The Renderfarm

gandalf3

00:03

and....

done :)

Thom Blair III

Congratulations!

Did you ever look at that looping particle systems question?

I looked on google to see if I could find a solution and I saw a tutorial about how to do it using After Effects, but I couldn't quite figure out how to do that in Blender

Either my brain can't figure out how to get a hold on the necessary concept or the ability doesn't exist without some coding or something

Or I'm just confused, which is very possible

I was making some progress with it when it got late and then I had other things I had to do since then, but I was thinking about picking it back up some time.

@Gandalf are you afk?

gandalf3

@ThomBlairIII no

Just aft again

(away from tab)

Thom Blair III

:)

gandalf3

But I'm here now

Thom Blair III

ah yes

gandalf3

00:09

:)

@ThomBlairIII I was actually wondering the same thing a while before that question, but never thought to ask it

I'm not really sure, but I think you might be able to use keyed particles

I've never used them though

Thom Blair III

huh, I've used keyed particles before and they're neat, but I couldn't figure out how to adapt them to make a loop

There's a very easy to follow tutorial on them by Sci Fi Animator on Youtube

short and easy to follow

here is the After Effects tutorial I was watching about looping particle systems

►

it's very clear and easy to follow

IF you're using AE, but trying to figure out how to translate it into Blender is hard on my brain

it explains exactly the technique/concept needed, but I can't figure out how to get that data set up in blender

it's hard on my brain because in AE they use a layer that slides on the timeline and thus holds keyframed data that you can slide in time & crop the layer,

but in Blender, it's not quite the same...the blender timeline doesn't have a thing you can slide & crop in time like AE does

so it's hard to figure it out...I bet someone with good coding skills or more experience with particles or Blender's UI could figure it out

the concept is SO obvious and easy to see in AE

which makes it all the more tantalizing to get it to work in Blender

see what you think...these are my notes from watching the video

- particle system 1 - mark where all particles are fully created
- duplicate that system
- move the beginning of particle generation for system 1 forward in time so that the point where all particles are fully created is at the last frame of the animation
- for second particle system, at the point in time where system 1 starts, put a keyframe on birth rate
- then on second particle system, move one frame AFTER system 1 begins and keyframe the birthrate to zero - this makes the particles die off here

gandalf3

watching the AE tutorial now..

Thom Blair III

this is the beginning of my blend file pasteall.org/blend/28674

gandalf3

The animating "birthrate" part is where the problem is

I think

Thom Blair III

yeah

I was thinking that might equal the particle lifespan in blender

"lifetime" is what I meant, not lifespan

gandalf3

00:25

Not really

Unfortunately blender doesn't seem to have an equivalent

Thom Blair III

oh

gandalf3

Blender's particles are pretty old

Thom Blair III

i didn't know that

gandalf3

(And I've heard they are a bit messy and full of workarounds on the inside)

Thom Blair III

huh! I didn't realize that either

gandalf3

00:27

There are a couple projects to refactor them though

16

Q: Is it possible to change the emission rate of particles over time?

Is it possible to change the emission rate of particles over time? E.g. Start off with an initial burst of particles, then emit at a steady rate. Here is a (poor) example of what I mean by the emission rate: Is this possible to do using only one particle system? (This is necessary because th...

Thom Blair III

I talked to one of the developers about using lamps in particle systems and he said that even in hollywood, they use clumsy workarounds for flamethrower particle systems because even THEY can't figure out how to render light from a volume

(if I understood him correctly)

gandalf3

code.blender.org/index.php/2011/03/paged-buffers-for-particles

Thom Blair III

you can see our conversation here: developer.blender.org/T38657

gandalf3

@ThomBlairIII Really? hm. Cycles does it..

Thom Blair III

@gandalf3 then I think I'm either using the wrong terms or I'm otherwise confused about what the developer said

gandalf3

00:34

I think perhaps he meant that hollywood is using lamp tricks because it's so much faster than lighting from volumes?

idk

Thom Blair III

idk either

I was trying Andrew Price's flamethrower tutorial, as you might have guessed

gandalf3

aha

I forgot about that one

Thom Blair III

it was pretty fun to play around with

I wish my computer was faster so I could have rendered the fire at higher resolution

here's my render: youtube.com/watch?v=5N-0Oix6IJk

gandalf3

hmm

I see what you mean

Looks pretty good though

Thom Blair III

it was actually hard to replicate Andrew's tutorial because it seemed like Blender's UI had changed or something

so I had to do a bunch of stuff on my own without really knowing what I was doing

gandalf3

00:38

The lighting is convincing

Thom Blair III

I was still pretty pleased with how it came out

yeah, thanks

gandalf3

@ThomBlairIII It might have..

iirc that tutorial was from a while ago

Thom Blair III

something was wrong, either with andrew's steps, or me or the UI changing...something had me super confused

gandalf3

The smoke system got a massive update in 2.64 (I think)

Thom Blair III

what's new?
:P

oh, maybe that's it!

yeah, boy, I had SO much trouble getting the smoke and the fire to render properly when I followed the different tutorials on it!!

each person's tutorial on their video worked great, but when I tried it in 2.69, I couldn't get their steps to make smoke, only fire

and MAN, I had to really work hard to get that to do something right

if you ever want to see his tutorial on keyed particles, it's this one: youtube.com/watch?v=6tRKFUEhEgw

BUT there is one thing I think he didn't mention that I had to figure out on my own

...wait, I have to check on it before I say it, to make sure I get it right....

oh shoot, I've forgotten and don't think I saved the blend file...

I think it's that the lifespan setting MUST fall before the end of the animation, because that frame is when the particles will hit the target/receiving mesh

If I remember correctly, he didn't cover that in his tutorial and I was SO confused for quite a while until I figured that out

gandalf3

00:51

Good to know

Thom Blair III

yeah, I'm rewatching the tutorial right now so I can get it right

Yeah! That's it, the emitting particle system's particles must have a lifetime setting LESS than the total number of frames in the animation

so if the animation is 250 frames long, like it defaults to, then the lifetime of the emitting particles must be set to something less than or equal to 250

actually, do the animated GIFs make the chat room page load too slowly for people?

the Lifetime setting actually determines the frame on which the particle hits the target

So, if you set the lifetime too long, the animation will end before the particle reaches the target

that's the point that I was SO confused on for so long because he didn't mention it: the lifetime setting determines the frame the particle hits the target

well, I guess I should say it determines the number of frames after birth that the particles hit their target mesh

gandalf3

01:11

True

Thom Blair III

did you make one?

I mentioned it to him in the comments on his video

He's super nice...very easy going & likeable

Every time I say thank you or something like that in comments on his videos, he writes back very politely!

ooo! that might make a really good question for me to ask and then answer: "Why do my keyed particles not hit the target?"

@gandalf What do you think?

gandalf3

sure

Thom Blair III

ok, I'm going to make it

@gandalf if, as part of my answer, I include steps on how to setup the keyed particle system from nothing and include some animated gifs, do you think that'd be considered too much of a tutorial?

gandalf3

01:29

idk. You could make a meta, I don't know about tutorial answers (I don't think that has been discussed much yet). Tutorial questions are the heavily discussed things.

Thom Blair III

yeah

I don't want to make a mistake with the forum procedures

I don't understand why I want to include the full steps on how to set up a keyed particle system

I think I think that it's something users unfamiliar with keyed particle systems would like to know, and then make sure they know the key point about the lifetime setting

I guess I'm wanting it to be a complete package of information on how to make sure the keyed particle system works properly

because I think that if I just put up a question about the lifetime setting only and don't explain how to set up the system, people won't be able to relate to it or use the knowledge immediately

I think God or the Devil is trying to get me in trouble here

I'm going to ask it in meta and see if people approve of it and then, if they like it, only then will I migrate it over to a public Q&A

gandalf3

Or you could ask about long/tutorial answers on meta before bothering to write it all up

Thom Blair III

yeah, that sounds like a good idea

Thom Blair III

02:06

hey @iklsr are you there right now?

oh well, I'll just ask in meta

Thom Blair III

02:41

now that I've read iklsr's post in meta about tutorials in answers, I think I'm going to let this urge to write a tutorial on keyed particle systems go away. I don't know why I have such an urge to write it up, but as far as I can see, it's definitely not what I should be doing.

gandalf3

Oh yeah, I forgot that post covered answers..

Thom Blair III

there's so much in meta that I've never read...I never even thought to go there and read the posts like I do here

omg, my poor brain!

thankfully, the urge is passing already! hurray!

god, what a relief!

man, I wonder how many meta rules I've been breaking here already and people haven't had the need/urge yet to tell me about it?

@iklsr would you mind telling me if there are any meta-type rules I've not been doing properly so I can learn about them & not be a pest? That'd be a big help to my brain!

:)

I can't tell if I'm doing the right things or if I'm doing the wrong things...I worry about it too much I think now...so any help/guidance you can give would be greatly appreciated so I can put my mind at ease & do the right thing. Thanks!

:)

I think I've cleaned up all the questions I answered so they're in a good format

Sintel

03:04

0

Q: Subgrouping a large mesh

Recently I've been trying to import into my game the mesh of a terrain that I have in Blender. I chose to use a model other than a heightmap because it's needed the maximum accuracy possible. Unfortunately the model, once highly detailed, has 263,169 verts and this exceeds the maximum limit that ...

modeling vertices groups vertex-groups blend-modes

Thom Blair III

03:22

almost lunch Qwertie!

I was about to say morning!
:D

Qwertie ϟ

:D

Thom Blair III

how's life?

Qwertie ϟ

@ThomBlairIII good

Thom Blair III

still playing with that new node?

Qwertie ϟ

?

Thom Blair III

03:22

Sv....orak?

Qwertie ϟ

@ThomBlairIII ??

Thom Blair III

I can't remember the full name...the one that makes the geometries with points...

Qwertie ϟ

@ThomBlairIII sure it was me

Thom Blair III

what's it's name again?

OH! no, you're right, it was the other guy,

what's his name again? ziffin?

Qwertie ϟ

:P

Thom Blair III

03:24

@Qwertieϟ totally!

Qwertie ϟ

Im learning ruby on rails atm :)

Thom Blair III

oh cool...I just heard about that the other day...

Qwertie ϟ

Im going to make some web apps

Thom Blair III

it's name sounds like something you'd hear in an odd dream

Qwertie ϟ

The syntax is very similar to javascript

@ThomBlairIII Me too

I found it 3 days ago

Thom Blair III

03:26

I don't know java, or any scripting unfortunately...

is it free?

Qwertie ϟ

@ThomBlairIII yes

Thom Blair III

nice!

free is always better!

Qwertie ϟ

Most of these things are

Thom Blair III

I wish After Effects was free!

I'd love to have that

Qwertie ϟ

@ThomBlairIII How much is it?

Thom Blair III

03:28

in the thousands I think, unless you get a monthly subscription to Adobe Creative Suite, and then it's' only ~US$45

Qwertie ϟ

@ThomBlairIII DX

BRB

Thom Blair III

but, I'd have to buy a new computer since mine is only 32bit and they require 64bit for a lot of the CS apps

so that makes it a LOT more expensive!

yesterday, by zeffii

Sverchok!

THAT'S what I was trying to think of...the Sverchok node!

Thom Blair III

03:46

here's my keyed particle system:

I'm glad to relearn how to do it...it's not at all intuitive, imo

Thom Blair III

04:01

HEY! @Gandalf , I just saw this "Loop" setting in the particle settings of my keyed system:

I wonder if this can somehow make the looping particle system we were pondering over earlier?

omg, I'm way too tired to do anything more with this now...off to bed.

goodnight moon! goodnight renderfarm!

:D

Qwertie ϟ

back

Thom Blair III

hey

I'm about to crash...so tired...

Qwertie ϟ

KK

what time is it there?

Thom Blair III

midnight

Qwertie ϟ

:0

Thom Blair III

04:07

definitely time for bed!

yep

Qwertie ϟ

cya

Thom Blair III

ok, have a good rest of the day!

Qwertie ϟ

:)

@gandalf3 A while ago you posted a link to blenders new water system. Is there any new news about that?

iKlsR

04:47

@ThomBlairIII I can only do so much as one person. Sometimes I just have to ignore some of the crap I see on the main site because I just don't have the time to address everything. Best way I think is to read my answers and questions there. I see every post on meta and I've commented on anything worth addressing. Having someone like you helping to enforce these would be a big help since I'll be getting a bit more scarce in the coming days. Thanks for your contributions to the site! :)

gandalf3

06:16

@Qwertieϟ Not sure.. Do you mean SPH (particles)? Or the new mantaflow integration?

@ThomBlairIII It just seems to make the particles do laps

Going around again after going through all the keys

Qwertie ϟ

07:02

@gandalf3 I think it might be the second one

gandalf3

Not yet, then

iKlsR

08:20

I swear, 98% of the problems people have can be answered/resolved with a single meta link.

God bless the meta.

gandalf3

Is this too hardware related?

1

Q: What will speed up renders more effectively?- more cores or higher clock speed?

I am contemplating between the AMD FX6300 and AMD FX4350, the former being [email protected] and the latter being [email protected] http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Bulldozer/AMD-FX-Series%20FX-4350.html http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Bulldozer/AMD-FX-Series%20FX-6300.html

rendering

zeffii

08:52

Thom Blair III

12:15

@zeffii that's really cool looking!

@iKlsR Ok, thanks! :)

Thom Blair III

12:29

@zeffii that node and your screenshots of how you use it look very code-oriented. I like the patterns & forms I see you making and so I'm wondering if I should try it sometime, but I'm not a programmer, so I was wondering if it's heavily-reliant on scripting/coding?

omg! I started reading a bunch of meta posts and there seem to be so many divergent opinions that I start to feel even more confused. I don't know what to do. I guess I'll just take it easy and try to do my best...
:)

whoops, sorry to ping you so many times

zeffii

12:57

@ThomBlairIII, I think with the right introduction you will be doing crazy sverchok node noodling :)

knowing how to program helps, but it's not critical

if you've used the node-based materials before, then node-based geometry is not that much different

Sintel

13:16

0

Q: Is including music in created blender movie, legal?

Good day, I just want to ask if putting music in movies/videos created in blender is LEGAL or ILLEGAL if: -I created and published online my video that is free to watch and download Also, 1. Do I have to notify them(music publishers/studios) about it? 2. Is there a fee in using a music in an o...

video

Sintel

14:58

0

Q: Record Animation In BGE

Salutations cronies, I am having trouble getting the Record Animation setting to work in the BGE. Is it possible to record an animated characters that are controlled using BGE's logic bricks with some script. In my script I change the positions of the characters bones. Thanks!

python animation scripting game-engine

Sintel

15:10

0

Q: Is there a way to use the normal of a face to model something else?

I was wondering if there's a way to extract the normal of a specifici face to use it later in something else In my case what i'm trying to do is a pipe that, in its start point, goes perpendicular to a specific face of my model. So it would be useful to use the normal of the model to start a spl...

modeling normals

Sintel

15:32

0

Q: "Remesh" modifier hides my text object

At first, I had a simple text object: Then I pressed Alt+C and selected Mesh from Curve/Meta/Surf/Text in order to convert the text object into a mesh. Now I want to apply the Remesh modifier, however, it hides my text in normal mode and in the rendered image (it is visible in the edit mode th...

modifiers text-object

Sintel

16:05

0

Q: Bake displacement to alpha channel

I'm trying to make efficient use of texture maps in my code and it would be ideal to bake the displacement of my mesh to the alpha channel of a normalmap. Is this possible (with the BI engine)? Is this a nodes thing? I've not used them before - a good ref or detailed answer would be greatly appre...

blender-internal baking texture-baking

Thom Blair III

16:20

@zeffii well that sounds good! what would the right introduction be?

Sintel

17:51

0

Q: Need guidance for creating no dependancies between two installs of Blender

I want to have two copies of Blender on my machine that share no settings or preferences. One will be my development copy and the second on is the production version. I need them to be separate because I will be publishing my code to all the production systems and I need this process to be replic...

python installation

Thom Blair III

18:13

another keyed particle system
:)

Thom Blair III

18:34

spinning!

Sintel

18:58

0

Q: Why do the particles in my keyed particle system not hit 2 of the 8 faces of the target mesh?

Why do the particles in my keyed particle system not go to 2 of the 8 faces of the target mesh? I made the target mesh by duplicating the original 1 face 8 times and rotating them so they'd all be in a circle. They all appear to be one considered 1 object by Blender when in Edit mode, but when ...

particles

gandalf3

19:53

@vader In case you are interested: developer.blender.org/D483

Qwertie ϟ

20:52

Hi :)

Thom Blair III

@Qwertieϟ hey!

you're up early!

Qwertie ϟ

:)

Thom Blair III

I woke up pretty early also

it's saturday there, isn't it?

Qwertie ϟ

6 am

yes

Thom Blair III

oh, it's 5pm here

I then later on took a long nap ...slept till noon!

:D

Qwertie ϟ

21:11

kickstarter.com/projects/527051507/…

Why would anyone need this

Thom Blair III

@Qwertieϟ no idea...

Qwertie ϟ

Thom Blair III

@Qwertieϟ XD

Qwertie ϟ

@ThomBlairIII I was building a forum with PHP and my "friend" wiped out the entire post table with this.

Thom Blair III

really??!

nice friend...with friends like that, who needs enemies!

Qwertie ϟ

21:18

@ThomBlairIII It was just for fun. If He didn't I wouldent have known about that and wouldent have fixed it

Thom Blair III

well, that's a good way to think about it...

Qwertie ϟ

And there where only 5 posts in the table

Thom Blair III

definitely good to know before you become a multi-billion customer company!

Qwertie ϟ

I am 17% through the ruby tutorial

Thom Blair III

nice!

Qwertie ϟ

21:25

The estimated time is 9hrs

Thom Blair III

is the tutorial good quality? I've heard the ones for Blender on lynda.com are really bad.

Qwertie ϟ

@ThomBlairIII Its very good

Thom Blair III

awesome!

it's great when you find good quality stuff

Qwertie ϟ

The website has its own editor

Thom Blair III

wow, neat!

Qwertie ϟ

21:28

This is what it looks like

Thom Blair III

that's pretty neat

Qwertie ϟ

@ThomBlairIII Its way better than watching a youtube vid because it can tell you what you did wrong

Thom Blair III

now THAT's super useful

wow

man, that's so cool...

Qwertie ϟ

They do python html/css JS ruby jquery and PHP

Thom Blair III

neat

how do they make their money? advertising?

Qwertie ϟ

21:33

@ThomBlairIII I think its a non-profit

Thom Blair III

huh, I wonder how non-profits keep running...donations?

wealthy programmers wanting to help people I guess

Qwertie ϟ

codecademy.com

Thom Blair III

or something like the Gates Foundation funded them...

Qwertie ϟ

Here is a link

Thom Blair III

I must admit, I think there's a lot to be said for letting people learn at their own pace in what they're interested in like this

I think schools would be SO much healthier and better in every way if people could do that

kind of like they say on their about us page: codecademy.com/about

Qwertie ϟ

21:38

They only do web languages though so no C++ or java

Thom Blair III

maybe in time

Qwertie ϟ

A few years ago I read a whole Java book but I still has no idea how to use java

Thom Blair III

XD

I know the feeling

Qwertie ϟ

@ThomBlairIII 9 chapters later "Whats a variable?"

Thom Blair III

Qwertie ϟ

21:52

20 minutes after finding codecademy "Why is my loop running 9 times and not 10"

Thom Blair III

wow, that's awesome!

Qwertie ϟ

Green eggs and ram XD

Thom Blair III

XD

Qwertie ϟ

Its good for your memory :P

Thom Blair III

XD

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