English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

tchrist

19:00

Und jetzt?!

Weiß nicht.

Noch einmal!

@Reg Did you do something funky with tag feeds?

@terdon @Cerberus ’Fraid I couldn’t resist:

@CyberGuy That’s totally alright, honest. There are indeed subtle patterns going on here that native speakers internalize, but to sieve them out of The Chaos would be harder than just looking up the word. — tchrist 4 mins ago

terdon

@tchrist Heartless, just heartless.

I was wondering who/when would bring up that poem.

tchrist

Word beginning with hear- are also wicked.

hear hearse heartily

terdon

hearse being the first that comes to mind

Yup

tchrist

You just gave me a great idea.

Mahnax

Hiya, folks.

tchrist

19:15

hearable (adj.)                /ˈhɪərəb(ə)l/
heard (ppl. a.)                /hɝːd/
hearer (v.)                    /ˈhɪərə(r)/
hearken (v.)                   /ˈhɑ˞ːk(ə)n/
hearkener (v.)                 /ˈhɑ˞ːk(ə)nə(r)/
hearkening (vbl. sb.)          /ˈhɑ˞ːk(ə)nɪŋ/
hearsay (v.)                   /ˈhɪɚseɪ/
hearse (n.)                    /hɝːs/
hearsy (adj.)                  /ˈhɝːsɪ/
heart (n.)                     /hɑ˞ːt/
heart (v.)                     /hɑ˞ːt/
heart-ache (n.)                /ˈhɑ˞ːteɪk/

@Mahnax Hi, sorry to splooge.

Mahnax

@tchrist Oh, no problem.

They asked me to come into work today. On my first day off after six days in a row totalling 48 hours of work and about a million phone calls. No sir.

tchrist

Typical.

Mahnax

We've had two people quit with no notice in the past week and I've been on cleanup duty.

Oh well. enjoys day off

@tchrist I like your answer to the "re" question.

tchrist

Thanks.

I guess I could have included the unassimilated French pronunciation of rendezvous, since I gave both US and UK versions, and Dieu only knows what native French speakers in Québec say when speaking English.

/rɑ̃devu/ or some such.

Mahnax

It's a pretty good list as is, I think; it gives the reader a very clear explanation.

tchrist

19:24

> rendezvous /ˈrɒndɪvuː/, /ˈrɛn-/, /rɑ̃devu/, sb.

Who the heck says it like wren?

The middle one in the OED list.

Matt Gutting

@tchrist Sounds like a name: Ren deVou.

Mahnax

@tchrist No kidding! I've never heard that, and I can't imagine an accent in which it might be pronounced that way.

tchrist

Me neither.

Mahnax

Wait, people pronounce it with ɪ?

Like the i in hit?

I've said it out loud a few times and I guess I can see it, but it sounds weird.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

ron day voo

There is no other way

Mahnax

19:28

@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Exactement.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

The OED has gone too far

tchrist

@Mahnax Fixed.

> rendezvous (n.) /ˈrɒndɪvuː/, /ˈrandəvu/, /rɑ̃devu/

Matt Эллен

I can imagine ron day voo, or ren dez vows.

tchrist

@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 Or not far enough. They aren’t reducing it to a schwa as the three of us clearly do.

Mahnax

@tchrist But the first one still has an ɪ, which sounds so strange to me.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

19:30

@tchrist I don't think I have a schwa in it.

tchrist

@MattЭллен Matt, do you have the BIT sound there?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

well... maybe if I'm speaking quickly it turns to a schwa

tchrist

@Mr.ShinyandNew安宇 If I were to write the phonetics instead of the phonemics, I might use a schwi.

Mark berg

hi

thanks

tomorrow

Matt Эллен

@tchrist bit? like binary digit?

tchrist

19:31

@MattЭллен Right.

Matt Эллен

I guess

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Markberg You can edit your previous chat message by pressing the up arrow. You have two minutes. (like this)

Matt Эллен

people say bit

Saladin

hello

anyone home?

tchrist

@Markberg Just what it says.

Mahnax

19:32

@Markberg It means you will be going out with someone for something like drinks, or coffee, or for a meal, as the first step in a romantic process.

Saladin

I need help applying job with IBM

Matt Эллен

@Saladin nope. we're all out

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Markberg And "date" means appointment, but usually a romantic appointment.

Saladin

:(

tchrist

> I shall be having a date with someone come the morrow.

Mahnax

19:32

@Saladin Don't mind him, there's people here :)

Saladin

:)

Mahnax

Hm.

Oh, doesn't exist, that's why.

Saladin

wait

tchrist

@Saladin Sorry, you’ve come to the wrong place: this is persnickety.SE not careers.SE. :)

Saladin

I need some logical understanding and reasoning not big consultant view

tchrist

19:33

Then that is not English.

It is logic and reasoning.

And career advice.

Saladin

tchrist

And I just remembered I’ve forgotten to eat my @Saladin the fridge again.

Saladin

no can someone please view the screenshot.

Mahnax

@Saladin What's your question about it?

Saladin

its that simple I'm confused how to show my experience i.e I got total 5 yrs experience but When i fill the above menu it add to more then 5 years...infact there are part I have done in parallel like threat analysis reporting and ids/idp threat analysis occurrences...does this menu expects me to enter dedicated experience?

Mahnax

19:37

Oh, I don't know, I'm afraid. Are there detailed instructions somewhere on the application form?

Saladin

detailed instructions not as such

Matt Эллен

if you have been doing each of those things for more than 5 years you should put that. Put the amount of time you have been doing each of those things

Saladin

the job add says

Required

Associate's Degree/College Diploma
At least 1 year experience in IDS/IPS Threat Analysis experience
At least 6 months experience in Trending/Threat Analysis reporting
At least 1 year experience in Security Log Analysis
Certified in Industry standard security certifications (CISSP, GIAC, GSEC, ...)
English: Fluent
French: Intermediate
Dutch: Fluent

Preferred

Bachelor's Degree in Information Technology
At least 2 years experience in IDS/IPS Threat Analysis experience
At least 1 year experience in Trending/Threat Analysis reporting

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Yes, what Matt wrote

Mahnax

If you do two things at once for a year, then you've been doing both for a year, so I agree with the others.

Saladin

19:42

so if i add the fields in years if it mounts to time greater then 5 years I shouldn't be worried ....

like if i add up the current selection it take upto 6 years which is beyond my professional experience

Mahnax

@Saladin But you've been doing things simultaneously, so that's not really a good way to measure things. I think it's fine.

Matt Эллен

For example:
I have been in my job for 4 years. I started learning python when I started. I had been programming in c# for three years prior to that.
So if I was asked how long I had been using python professionally, and one option was "less than 5 years and more than four years" I would pick that
If I was asked similarly about c#, I would say More than 7 years and less than 8
I would not combine the two together.

I have not been programming in python and c# for 11 years

*numbers not actually representative of my experience

Saladin

Got it that's excellent explanation:)

@MattЭллен thanks a lot

Matt Эллен

no probs :)

Robusto

I thought Python programmers were born knowing everything.

Matt Эллен

19:49

@Robusto only the good ones. I was born only knowing that I don't know everything

Robusto

@MattЭллен I was born knowing everything. It's taken me my whole life to unlearn most of it.

Matt Эллен

@Robusto sounds like a fun life :D

Robusto

I get by. By the time I die I expect to know nothing. So the transition should be pretty gradual.

tchrist

@Robusto You were born a teenager?

RegDwigнt

@tchrist yes, and a long time ago too.

But I'm never around to actually harvest the fruit.

Every time I'm in here it's the same old ELU-only whatchacallit stuff.

It's only full of Japanese and German once I leave.

tchrist

20:11

Figgers.

Saladin

Hi i'm back again for more deciphering ..:)

applying for job is tough esp when english is not your fist language

can someone explain the phrase or para 'Have you ever worked for the Government, either as a civilian employee or member of the military, excluding mandatory military service (unless in that capacity you were involved in activities related to IBM or any affiliated company) ? contextual help '

skullpatrol

Which part don't you follow?

Have you ever worked for the Government?

Yes or no.

RegDwigнt

20:31

Yeah it's pretty straightforward, until it gradually becomes pretty stupid.

Have you, excluding, unless?

Don't ask three questions in one. Make it three questions, dammit.

Anyway, I'd wager @Saladin never worked for the government or the military or IBM, so wevs.

Just say no and move on.

Johan Larsson

@MattЭллен which do you prefer? Add Haskell and F# to the mix.OrderBy(x => x.Awesomeness)

RegDwigнt

It's not like they are going to check it anyway. It's just an application.

Pretty ridiculous, if you ask me.

Matt Эллен

@JohanLarsson I prefer haskell. I haven't really tried f#, but I've not felt compelled to, either

Johan Larsson

!!define compel

Jarvis the Bot

@JohanLarsson My pocket dictionary just isn't good enough for you.

Matt Эллен

20:35

one l

RegDwigнt

Meh. "I prefer Haskell" is just a thing people say to impress other people.

Jarvis the Bot

@JohanLarsson compelled simple past tense and past participle of

@JohanLarsson compel (transitive, archaic, literally) To drive together, round up

Matt Эллен

@RegDwigнt I prefer haskell

RegDwigнt

I am out of impressions for today.

Try again tomorrow.

Johan Larsson

@MattЭллен C# vs Python then?

@JarvistheBot My pocket comprehension just isn't good enough for you.

Matt Эллен

20:38

@JohanLarsson hmmm. I'm not sure. I prefer c# for GUI stuff. I like python for web work and it's nice for scripting tasks, too

@RegDwigнt you remind me of RegDwigнt

RegDwigнt

Me, I prefer Turbo Pascal 5.5. There, handle that pickup line. Shows character. Not your run-of-the-mill Lisp shit.

Matt Эллен

Well, if I have to pick a language, my current fave is javascript

RegDwigнt

Alas, if websites had to be programmed in Moscow ML. What a world, what a world.

Would make people bloody think.

Matt Эллен

@JohanLarsson in this context it basically means "a strong need"

Johan Larsson

ty ty

RegDwigнt

20:42

Compel is basically like paypal, except for communists.

Johan Larsson

@MattЭллен whoa man, I'm eating here!

Matt Эллен

@JohanLarsson you no likey the javascript? to spicy for you?

RegDwigнt

@JohanLarsson you could hack his machine and remove javascript from his favorites. Problem solved.

Matt Эллен

I should really learn emacs lisp

@RegDwigнt how dare you!

RegDwigнt

@MattЭллен no, not me. Him.

I'm not a hackzor.

Johan Larsson

20:43

I know very little but the things I have done have been painful (Console.Log()-fest)

c c

choose matlab, this language is a poetry

Matt Эллен

@JohanLarsson back when I first found it, I hated it. The book I bought to learn about it didn't help. It was badly written and wrong.

Johan Larsson

ok you know better but I doubt I can learn to like it, don't wanna spel when I code :)

Matt Эллен

but years later I took a second go at it, after it had matured, I guess. Now I really like it

Johan Larsson

tried typescript?

Matt Эллен

20:46

no

Johan Larsson

me neither but I hear good things about it

Matt Эллен

hmmm. looks like "classical OO" shoved on top of javascript.

tchrist

@Kit I think I have a solution to a Problem!

> We're looking for long answers that provide some explanation and context. Don't just give a one-line answer; explain why your answer is right, ideally with citations. Answers that don't include explanations may be removed.

Matt Эллен

If I want that, I'll use python :D

c c

!!learn how "<>$rand(0,100)%" \w+

Jarvis the Bot

20:47

@cc Command how learned

tchrist

@MattЭллен Well, if that sort of object model makes you happy, sure. :)

c c

python with scipy is not bad, somewhat as great as matlab

tchrist

Python’s object model has certainly improved over its history. I still find it less elegant and more restrictive than I would like, but there are many that are worse.

Matt Эллен

a guy I work with uses scipy all the time. I've not needed it yet, but it sounds good.

hmmm. typescript.org is 503ing

@JohanLarsson ah! made by Mr. Hejlsberg! now I see what's drawn you to it :D

Johan Larsson

@MattЭллен :)

Matt Эллен

20:56

I mean typescriptlang.org :D

RegDwigнt

@MattЭллен TIL that the is restricted to singular.

skullpatrol

*through

Matt Эллен

@RegDwigнt well, sort of. I mean uncountable nouns are weird. They get some singular things ("the milk was...") and some not (*"a milk in my tea")

RegDwigнt

@skullpatrol Instructions unclear. I began on an empty sheet of paper and there were no doors at all. I immediately won.

skullpatrol

:D

Matt Эллен

21:04

It's a Kit! Happy Birthday!

KitFox

@tchrist Thanks.

RegDwigнt

Misspelling Kitday again.

Every year.

KitFox

Thank you, thank you.

Also, I'm sorry I missed your birthday, @Reg. Happy belated.

RegDwigнt

Now we know what a fox says.

@KitFox oh right. I actually almost forgot myself. Getting better at it every year.

skullpatrol

Happy Birthday!

KitFox

21:06

@RegDwigнt The problem is, I only ever seem to remember it when I have mine, and yours comes first. If you would just kindly move it to after, I would be more conscientious.

RegDwigнt

@MattЭллен see, I was expecting a more logical response identifying my non sequitur as such. Looks like my trolling has finally defought all logic!

@KitFox I know a whole lot of people like that.

Indeed I met yet another one just the other day.

skullpatrol

When was it?

Matt Эллен

@RegDwigнt you are indefoughtigible

RegDwigнt

An employee in our LEGO store has theirs on 18th.

KitFox

Maybe I can shift to remembering it on my son's birthday. Then I'd only be about a week late.

skullpatrol

21:09

Yours is the "boxing day" of Canada day :-)

or the eve of the eve of Independence day

KitFox

It's even better than that, as I was born two days before the Bicentennial. Two days later, and I would be named America Independence Fox.

I shit you not.

It's also a convenient way for me to remember how old the country is.

skullpatrol

:-)

RegDwigнt

No point in remembering how old the country is if the country is not old to begin with.

skullpatrol

How old is the USSR?

RegDwigнt

What is that?

skullpatrol

21:16

*was

RegDwigнt

See, no point in remembering how old the country is if the country not is to begin with.

skullpatrol

how long did it last?

RegDwigнt

Too long. And then some.

70+.

KitFox

Long enough to tarnish the glory of the CCCP.

RegDwigнt

But it's the same as with the US: what do you consider "the" country? It kept piling on stuff.

Sorry, I mean: bringing peace and democracy to places.

I thzink they started with nine republics. Or was it seven?

Then it went to fifteen.

The US is at fifty and counting.

KitFox

21:22

<-- so confused

RegDwigнt

Even Germany got from ten to eleven to sixteen.

And that's just in the last fifty years.

Only the Brits and the French are shrinking. Cowards.

skullpatrol

how many does Russia have?

RegDwigнt

I wouldn't begin to know.

They recently made Moscow three times larger.

Kid you not.

The country is getting larger from the inside.

skullpatrol

Moscow is the billionaire's city

RegDwigнt

One giant lie. I've been to Moscow, but I've not been a billionaire.

skullpatrol

21:26

More billionaires than any other city in the world.

RegDwigнt

Jul 12 '13 at 10:54, by RegDwighт

That whole appendix at the bottom. Ewww.

Jul 12 '13 at 10:54, by RegDwighт

It looks so hideous now.

What's that medical condition called?

KitFox

Squamous.

RegDwigнt

Inguinal hernia.

KitFox

That's how it looks. Like squamous cell melanoma.

skullpatrol

we need @medica :-)

RegDwigнt

21:30

There's a guy in Las Vegas, with inguinal hernia, who looks exactly like Moscow.

aedia λ

Happy birthday, @KitFox!

medica

@skullpatrol I heard a ping?

KitFox

@aediaλ Thank you.

RegDwigнt

I will spare you the photos.

But you can look him up on Reddit.

skullpatrol

2 mins ago, by RegDwigнt

What's that medical condition called?

medica

21:31

Hey, happy birthday, @KitFox!

KitFox

Thank you.

RegDwigнt

@skullpatrol I've long answered the question myself. But thanks for caring.

Click if you dare. Parental advisory. Vegas Baby!

Johan Larsson

@KitFox Ha den äran!

RegDwigнt

That's a link to the Reddit post, just in case you do reconsider halfway through.

KitFox

@JohanLarsson Tack!

I think.

skullpatrol

21:34

RegDwigнt

Oh right. I know a language, too.

Поздравляю с днем рождения, желаю счастья в личной жизни, Пух!

@skullpatrol Ron Swanson is right as usual.

medica

@skullpatrol What's that map look like?

KitFox

@RegDwigнt Спасибо, Piglet!

RegDwigнt

OMG she not only reads she understands.

Johan Larsson

Tack is correct, not sure if ha den äran is right, think it is and oldfashioned way to say it but makes very little sense when analyzing it.

medica

21:36

A map, to me (sorry).

KitFox

@RegDwigнt You know I have trouble with Cyrillic.

skullpatrol

@medica he said he answered it

KitFox

And I appreciate the challenge.

skullpatrol

7 mins ago, by RegDwigнt

Inguinal hernia.

RegDwigнt

@KitFox well yes, I know that, and that's precisely why I am shocked when you suddenly stop.

On the plus side, perhaps one day you'll finally watch the cartoon.

medica

21:37

Yeah, I saw that. And the melanoma. I'd have to go with the melanoma if I needed to. Inguinal hernias are very smooth, etc.

KitFox

Ha! See?

I know melanoma when I see it.

Which reminds me that I should have this mole checked out.

RegDwigнt

@medica not if you're 800+ years old. Nothing is smooth at that age. Least of all inguinal hernias.

medica

but squamous cell carcinoma looks different.

RegDwigнt

@KitFox you can know what you see, but only I know what I mean.

KitFox

sighs

It's my birthday. Pretty sure that makes me right about everything.

medica

21:40

@RegDwigнt Well, on a mummy, I think it might have a few surprises...

RegDwigнt

@KitFox you get to be right about everything once a year, and of all things you pick your birthday for that? I'd recommend a surprise attack in November instead.

KitFox

hahaha

medica

@KitFox - doing anything special for your birthday (like not cooking/serving dinner/etc?)

KitFox

We are ordered dinner from Desi's. We are playing video games. Nothing too exciting.

RegDwigнt

Nothing too exciting is the best kind of exciting.

KitFox

21:44

There are birthday cards for me, from my boys.

The littlest had shots today, so he's not feeling super great. I got croup from the eldest, so I don't feel so great either.

medica

Good birthday, sounds sweet and fun. Enjoy.

Oh, sorry to hear that.

KitFox

It's OK. It's my excuse to work from home tomorrow.

I can't talk anyway after the four meetings I had today.

RegDwigнt

is confused because of apparent infamiliarity with enough meanings of shots

KitFox

@RegDwigнt Vaccinations.

medica

yay! I love sick days (if it weren't for the actually sick part.)

KitFox

21:46

Immunizations?

@medica Not a sick day though. Just remote work.

medica

Less fun than a sick day, but still better than going to work, tho.

KitFox

Definitely.

medica

I wish I could work from home more. :)

RegDwigнt

@KitFox right. I guess I know enough meanings after all, but only care enough for vodka.

aedia λ

@KitFox Aw that sucks! I hope you all feel better soon.

medica

21:48

@KitFox Do both your boys go to school?

KitFox

@medica That would be weird, wouldn't it? You'd have to always keep your kitchen table cleared off and your steak knives sterilized.

@RegDwigнt That sounds like a good plan.

@aediaλ Thank you. It's no big deal. Just hard to talk.

@medica Not currently. It's summer. ;-)

Johan Larsson

in Sweden there is VAB, Vård Av Barn, meaning if your child is sick you can stay home with no 'karens' (failed to translate)

medica

that's what happend when kids become adults. The school year disappears. D'oh!

I did suture a couple of lacerations on my kitchen table though. That was fun. But, yeech for the nastier stuff.

KitFox

I prefer to do my suturing in the bath, for easy cleanup.

medica

:D

Why didn't I think of that?

RegDwigнt

21:55

off to look up suture, laceration, my

KitFox

Stitched, cut

Off to eat. Bai!

RegDwigнt

Have fun.

And get well soon.

skullpatrol

you do a lot of looking up, try looking down, you might find some money :-)

medica

Happy Bai.

RegDwigнt

I will be off in a minute.

tries to look down to skullpatrol; succeeds

skullpatrol

21:58

:(

RegDwigнt

An atypical reaction to success.

skullpatrol

I don't like to be looked down at

RegDwigнt

Now let me write down my stats for the day already and you'll be rid of me.

@skullpatrol then why you ask.

skullpatrol

I didn't ask

I made a joke

RegDwigнt

Ditto.

skullpatrol

22:00

icic

RegDwigнt

But now I'm off. Au ruguay.

skullpatrol

later

pal

Johan Larsson

22:44

@Cerberus link

skullpatrol

23:32

This, in my opinion, is a great quote: "there's literally nothing to be afraid of in mathematics, and a surprisingly large fraction of the work that goes into understanding something is just resolving not to be scared by it"

by Qiaochu Yuan

Robusto

@skullpatrol We had puzzles like that one in my game theory class in college. But I don't remember the math.

skullpatrol

@Robusto yep, as they say, use it or lose it

Robusto

It was pretty straightforward, IIRC.

I took game theory because I thought, hey, games! What could be more fun than that?

And then it turned out that they had tricked me into doing math.

@skullpatrol Sounds like something an Asian guy would say.

And I don't think I want to succeed Almo's golf video game.

skullpatrol

23:48

This is what a white guy would say:

"Young man, in mathematics you don't understand things. You just get used to them."

Robusto

And an American would say, "Aww, you didn't say there was going to be math!"

skullpatrol

:D

Transcript for

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…