Trump says the Republican health care bill will have Heart™ ...

I just bought the D. Appleton-Century Co. New Century Dictionary of 1944. It comes in two volumes and certainly has the prettiest covers of all of my dictionaries so far, with embossed borders

Does anybody else have trouble spelling wiktionary? I always want to put an additional i in it, like wikipedia.

@Tonepoet Me too.

@Tonepoet yeah, I do that

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Offensive body detected, offensive title detected: How would i write "fucked up" in an essay by onewouldnotbeconsideredshitte on english.SE

The phonemic transcriptions of industry and industrial in the M-W dictionary suggests that the u is pronounced the same in both words: \ˈin-(ˌ)də-strē\ and \in-ˈdə-strē-əl\ both have a schwa following the \d\. This is rather strange.

Do you pronounce them the same? I think the stressed vowel in industrial is not a schwa.

And is there no difference between the vowels in mother? M-W and ODO suggest that the only difference is the stress: \ˈmə-thər\, which, again, I find a bit surprising.

why all the interest in pronunciation pal?

Why not? :)

just wondering :)

Partly because I don't want to sound foreign.

accents are extremely difficult to change

I've got Arabic pronunciation down pat. Want my English to be as refined.

@Justwinbaby For me, that's the easiest part to learn. I have a good ear for this stuff.

I guess.

cool

What would be correct tag(s) for this question: Term for type of fast food restaurant? Perhaps expression-requests?

@MartinSleziak single-word-requests

@terdon I have considered that as the first possibility. The fact that the OP does not say that it has to be single word is what made me hesitant.

Hmm. It sounds like they're asking for a single word:

> Is there English term for. . .

Hm, so perhaps the problem is that I misunderstood what the term term means.

However, I guess I can leave the retagging (if needed) to the regulars now that it has been discussed in chat. (If I edited it, it would need to go through suggested edit review, so I would have to bother one or two reviewers with that.)

@MartinSleziak That's fine. Thanks for bringing it up!

I added both, to be on the safe side.

Thanks for the retag.

np

#TrashTiresTchrist

@terdon @MartinSleziak Term can mean either a word or a phrase, so it should have both phrase-requests and single-word-requests

@terdon a 'term' is one or more words

@terdon I missed that. XD

'term' covers phrase and single word

Yeah, but somehow asking for a term makes me thing of a single word, but as I said, I added both tags since it wasn't entirely clear.

@Tonepoet Oh. Jinx. I should read first

@Mitch So should I...

And check the question :P

english.stackexchange.com/revisions/395138/2

@terdon A term would mean one term, which could be one phrase.

WORM

Write Once, Read Maybe

@Tonepoet Yes, but dunno. I would have asked for a term or phrase in that case. But anyway. All fixed now.

Are you sure it's fixed now?

@terdon I think "a word or phrase" would be better in that case. I usually only use the word term when I want to mean both of those words at once.

@Mitch Batten down the hatches! She's gonna blow!

@Færd the schwa is very closely related to the vowel in 'cup' (which is the second vowel in 'industrial'

@Tonepoet haha. I was poking the bear

@terdon I was funning before but now that I actually looked...

terminology is not the same as term.

term is not an abbreviation for terminology

a term is one or more words that together mean a single entity

@Mitch I didn't add that one. I only failed to remove it.

terminology is the selection/set of vocabulary particular to a given field. similar to a word list, vocabulary, lexicon, jargon.

@terdon oh.

@Mitch Um. No shit?

nvm

It's not exactly an obscure word :)

@Mitch I doubt think Terdon was suggesting that. Who says a terminology?

@Tonepoet people

'terminology can be mass or count depending on the situation

@Mitch I believe the count definition is much rarer though and doesn't make much sense in this context though.

"Here is a terminology for a hardware store and here is one for a car parts store"

Live demo: artlebedev.ru/type/lamon/drive

@Mitch Indeed. You're acknowledging of my claim actually.

They ain't the same thing.

They are in terms of the position and movement of the lower jaw, but aren't in terms of ... something else. I'm not quite sure.

(Correction: acknowledging of my claim)

@Færd but they are very close, and there's lots out there on schwa and low back vowels. stressed vs unstressed. I have a hard time explaining the difference (if there is any in either production or perception)

Where do I go to make programming snack questions?

@Færd This doesn't apply to everyone, but for me, I think the vowel in "industry" is higher than the vowel in "industrial". It's like [ə] vs. [ɐ]. I have some form of the weak vowel merger, so for me non-final schwa and /ɪ/ are more or less neutralized. But word final "schwa" (in words like "comma" and so on, and also in plural forms like "commas") is [ɐ]. Also, stressed schwa doesn't exist in my phonemic inventory, so the stressed forms of words like "just", "of", "was", "what" have [ɐ].

@sumelic I think that's more or less the way I've come to be pronouncing these things. And, indeed, it doesn't apply to everyone. Thanks.

What about weak to? How do you pronounce that?

The consensus is, of course, that weak to has a schwa, but I guess not everyone does it the same.

@Færd Oh, weak "to" and "the" have /ə/. I'm not sure about "a", now that I think about it.

Which to is the weak one?

After thinking about it a bit more, I think "a" seems more like it has [ɐ] than other weak forms because the vowel is word-initial. It seems that, in addition to my sense that a stressed vowel cannot be realized as [ə], I have a tendency to not identify vowels as [ə] when they come either at the start or the end of a word. That said, although "amoral" and "immoral" seem to have a slight but definite difference for me, "except" and "accept" and "affect" and "effect" are more iffy.

So I think I might use [ə] word-intially (and possibly word-finally) more often than I realize.

@sumelic Damn. Had you asked me a minute ago, I would have told you that I pronounce effect completely different from affect and the same for except and accept. You made me realize that actually, I don't. They're probably different but certainly similar.

Huh. Cool, I love it when I find out things about the way I speak I wasn't even aware of :)

@terdon prose. For years. Didn't know.