English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

@Cerberus Yup. The G4's replaceable battery gave me a feeling of security, knowing I could be anywhere for any length of time and all I'd have to do if my battery died was to pop out the depleted one and pop in a fresh one.

@Robusto I agree, it as an advantage.

It is.

So how are you doing these days?

But I could downplay it, if that would give you...peace of mind?

2:04 AM

Oh, same old, same old. You?

@Robusto You always know how to charm people, don't you?

I'm pretty decent, except for the political situation.

Naturally.

@Cerberus Hehe.

How is life below sea level?

(So, about the battery: you have to turn off your phone in order to replace the battery. With an external battery, also known as a mobile charger, which is cheaper than an internal battery, you can just continue using your phone as you connect it. So perhaps a replaceable battery isn't so important after all.)

I've been watching tsunami videos tonight.

So it is good.

Just glad we have no quakes here.

@Robusto It's excellent.

2:07 AM

@Cerberus Actually, I used to just pop out the battery to kill the OS and stop all those cloying processes dead in their tracks.

@Cerberus I guess you can't really get tsunamis, either. Unless a meteor lands in the North See or something ...

@Robusto Hmm I have a reboot button for that...

@Tonepoet That's the Disney version. The reality is quite different.

@Robusto Exactly.

@Cerberus I got better results from the cold-turkey approach.

But...a real reboot is as cold as it gets...

I agree that a "soft" reboot, or whatever it's called, is not always the same thing.

2:10 AM

BTW, the fairy tale that Little Mermaid story is based on is actually an allegory about a girl becoming a woman, with all the attendant blood and suffering that entails.

"Your tail will then disappear, and shrink up into what mankind calls legs, and you will feel great pain, as if a sword were passing through you. But all who see you will say that you are the prettiest little human being they ever saw. You will still have the same floating gracefulness of movement, and no dancer will ever tread so lightly; but at every step you take it will feel as if you were treading upon sharp knives, and that the blood must flow."

@Cerberus Is that what happens when Chef Louis wins his battle with Sebastian?

hca.gilead.org.il/li_merma.html

@Robusto Grimm?

Andersen.

@Tonepoet Haha probably.

2:13 AM

Louis Szathmary

Louis Szathmary (born Lajos Istvan Szathmáry II June 2, 1919 – October 4, 1996) was a Hungarian-American chef, writer, and public personality. A pioneering force in the food service profession, he is best known for heading the Chicago restaurant The Bakery and writing the New York Times bestseller The Chef's Secret Cookbook. Szathmary's involvement with the early frozen food industry, his numerous cookbooks and articles and his persona established him as an icon in the culinary arts industry. == Early life == Louis Szathmary was born on June 2, 1919, on a train heading from Transylvania ...

That's the chef Louis I remember.

@Robusto Ah, I forgot.

From Chicago, The Bakery on Lincoln.

Germanic and Scandinavian folklore tends to be very dark. Also Eastern European.

Not all folklore?

I thought most fairytales were originally meant for adults...

Maybe. I haven't read all folklore. But surely there must be some cultures that didn't try to scare the bejesus out of the children ...

amazon.de/Springwurzel-andere-M%C3%A4rchen-Friedrich-Blunck/dp/…

I think I read these when I was nine or ten and couldn't sleep at night.

I mean I couldn't sleep after reading them, not that I used them as a soporific.

That's nice.

I remember finding some fairytales too dark when I was very young.

2:20 AM

Just about all of 'em.

I could handle Hansen and Gretl?

Oh, and The Witches.

Is that a question?

It is an assertion with an implicit question: don't you think that is an example of a 'dark' fairytale that is still not super scary for young children?

Hansel & Gretel (Eng. sp.) was dark. The children are exiled by their parents and captured by a witch, whom they then kill? If that isn't dark it'll do until dark shows up.

Oh, I actually just guessed the German spelling: I only know the Dutch spelling.

Indeed, it is dark; but still the witch was not super scary.

And killing her was fine.

2:22 AM

It was fine with me.

I suppose the exile might be more disturbing; but it happens at the beginning, when you don't care about the characters that much yet.

I actually only remember that part now that you mention it.

But then, I was a strange child. When I was three I was given a leopard mask to wear for Halloween and I refused to go to people's doors because I didn't want to scare them.

Aww.

@Cerberus Yes, that is the scariest part for kids.

It could be.

But I didn't even remember it.

The witch, the candy house, the forced-feeding, the oven: those I did remember.

2:24 AM

BTW, do you realize that just about all children's lit has an element of parental abandonment, cruelty, or absenteeism?

Fondly.

Hmm does it?

Pretty much.

I did a paper on that once.

I suppose one cannot normally experience adventure with loving, responsible parents?

Blyton's Famous Five were sometimes a bit abandoned, but usually not, I would say.

Nope. The main thread usually involves finding a surrogate parent or becoming self-reliant.

They were stuck on an island, or kidnapped, etc., instead.

It's an interesting thesis.

2:27 AM

Abandonment is the scariest thing for a child. That's why even abused children won't go against their parents.

It is indeed.

It may also be one of the reasons why adopted children more often than average develop mental problems.

And why gays are more depressed, perhaps.

Because they get rejected by their hetero parents?

It happens.

I'm sure it does.

Perhaps often enough to explain the increased depression etc.

2:29 AM

I guess trans kids have it worst of all. Supposedly 40% commit suicide, or at least that's the number I saw touted recently.

Hmm why is it worse for them?

Because it is less accepted?

Maybe.

Yeah that's horrible.

huffingtonpost.com/brynn-tannehill/…

The conclusion: "If we want to end the scourge of suicide, it’s time we stop trying to fix transgender people. It’s time to fix society."

It's always a good idea to be tolerant and respectful.

Now all we need is a solution for paedophiles.

Maybe life-like robots.

Or total plastic surgery.

2:39 AM

I don't know. I read that shockingly often pedophiles were themselves abused as children. Dunno if it's true or not, but if it is, something has to be done to break the chain.

Psychiatrists say that many child molesters aren't paedophiles.

They do it for other reasons.

But true paedophiles do exist!

I saw a television interview with one the other day.

His appearance and voice were altered such that he was unrecognisable.

A young man, who had never touched a child.

I think harming children is about the worst thing someone can do. Because it screws up someone's entire life.

But by the time he turned twenty, he still felt attracted to 12 or 14-y-o's. The he realised it was not going to pass.

@Cerberus So he just had the urges, but had the fortitude never to act on them?

Yes.

Of course it cannot be excluded.

2:42 AM

Sounds like a principled individual.

But the television people said they had done thorough research on him.

I'm sure there are tons of paedophiles who never act on it.

It would be nice if they could be given robots or something.

What a horrible life that would be.

Less horrible than their lives are now.

There are other things in life.

That one can get happiness from.

That's what the Roman Catholic Church tells its priests ...

Well, it doesn't work for everyone...

2:51 AM

Haha.

All too true.

Q: How to deal with an erroneously answered question that has been closed with the faulty answer accepted?

4:55 AM

2

I've just run into a problem involving a question with an accepted answer that is demonstrably (albeit circumstantially demonstrably) untrue: We can predict everything, except the future. The complication in this instance is that the question has been closed, thus effectively locking out competin...

discussion closed-questions accepted-answer

Finally somebody seems to have a reasonable reopening request. Knowing my recent luck with Meta though, it'll just stay closed. =\

6:01 AM

@Tonepoet Finally, my first downvote . . .

Hmm, shouldn't meta.ELU be less harsh considering Rathony is no more?

6:19 AM

@M.A.R. The matter is actually precisely the opposite. I was arguing to keep some rather poorly received requests closed, but by some sort of miracle they got reopened anyway. =\

Færd

@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Wow, even newer Galaxy Notes don't have that option anymore. I always carry an extra battery for my Note 3 in case I need it, which I frequently do.

Færd

6:40 AM

@Cerberus I thought everyone's a pedophile?! The way everyone is gay to some extent. Of course it doesn't get that annoying unless you cannot find pleasure in normal relationships.

I think it sounds so accusingly shocking that many people just can't bring themselves to even consciously think about it, let alone admit it to others.

And for the record, I don't think I'm especially pedophiliac.

@Tonepoet Well, it is indeed less harsh. Reopening stuff is being more lenient, hence less harsh

7:54 AM

Not answering the question, but the proverb is nonsense. Wet wood doesn't burn, it dries out first, then burns. — i-CONICA 8 mins ago

Thank you for your comment.

As crappy as ELL can be, it never gets such ridiculous opinions

Andrew Leach

@M.A.R. That's because english.stackexchange.com should go to ELL.

@AndrewLeach can't disagree

You should change the site name to badassenglishmenandamericans.SE

Or, hmm, legolovers.SE

@Andrew ever seriously discussed site name change on meta.ELU?

I recall a couple of discussions, but no real community effort

Andrew Leach

8:12 AM

It's been mentioned, but it hasn't been the subject of its own question.

We should rename this website gocheckadictionary.stackexchange.com . . .

@Tonepoet Not strong enough. Should add a fing somewhere

I thought about adding a pejorative word, but I don't want to tread off of the Be Nice track here. . .

8:40 AM

Hah, just earned [yearling]

skill patrol

10:28 AM

Congrats.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

2:20 PM

Why do software developers gotta be so arrogant.

Every software developer should be required to start their career doing tech support and maintenance

Learn to listen

3:49 PM

@Robusto Oh I remember that because I was going to answer a question about the sex/gender distinction, and a few debates I got into because of it. I hadn't yet, since I thought the answer would be too contentious for me to post at the time, but David Reimer's psychologist was John Money, who is often falsely attributed as inventing the word gender, when he really just invented the phrase gender role to be distinct from sex role.

That is impossible though, because the word gender itself, even as it pertains to its synonymy with sex, is centuries older than John Money.

hi

anyone about?

I am, although I will not guarantee I can be of much help. What do you want to know?

nothing just mild inconsequential conversation really :)

otherwise known as, how is your day going? :)

also not too sure on the etiquette in ELU chat, are smilies allowed? First time I've ventured into these realms

@Gary It is going fine, although nothing especially interesting has happened yet.

@tonepoet well perhaps that's a boon, nothing interesting, means nothing particularly interesting, which means nothing crazy, by an odd leap of linguistic reasoning

3:59 PM

@Gary They are allowed. I see them used rarely. I use them somewhat more than that. However, user discretion is advised. If they appear at the end of every message...

ah ok, yes, a sensible precaution. It's so difficult to get your tone across in the written word without a great deal of thought, I can just about manage it in ELU comments, ELU chat by it's reactive nature, i think the smilies help, but very happy for the headsup thanks!

@Tonepoet btw, are you a poet?

@Gary So you've asked me how my day is going, how is yours?

@Gary My name is entirely a misnomer

@Tonepoet it's going great thanks, taking a few days off from work, was a busy week last week, just relaxing really.

@tonepoet haha, well a fortunate misnomer to have on ELU! :D

woops there goes the smilies again

@Gary 'Tis a lovely time to be curling up with a book I suppose?

I'm actually listening to music at the moment (expanding atm to "at the moment" for no other reason i'm chatting in ELU :D)

@Tonepoet are you reading any good books at the moment?

4:06 PM

@Gary Hmm, I see. What type of music are you listening to now?

[Trance] Best of Female Vocal Trance (March 2016)

not exactly what you might call civilized

►

i think the beat is very good, but i feel I should be posting a baroque song in here!

@Gary Hmm, unfortunately I am not, unless you count my frequent consultation of dictionaries for answers on the main website.

haha

:D

the last good book i read

was pear shaped

thoroughly recommended

that was about 3 years ago mind you , ha

amazon.co.uk/d/Books/Pear-Shaped-Stella-Newman/1847562701

@Gary Unless the title of the book was LOL WUT, I fear that is not enough of an identifi... oh.

^ there you go ;)

very classy style of writing in my humble opinion

very sharp wit, and quite poignant in places too

4:14 PM

The plot description sounds very tsundere, if I may use some terminology from the anime slang vocabulary.

actually that's the second best book i read

i swear i am bad with titles, i just read the reviews, that was quite funny

its not the one i was thinking of , i will try to find it one second

actually suddenly saved, i bought it on my kindle, so it'll be there somewhere

@Gary Take your time: Take your time. The pace of chat is usually quite slow compared to I.R.C. We have tools to grab people's attention when necessary, as I'm sure you already know.

yes i found it, i was actually thinking of the follow up book, this is actually free on kindle, and was just an amazing read very poignant and very well written amazon.co.uk/Silence-Natasha-Preston-ebook/dp/B009SV1YCU/…

needless to say i disagree with the latest Amazon 'user' reviews

it's certainly a book that keeps you turning the pages, that is something i generally look for in a book

Q: Is it really possible to be "half dead"?

5:21 PM

@Gary Hmm, I see.

MetaEd

6:00 PM

4

It is not all-too-rare to hear of someone being "half-dead," but is that logical, or possible? If so, how do you determine just how dead, percentage-wise, a person is? If it's possible to be 50% dead, then it must also be possible to be 7% dead, 42% dead, etc. Or even beyond integers, what abou...

etymology expressions colloquialisms logic

Yikes. Just yikes.

6:51 PM

Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat. — tchrist ♦ 1 min ago

Now, that's refreshing

@MetaEd It made you half-dead?

Or just 30 percent?

7:15 PM

@M.A.R. You're half-dead to me.

Nah, I used to be DEAD before

Now I'm just White

@M.A.R. Zombies come in all colors.

Not the color of pee

Gray, Ashen, Black, Rotting

It'd be too gross

7:19 PM

@M.A.R. You have accurately summarized the situation

Trivia question of the day: what English word has three pairs of double letters?

Don't rush it, I'll come back later.

@Mitch starters

@Mitch Committee, of course.

Which is incredibly apt, all things considered.

Oh, and successfull.

That second L belongs there and you know it.

7:36 PM

@terdon you prolepsisised me

I was thinking of bookkeeper.

But dang it you came up with others

I've always found it funny how when committees are involved, even the consonants have to be in duplicate.

Haha. Ccommittees

Coco-mites

@M.A.R. oh. Dang it. That too.

bloodened

7:40 PM

Ok. Change the question to 'consecutive double letters' which is intentionally ambiguous

Coinages definitely count

Coinages aren't worth the silver they're cast in

Not if I did the coining ᕙ(⇀‸↼‶)ᕗ

flips table

┬─┬ ノ( ^_^ノ)

7:54 PM

I can't parse those things. They look like random lines to me. I see a table? And a face? And that's it. Dunno where the flipping comes from.

@terdon That's actually an 'untable'

Something you can unt?

Meaning putting a flipped table back

Tidying things up

Oh. Yeah. Don't see that.

This is a table flip

(/¯◡ ‿ ◡)/¯ ~ ┻━┻

Or

(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

8:09 PM

Yeah. If you say so.

I mean, I've seen it before and have learned what it means. But I really don't see why.

@terdon Because it's a meme

Memes require little reason to be used

I could say "Yes!", or just simply use this

media.giphy.com/media/FjeGBljESVAzu/giphy.gif .

@M.A.R. Yes, but it's a meme because there's a whole culture that has arisen around the various emoticons (sorry Tonepoet) like that one. That culture is relatively opaque to those of us who didn't grow up in it.

@terdon Well, who doesn't like to be interesting, and these are a way to be so.

I didn't grow up with any of these either

@M.A.R. Um. How old are you again?

18

Don't look at me,

8:22 PM

Exactly. You did grow up with them :)

I look big enough

You still are, after all :P

I mean, I've got a beard and all

Heh, true, true

@terdon And then they'll have kids of their own that they won't understand, what with their lingo, and strange ways of walking, and they'll claim that memes were way cooler back in the teens, this new stuff is crap.

8:27 PM

Dammit, I was so sure the buck had stopped with my generation :(

@M.A.R. and under the hat are you shaven or bald?

@Mitch It's early baby hair

@terdon I was blown away one time when my mom used some slang term for getting drunk that I had only heard recently before.

and then all time collapsed into one, and there's nothing new under the sun.

hm...I could work 'comfortably numb' in there for a near rhyme

but I'm sure it's been done before.

@Mitch Heh, I did worse. I must have been around 12, happily singing along to a Beatles tune with my cousin when her father, my uncle, joined in. I was taken aback at how modern he was and how come he knew the Beatles!?

'I wanna be sedated' doesn't rhyme with anything

8:29 PM

This was in the early 90s, of course.

which makes it even more timelesser.

@Mitch Twenty-twenty-twenty-four hours to gooooo, I wanna be predated!

@terdon haha those beatles with their long shaggy hair that covers their ears

It's like in Arrival when Amy Adams finally learns the aliens's language which ... uh oh no spoilers.

@Mitch Thanks. I haven't seen that one yet and it's supposed to be good.