English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

3:15 AM

@Lawrence I know, but ...

@Lawrence ... that's not the message that you replied to at first. :)

@Cerberus Isn't that obvious? Is that what the American/Freudian school really denies?

@Cerberus It's not something a Farsi speaker normally discerns, but yeah. The two pronunciations of the word کون (meaning ass) on this page have two different /k/s, the first think and the second thick. They have totally different feels and are (or can be) used in different situations.

English /k/ is mostly like our think /k/; I've heard thick ones too, though. (Standard) Arabic /k/ is also mostly thin.

But Turkish has both I guess, maybe @M.A.R. can attest to that.

Oh, I forgot to link to the page: forvo.com/word/%DA%A9%D9%88%D9%86/#fa

@Mitch That's interesting! This is a chaotic world, though. Something as insignificant as a war can change the course.

Cerberus

3:37 AM

@Færd To some degree, that is what they deny. Their approach is to portray almost anything we consider a conscious decision to be mostly or wholly based on subconscious, often unwanted workings of the brain.

Færd

That's what I guessed you meant, but there was no harm in asking.

@Mitch And look at China's growth: it's almost linear between now and 2030, not slacking or slowing down.

Cerberus

Yeah, I'd be a bit sceptical.

Færd

Generally yeah, but I have no idea about this particular issue.

@Cerberus Well, as I'm sure you know, unwanted and subconscious are not the same. And there probably are levels of subconscious the workings of which are easily traceable and levels that are more subtle or hidden (that's the picture I have of it). Maybe they use subconscious as an umbrella term for them all, not to mysterize the origins of our every behavior.

Cerberus

3:54 AM

Absolutely.

About everything but your last sentence.

Færd

Speaking of chaos, this is awesome:

A visualization of chaos: 41 triple pendulums with very slightly different initial conditions https://t.co/CTiABFVWHW

Tweeted by fermatslibrary on March 5, 2017 at 2:15 PM

Lawrence

5:28 AM

@Færd You wrote three lines consecutively. They were related. My reply could only point to one of them. I pointed to the start of that trio.

Hugo

6:24 AM

Top tip! The OED is asking for words related to parenting, and if you follow the link from public.oed.com/the-language-of-parenting-mumsnet-access you can search the OED for free, presumably until the end of this month. The list of submitted words is interesting too, add any if you have any! mumsnet.com/Talk/what_were_reading/…

englishstudent

8:00 AM

@Tonepoet Do you have a link? If yes, then I will be happy to take a look.

Tonepoet

@englishstudent I do.

englishstudent

Oh great. Thanks tonepoet.

looks

Tonepoet

It's probably worth noting that at least the Merriam-Webster key isn't perfectly consistent across all editions of their dictionaries, so I'm not sure exactly how helpful it'll be.

englishstudent

8:15 AM

@Tonepoet It is helpful to me. The page you link has IPA and AHD transcription system symbols so I can compare them easily now. By the way, are all those all symbols that AHD has? The list looks quite short.

I don't know. I could be wrong.

I also found this post on the internet if you interested in reading discussions: forum.wordreference.com/threads/…

Tonepoet

@englishstudent I am not sure. Keep in mind that the A.H.D. and Merriam-Webster systems are specifically designed for English, and American English at that though.

englishstudent

But they are talking about Longman Dictionary, hmm so I don't know how relevant that would be to our discussion.

@Tonepoet yeah.

Tonepoet

@englishstudent Longman uses I.P.A. according to the webpage I showed you. It's of no special relevance as a result.

Pandya

@AndrewLeach Is it worth to visit this question? Or the answers to this are enough or it is worth to ask this question on ELL? (If I'm having samr question)

englishstudent

@Tonepoet Yeah the page is missing these symbols I found on AHD I have. Here is the screenshot I just took:

It is from AHD.

@Tonepoet Oh never mind that's only a sample in your link. So it is not complete obviously.

Andrew Leach

8:26 AM

@Pandya My comment on the duplicate should be sufficient. No: it's not worth visiting the duplicate (if you can see it); the duplicate is closable because of insufficient research. If you find the existing answers are not good enough, by all means ask a new question referencing that one and explaining why they are not good enough, together with your own research.

However it seems OK to me. Rules are external, principles are internal.

Pandya

@AndrewLeach ok. Thanks!

Tonepoet

@englishstudent Well that's unfortunate. I hope it can still be of some help.

englishstudent

Yeah I know. I will search for a better page/guide like that too and see if I can come up with anything good.

M.A.R.

8:48 AM

@Færd Turkish has everything O.O

key_asdfg

9:28 AM

What is this guy saying here after "the same for notebooks" til "little baby so dim"? youtu.be/oRCXYXszi8U?t=39

Andrew Leach

I think he's saying "instead of a full-size DIMM you get a little baby DIMM" -- that is, memory chips are smaller.

M.A.R.

@key_asdfg It's a little maybe so dim

What wait, did I look at the right moment?

Andrew Leach

He then goes on to talk about how you find the right memory, so dim (from auto-recognition) is likely to be DIMM.

And what he's holding looks like a desktop-size DIMM.

M.A.R.

Oh, right

key_asdfg

Ah, that DIMM....I got it, thanks!

Andrew Leach

9:33 AM

Dual In-line Memory Module, IIRC.

Automatic subtitles usually work, but that speaker was bound to cause problems.

M.A.R.

My speaker makes weird noises lately and I haven't got to fix it

key_asdfg

But hey, he says something like "so DIMM?"

M.A.R.

They're not that distracting or concerning

key_asdfg

He says something like "but the main difference is being that instead of a full-sized DIMM and its little baby... so DIMM." Does it make sense?

M.A.R.

'It's a little baby so DIMM', yeah, that seems like what he says

key_asdfg

9:37 AM

Is it natural English? DIMM sould be a noun

Ah,

I got it, it means "so the main difference is DIMM."

Thanks!

Andrew Leach

@key_asdfg I think it's a "little baby-size DIMM".

key_asdfg

I thought he was saying something like "it's a little baby that's so [adjective like cute]."

at first

M.A.R.

Well yeah, that's what the intonation suggests

Andrew Leach

I think he's only talking to Americans. I find him rather difficult to understand.

M.A.R.

@AndrewLeach This makes sense. Or 'baby-sized'

key_asdfg

9:42 AM

@Andrew Are you sure? on my speaker I can hear the "o" sound in "so" clearly. It doesn't sound like "sized"

Andrew Leach

Hmm. Perhaps it's "baby, like so, DIMM" -- like so as in thus. But his excitable speech is horrible for this sort of thing.

key_asdfg

By the way how do you transcribe the way he said DIMM? He said it like DIMMMMA.

And how does he sound btw? Is it common for people to talk like that?

Andrew Leach

He released the M rather extravagantly. I wouldn't bother transcribing the ma at the end at all.

key_asdfg

Is it geek-ish at all?

I see.

Andrew Leach

If you've been given this as a transcription exercise, your teacher is ... um ...

key_asdfg

9:48 AM

Oh I chose this video myself.

Is he that weird?

Andrew Leach

He's American. Weirdness is relative: everyone thinks everyone else is weird.

I can't spell wierd. I always type it wrong.

M.A.R.

Heh

Andrew Leach

I before E.

M.A.R.

I was wierding weird a couple of months ago

@AndrewLeach I believe you spell wierd perfectly

Andrew Leach

Yes. Weird, isn't it?

M.A.R.

9:51 AM

Wired.

key_asdfg

I just don't have any idea what kind of category people speak like him typically fall into. I mean you have some categories of image of people you've had from observing your school classmates, right? typically geek-ish, mean girl etc...I just don't have any idea because I've never been in school in an English speaking country.

M.A.R.

@key_asdfg The category of people that want to make an enthusiastic YouTube video

key_asdfg

Ah so his speech style is just a typical video host speech.

M.A.R.

@Mitch That proves [word-choice] is the source of your problems.

Shtoopid meta tags

Andrew Leach

@key_asdfg It's enthusiastic, excitable even; he seems knowledgeable on his subject. He wants to get that across. Unfortunately his enthusiasm gets in the way.

key_asdfg

9:59 AM

I see. By the way, what kind of British accent would you recommend to others to pick up? I'm interested in picking up one, but there's a lot and don't know which to choose.

Oh, one more question, do a lot of staff at electronic stores speak like the guy in the video?

Andrew Leach

I've never encountered anyone who speaks like the guy in the video. But then I'm British.

As for an accent, "standard" would be best.

Unfortunately, even the BBC don't use it much on the English-language World Service.

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English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…