@RegDwigнt I use a splash of cream to kill the acidity. Brioche works for that as well. But, yeah, I usually get your basic 500-600 ml dose in the morning.

@Mitch I wanna link to something that sums it up but I can't seem to find anything not already drowned in emotional banter and clutter

Long story short, there seems to a push towards being 'welcoming' ever since the welcoming wagon, even at the expense of quality.

And it puts off users that have been curating SO for a long time.

@Mitch meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/366692/… and meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/366954 (especially the comments below them) are good reads to get a general feeling, if you have some spare minutes for soap operas. Nicol Bolas is also a really awesome guy and tends to write elegantly and articulately about this. meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/366757

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Oh OK you're talking about the 'be nice' thing that came up about a year ago? And did people generally start being nicer? And is that what is annoying?

But Tonepoet was referring to the mod queues which have always been there (for people once they get enough rep). That is annoying, to be a mod and have these buttons to push (which are always punitive) and come across looking like a jerk.

@Mitch No no, you missed a couple of things since you (rightfully so) kept yourself out of the drama

I don't know how to tie the two together, except negative comments are kind of acting like a jerk, and close voting seems like being a jerk too.

A positive side effect of the wagon, in my impression, was people started being more careful about what they say in their comments.

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ That drama was over on SO, not here on ELU.

"garbage" and "dumb" and "useless" started appearing less often.

I am an extremely passive user of SO. "Is it a semicolon or not? Google SO" is about as close as I get.

@Mitch Yeah but people active on several sites are usually affected by it just like SO regs.

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ So that's positive right?

A good change?

@Mitch IMO yeah, but it wasn't what irked Tone

And my other impression is things started to get better since last year after some mismanagement on SE's side and some knee-jerk from the more jaded regulars

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ People may get snitty here on ELU, but I don't think it was ever common to use anything like those terms. Or ever. Slightly heated maybe, but never strong words.

Oof, wait. I should have linked this. meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/385023/…

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Oh. That sounds recent. But also something I missed (and I think what you were really referring to).

But 'mismanagement'? 'Knee-jerk from regulars'?

What people are still upset about is how quickly SE acted on a couple of random accusations on blogs, Twitter etc. while useful features about moderation sit there waiting for attention from years ago.

Another, newer thing people are not happy about is after SE shed some of its staff, the new hires don't have much experience with this whole moderation thing and their view on SE, which bears quite some weight since they're now an SE employee, is more like that of an outsider than someone already well-versed with this system.

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Oh. That's very recent. Almost at the same time as this conversation.

Opinions like "downvoting is rude".

@Mitch I know! I can also go a little bit further and talk about 2020.

Also WTF. (I'm going to be weird now...) How is your English so good? Did you spend time immersed with native English speakers? Like almost all of your childhood?

. . . o.O

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Stock tips please

I've been here for like 4 years and now you ask me this?

@Mitch green means things are good, red means bad.

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Oh. THere must be a little more 'SE current events knowledge' over on SO. Is that where you've been all this time?

No I was in the bathroom

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ haha. It just sorta hit me.

Playing sudoku

@Mitch If it's a noticeable change since, say, last year, it'd be because not being on dialysis means I have unlimited verbal ammo.

@Cowp linked something about it a while ago.

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ My opinion on that is... software takes time and effort and planning to modify (sometimes changing the color to one button takes years of planning, but rearranging the entire look and feel, a matter of a few minutes (OK, not really that exactly, but that's the idea)), but some behavioral things like writing an op ed to say 'Don't be mean' is super easy.

P.S. for a 20-year-old, it means I'm 20/19th more mature

So I can be disgruntled too at the lack of response on some of these feature requests, but I understand why nothing has been done.

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ That's what the bathroom is for.

Yeah, that was just considered a bit annoying in the past. What happened recently-ish, we're talking 6 months ago maybe, I lost track of time, is they immediately acted on a couple of critical, misguided slash hypocritical blog posts or tweets which related to that wagon thing

So regulars memified it that if they wanna be heard, they should go and rant on Twitter instead of meta.SO, for example

Oh. Drama. I missed it.

Basically, the regulars feel the company focuses on attracting new users at expense of quality, and they're being ignored although they're the really invested people

@Mitch I missed it too but not the aftermath

Plays Radioactive from Imagine Dragons

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ In the handful of times that a google search on 'how do you do X in programming language Y' that I do, I haven''t seen much weirdness in comments as I've seen extremely helpful questions and answers get 0 votes in any direction.

Some cool CMs are working on making things better though, so that was mostly true due to some ignorance before but not so much now

Ask Question Wizard came, and they're trying to improve mod tools, etc.

But on twitter I see both Jeff A and independent sources say how StackOverflow is revolutionizing programming.

@Mitch I think what ultimately everyone agreed on is something like "look dude. The internet is 40 percent rude, 60 percent OK. SO is 95 percent OK, 5 percent rude. But rude stuff gets people, and OK stuff is usually considered business as usual. Let's work on that"

AFAIK that's the only thing staff and regs agreed upon

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ As to software product evolution, the system was set in stone by about 2010 (with mostly tweaks after 2008 after first release), everything else is tacked on afterthought, or very hard won miniscule tweaks.

To reduce that 5 percent even further.

Quora seems to not have rude things somehow.

And even if some of their questions are dumb, they're not written in an offhand way. (or maybe I only see links to their better quality questions)

@Mitch That's what I'm getting at now. One thing regulars and the whole community in general agreed upon was the problem is that of perception. New users expect to be served, satisfied and sent back home in a private jet no matter the cost

@skullpatrol @skullpetrol You guys should get to know each other. Like how's that football thing going.

Regulars are building an interactive Wikipedia instead. If you have nothing to add to the knowledge, get out. And we don't care about your error because if you Google the goddamn question title you'd see 679 SO questions with the exact same title. True story.

too much into b ball and hockey right now pal

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ I sometimes think authoritarian niceness is called for. Somebody asks a extremely poor quality but nugget of interest question, a mod could edit the question radically so that it is useful and passes all the close reasons.

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Nobody reads below the top search item.

@Mitch Pretty sure people do it everywhere from time to time when they feel like it. But normal SE sites are usually 1 high-rep to 100 newbies, and SO is something like 1 high-rep to 10000

@Mitch I think that's fine.

@skillpatrol Yeah! That! You two should have a lot to talk about.

Doesn't scale.

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Problems of success

@Cerberus It gets some peoples hackles up. Like not representing what the OP really is asking.

So, when a meta post comes around with "why wasn't the answer delivered to me on a silver platter", and it boils down to OP asking for some chivalry, the response is often that there is no way to be chivalrous to everyone. Not even close.

@Mitch Nobody bothers to do a Google.

Or to Google a do.

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ The time it takes to close vote and compose a comment to that effect (which is probably what someone with higher rep would do), might as well edit, same time and effort.

Have you SEEN some of the crap SO gets. It takes like 30 minutes to edit some of those posts.

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ That's the only way I get into SO. I would never bother with SE's search box because Google searches SE much better.

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ I'm a newbie there.

SE's search is useful if you wanna post some stats on meta without a diamond.

@Mitch I'm a pro. 150 rep. (`･ω･´)ゞ

@Mitch i wanted to congratulate Mr. Shiney on his team's win, but he hasn't been here in 40+ days?

To be fair to myself, I have many years of software behind me, but 'how do you do X in programing language Y' because Y is constantly changing is a constant question.

All of them from grammar edits.

@Mitch AFAIK SO is cool with that.

@skillpatrol Team? Was there a SE competition?

Toronto Rappors

Canadian Hiphop is awesome.

Wait... Drake.

I take that back.

dang why did you edit

@Cerberus did you get to meet Mr. Shiney when he was in your city?

Thank you.

np pal :-)

It's built on Chrome, and appears identical except for a few cosmetics.

And the home page lists all the ad blocking and tracker blocking functions it's performed.

And they say they don't keep any stats on you.

@Robusto how goes the biking?

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Blacklisted user (70): "State" vs "country" as "nation" by Donald Trump on english.SE

@SmokeDetector Too verbose for Trump, but of course that's the kind of crook such a question title attracts

> History and Etymology for recalcitrant

> Late Latin recalcitrant-, recalcitrans, present participle of recalcitrare to be stubbornly disobedient, from Latin, to kick back, from re- + calcitrare to kick, from calc-, calx heel

What is the -itr part in the Latin root?

@Færd My Latin etymological dictionary gives calx for heel and in that entry calcitare = to kick without any further comment about -itare or -itrare.

but 'iter or iterare or itare all have something to do with 'to go or repeat', so that's a possible extra.

but @Cerberus would have more of an idea.

@skullpetrol Very well, thanks. Only 4K miles so far this year, but it was an unusually snowy winter. Not sure I'm going to make 10K unless things go very well and I don't get sick or injured.

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Repeating characters in answer (82): Opposite of "Squeaky wheel gets the grease" by Mustard Tiger on english.SE

@Mitch Thanks!

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Blacklisted username, offensive title detected, blacklisted user (215): You dirty fascist faggots! Stop deleting my posts! by Donald Trump on english.SE