English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

SmokeDetector

14:57

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Few unique characters in answer (86): How to say "it gives an opportunity" in a word? by asi on english.SE

tchrist

16:30

0

A: What is the correct pronunciation of Costa Coffee?

Surprise, they’re [ˌɔə̯ɫkɚˈɻɛ̝t̚]! Many, many other actual pronunciations of this word can be found among native speakers of different regional accents. Each one is “correct’ for that accent and speaker, even should this differ from one’s own. Not only is English a pluricentric ...

Mitch

17:05

@tchrist Those vowels are all over the place for different dialects. But within GenAmE, people might rhyme with what they say for Costa Rica, or just as likely not.

But more apropos:

You can't run through a camp site. You can only ran, because it's past tents. #RunningBearFun #Friyay

Tweeted by RunningBearFun on January 11, 2019 at 8:57 AM

Robusto

@tchrist I'm surprised you spent so much of your time answering this.

@Mitch Who cares how brand names are pronounced?

Everybody in America pronounces Cuisinart "queez-in-art" ("queasy-nart") when the company almost certainly thought it would be pronounced "cuisine-art" ... no queasy involved, which you'd think would be brand suicide for food-related items.

More to the point, people don't even think about the pronunciation or the implications thereof.

Mitch

Luke Skywalker - I care

►

Coast-uh-Cahffee sounds like you're saying Coaster Coffee in the 1950's Bronx

Robusto

17:20

In Costa Rica
I ate paprika
Con mi linda Tica
Named Sra. Eríca

Mitch

Señor Erica is going to wonder why her lips are so red.

Robusto

2pac - Tupac I Don't Give A Fuck

►

@Mitch Señora ...

Note terminal a.

Mitch

@Robusto Note the lack of terminal a for her husband

Liberace Entrance in Las Vegas Only the way Lee Could do it Featuring Scott Thorson

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SmokeDetector

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Repeating characters in answer (82): What did people in the 1800s used to call their mothers? I'm writing a paper for english 3rd pd by Lizzie on english.SE

Robusto

@Mitch There's gay, really gay, totally gay, Elton John gay, so-gay-not-even-light-can-escape ... and Liberace.

May 14 '13 at 22:05, by Robusto

Aug 2 '12 at 18:40, by Robusto

I rest my case.

tchrist

17:30

That's just dandy.

Verging on fop.

Robusto

@tchrist I think we're talking several orders of magnitude beyond fop.

tchrist

Looks like the love-child of Uncle Sam and a Rhinestone Cowboy.

Maybe cowbow was right in the first place.

THEGreatGatsby

SMASHING MY PHONE AFTER REJECTION!!

►

can someone help me what is he saying in 5:00 to 5;15

he says
I need this back, I've got it get it repaired, Hopefully it still works

Robusto

@tchrist Actually, I think he's probably sui generis.

THEGreatGatsby

my word I do not understand

the fair amount

I am messing with you guys

Mitch

17:35

@THEGreatGatsby Did you turn on closed caption? It looks right.

Robusto

Sounds like "My [cricket] I just paid for the month."

Mitch

He says "I need this ... I need this back."

@THEGreatGatsby we're already messed

THEGreatGatsby

I ve got get it repaired

Robusto

Just don't fuck with us. You will be sorry.

THEGreatGatsby

or I gotta get it repaired ?

Mitch

17:37

@Robusto He's so over the top, he's gone back down and come back up again.

tchrist

@Mitch I'd rather hear [ˈkostə kɑˈfei] than [ˈkɑstə ˈkɑfi] from speakers incapable of saying [ˈkɔstə ˈkɔfi] come hell or high water.

Mitch

@THEGreatGatsby "I've gotta get it repaired" maybe

Robusto

3 mins ago, by Robusto

@tchrist Actually, I think he's probably sui generis.

Mitch

@THEGreatGatsby Yeah.

Robusto

Whatever he is, there has never existed another in his category.

THEGreatGatsby

17:38

what is the meaning of my cricket I just paid for the month

Mitch

which is perfectly fine very informal fast unarticulated speech. If you're a non-native speaker, you probably don't want to try to emulate that. Except maybe 'gotta'.

THEGreatGatsby

my cricket ?

Robusto

@THEGreatGatsby Probably some brand name we don't know about.

THEGreatGatsby

the brand of the phone ?

Robusto

Just assume it's his cell phone contract.

THEGreatGatsby

17:39

or the chain that sold the phone

Robusto

Or something related to it.

THEGreatGatsby

thanks @Robusto

Robusto

np

THEGreatGatsby

I ve gotta means I have to

but informal right ?

Mitch

Yes

THEGreatGatsby

17:40

in formal email chain can I use it

Mitch

"I hafta" also

THEGreatGatsby

with my colleagues I mean

not with clients

Robusto

We don't know your colleagues, so ...

If you can be informal with them, fine. If not, don't.

Mitch

@THEGreatGatsby It's weird to write it that way unless you're an author trying to present speech as informal.

THEGreatGatsby

yea our chat and emails with colleagues is informal

I mean it is not offensive

just informal

Mitch

17:41

'gotta' is OK to write, 'hafta' is weird, just write 'have to' and people normally pronounce it as 'hafta'

not offensive at all

THEGreatGatsby

what is correct

My general understanding for the problem is

or

My general understanding of the problem is

for or of is better

Mitch

of

Robusto

of

THEGreatGatsby

for is incorrect

or more unnatural ?

Jasper

of

Mitch

17:42

You're welcome in advance

Jasper

for is wrong

Mitch

In exchange, what is your opinion of Liberace's style?

This is kind of a poll

Robusto

@THEGreatGatsby I would suggest that until you acquire a higher level of fluency you skip the colloquialisms.

THEGreatGatsby

thanks guys

you are really helping me improving my english

Mitch

Yeah. Totally agree with Robusto.

THEGreatGatsby

17:43

better than my paid teacher

hihi

Mitch

Walk properly before you run

Robusto

It's like juggling. Most anybody can learn to juggle three balls fairly well in a short amount of time. But you don't want to go on stage trying to do five until you are really good.

Jasper

@THEGreatGatsby Depends on how much you pay him or her.

Mitch

@Robusto or ever

THEGreatGatsby

7 dollars per astronomical hour

Mitch

17:44

In the hierarchy of circus performers, there's

Robusto

Yeah. Juggling three balls is 3 out of 10 difficulty. Four is about a nine. Five is a 37.

THEGreatGatsby

but I got the feeling she does not know as much as me

Jasper

Well, I can't even juggle one ball, let alone two.

THEGreatGatsby

with online help I've got the feeling my limits are infinite :D

Mitch

rodeo clowns, fat clowns, granma clowns, birthday clowns, birthday magicians, jugglers, and last of all at the bottom of the ladder is mimes.

@THEGreatGatsby That's pretty cheap.

Jasper

17:46

@THEGreatGatsby There are infinite limits and also limits at infinity in mathematical analysis.

Mitch

I would expect.

barely enough for Starbucks coffee

Robusto

@Mitch And when you lift up that ladder you find sad clowns staring up at you, weeping.

Mitch

@Jasper how about 1/2 a ball?

Jasper

For one cup of Starbucks coffee, I can get seven cups in the small coffeeshop.

Mitch

@Jasper or limits that are co-infinite

@Jasper and a nervous tic

Robusto

17:47

Raining here today, didn't get to ride, so I guess you all are stuck with me for the morning.

Mitch

but caffeine is good for you.

@Robusto dammit

Robusto

Personally I'd rather be riding than messing with you folks, but you take what you can get.

Mitch

@Robusto .

Robusto

No, I'm not on my .

Mitch

. it

Robusto

17:49

Full stop?

0

Q: Meaning of 'very fine' when expressing a relationship

Example: He is very fine to work with. From the Cambridge dictionary I get two (relevant) meanings: SATISFACTORY (adjective) EXCELLENT (adjective) To me these two meanings seem very different. While satisfactory sounds somewhat negative in this context (i.e. working with someone), exc...

Close-worthy? Port to ELL? I'm not sure.

Mitch

he so fine?

Robusto

All meanings depend on context. Absent that, the adverb very changes the meaning of fine and militates against an interpretation of "satisfactory." — Robusto 2 hours ago

Jasper

To port to ELL, we need an adaptor.

THEGreatGatsby

how to say in other words

Before going into deeper details

Mitch

@Robusto I thought we had a tendency to never migrate meaning questions. But this one is certainly migrateable.

THEGreatGatsby

17:51

Today I am going to present you main differences between Windows and Linux but before going into deeper details lets first indtrouce myself

"before going into deeper details"

how to say it to sound more natural

Jasper

These days, if you have a USB C port, there are two ways to connect a mouse. Use a USB C mouse or use a USB A mouse and get a USB C to USB A adaptor.

Mitch

It's like a question "Is 'good' different from 'bad'? I can't tell"

Robusto

Kinda.

Mitch

@THEGreatGatsby deeper -> more

actually 'deeper' is fine

Robusto

@THEGreatGatsby Before going into more detail.

Mitch

17:52

or that

Jasper

Today I went to the Apple store and tried out all the keyboards and touchpads of the six laptop models.

Mitch

@Jasper Will I have to get a new phone to take advantage of 5G?

Robusto

@Jasper Nope. Just an API.

Mitch

@Jasper Did they have to escort you out because you were also eating chocolate at the same time, getting it all over the keyboards?

Jasper

What they call the force touch trackpad is really nice. You can click anywhere on the pad, not just tap. The pad is uniform.

@Mitch No, I don't usually eat chocolate. I worried so much recently that I lost 10 kg the last 2 months.

Mitch

17:56

@Jasper I was really upset the other day when a chocolate bar had on it a label that said 'candy bar'.

CHOCOLATE IS NOT CANDY

Jasper

I learnt 2 facts about Toblerone recently.

Fact 1: There is actually a bear hidden inside the mountain logo. I didn't notice the bear until recently.

Mitch

I hope they're not bad

Robusto

There is only one fact about Toblerone: too pricey.

Jasper

Fact 2: To split the chocolate, you are supposed to press the sharp ends together, not the other side.

@Robusto Well, over here, they are pretty cheap, not really more expensive than normal chocolate.

However, the new Macbook Air is cheaper in the US than over here, by about 100 dollars.

Robusto

I tried to use Numbers on my iPad with an existing Excel spreadsheet and it keeps reclassifying my text cells as dates, and changing them from black to red. This is unacceptable behavior.

Jasper

18:01

Maybe some compatibility problems. That is what happens when everyone tries to use Microsoft's format.

But Microsoft Office is still the industry standard.

But from the FAQ it does seem that if you install Office on macOS, you get slightly fewer features than on Windows.

Robusto

It has been this way for only about 35 years now.

Mitch

@Robusto it probably knows better

Jasper

For one, macOS doesn't run on a touchscreen, so you don't use a pen to input text.

Mitch

@Jasper what do you mean the other side?

Jasper

@Mitch The chocolate is in the shape of triangles. You are supposed to press the top of the triangles together, not apply force in the other direction, I mean.

Mitch

18:05

not pull apart?

Jasper

Yeah.

Mitch

oh

I had no idea about the bear. will have to look next time

Jasper

But the good thing about Pages compared to Word is that Pages lets you input LaTeX directly for equations, I think.

And the Grapher application on macOS also lets you input equations, and even draws all kinds of 3D graphs.

Mitch

Jalapeños are not supposed to be that hot, but I just ate something that was next to a jalapeño and I'm sweating

@Jasper Equation Editor is the worst

Jasper

When I was playing with macOS today, I realised that Ubuntu with the Unity desktop was made to resemble it a lot.

And today I also tried out the Safari browser.

It's good to know that you can change the settings in Safari to always launch in private mode, like Firefox and unlike Chrome or Opera.

That is, without manually setting a flag.

So Safari has passed my first browser usability test.

Robusto

18:11

@Mitch But that's Microsoft's job, to correct your shit in ways you do not intend. I thought Apple was supposed to be more forgiving than that.

Mitch

I just got trolled today on twitter by some @IsThatABigNumber account. It didn't have any numbers, barely any math at all.

Jasper

I also read that Microsoft is planning to rewrite Edge by starting with a Chromium base.

Robusto

@Jasper I have a LaTeX allergy.

Mitch

@Robusto I've lost many productive days not realizing that Excel sucks at importing.

@Jasper What is 'Edge'?

Robusto

@Mitch Well, I was importing into Numbers from Excel.

Jasper

18:13

@Mitch It's the successor to Internet Explorer in Windows 10.

Mitch

@Jasper Oh. Why do they do that? Don't answer that.

Robusto

I would call it a replacement, not a successor.

Jasper

I did try using Edge for a few days, really not good. IE might be better in some ways. Disappointing.

If they start using Chromium as a base, then it would just be another Chrome eventually.

Mitch

@Robusto I remember wehn Neuromancer came out in '85, some of the brand names for computer conglomerates that were still around in 100 years or whatever were ...

wait... what was lotus 123 done by?

Robusto

I remember Lotus 123, and Mitch Kapor, and all that '80s stuff.

Wait ... you're not Mitch Kapor, are you?

Jasper

18:16

Oh I remember using Corel Draw long ago, and also Word Perfect.

Mitch

Ashton-Tate?

@Robusto No. But that would be funny if I recognized that name.

Robusto

Mitch Kapor

Mitchell David Kapor ( (listen) KAY-por; born November 1, 1950) is an American entrepreneur best known for his work as an application developer in the early days of the personal computer software industry, later founding Lotus, where he was instrumental in developing the Lotus 1-2-3 spreadsheet. He left Lotus in 1986. In 1990 with John Perry Barlow and John Gilmore, he co-founded the Electronic Frontier Foundation, and served as its chairman until 1994. In 2003, Kapor became the founding chair of the Mozilla Foundation, creator of the open source web browser Firefox. Kapor has been an investor...

Mitch

wow. he's done a few things

Robusto

Kinda makes you feel like Mitch the Lesser, huh?

Mitch

Ashton-Tate

Ashton-Tate (Ashton-Tate Corporation) was a US-based software company best known for developing the popular dBASE database application. Ashton-Tate grew from a small garage-based company to become a multinational corporation. Once one of the "Big Three" software companies, which included Microsoft and Lotus, the company stumbled in the late 1980s and was sold to Borland in September 1991. == History == The history of Ashton-Tate and dBASE are intertwined and as such, must be discussed in parallel. === Early history: dBASE II (1981–1983) === In 1978 Martin Marietta programmer Wayne Ratli...

@Robusto If by that you mean Mitch the Well-Rested, then yes.

Robusto

18:20

@Mitch They were a clieint of mine at one point.

Or at least dBase was.

Mitch

I vaguely remember dBASE II or 3 or something

Jasper

They do sell Word Perfect Office suite on wordperfect.com. Cheaper than Microsoft Office, but I wonder who uses it.

Mitch

or was it RBase?

@Jasper People who are stuck in the past?

Obviously for me the past is slipping away barely noticed

Last month? Gone.

Last year? I'm sure something happened

Last Century? Talking about 'last century' is so last century.

No one ever talks about fin-de-millinium

Robusto

Yay, my Park Tool INF-2 Inflator just arrived!

Mitch

Congratulations!

Robusto

18:23

amazon.com/Park-Tool-373-248-Shop-Inflator/dp/B00Y63UMXC/…

Mitch

But I hesitate to ask...

oh

I'm not clicking on that, you troll

Robusto

Why no one-box?

Mitch

because SE

Robusto

I thought we one-boxed Amazon pages.

Mitch

did amazon used to one-box here?

Robusto

18:24

Yes.

Jasper

Yeah seems that amazon no longer oneboxes.

Mitch

maybe it's broke?

file a report

Robusto

Like so many other things around here ...

Mitch

I just read a thing about how terrible JIRA is and it really put into words what I hate about JIRA.

Robusto

I too hate JIRA.

Mitch

18:25

And then I realized, JIRA isn't everything.

Robusto

But now I don't have to deal with it anymore. ^_^

Mitch

Just because JIRA doesn't wash your socks for you, doesn't make it a bad thing.

If you're using JIRA to help you wash your socks, you're using JIRA badly

Jasper

Socks are easy to wash. You just need to turn them inside out first.

Mitch

"But..." you say, "What if we added a sock-washing module to JIRA?"

Robusto

What was the competing product with JIRA? I forget.

Mitch

18:27

Trello

which was bought by JIRA

Robusto

All sufficiently advanced software products will implement Tetris and sock-washing.

Mitch

but that don't mean they changed trello

Robusto

Yes.

Mitch

@Robusto Oh Emacs! sigh

Robusto

I got my company to use Fog Bugz back in the '00s, but it didn't stick when they were acquired.

Mitch

18:29

I like the look of trello, but really, it feels unmanageable once you fill the screen with tasks (which is about 20). After that it's awful

@Robusto I never saw that.

Robusto

All task management is awful.

@Mitch That was Joel Spolsky's previous life before SE.

Jasper

@Robusto Just open the Windows Task Manager, LOL.

Mitch

JIRA is like a big game where you squash tickets to get programming done, but eventually it becomes just squashing tickets. That's what bothered me

Confluence is worse.

(or any wiki)

Things go in but nobody ever reads them, or it's just too hard to search. or both

@Robusto and then it's worse than that if you don't have task management

Robusto

Now let's talk version control systems.

Mitch

woohoo!

svn for the win!

Robusto

18:32

I like git or mercurial better.

Mitch

I could understand that

and couldn't mess it up

Robusto

But the absolute worst is ClearCase.

Mitch

every time I touch git I have to start from scratch.

@Robusto is that the microsoft Total Version Live thing?

TTFN?

Robusto

Git is very Unixy. You have to know the commands.

Mitch

I hate the commands

Robusto

18:33

@Mitch IBM Rational ClearCase, I think it's called.

Mitch

I just want to choose the menu items

@Robusto Oh.

Like Rational Rose etc?

Robusto

It's a ClearCase for suicide.

Mitch

in that set of products?

@Robusto you made suicide funny

Robusto

Rational ClearCase

Rational ClearCase is a family of computer software tools that supports software configuration management (SCM) of source code and other software development assets. It also supports design-data management of electronic design artifacts, thus enabling hardware and software co-development. ClearCase includes revision control and forms the basis for configuration management at large and medium-sized businesses, accommodating projects with hundreds or thousands of developers. It is developed by IBM. ClearCase supports two configuration management models: UCM (Unified Change Management) and bas...

Mitch

now for some holocaust jokes

Robusto

18:34

@Mitch I just referenced the essential humor in self-demise.

Mitch

Larry David did a holocaust joke for SNL last year. I remember laughing real hard at it, but everybody was clutching pearls about it the next day.

and then last week I saw it again. It wasn't that funny.

Robusto

Well, humor is subjective.

Mitch

You just explained my non-joke to me.

Robusto

Anyway, I remember someone went on vacation leaving a dependency file locked in ClearCase and for want of a one-line change to that file a whole project got put on hold for a week.

@Mitch You're welcome.

Mitch

oh. yeah. that kind of locking feature is crazy

@Robusto danke

Robusto

18:43

I wish something needed inflating around here. I'm just itching to use my Park Tool INF-2 Shop Inflator.

Mitch

can you use it on car tires?

Robusto

Yes.

Mitch

can you let some air out of your car tires?

Robusto

That would be cheating.

Mitch

Oh

You can walk from house to house asking if they need air in their tires.

Robusto

18:45

They'd have to bring their cars/bikes to my house, though, cuz that's where my compressor is.

Mitch

Oh

Wait...

What is this Park Tool INF-2 Shop Flux Decapicitator for then?

Robusto

Time travel.

Mitch

Can't you just use the compressor and a air nozzle to blow things up?

Robusto

You can, but that is far less cool.

Also harder.

Mitch

and maybe an air gauge to make sure you're not overblowing?

Robusto

18:47

Theoretically you could just use your lips and lungs, but that's also harder.

Mitch

@Robusto Also uncool

Robusto

Remember, blow is just a metaphor.

Mitch

the exercise you get out of it is not worth it

@Robusto All words are metaphors

Robusto

All metaphors are words.

Mitch

That's my poetry limit for the day. From here on out it's all literal.

Robusto

18:48

I never metaphor I didn't like.

I metaphor but I wish I'd metaten.

Mitch

Last night I shot an elephant in my pajamas.

Then I went back to sleep.

Robusto

Pix or it didn't happen.

Mitch

This morning there was a big dead elephant outside.

Robusto

Lies.

Mitch

@Robusto If I could take a picture of myself while I was a sleep, I'd use those skills to not interrupt myself while sleeping.

@Robusto I said I'd be literal, not necessarily truthful

Robusto

18:52

So those are literally lies. Got it.

Mitch

yeah. none of these white lies or half truths or bullshit.

Robusto

20:33

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English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…