English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

OK, but is it also hard to pronounce? I can see why you could have trouble differentiating between S and X, but pronouncing X is just like pronouncing K+S.

Kit Z. Fox

It's probably on account of having the consonant sounds um...in tandem?

johnchae

Hmm, is it really that easy?

:p

terdon

@johnchae Of course it's easy for us. Natives find all sounds in their language easy. That doesn't mean it's easy for anybody else.

johnchae

2:14 PM

I'll try it later, and yeah, will be getting it covered in my next recording

I mean "s" vs "x"

PhMgBr

"It's easy for US" might be one of Trump's mottoes.

Kit Z. Fox

'x' has a definite 'k' sound at the front. For me, 'x' and 's' sound nothing alike.

terdon

I am always fascinated by how non-natives can confuse what, to me, are two very different sounds. Of course, I also have the problem when listening to other languages. My French friends were always amused by how many vowels I confused. As far as they were concerned, they were totally different but sounded almost identical to me.

johnchae

Oh Yeaaaaaahh

Thank you so much guys

I never thought it would be that easy

I just tried it with Google Now

Kit Z. Fox

@terdon Same for me. I could never get French verb endings to sound right.

terdon

2:16 PM

?

johnchae

and it immediately recognize the word exactly

Yay

Kit Z. Fox

Great. Add it to your practice list.

terdon

@KitZ.Fox It got easier with time. After a few years living there, I could tell the difference but I couldn't always reproduce it.

johnchae

I got it

terdon

@johnchae Nice!

Kit Z. Fox

2:16 PM

fox, box, socks.

rocks, talks, walks.

johnchae

Thank you so so much

Ixrec

@terdon I'm beyond hopeless at the tones in Chinese, but then Japanese native speakers always get "l" and "r" mixed up in English words

johnchae

You guys don't know how I feel right now since I just solved one of the big problems since learning English

I mean, before this, I always tried to avoild these words

Kit Z. Fox

@Ixrec That is because of retroflexion.

johnchae

I mean the words with "x" at the ending

"I'm beyond hopeless at the tones in Chinese, but then Japanese native speakers always get "l" and "r" mixed up in English words"

@Ixrec, As an Vietnamese, I don't have those problems at all

Kit Z. Fox

2:19 PM

3

Q: Chat: how do I use it right?

Now that I've figured out how to get to chat, I see that there's kind of a lot there. I see all sorts of weird things there. Before I ask about what's appropriate behavior, I'd like to know just how to use all the bells and whistles. I get that you type in the box at the bottom, but: What if ...

This might help you.

Ixrec

lol

terdon

@Ixrec Yes, I believe Chinese also have that. That's exactly the sort of thing I was thinking about. Apparently, as children, we can hear and distinguish between a huge variety of sounds. As we age, our ears get specialized and become extremely good at dealing with the phonemes we are often exposed to, but we loose the broad range of infancy.

So, by the time we reach adulthood, we are simply incapable of differentiating certain sounds. Those who were raised exposed to those sounds can do it with no problem and cannot understand why we can't.

Kit Z. Fox

There's an 'l' sound, but the 'r' sound is retroflected, with the tongue curled back against the hard palate.

terdon

L and R are a case in point. They don't sound remotely similar to me. It would never occur to me that anyone could have trouble distinguishing them.

Kit Z. Fox

So 'r's sound very similar to an English 'l'.

johnchae

2:21 PM

@Ixrec, I have a Chinese friend, and I once asked him if he ever found that sound to be easy to mistake with, he said immediately: NO

terdon

@KitZ.Fox Do they though? I can imagine how they would, but have you ever actually confused them?

johnchae

So I think it's just for Japanese

terdon

Oh, OK

Kit Z. Fox

No, it's for Chinese.

@terdon I can record what I sound like, but I'm not a native Chinese speaker.

Ixrec

the l vs r thing definitely affects Japanese, no idea about other East Asian languages

Kit Z. Fox

2:23 PM

I have confused them before when I couldn't see the person talking or couldn't figure out the word from context.

johnchae

I'm not sure, but I asked him to try pronouncing this word "Like" and he easly got it right

Kit Z. Fox

But Chinese people wouldn't confuse their own l and r, it's the English l that sounds kind of in between.

johnchae

While I heard a lot of Japanese pronounce that word like "Rike"

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English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…