English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Matt Эллен

13:00

lol whut?

July 2012 India blackout

The July 31, 2012, India blackout began at 1:05 pm local time in India, affecting 22 states . This was the second consecutive failure in as many days. The previous one occurred on 30 July 2012, beginning at 2:35 am local time with power being restored by 4pm. The blackout was the biggest ever power failure in human history affecting over 600 million people. The power has been restored to parts at around 5:30 PM Local time. Cause At 1.05PM IST 31st July 2012 the Northern Power Grid failed, allegedly, due to a fault at Agra near Delhi. In the weeks leading up to the failur...

oh, it's been edited back into shape

Cerberus

@RegDwightАΑA They probably just added up all people in regions that were out of power.

I don't see a huge problem there getting semi-reliable numbers?

RegDwight АΑA

@Cerberus yeah like they did with Olympics, ending up with 4bn people watching the Opening Ceremony (official numbers).

Cerberus

That is much harder to measure.

We have fairly reliable census numbers.

And the reach of a power outage is usually easy enough to establish.

RegDwight АΑA

Their reliable census has only just begun, some two years ago.

Cerberus

Make it +/- 50 million, then.

RegDwight АΑA

13:04

They don't know how many people are in a particular street right now. If you multiply that by the number of streets, you might as well just go with 4bn and hope nobody notices.

Cerberus

You mean live or happen to be in?

RegDwight АΑA

@Cerberus yeah I think 10% is a fair assessment of the deviation, even in countries such as Italy.

@Cerberus both.

Cerberus

I believe such statistics are about where people live and nothing else.

@RegDwightАΑA I find that a bit hard to believe. But anyway, 10 % is reliable enough.

RegDwight АΑA

The thing is, it's been only a couple hours since the outage, and it covers half a country, and they already have an estimate? Without computers, just using abacus? Why is the census taking years, then?

That's all I'm saying.

KitFox

How many states in India?

Cerberus

13:07

If you look at Wikipedia, you will see that most cities and regions have population numbers that have been estimated earlier.

KitFox

Take the percentage of states and multiply it times the population. There's your estimate.

Cerberus

You just add up the regions affected.

Jez

I think the Indian power companies need to do the necessary. ;-)

RegDwight АΑA

@Cerberus exactly. Thin air.

Cerberus

How is that step thin air?

Matt Эллен

13:08

is it because thick air requires deuterium?

RegDwight АΑA

Because adding up estimates gets you less precision, not more.

Cerberus

In any case, what does it matter whether it's 600 or 700 million people?

RegDwight АΑA

It's a different number.

Cerberus

In the case of Italy, I don't believe the margin would be nearly as large.

RegDwight АΑA

But if the number doesn't matter, then why feed it to news agencies in the first place?

Cerberus

13:10

@RegDwightАΑA It's still loads more people than in other outages.

RegDwight АΑA

@Cerberus which is exactly what I'm saying.

Cerberus

It's still the majority of the subcontinent.

RegDwight АΑA

Please, do read what I say.

KitFox

"lots of people without power"

Cerberus

@RegDwightАΑA Because an estimate is interesting. I want to know whether it's closer to 200 million or 600 million. And you can see that they took a safety margin of +/- 5 million people, probably.

@KitFox In my country, that would be like 4000.

RegDwight АΑA

13:12

@Cerberus what does it matter whether it's 200 or 600 million people?

(Your own question.)

Cerberus

It matters a great deal.

Because it's thrice as many.

RegDwight АΑA

It's just a number. It means nothing.

Cerberus

It does to me and many readers.

RegDwight АΑA

Most readers can't tell 600 billion from 600 thousand.

Matt Эллен

too many zeroes to contend with

Cerberus

13:13

There. Many, then.

RegDwight АΑA

Cerberus keeps giving people too much credit today.

Matt Эллен

600,000
600,000,000,000

Cerberus

I really have no idea what you are arguing about.

RegDwight АΑA

I am not arguing at all.

You are.

This is déjà vu all over again.

Cerberus

So you have no opinion at all about the numbers as presented. Good.

RegDwight АΑA

13:14

I make a simple statement, you keep asking questions until you don't understand anything anymore.

Cerberus

Your position seems to be that mentioning any number in a newspaper or Wikipedia article is meaningless and useless.

I found that odd.

RegDwight АΑA

No.

MetaEd

@RegDwightАΑA Nice marks.

RegDwight АΑA

That is not my position.

Cerberus

Then you should have explained yourself better!

MetaEd

13:16

There is no mentioning any number in this chat.

RegDwight АΑA

I have. With my very first statement, which I intended to be my last.

Sonic The Hedgehog

Cerberus

I thought we were agreed on 10 % being a reasonable margin of error for India.

But then you went on.

Well, never mind.

We probably have nothing to disagree on now.

RegDwight АΑA

@Cerberus I didn't go on. I explained the same thing again in more simple words, because that's what you kept insisting on, and still are, ending with "That is all I am saying".

Cerberus

All right, then.

Sonic The Hedgehog

13:18

Dang it, I can't decide who to vote for!

cries

All those people...

RegDwight АΑA

It's only the primaries. You have a couple more days to decide.

Cerberus

If you're looking for someone crazy to vote for, you are in luck.

Sonic The Hedgehog

@reg Thats the problem.

Cerberus

There is a clear candidate.

Sonic The Hedgehog

You?

Cerberus

13:19

No.

I'm not participating.

Sonic The Hedgehog

Why didn't you?

Matt Эллен

@SonicTheHedgehog in the primaries you vote for everyone!

RegDwight АΑA

@SonicTheHedgehog in that case, just come back in 6½ days. Then you'll only have a couple minutes to make your mind up. That'll save you 6½ days of decision making.

Matt Эллен

it's only in the election you need to worry

Sonic The Hedgehog

@Matt ...wait.

I thought this was official voting phase?

Matt Эллен

13:21

it's an official voting phase

RegDwight АΑA

Just not the last one.

Sonic The Hedgehog

I'm no good at politics.

Matt Эллен

this narrows down the candidates from 11 to 10

Sonic The Hedgehog

hmm..

RegDwight АΑA

@SonicTheHedgehog it's okay. I can pay you to get better at it.

Matt Эллен

13:21

vote up the ones you want kept and down the ones you want gone, and not at all the ones you don't care either way about

Sonic The Hedgehog

@Reg for sometime now, I couldn't get minecraft premium account because of my parents.

@Reg you could bribe me with minecraft account.

XD

@Matt Ah, I see.

RegDwight АΑA

See. Vote for change, and you will have two minecraft accounts delivered right to your doorstep, overnight express.

Sonic The Hedgehog

@Reg so who do I vote for in that case?

RegDwight АΑA

Jul 12 at 12:23, by RegDwight ΒВB

You vote for change.

Sonic The Hedgehog

@Reg Ah, you sly you...

Matt Эллен

13:24

you get a sock of pennies to the head

Sonic The Hedgehog

change != change.

@Matt be careful.

RegDwight АΑA

No, АΑA != AAA, but change == change.

KitFox

Stupid fire drill.

Sonic The Hedgehog

@Matt I could decide not to vote you.

Matt Эллен

stupid fire

RegDwight АΑA

13:24

@KitFox I thought you drill wells, not fires? confused

Matt Эллен

@SonicTheHedgehog that would be a vote for change

Sonic The Hedgehog

Vernon Dursley has a company for drills.

shrugs

Blame him.

@Reg From eyeballing that picture, I detect 5 dollars at least.

RegDwight АΑA

@SonicTheHedgehog see, vote for 5 dollars, get two Minecraft premium accounts.

It's a win-win.

Sonic The Hedgehog

@Reg but two minecraft accounts equals about 54 dollars.

:(

RegDwight АΑA

Sonic The Hedgehog

13:28

@Reg I meant minecraft the GAME.

Stop being so real.

RegDwight АΑA

Sonic The Hedgehog

Stop! I hate pictures of lemon cars!

RegDwight АΑA

Them's melons, not lemons.

Sonic The Hedgehog

lemons, as in useless cars.

Those cars are in no doubt useless.

RegDwight АΑA

Melons, as in Russ Meyer.

Sonic The Hedgehog

13:30

Lemons!

RegDwight АΑA

@SonicTheHedgehog those cars star in movies. You do not. That makes you even more useless than them.

imdb.com/title/tt2027140

Sonic The Hedgehog

@Reg Idc if they star in movies.
They are useless.

RegDwight АΑA

They work. Unlike you, again.

Or myself.

Robusto

"The Town Hall Chat will take place on Thu, August 2nd, at 1:00Z UTC" ... uh, what is that in Fahrenheit?

Matt Эллен

it's about 3 hours into my sleep

Robusto

13:33

Take an Ambien. You'll sleepwalk through the whole thing.

RegDwight АΑA

@Robusto read on for EDT or click the link for other timezones.

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA But I want it in Fahrenheit.

RegDwight АΑA

@Robusto I could add that nugget of wisdom but it would get cut off.

tchrist

"1:00Z UTC" is redundant and redundant.

RegDwight АΑA

I already had trouble fitting Cerberus in.

tchrist

13:35

@RegDwightАΑA Next time, cut off a few heads first.

Robusto

@tchrist I can only add that it is also redundant.

RegDwight АΑA

Noob. I could add way more than that.

Matt Эллен

is that a cat dressed as a banana?

JSBձոգչ

look! it's a cat! and it's eating a banana!

Matt Эллен

or a tooth?

Robusto

13:39

A clearer picture of pure evil I haven't seen.

Don't make me bring out the sparkles.

RegDwight АΑA

That's because there are no pictures of me.

Robusto

Seriously. Sparkles. I've got 'em. You don't want 'em.

RegDwight АΑA

Exactly. Wir kommen nicht ins Geschäft.

Robusto

Keine Wirtschaftsgelegenheit?

RegDwight АΑA

Take your bees nest elsewhere.

Robusto

13:42

There weren't any b's in that sentence. Also, no nests.

RegDwight АΑA

So you already started doing what I asked you to. Suits me fine.

What is a for doing in there? Hmpf.

Robusto

Watch it, or I may start camel-casing compound nouns. Then you'll be sorry.

RegDwight АΑA

Watch it, or I will start camel-casing yOu!

Robusto

You can't camel-case mE!

Matt Эллен

mmmm camel casing

RegDwight АΑA

13:45

@Robusto how do you make that backwards ∃?

Ш? Nope.

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA By holding it up to a mirror, silly. Duh.

RegDwight АΑA

Щ? W? Ц?

Robusto

You seem to have spilled a bowl of Cyrillic Oats. Perhaps you need help to sweep them up?

Matt Эллен

∄

RegDwight АΑA

т

Robusto

13:46

@MattЭллен That is a notty response.

The cow says μ.

Get a hunch and β bunch.

RegDwight АΑA

O, Me, Ga!

Robusto

The Greeks were masters at δ blues.

I η peanut-butter sandwich. And some π.

Matt Эллен

mmmm blue screen of death flavoured

Robusto

ρ, ρ, ρ your boat!

4

Matt Эллен

lol

Robusto

13:53

See? I have successfully out-sillied @RegDwightАΑA. And all it took was a handful of letters. Who knew such a thing was possible?

tchrist

@Robusto Who ν?

Robusto

@tchrist I の, right?

KitFox

fucking hell.

The meeting is tomorrow.

Matt Эллен

what's up @Kit?

oh

KitFox

Now I look like a crazy person.

Robusto

13:56

@KitFox That's not my impression of hell.

RegDwight АΑA

Oh, now...

KitFox

Because the only one around to ask was the dean.

Matt Эллен

@Robusto what about fucking hell?

Robusto

@MattЭллен See, I don't think they allow fucking in hell. Except if you're religious, and then you're catching, not pitching.

Matt Эллен

if there is a way to make fucking hellish...

KitFox

13:58

oh there is.

Robusto

I dunno ... the worst I ever had was better than the best church service I ever attended.

tchrist

@Robusto Bottom of the 9th

Matt Эллен

@KitFox I'm sure he's already forgotten about it

Robusto

@tchrist +1. I love it when people make witticisms involving baseball and Dante.

KitFox

pouts And now what am I gonna wear?

Fucking was 7th circle though.

Well, 2nd.

But sodomy on the 7th.

IIRC.

tchrist

14:00

Both top and bottom then?

Robusto

►

KitFox

@Robusto Thanks, that makes me feel better.

Robusto

Nevermind.

KitFox

@tchrist Depends how you feel about tempests and burning plains.

Why are laptop speakers always on the bottom?

punches laptop designers

tchrist

@KitFox The burning pains would be from bottoming.

KitFox

14:02

Only if you are doing it wrong.

Matt Эллен

laptop designers reel back in agony, cursing their lack of forethought

RegDwight АΑA

0

Q: Meaning of "native" as it is used on U.S. Census Bureau's website

I am trying to gather some data for use at work and I am a little confused on the meaning of the word native as is used on this page of the U.S. Census Bureau's website: http://factfinder2.census.gov/faces/tableservices/jsf/pages/productview.xhtml?pid=ACS_06_EST_S0601&prodType=table does it...

Gen-ref.

"How do I use website X?"

Matt Эллен

indede. the answer points to the glassary

Robusto

BTW, someone tell @GraceNote that the phrase is "by the bye," not "by the by."

Matt Эллен

fkc spleing

RegDwight АΑA

14:05

4

A: What is the origin of the phrase ‘By the by...’?

I found the first entries during history, not the exact origin of the expression, unfortunately. They are around the 17th Century. by the by (earlier by a by, on or upon the by): by a side way, on a side issue; as a matter of secondary or subsidiary importance, incidentally, casually, in pass...

2

A: "By the Bye": Etymology and Usage

According to Etymonline, by with the sense of secondary course as opposed to main course comes from Old English. This is also the meaning of the second by (also spelled bye) in the phrase by the by, which dates from the 1610s. This link shows that by the way is a lot more common than by the by.

Dupes, btw.

Matt Эллен

rooo rorarized?

0

Q: What does the waitress tell to Don in this "Mad Men" video?

I would like to know what the waitress tells to Don Draper in this video. It looks like she is flirting with him but I don't understand what she tells him. First she tells him something (I cannot understand). He is surprised. Then she tells him he is sitting here alone for a long time and asks i...

listening

Robusto

Actually, neither phrase exists, as this NGram clearly shows.

Matt Эллен

I believe that google ngrams is having troubles today

I got a similar result with something else I was searching

KitFox

@MattЭллен Off topic.

Robusto

@MattЭллен It always has troubles. Why should today be any different?

tchrist

14:09

@Robusto It’s full of sound and fury, ...

Robusto

You hear the call of the Faulkner. Or MacBeth.

tchrist

More like a tale told by an idiot, signifying nothing.

RegDwight АΑA

@Robusto learn to read graphs. Clearly both lines GO TO 2000!

Robusto

But nothing is an important concept! Computers would be impossible without zeroes. And neither would Comic-Con!

Matt Эллен

becaUSE comic-con uses lots of computers

Robusto

14:12

@tchrist Is this a dagger I see before me, its handle toward my hand?

@MattЭллен Immediate disqualification for faulty use of camel-casing.

Spent camel-casings. Just imagine the damage those camels did to their targets.

Matt Эллен

cAmElCaSiNg Is WhErE CApitALisE some of the letTERS

Robusto

See? Innocent people are getting hurt!

I think would-be moderators should have to explain their views on camel-casing. makes note to ask in election chat

RegDwight АΑA

I think all answers should be transliterated in Hiragana and Greek.

Robusto

What, no русский?

tchrist

non potest legi

E2文字化け

KitFox

14:22

I can't type fast enough to do that.

Oh. Oh, I see.

sad panda

Robusto

@tchrist Well, this is The Incomprehensible Room, so unintelligible sequences of letters (mojibake) are allowed.

tchrist

@Robusto Seems like a pretty comprehensive statement to me, and thus ipso facto offtopic.

Robusto

Damn. Epic fail.

Also, at the risk of making a cogent statement in here, I think you mean comprehensible, not comprehensive.

RegDwight АΑA

@Robusto んΩ, そρι.

Robusto

ん never begins a word.

RegDwight АΑA

14:26

Exactly.

Robusto

Wow, all my posts are getting phantom-jinxed for a few seconds. Or else I'm seeing double.

RegDwight АΑA

English words are also transcribed using Katakana, not Hiragana.

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA The comprehensibility ship has sailed. Why aren't you on board?

RegDwight АΑA

I am. You just use the wrong point of reference. You often do. Must be a curse. I am very sorry for you.

Robusto

You mean you are ebbing toward me?

RegDwight АΑA

14:30

That's ebbing stupid.

tchrist

/me towardses Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA s/b/f/g

Robusto

Put a little more power into your ebbing:

Richard von Krafft-Ebing

Richard Freiherr von Krafft-Ebing (full name Richard Fridolin Joseph Freiherr Krafft von Festenberg auf Frohnberg, genannt von Ebing) (14 August 1840 – 22 December 1902) was an Austro–German psychiatrist who was born in Mannheim in Baden, Germany. He was the author of the seminal work Psychopathia Sexualis. Krafft-Ebing studied medicine at the University of Heidelberg, where he specialized in psychiatry, and later practiced in psychiatric asylums. After leaving his work in the asylums, he pursued a career in psychiatry, forensics, and hypnosis. Principal work Krafft-Ebing's principal ...

RegDwight АΑA

@tchrist wow thank you! So many joke decomposers in this chat today!

First Rob, now you!

I am thrilled!

Robusto

Said the original joke deconstructor.

tchrist

@Robusto Guy was on a Power Trip.

RegDwight АΑA

14:32

@Robusto Exactly. Thank you for explaining that.

What is this, the International Explanation Day?

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA You are the joke deconstructor, Mr. Torrance. You have always been the joke deconstructor.

Matt Эллен

14:44

@RegDwightАΑA no, that was on October the 1st last year

RegDwight АΑA

Right. Last year we still had October. Now it's eternal September.

Matt Эллен

oh ye gods, dunnae remind meh

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA And yet, ironically, Oktoberfest could conceivably go on forever.

@MattЭллен BTW, have the Olympics inconvenienced you yet?

Matt Эллен

@Robusto only during the torch relay, not since yet

so, only before they started

ignoring any tax burden I may have accrued

Robusto

Haha, ignore away. It will avail you naught.

cornbread ninja

14:55

@RegDwightАΑA this is why you should help with my flat tyre. Why else am I paying you $54/year?

I even spelled it Britishly.

Matt Эллен

then you misspelled £54

cornbread ninja

@MattЭллен truth.

More like £108.

Matt Эллен

What kind of terrifying orc head would I be if I lied?

cornbread ninja

@MattЭллен all the more terrifying.

Matt Эллен

:D

cornbread ninja

14:57

Oh; I linocut a lowercase 'k' in the meantime, but I shall cut your head soon enough.

Robusto

it's funny, but if you lose £100 in England nobody compliments you on how much thinner you look.

4

RegDwight АΑA

@cornbreadninja you should have spolen it tyre♭, then I might (might!) have offered help.

cornbread ninja

@RegDwightАΑA noted.

RegDwight АΑA

@Robusto but why is it funny? Please explain.

You have four minutes. Commie mutant won't wait.

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA Joke deconstructions can't be forced. They are like a delicate, exotic fruit. Touch it, and the bloom is gone.

tchrist

14:59

@Robusto orchidectomized

Robusto

Ouch.

RegDwight АΑA

@Robusto in which variety of English is a "please explain" aptly described as forcing?

cornbread ninja

@tchrist phalaenopsisized.

Robusto

@RegDwightАΑA You're so strict.

RegDwight АΑA

I am a literal.

Robusto

15:01

Hello, literal. I am a variable. I could contain you, but I probably won't.

2

RegDwight АΑA

Little do you know.

tchrist

@RegDwightАΑA You should be well-quoted then.

RegDwight АΑA

@tchrist I am the wellest quoted here.

Search the transcript.

tchrist

@RegDwightАΑA How profound.

cornbread ninja

I AM STATIC FINAL.

RegDwight АΑA

15:02

You have to be pro found in order to be quoted.

Robusto

Self-references don't count.

Matt Эллен

@cornbreadninja I look forward to it

RegDwight АΑA

Twenty seconds.

cornbread ninja

@MattЭллен I'll have to get some green ink.

Robusto

No fair using super-powers in chat.

RegDwight АΑA

15:03

@Robusto you should have ranned for mod.

tchrist

waits for it

RegDwight АΑA

Commie mutant! Ouvert et haut !

Robusto

I am Nuance. I don't do anything so overt.

RegDwight АΑA

No, not overt. Ouvert.

Robusto

Hmm ... something about oeuvre ...

tchrist

15:05

œuvre

Robusto

When you hit a French chicken in the stomach, does it say oeuf ?

Matt Эллен

eggs? you want your eggs sunnyside up?

Robusto

Is there any other kind?

tchrist

@Robusto That’s un œuf out of you there, or we’ll bring back the orchidectomizations.

Robusto

Sacre merde!

Matt Эллен

15:06

@Robusto I didn't want to poach the subject, but yes

tchrist

@Robusto Try less gruyère.

Gigili

Umm, none of the starred messages make sense to me.

Robusto

But even if you have les oeufs, you still can't make an hommelette with them.

Gotta go stretch. AFK.

Matt Эллен

@Gigili then we're safe!

tchrist

2 \N{GREEK SMALL LETTER RHO}, \N{GREEK SMALL LETTER RHO}, \N{GREEK SMALL LETTER RHO} your boat! - 1h ago by Robusto
I \N{HIRAGANA LETTER NO}, right? - 1h ago by Robusto
Who \N{GREEK SMALL LETTER NU}? - 1h ago by tchrist

Gigili

15:09

Nice!

tchrist

@Robusto That particular Homini bus left a long time ago.

KitFox

15:24

So I said "screw it" today. I'm having peanut butter pie and bbq chips and soda for lunch.

Because I can.

Matt Эллен

Yumm!

KitFox

Are you going to make it to chat today?

Matt Эллен

I am not. I am trying to find someone to take over this free lance work I'm doing, so I'll be elsewhere, I'm afraid

tchrist

@MattЭллен Jousting at the tourney, no doubt.

KitFox

@MattЭллен Oh, oh, I'll do it!

Matt Эллен

15:27

@tchrist Yes, well, These lances won't mend themselves

@KitFox OK!

tchrist

@MattЭллен His sword was long, his lance was keen. His shining helm afar was seen.

Matt Эллен

they need a bunch of Arduino stuffs done by the end of the week

I said, given the speed I'm working at, it will take me 8 weeks. I also said there's probably someone better qualified to do it

KitFox

A bunch of what stuffs now?

Matt Эллен

so we're going to visit ox hack this evening

@KitFox oh, just some firmware for Arduinos

parsing UDP packet, writing data to pins and such

KitFox

I was being silly.

Matt Эллен

15:30

I know :D

I was being dead pan

KitFox

Is that where you put your cadavers? Like a chamberpot is where you put your etymologic tome? And a pie pan is where you put your pie?

This peanut butter pie is so good.

Matt Эллен

KitFox

I'm not sure I get it...

Matt Эллен

oh. Well, I guess homestar runner isn't so popular anymore

►

KitFox

Oh, I'm just old.

Matt Эллен

15:44

Time to jet. SEEE YA

KitFox

@MattЭллен BAI!

15 minutes to weekly Writers chat

The Overlook Hotel

General discussion for writing.stackexchange.com. Writing exer...

For anyone who is interested.

You don't have to be a writer to chat.

cornbread ninja

@KitFox I had another look, and I had a cup of tea and a butter pie

@KitFox I understand there is a weekly exercise. I'm interested in that.

KitFox

@cornbreadninja Well, come on over then.

The Overlook Hotel

Transcript for

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…