English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

tchrist

00:09

@Xanne Handwriting has always been wildly divergent. That's what happened in all Middle English before Gutenberg locked it down. Well, he locked down Latin :) but you know what I mean.

Caxton.

> The Mississippi State Department of Health issued an isolation order Friday for people diagnosed with covid-19 that comes with a penalty for failure to comply.

The Freedom Fighters will be calling out the banners on that one.

> Mississippians with covid-19 must isolate at home or in an appropriate residential location for 10 days from the onset of illness or face up to five years in prison and a fine up to $5,000, State Health Officer Thomas Dobbs said in the order.

Banners which I presume will read Give me liberty and give me death.

Cerberus

00:48

What do we see?

From my great-great-grandfather's journal.

Mitch

@Cerberus where is that?

Cerberus

01:04

@Mitch Where do you think?

You have most probably been there.

CowperKettle

01:55

> the manufacturers of Hedgehog Flavour Crisps were taken to court under the Trade Descriptions Act as they did not contain actual hedgehog?

@Cerberus Looks like Chicago

M.A.R.

02:12

@tchrist I think it's further confirmation that they don't give a shit about him, and if they say they do it's some gaslighting ritual. They just hate lots of things the world is starting to accept and see the conman as the only person in power who can help them hate blacks, gays, Asians, abortion, social movements, welfare and the poor.

2

Meanwhile, our president is trying hard to be an incompetent mini-Trump, right up to the point of outrageously obvious nepotism

His cabinet consists mostly of former colleagues that have near zero experience regarding anything resembling their position. The minister of education is going to be someone who's only taught kindergarteners or something for three years, no experience in the ministry of education whatsoever.

So now, instead or half-charismaric educated liars, we'll be having uneducated, incompetent, uncharismatic, paranoid, primitive liars for four years. Thanks Obama, er, Trump

Fun times

@Cerberus oldish looking buildings remind me of how much more polluted it must have been back then

CowperKettle

02:35

Shrimp on the barbie

"Shrimp on the barbie" is a phrase that originated in a series of television advertisements by the Australian Tourism Commission starring Paul Hogan from 1984 through to 1990. The full quote spoken by Hogan is "I'll slip an extra shrimp on the barbie for you", and the actual slogan of the ad was "Come and say G'day". It has since been used, along with some variations, to make reference to Australia in popular culture. == Details == The advertisement pre-dated Hogan's popularity in the 1986 film Crocodile Dundee. Thus they were not initially seen as celebrity advertisements in the US, as he was...

CowperKettle

02:59

> Physiologically, people’s bodies aren’t built to handle heat beyond wet bulb temperatures — a combined measure of heat and humidity — of around 35° Celsius, or about 95° Fahrenheit (SN: 5/8/20). Mounting evidence shows that when heat taxes people’s bodies, their performance on various tasks, as well as overall coping mechanisms, also suffer.

sciencenews.org/article/…

Cerberus

@CowperKettle Not quite!

@M.A.R. It certainly was!

@Man_From_India This may or may not be significant.

@S.M.T Is it going well so far?

CowperKettle

03:17

Lenin playing chess at Maxim Gorky's estate on the Isle of Capri

Capri

Capri ( kə-PREE, US also KA(H)P-ree; Italian: [ˈkaːpri]; Neapolitan: [ˈkɑːpri]) is an island located in the Tyrrhenian Sea off the Sorrento Peninsula, on the south side of the Gulf of Naples in the Campania region of Italy. The main town Capri that is located on the island shares the name. It has been a resort since the time of the Roman Republic. Some of the main features of the island include the Marina Piccola (the little harbour), the Belvedere of Tragara (a high panoramic promenade lined with villas), the limestone crags called sea stacks that project above the sea (the faraglioni), the town...

> In 27 AD, Tiberius permanently moved to Capri, running the Empire from there until his death in 37 AD.

Running an empire from a resort.

Cerberus

@tchrist Very American measures, though! Might scare some people...

@M.A.R. To put that in perspective, many of our ministers don't have much experience in the fields of their ministries, not seldom none at all. I agree, though, that this is generally bad.

@CowperKettle He became kind of a paranoid recluse, Ibelieve.

CowperKettle

03:57

BSOD fountain in Chicago

tchrist

04:08

@Cerberus You prefer not just offering asylum to Typhoid Mary but giving her the keys to the city as well? Imagine a rabid madman who refuses to stop biting people even when ordered not to. Or someone who is HIV positive knowingly and deliberately having unprotected sex with as many people as possible and never telling them. Public health laws exist for good reasons.

CowperKettle

> In the United States, over the past 60 years, only four people out of 148 cases (2.7%) survived an infection with Naegleria fowleri

Xanne

06:14

The AQI in South Lake Tahoe is over 650 and “beyond index.” On the north shore it’s 251.

Just you waite, Colorado.

S.M.T

06:26

@Cerberus It has begun

The 3 areas which I earlier told you are recaptured by taliban.

M.A.R.

@Cerberus I agree that lack of a hefty resume is in itself not much of a red alarm, and in some positions not at all. It's often supporting evidence that someone 'doesn't deserve' to be in some position of power. For all I know our current president is a college dropout or something like that, and his goons are probably as uneducated as he is, and when the question inevitably becomes "Is a guy that hires his favorite buddies to important, diverse positions of power some benevolent [...]

[...] Caesar Augustus or is it just good ol' nepotism with theocracy topping?" part of the answer is "Their CVs aren't encouraging in telling us they will know what they're doing"

@CowperKettle The ones that go to the brain are the worst. There was also this worm whose immature predatory form could migrate freely in different organs and sometimes landed in the brain. The subject is too harrowing even for this chat.

Which brings me to what I've wondered for a long time: Who studied that crap?!

S.M.T

Did you know that soviets made a deal with masood in 1985 in which masood after winning the war had let the soviets go back but took a lot of guns,trucks from them. That’s the ammunition Masood son is now telling about in news.

M.A.R.

Are they such moral people that they sacrifice their sleep at night to explore these monstrosities, or are they fascinated by them like some sort of mad scientist thing? Shrug

@S.M.T Source?

Faheem Mitha

06:48

@M.A.R. That sounds like our "people". Also, our people are gangsters. Like literally.

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha morning! We seem to be headed in that direction but I don't wanna be an unnecessarily hasty alarmist

If this 'new Iranian elite' as dubbed by US media which is not new at all becomes a group of gangsters, they'd probably make really incompetent ones

Faheem Mitha

The way it works is that their cases never come to trial, so they carry on being politicians.

@M.A.R. Good morning.

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha yeah guess it's just how the world works

Faheem Mitha

@M.A.R. Who is the "half-charismaric educated liar"?

@M.A.R. In some places. I don't think it's the case everywhere.

At least, I hope not. Obviously, I'm not familiar with the details of world politicians.

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha Rouhani and his goons

Though the VP's nose was in the way of his rugged good looks

Faheem Mitha

06:54

@M.A.R. So he retired? Or just temporarily out?

M.A.R.

Well democrats didn't 'retire' when Trump won, but here we have a tendency of throwing lots of shit in the previous president's general direction and blaming everything on the last government

Cheapest PR trick in the book

Faheem Mitha

@M.A.R. Yes, that's common here too. I suppose it's common everywhere.

M.A.R.

And considering his failed JCPOA plan he won't be showing his face much anymore

Faheem Mitha

@M.A.R. Not sure why I said retire. But he seems like he's a senior citizen.

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha Well here it's all they do so it's kinda stark

@FaheemMitha All of them are

Last term saw several of them die off.

Faheem Mitha

06:56

@M.A.R. Oh.

M.A.R.

But I think Fard was a bit too optimistic. It seems to me the younger generation of the 1% percent can still be as full of shit as the older one. Maybe that's my despair talking.

Xanne

@Cerberus The photo is New York? London?

M.A.R.

There's no hope for reform.

Faheem Mitha

@M.A.R. If I understand correctly, your country is subject to unremitting harrassment from the USA. Like Cuba. That probably does not help things.

I know Cuba has a very difficult time.

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha mhm. Not at all

Faheem Mitha

06:59

@M.A.R. Not at all? What about the sanctions?

They regularly fine people for trading with Iran.

Sanctions against Iran

There have been a number of sanctions against Iran imposed by a number of countries, especially the United States, and international entities. The first sanctions were imposed by the United States in November 1979 after a group of radical students seized the American Embassy in Tehran and took hostages. These sanctions were lifted in January 1981 after the hostages were released. Sanctions were reimposed by the United States in 1987 in response to Iran's actions from 1981 to 1987 against the U.S. and vessels of other countries in the Persian Gulf and support for terrorism. The sanctions were expanded...

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha I meant "it doesn't help at all". I'm just bummed out that we're headed in the same direction as we would have been as a US puppet, except we keep snarling at them and are devoid of the few benefits being a bully's ally entails.

Faheem Mitha

This may have errors or be incomplete. I remember about the oil stuff.

@M.A.R. Sorry, I'm confused.

All I'm saying is that sanctions harm a country. Hardly a controversial statement.

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha We often have shortages of medicine because of these sanctions. I've witnessed it myself for two decades. It disgusts me that some US leftists twist that to mean it's good for us because we're more incentivized to rebel against the regime

Faheem Mitha

@M.A.R. It's obviously bad for the country. Any country.

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha Sure, they've harmed us plenty. I'm saying if we were a US pseudo-colony wagging our tails at our overlords like Saudi Arabia, things wouldn't have been much different for normal people.

Faheem Mitha

07:03

Sorry, I'm losing track of what we are talking about. All I said is that sanctions are bad for the country. And don't help if you are trying to deal with other problems. Obviously.

@M.A.R. Presumably you would not have the sanctions, though.

M.A.R.

Wealth disparity used to be surprisingly low here, for a third world country.

Faheem Mitha

So no shortages etc.?

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha Plenty. As I said, we often have medicine or food shortages, even though the US claims the sanctions won't harm those.

Faheem Mitha

Having sanctions is bad. Being a US puppet is bad. But I hope those aren't the only alternatives.

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha How I wish that were true.

Faheem Mitha

07:05

@M.A.R. No, I mean if you were a US puppet, then there would be no shortages. As you are, under sanctions, clearly there are shortages.

Sorry, I'm communicating badly here.

M.A.R.

But what I'm saying is it's not only the sanctions that are driving us to ruin and hopelessness

Faheem Mitha

@M.A.R. Are you saying those are really the only alternatives?

@M.A.R. OK. What are the other problems?

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha I don't see a single person in the horizon that would try to fix this country.

Faheem Mitha

I didn't mean to suggest there weren't other problems. Just that the sanctions are an added burden, and get in the way of dealing with those problems.

@M.A.R. I hear these things are a group effort. Expecting a magic person to arrive in a puff of smoke, or via umbrella, probably isn't useful.

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha Looking at Saudi Arabia, a US 'colony' that's exploited like that often results in huge wealth disparity, lack of diversification in the national products and becoming dependent on other, often richer nations, and the benefit of the international community mostly looking the other way when you chop up journalists.

Faheem Mitha

07:08

But I don't know Iran at all. Except I've met some Iranians here and there. Also, your women are very pretty.

@M.A.R. Agreed. But I was asking about what your other problems were. Maybe I'm missing something.

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha I don't see that group effort either. If anything, the group efforts here are only directed at fighting nonsensical laws or becoming, culturally, that US puppet.

Faheem Mitha

@M.A.R. I mean, if things get better, it will be because of a group effort. Or not at all. An individual can't so much, IMO. And the role of individuals is much overstated, IMO.

@M.A.R. Fighting nonsensical laws sounds like a reasonable thing to do.

Better than not fighting them.

One concern is population control. Here it's a big problem. If Iran let's it get out of hand, you're pretty much screwed, I think.

Anyway, looks like it is nearly lunch time.

M.A.R.

Well, for example, 15 years ago there were efforts at diversification of products, we were developing nuclear energy, and wealth disparity was surprisingly good (as in, low) for a country like Iran (so lower than Scandinavia of course but not like Saudi Arabia).

Recent years have seen us become more and more dependent on selling oil, which would have been what the US wanted of us, to be a cheap source for resources, and many Iranians escape the harsh reality here, essentially providing the US and Europe with cheap labor, which is again what the US would have wanted if they had more control…

Faheem Mitha

@M.A.R. So all of this bad stuff is unrelated to sanction activity?

@M.A.R. "Escape the harsh reality here", meaning leave to live in other countries? Like US and Europe? The so-called Brain Drain?

That (people leaving) happens a lot here too, of course. Though not the oil selling stuff, obviously.

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha Except maybe the last part, all of it is directly affected by sanctions. But my point is I'm having a hard time being morally superior for being independent of the US if it's going to mean mostly the same things for the people. So why bother?

Faheem Mitha

07:17

I left myself. I would probably have stayed gone, if it was not family obligations.

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha Yep.

Faheem Mitha

But most Indians don't have anything here, so they have no reason to stay.

@M.A.R. Still better to be independent, regardless. One should be free to make ones own mistakes.

But the sanction stuff sounds pretty bad.

M.A.R.

They seem awfully similar to the mistakes we would have been told to make

It's a bit of an off-hand remark for me to say so, but I suspect it all is because few people relatively want us to be independent. From the ordinary citizen to people in power, maybe especially people in power, our mindset is that of a dependent nation, except we did something half a century ago and got ourselves into a pickle.

These people probably think deals and alliances are made behind closed doors or with coercion or ultimatums. It works well enough for them I suppose, and the money keeps flowing that way, but right now I don't see us ever breaking free of the sanctions like Vietnam.

We had a chance 15 years ago, now, not so much

CowperKettle

Today is the warmest 24 August in Yekaterinburg on record. An all-time high for a fifth day in a row. The heatwave started on 19 August. It's now +33°С. e1.ru/text/summer/2021/08/24/70095515

Wow.

M.A.R.

33!

Is nowhere safe?

CowperKettle

07:28

We have almost the same weather these days as Tabriz

M.A.R.

You must be melting like ice cream

CowperKettle

This is the snapshot for Tabriz ^^^

M.A.R.

What specially sucks is I never feel like exercising in this heat

CowperKettle

I jog in the evenings, just before the sunset.

M.A.R.

Still too hot here for that. The sun is relentless

CowperKettle

07:30

Matt E. Эллен

08:06

@M.A.R. it will outlast us all

Faheem Mitha

08:50

@M.A.R. (Sorry, was away.) When you say dependendent, dependent on who (or whom)?

@M.A.R. Iran is currently under sanctions of some sort or the other, correct?

CowperKettle

11:08

A large forest fire to the west of Yekaterinburg

Just about 30 km from me

S.M.T

AmrullahSaleh2
·
15h
Talibs aren't allowing food & fuel to get into Andarab valley. The humanitarian situation is dire. Thousands of women & children have fled to mountains. Since the last two days Talibs abduct children & elderly and use them as shields to move around or do house search.

From Twitter.

republicworld.com/world-news/rest-of-the-world-news/…

This is still a good news. I think other countries are also helping but all is done secretly to hide from taliban since no other country also want war.

Situation is pretty bad. Probably they’ll lose & just like old times. Some people will start protesting & just like every country has an Independence Day. Afghanistan will also have it but after some years .

indiatoday.in/world/story/…

Attack by northern alliance

CowperKettle

12:25

Igor Vovkovinskiy

Igor Vovkovinskiy (Ukrainian: Ігор Вовковинський, romanized: Ihor Vovkovynskyj; September 18, 1982 – August 20, 2021), also known as Igor Ladan, was a Ukrainian-American law student, actor and tallest living person in the United States, at 7 feet 8+1⁄3 inches (234.5 cm), briefly taking the record from George Bell. Originally from Ukraine, Vovkovinskiy moved to Rochester, Minnesota in 1989 to be treated at the Mayo Clinic. At that time, he was already at least six feet tall.Vovkovinskiy acted in commercials and films, including the 2011 comedy Hall Pass, and became better known for wearing a T...

235 cm

CowperKettle

13:54

@S.M.T I hope the anti-Taliban forces manage to entrenche themselves in some area.

S.M.T

14:12

@CowperKettle Yeah. Also , I hope they win because they have an advantage of being at top of the mountain. It’s always easier to attack your enemies from top than ground.

aljazeera.com/news/2021/8/24/… @CowperKettle

Mitch

@Cerberus The view from the water and the one building with the very square tower seem awfully familiar, and Chicago would be my first guess, but none of the other buildings are familiar at all. Of course many skylines have changed considerably (there's a great book called 'Lost Chicago' which has photos of the many noted buildings in Chicago that were taken down decades ago). But I don't remember any good skyline pictures from that book.

But it only takes a couple new buildings to alter the personality of a skyline. I visit Chicago every few years and skyscrapers last a long while so individually they are landmarks, but one extra skyscraper can change the whole look.

There are parts of Chicago's downtown that I just don't recognize anymore, like it's an entirely new location altogether.

@S.M.T 'Northern alliance' is always science-fictiony to me.

Star Wars-like intro crawl: "The northern alliance has sent a delegation to the United Federation of Planets but were attacked by the rebel fleet from the Outer Rim. The banned flux capacitor was used in an ambush off the shoulder of Orion."

S.M.T

14:39

@Mitch Why ?

Mitch

@S.M.T It's just has this sound reminiscent of vague but specific references that are used in science fiction to sound like they are like things we've vaguely heard in the news.

Matt E. Эллен

15:10

@Mitch Mitch makes me think of Dawson's Creek. My partner's been watching it for the first time on Netflix.

CowperKettle

15:35

Etymology of the day: gossip (late Old English godsibb, ‘godfather, godmother, baptismal sponsor’, literally ‘a person related to one in God’, from god ‘God’ + sibb ‘a relative’ (see sib). In Middle English the sense was ‘a close friend, a person with whom one gossips’, hence ‘a person who gossips’, later (early 19th century) ‘idle talk’ (from the verb, which dates from the early 17th century).)

Matt E. Эллен

cool

CowperKettle

@S.M.T Maybe. But the Taliban now has all kinds of high tech equipment. Drones. Planes. Helicopters.

moorgatebooks.com/05/when-gossiping-was-a-good-thing

> The wording of these four tomes, published between 1752 and 1807, suggests that successful man-midwives did not call their patients’ friends gossips!

So, by the end of the 18th century the term 'gossip' started to take on a derogatory meaning.

Faheem Mitha

@M.A.R. Does Iran have insurance for bank accounts? In case a bank fails. And if so, how much is it per account?

Mitch

16:04

@MattE.Эллен Mitch makes me think someone is calling me for dinner. I'll also answer to 'Dinner!'

Matt E. Эллен

@Mitch Mitch seems to make us think a lot of things. We should get him to stop.

CowperKettle

16:23

Forest fire still burning

M.A.R.

@FaheemMitha point is, like many other third world countries, we very much rather cling onto someone. If not the US, then China. Nobody's having any grand thoughts about independence or utopia.

@FaheemMitha yes

@FaheemMitha i dunno, probably not. A bank failed a couple of years ago, they called it a scam on the news and that people lost money, I dunno who was compensated and how many.

I didn't care enough about it to find out more.

Faheem Mitha

17:56

@M.A.R. I'm not familiar with Iran at all, so I can't comment. But it's hard to gauge the mood of an entire country. Once there was the Non-Aligned Movement. Which ironically is where the Third World term comes from. It could be nice if we saw that again.

I used to hear about it a lot as a child when I didn't understand the issues.

@M.A.R. OK. Oil sanctions? Goods and medicines sanctions?

@M.A.R. If financialtribune.com/articles/economy-business-and-markets/… is correct, then

> It guarantees the deposits of each customer in every member bank or credit institution for up to 1 billion rials ($26,700) and if the bank or credit institution finds itself bankrupt, as per the regulations, the fund will reimburse depositors up to that ceiling.

Better than India, which is currently at 5 lakhs (USD 6,742.86 at current rates of exchange).

Until recently it was 20% of that.

The Indian banking system has huge amounts of fraud. Much of it politically connected.

S.M.T

@CowperKettle Extremely bad.

Mitch

18:31

@MattE.Эллен clutches head in hands muttering stop stop stop

M.A.R.

19:13

@FaheemMitha well it's probably the mood of a couple billion young people in Asia who think they can't be happy unless they try to imitate every aspect of the Western lifestyle.

Faheem Mitha

@M.A.R. Yes, India used to be like that when I was young. Possibly still is.

I was actually rather starry-eyed myself about such things. It's embarrassing to recollect.

But, well, we were all young and foolish once.

Xanne

19:56

AQI at Lake Tahoe is now 330.

Cerberus

21:38

@tchrist I'm just saying the severity of some of those punishments is quite American. Not saying that's a bad idea. But consider how private citizens will be fined €95 here for breaking Corona rules. It's just a very different approach.

@M.A.R. A sensible point.

@Xanne Ding! It is New York. Apparently, my great-great-grandfather visited it together with his unmarried daughter in 1900. I am now in their former house, where I found the journal.

He praised the city for its modernity, it seems.

tchrist

22:42

@Cerberus That's more of a tax than a fine. :( Unless they can be forcibly imprisoned, it won't stop them from endangering the lives of others. You need actual criminal penalties. Imagine them going into a nursing home! Oh you already paid your 95 euros to be allowed to wander around wherever you please? Well that's ok then, step right in. Death is death. It is the job of the State to protect its citizens from unreasonable harm caused by others' malice or carelessness.

Dealing out lethal illness really is in a different class of crime.

And it is a crime, whether your law recognizes it as such or not.

It's not like trespassing. It's reckless endangerment.

It's one thing if you know. It's another if you do know and you don't care whom you kill.

Remember I lost a friend to this.

2

user178758

@Mitch and vice versa

classic

Mitch

23:01

@Cerberus bows deeply

user178758

Very much above average imo

Mitch

user178758

:D

Mitch

haha birb is the word

user178758

yuppers

Mitch

23:12

There's a lot of stupid stuff out there that is very entertaining.

cats being mean to dogs.

love it

the otter wars

better than the fast and the furious movies (and that's saying a lot)

They should have a 'people slipping on bananas' channel

maybe that's a little too painful

user178758

31 seasons of AFV agrees with you

Xanne

Manhattan Life Insurance Building

The Manhattan Life Insurance Building was a 348 ft (106 m) tower on Broadway in the Financial District of Manhattan, New York City. == History == The original structure at 64–66 Broadway was completed in 1894 to the designs of the architects of Kimball & Thompson, and was slightly extended north in 1904 to 68–70 Broadway. It was the first skyscraper to pass 330 ft (100 m) in Manhattan. The building was sold at least twice. In 1926, the Manhattan Life Insurance Company sold the building to Frederick Brown, who then re-sold it to the Manufacturer's Trust Company a few weeks later. Then, in 1928...

@Cerberus This may be the tallest building in your photo of NY 1900. Probably an historic photo, in any case.

Xanne

23:30

@Cerberus See also “ new york skyline 1900” in Google. Some of the same buildings.

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