up by chemistry or trauma you probably can't figure yourself out of it.

Robusto

@MetaEd But there might be signs. "Ow, that dog just bit me!"

Robusto

20:57

Liberal Redneck - Boo, SCOTUS, Boo

►

MetaEd

21:29

@Robusto All dogs go to Heaven

Robusto

21:40

@MetaEd But do they bite when they get there?

MetaEd

22:27

@Robusto Of course they do. Dogs get to do what they love in Heaven.

Just as I'll get to spend eternity telling Dad Jokes. And driving everyone crazy.

s.H.a.R.p.R.i.F.t

22:39

A Happy Independence day weekend! Incidentally, LGBTQ people are welcome in Canada. If you want to build a life where you can hire a graphic designer and not risk them denying you of your equality rights with the complicity of a backward SC, it is the place. I'm afraid members of the LGBTQ community are less equal in rights than the African-Americans already are in the U.S. A shame.

alphabet

22:56

@s.H.a.R.p.R.i.F.t I'm glad I'm in a liberal city; not too many homophobic web designers here. The decision is annoyingly vague; I'm not sure how it's going to be applied and interpreted.

s.H.a.R.p.R.i.F.t

@alphabet Maybe mixed mariages are next, who knows. The conservatives from that court are just corrupt.

That breed of christianity will be kept in check in Canada, that much is clear.

But it's important for people to return to grassroots politics and make a difference and not let a theocracy emerge in the guise of nationalism. Anyways.

If that's what Americans want then so be it.

alphabet

23:12

@s.H.a.R.p.R.i.F.t One would hope that they were imposing unpopular opinions on the public, but actually polls showed people were evenly split on the issue. Ideally people would support LGBT rights of their own volition and this wouldn't be an issue.

Robusto

23:26

@MetaEd Your heaven would have me getting bitten by dogs? Hmm ... that's a hard pass.

@alphabet Don't worry. This Court is fine with handing down ad hoc decisions in support of any religious bigotry at any opportunity.

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English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…