The 2nd Monitor

Corbin

00:00

Oh that's a good point. Hrmmmmm

Mat's Mug

is it me or it's like forcing a circle into a square hole?

nhgrif

So you really can't make a truly abstract class.

200_success

55

A: What are best practices that you use when writing Objective-C and Cocoa?

Don't write Objective-C as if it were Java/C#/C++/etc. I once saw a team used to writing Java EE web applications try to write a Cocoa desktop application. As if it was a Java EE web application. There was a lot of AbstractFooFactory and FooFactory and IFoo and Foo flying around when all they ...

Corbin

I suppose it's just best to not try to shove Java down ObjC's throat. Unfortunately though, mid to low level Java programmers try to force Java down everything's throat.

nhgrif

Yeah.

I mean, at the end of the day, the answer is that you probably just need a protocol.

Corbin

00:01

Yeah

Jerry Coffin

@Corbin s/mid to low level //

nhgrif

Or maybe just write a base class that's concrete, even if you never intend to use it as is.

rolfl

@Mat'sMug I was thinking more like: "This is a tentative schedule for the first X blogs (whenever the blog is activated). Which ones are good, which ones are bad, is the order OK, and who is willing to write which one..."

Corbin

@JerryCoffin :D. I was trying to be nice :p

nhgrif

For example... EVERY Cocoa class that ends in "Controller"

Jerry Coffin

00:02

@Corbin Fair enough. I've long since given up even trying to act like I'm nice. :-)

Corbin

Oooo that would drive a Java programmer insane... in quite an amusing way.

rolfl

@JerryCoffin I suppose it is only the very top C++ folk that push it down others' throats?

Mat's Mug

@rolfl oh, like, some 6-month (/post) schedule of what topics the blog posts should be about? Yeah, I can do that ...right now!

Corbin

@JerryCoffin I just find it much easier to avoid arguing with Java people. It's like arguing with a wall. :D (Kidding, Java people. Kidding!)

nhgrif

UIViewController,UITabBarController,UINavigationController,UITableViewCon‌troller,UICollectionViewController... these are all technically concrete classes, but they're basically abstract classes in pratical use.

rolfl

00:03

@Mat'sMug yup.... co-ordinate, writing comes later.

Mat's Mug

coming up

Jerry Coffin

@rolfl Most find it more amusing to see what a mess they make, but a few of us care enough about code quality to try to do at least a little to correct their worst mistakes anyway.

nhgrif

You can also declare properties in your protocols--not just methods.

Mat's Mug

protocols == interfaces

nhgrif

Right.

Well.

ObjC.protocol == Java.interface

ObjC.protocol != ObjC.interface

Mat's Mug

00:07

yeah makes sense.

nhgrif

Objective-C interface is like C++'s class definition

Mat's Mug

actually "interface" is an ambiguous term - refers to e.g. IComparable if you're talking about language structures, or if you're talking about objects and runtime stuff it refers to what an object exposes to its clients - I'd guess like ObjC.interface

rolfl

@Mat'sMug - consider/reread this post blog.stackexchange.com/2011/06/blog-overflow (specifically step 4).

nhgrif

Where you have:
class Foo {
// stuff
};

Where //stuff is the public variables and method declarations

Mat's Mug

but you should post at least once a week.

rolfl

00:10

I know, we can bend that for the inital plan.

nhgrif

well, public or private

rolfl

I proposed once-a-month to GraceNote....

nhgrif

Where Objective-C, it'd look like this:

@interface Foo
//stuff
@end

Mat's Mug

saw this resurface on meta today, thought it was funny:

10

Q: Why don't people on code review use the SE chat system?

Here is the old room which was frozen due to inactivity. And the new room which noone is ever in? Why is that? This has been sort of asked before ( Role of the Chat in Code Reviews ) but it was not completely fleshed out? I believe that the chat system on this site could and will be very usef...

rolfl

Yeah, did you see my red-freehands?

Mat's Mug

00:14

totally. looked better on my phone though ;)

is the diamond clickable and brings up the EMP menu from the SE bar?

rolfl

About the diamond... it actually just glows green when orcs are near.

in Stack Exchange Community Blogs, Apr 14 at 4:35, by Grace Note

@jmort253 Mmkay. There's a bit of a hold on further blog creation for a bit while we fiddle with a few things, but I'll get to looking into it.

^^^ check that out...

zab

G'day all

rolfl

hey @zab

Please tell me you are really Australian ....

zab

Yessir!

rolfl

Good, just checked.

zab

00:19

Actually writing in a bit of an emergency. I need some help with a sort of a game I'm writing in Mathematica. Any chance someone here could help?

Mat's Mug

in Stack Exchange Community Blogs, Apr 14 at 4:39, by Tim Stone

starts cooking some bacon

zab

Long shot, I know.

Mat's Mug

ahem. I meant this one:

in Stack Exchange Community Blogs, Apr 14 at 4:38, by Grace Note

Do note that as you have graduated, that means I need to pull a designer to make an actual design for the blog, so that'll take some extra time, though, when I do get around if we do approve the blog motion.

rolfl

@zab Try GameDev folk here: chat.stackexchange.com/rooms/19/game-development

Mat's Mug

@rolfl so that means as a beta site, we can get ours faster.........

rolfl

00:21

But, when it is done, and working ... ;-)

zab

@rolf

@rolfl, thanks!

rolfl

@Mat'sMug but.... you saw:

in Stack Exchange Community Blogs, Apr 14 at 4:35, by Grace Note

@jmort253 Mmkay. There's a bit of a hold on further blog creation for a bit while we fiddle with a few things, but I'll get to looking into it.

Mat's Mug

yeah

rolfl

I want to be first-in-line for when they are ready

Mat's Mug

that sounds like a good idea

rolfl

00:22

Funny, I thought it was mine ;-)

Mat's Mug

should I set up a Trello board? Ironically after > 2 years of waiting for a "delete board" feature, I deleted my Trello account like 2 months ago

Today is CR beta day #1190

rolfl

Google-groups was recommended by GraceNote.

As well as google-docs.

Mat's Mug

I think for blog post #1 we should get a hold of this guy:

RobertPitt, United Kingdom

575 4 13

php mysql php5 javascript c# codeigniter constructor

Corbin

O.o

Mat's Mug

the guy that made the original CR proposal!

Robert Harvey, Lancaster, CA

119 8

c#

Corbin

00:27

Ah. I was thinking that 3.25 years was a really long ass time to have been a member

rolfl

I can ask him if he's interested....

Corbin

Might be kind of awkward since he was last active 3 years ago.... Could be kind of interesting in a way though.

Mat's Mug

area51.stackexchange.com/posts/11464/revisions

it's Robert Harvey that made it CR - the original proposal was "Beta Testers"

and I think he's been in this chatroom not too long ago

(fighting the nazis, I think)

(I borked the chatroom)

rolfl

00:51

Nope... still here.

I have sent a request to Robert Harvey, just to gauge his interest. No response... yet.

Mat's Mug

nice

@rolfl seen the activity graph lately? looks like the Answers-per-Question ratio is finally getting somewhere!

(seeing how the red vs yellow lines become more and more distant to each other)

rolfl

I have a ratio-specific query .....

data.stackexchange.com/codereview/query/166314/…

Mat's Mug

bleh

rolfl

Unfortunately it is 'for all time', and the recent activity needs to do a lot to move the weight of the early 3 years.

Mat's Mug

oh that's what I thought

so the activity graph has a more accurate/useful reading then

rolfl

01:01

I think so, but I have considered trying to write a new query that does a moving-average of the ratios, or something.

But, that graph would not represent the numbers you see on the front-page, or Area51

Doorknob

> Chat is evil.

Mat's Mug

A51's 1.8 is the entire history I think

Doorknob

What do you think of that? ;)

Mat's Mug

hey @Doorknob!

Doorknob

Hello

rolfl

01:03

@Mat'sMug which is what you see on the ratio graph I linked..... (see the actual data is 1.84)

Mat's Mug

I think it's BS ;)

yeah but looking at the recent activity graph, like, only looking at last month's posts, looks like the ratio is around 3 or 4

ok 2

rolfl

Yes....

Mat's Mug

so we need to keep posting 3rd & 4th answers

it's going to take longer than I thought coming up with my answer to phase 4, should I just post the question and then post my answer later, or posting the A with the Q is best?

or maybe the best would be to just have a "pool of ideas"? I think that would make it more accessible for everyone that way

hey @200_success

Doorknob

So you're working on your blog; we're still in phase 2 :P

Mat's Mug

just the shape of it

Doorknob

01:13

Btw, did you notice that we're both approaching 1337 days in beta? Maybe a good day to graduate :D

Mat's Mug

hehe

48 mins ago, by Mat's Mug

Today is CR beta day #1190

rolfl

@Mat'sMug Meta is a poor way to throw around ideas... there is no good answer.

Edward

wot's all this about a blog?

rolfl

I think getting the discussion going is more important than the actual prsentation

Mat's Mug

@rolfl help me out then, I think I'm missing the point of phase 4

rolfl

01:14

Hey Edward .... Look right ;-) -------> there. 13 stars

Mat's Mug

14

Q: Code Review Blog - Phase 1 - Raise the idea on the meta site

Having a community blog for Code Review could be an interesting idea. The real quesiton is, if we do want a community blog, what should we talk about in this blog? Here are some pseudo-random ideas: About Code Review itself. How to write a good question or a good answer. What's on/off topic he...

feature-request status-planned blog

or here^^

Doorknob

^ or the superior site right there ;)

Edward

Yeah, I read the meta post on the topic. "what for" is my question...

rolfl

@Mat'sMug - ideally, plan at least what the first three blog entries will be about, and who's going to contribute them....

Mat's Mug

ah!

rolfl

01:16

Hopefully get a 'pipeline' of what's coming up or 'in the wings' as well.

Edward

Is the idea that it's a blog about CR or about code and code reviewing?

rolfl

both

General interest things about, and that affect Code Review

Mat's Mug

yeah

10

A: Code Review Blog - Phase 2 - Define the Scope

All of the Above. Why restrict it to only one topic? Have a blog post about the evolution of Code Review, and the next one about Code Review itself, or when someone's inspiration pushes them to address language-specific common review issues, if it's good content it's content that we want, even i...

Edward

Oh, I just noticed that the clicky thing was only to Phase 3.

Literacy is my friend.

Mat's Mug

oh crap. I wanted to discard the answer, and ...discarded the entire thing.

Edward

01:18

I've got an idea which would be something like "top 5 C++ review points I'm tired of making"

or maybe 10

Mat's Mug

(afk)

rolfl

@Mat'sMug - nooo!!!!!!

@Mat'sMug - your timing is atrocious.

Doorknob

@Mat'sMug How does a mug go away? Does it just sort of... happen?

rolfl

Hey Robert ;-)

5 mins ago, by rolfl

@Mat'sMug - ideally, plan at least what the first three blog entries will be about, and who's going to contribute them....

30 mins ago, by rolfl

I have sent a request to Robert Harvey, just to gauge his interest. No response... yet.

Robert Harvey

I think the only thing I'd be qualified to contribute to the blog would be my perspective as a moderator migrating things to Code Review. Code Review has a very specific charter, and that charter serves it well, despite the fact that it doesn't cleanly fit into the Q&A model (it being essentially a site designed specifically for Too Broad, List all the things questions).

Doorknob

01:22

@rolfl What's that about no response? :P

rolfl

Just bringing things up to date ;-)

syb0rg

Just made a pull request on a pretty large Github repo: github.com/yarrick/iodine/pulls

Code Review IRL

(kinda)

Robert Harvey

Code Review probably has the highest concentration of experts anywhere in the network, outside of the graduate-level sites. All of those sites (including Code Review) have an extremely high signal-to-noise ratio, suggesting that it's the scope of the site that makes it work, not a slavish adherence to Q&A rules.

4

rolfl

@RobertHarvey We have managed to create a fair amount of confusion in the migration circles because we can be both picky, and generaous about what is on-topic.

Robert Harvey

Anyway, that's partially what I would write.

Edward

01:26

@RobertHarvey Yes, I often find that SO is the first or second hit when I search for some programming problem I'm trying to solve. Often very useful, as well, if the title is good.

rolfl

I would suggest that CR has probably a higher ratio of experts.

(modesty aside).

TheDoctor

@syb0rg - you're reviewing code without being asked!

syb0rg

@TheDoctor Well, yeah. Hopefully the original author of the code will approve of it :P

Doorknob

ohai @TheDo ge

(:P)

rolfl

Robert, I think that perspective can be tied nicely in to the scope o the blog, I have in mind (and this is not confirmed) that the first blog should be a wordy introduction to Code Review. A small blurb about what people were thinking 'back then', and what gaps you thought would be useful to fill, and then we can work that in to an blog about where Code Review is working now, and how it is filling those holes, or is different from that.

When we have things closer to fleshed out, I'll drop you a note, and we can coordinate a bit then.

GraceNote has not yet confirmed our blog's existence, or timeframe, and this process is needed to establish the blog.... so, we need to get some ducks lined up....

But, it would be helpful to know that we can call on you for a paragraph or two.

syb0rg

01:31

Yay! My build passed! travis-ci.org/yarrick/iodine/builds/23639508

Which means it is more likely to get merged!

200_success

@Mat'sMug Hi

Mat's Mug

@rolf exactly what I had in mind!

rolfl

Hey @RobertHarvey - we're back ... ;-)

Mat's Mug

16 mins ago, by Robert Harvey

Code Review probably has the highest concentration of experts anywhere in the network, outside of the graduate-level sites. All of those sites (including Code Review) have an extremely high signal-to-noise ratio, suggesting that it's the scope of the site that makes it work, not a slavish adherence to Q&A rules.

it's the scope of the site that makes it work

200_success

01:51

Experts? Interesting. I didn't realize our barrier to entry was that high.

Edward

I'm just disappointed by the complete lack of slavish adherence to Q&A rules.

What am I going to do with this perfectly good riding crop?

Mat's Mug

reminiscent of @syb0rg's now deleted comment on the deleted "Style Tips From Experts!" ad: I actually don't like this one very much. It leads to the misconception that you have to be an expert to review code, which you don't. – syb0rg 2 days ago

syb0rg

@Mat'sMug It's a myth I'm trying to debunk.

Mat's Mug

we need to tackle this one as a team, mate. ;)

Edward

Good. And you don't necessarily need to post superb code for review either.

Doorknob

01:57

Oh btw @syb0rg:

Ahem, I believe I licensed that under MIT, meaning you have to give attribution to me. ;) I'd prefer "The Supreme Overlordly Knob of the Door, Superior to Mankind in All Ways," but anything goes — Doorknob 13 hours ago

:P

syb0rg

@Doorknob Unfortunately, @rob0t doesn't know how to parse comments on Stack Exchange sites. It could take a little while for that to be added ;)

200_success

You only need to be an above-average programmer who pays attention to details and can write well. All programmers should be able to spot bugs if they tried. That's a review right there.

6

Doorknob

Yeah, that's why I pinged you here. :)

Edward

True, and personally I often peek at code in languages I don't know as well to see what I can learn

syb0rg

Hrm...

thinks of a comeback

fails to think of a comeback

Edward

02:00

Next month for sure. ;)

Mat's Mug

but anything goes? I suggest SmugKnob ;)

rolfl

47 secs ago, by syb0rg

fails to think of a comeback

Jsut say you sublicensed it under CC

syb0rg

@Doorknob There:

32

Q: Chat bot for posting recent answers

I am the half-robot side of syb0rg that will be posting the recent answers of Code Review to the CR Answers chatroom. Here is the list of review suggestions I would like, in order of preference: Efficiency (with API requests, speed of login and posting answers, etc.) Security issues Best pract...

optimization ruby security stackexchange

Doorknob

@syb0rg Heh, thanks

syb0rg

Hmm, I seemed to have missed this. It's a shame, I think I could have been of help:

8

Q: Post Mortems - Episode I: A new hope

Prologue: A long long time ago (Apr. 17th, 16:00), in a galaxy far away, there was a stranger, seeking enlightenment. He came across a miraculous star named CodeReview in the deepest depths of the internet. He (maybe) read the rules of the planet, and then unboarded from his ...

discussion specific-question vote-to-close new-users comment-style

Jerry Coffin

02:10

@Edward See if you can find some remnant of Fidonet on which to apply it?

Edward

Never mind. The wife has it now.

Corbin

Well I need to avoid that meta post, @syb0rg. That comment stream just made me rage a bit.

Edward

One of the things that makes this work (and SO and related places as well) is that unlike much of the interwebs, people are generally mutually respectful.

Jerry Coffin

@Edward ...though rather more so here than on SO (I think).

rolfl

@syb0rg - for the record, that happens again, you flag the post, and you stay away

That's how you help ;-)

Corbin

02:17

I have very torn feelings on the whole thing. I'm typically a fan of giving someone attitude right back. That of course runs the risk of devolving into what happened in this situation... But, what do people expect? If you're a sarcastic, immature, impatient dick, people are typically sarcastic, immature, impatient dicks back.

On a logical level, I'm aware that the community should have stepped up, remaining professional and tried to be as polite as possible. It just annoys me how many people have that attitude on SE though. I don't think they'll ever truly change if they don't see the error of their ways, and I don't think polite coddling accomplishes that.

syb0rg

@rolfl Erm, you don't want me to help in the comments? I am usually quite polite, and slow to get angry.

Corbin

All I know is that it's good that I'm not a moderator, for I would surely be a terrible one x.x lol

rolfl

I'm OK with taking the responsibility for adding to the problem with my second comment, but, in my assessment, none of the other comments from CR regulars worked to calm things down.

Edward

It's not so much "polite coddling" as "establishing a tone" I think.

rolfl

There was nothing that was going to stop that flame, other than preventing it, which was too late after my second comment.

Corbin

02:20

Yeah, I suppose so.

The only other option was to go all out and tell him to either go to meta and make a case for different rules, or take the free help offered to him and shut up. Not sure that would've ended well though....

Edward

@Corbin In my experience in other realms, that latter approach only leads to escalation.

rolfl

No. I have not figured out, yet, as a moderator, how I could have stopped things after the flame-war was happening.....

I am not convinced my second comment was the trigger though, I like to think the flame war was happening after my first comment... ;-)

Corbin

@Edward Well, you would have to follow through on the "go all out" part after that and ignore him/delete comments. That comes off as mod abuse though.

Really, @rolfl, I think people with attitudes like that will find a fight in anything. He got pissy after the first comment. I'm sure he would have stayed that way.

rolfl

^^^ exactly....

Corbin

People rarely insult an entire, well established community and its set of rules and then change their mind after being politely corrected once.

Edward

02:24

@Corbin Yeah, but then you have created somebody who has "been wronged" and is unlikely to return any wiser. Leading by example seems to work best... and if it doesn't work, give 'em the boot.

rolfl

I don't believe anything would have prevented, or calmed the waters...

other than time.

As a moderator, my tools are: lock the post, close the post, suspend the user.

and comment.

Corbin

@Edward Eh, I guess I'm just a little extreme. After hanging around on SO enough, I've lost faith in people's ability to return wiser. I tend to lean towards giving them half the boot up front and seeing if they take the hint.

rolfl

^^^ that is the SO approach ... I don't want it to be that way on CR

As we get more popular, successful, we will have to deal with it more often though

Edward

I think we have the ability to establish a culture that will make it easier to keep the trolls at bay.

Corbin

I'm not advocating the SO way. The SO way is a barrage of downvotes, 3 personal insults, 5 close votes in 30 seconds, and 25 "omfg can't you google?!" comments. I'm advocating a calm, collected "if you don't like the rules, argue them in the proper forum. Otherwise, either delete your question or comply."

I suppose hard line stances are rarely level-headed though.

Jerry Coffin

02:27

@rolfl Largely true, I think. Back in the Usenet (and before that Fidonet) days I'm quite certain quite a few flames were prevented by the simple fact that the medium was relatively slow, and people had a lot more chance to re-think and delete flaming messages before they posted them at all. That didn't prevent all flaming (of course) but I think it probably prevented a lot. SO is a lot faster, which is certainly good in some ways, but has a few minor disadvantages as well.

syb0rg

0

A: Post Mortems - Episode I: A new hope

Unfortunately I wasn't a part of this, I wish I could have been there to help. I'll make a small note here though: tone is everything. Whenever you are writing something to be read, the it is up to the reader to decide how you will "sound" in their head. At first I think we handled ourselves ...

rolfl

I think my future response is: 1. comment "Take this to meta", 2. Lock the post (so that the venue is moved from comments, to posts, and the 'regulars' cannot "help"), 3. wait for the meta post, which may, or may not happen, but will give the guy time to think, stew, and calm down.

thoughts?

Corbin

Unless I'm missing a step, I agree 100%. Sounds like a more tactful version of "if you don't like the rules, argue them in the proper forum. Otherwise, either delete your question or comply."

(And even if I am missing a step, I still agree. I think the go-straight-for-the-throat approach would be very effective at maintaining quality, but the feel of it would be very, very wrong.)

rolfl

The trick, I think, is identifying when there is the crisis, and I missed it that time.

I don't want to be firing off that action plan for false-positives

Which is why flagging from 'you all' is useful.

Corbin

Yeah, that's a good point. No need to get combative if it could have been an otherwise pleasant experience.

200_success

02:33

You never really know what frame of mind someone is in. There might have been triggers (dog died, girlfriend dumped him, got robbed… who knows?). That doesn't excuse the behaviour, but the response should always just be kind but firm.

Stack Exchange

0

Q: Four algorithms to find the Nth fibonacci number: looking for both general and idiom feedback

I'm implementing some basic algorithms in Go as an introductory exercise. Here are four different algorithms to find the Nth fibonacci number. I'm looking for general feedback, but I'm specially interested in the Go idiom. Are the algorithms implemented idiomatically? If not, how can I correctly...

algorithm go idiom

Edward

@200_success Yes, in this somewhat impersonal medium, things can easily be misconstrued, especially since we're literally from all around the planet and have different cultural norms.

200_success

Just pretend you're a Customer Service Representative in a global call centre.

Jerry Coffin

@rolfl In this case, I think the OP did have something of a point, and we were a little too sensitive about deciding that he knew the code didn't work. Code that really doesn't work is obviously off-topic, but saying the code probably has race conditions or other corner cases shouldn't (IMO) be taken quite so literally as a statement that it isn't working code.

@200_success I've tried that, but my accent is all wrong... :-)

Corbin

I didn't even think about that. I just got caught up on the code link x.x.

rolfl

02:38

@200_success I hate those people ;-) Don't want to pretend to be one

Corbin

I agree though. We do jump the gun sometimes with what code does and doesn't "work."

rolfl

@JerryCoffin - the timing is off.... the flames were flying before the non-working code issue could be addressed.

I knew by then it was 'lost'....

Jerry Coffin

@rolfl Oh, don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to say the OP was (even close to) blameless, or anything like that. Nonetheless, I think it's an issue that arises, and we probably get a little to literal/narrow-minded about exactly what qualifies sometimes.

Anyway, need to go for a while. Later, all.

rolfl

Yes, as a meta issue, it is 'ripe' for being addressed (whether bug-free code is required for review).

cheers

200_success

Feel free to continue…

7

Q: Could incomplete or not-quite-working code be suitable for review?

I've noticed that sometimes I end up reviewing code despite the question's violation of our policy that it must contain working code. I bring this issue up because it is related to Changing wording of the code-to-be-written and working-code off-topic reasons, but I don't want to sidetrack that d...

discussion site-policy close-reasons on-topic off-topic

rolfl

02:45

Anyway... back to what I said earlier .... as a mod, with a crisis at hand, it is hard enough dealing with one person, but dealing with lots of helpers, being on the 2nd monitor telling people to back off, etc... made it harder, not easier.

Edward

Oh sure. Blame it on us. :)

rolfl

Not blaming 'you all', just saying, that I deal with things in a focused way, and get pissed off with the things that distract me from the problem at hand ;-)

Also, the way I see it, is that moderators occasionally have to be the bad guy....

and when a bad guy is needed, don't volunteer for it.

You don't want to be facing down a flame-war unless you have the support of SE behind you

syb0rg

Unfortunately, even high-rep users from SO are confused about what is on topic here:

@jfriend00: It may be open to some argument whether it's topical here on SO. As it stands right now, it's clearly not topical on CR though (among other things, CR would require that the code be included in the question). — Jerry Coffin Apr 17 at 16:59

(the confused one is not you @JerryCoffin, I'm referencing @jfriend00)

Corbin

Most of the time I correct people on SO about CR, they have at least 10k rep. I think the problem is that they're comfortable enough with SE to assume they know a site's intended purpose on name alone. I remember the PhD level math site (mathematics? or math? or something like that) used to have the same problem where people would redirect questions there thinking it was just any math.

Jamal

@Corbin Math Overflow

rolfl

02:57

Jam!

Jamal

hi

Edward

Got to go. See you all later.

Corbin

@Jamal That one :). Thanks

Jamal

Later!

Corbin

See ya, Edward

syb0rg

02:59

Bye @Edward

Jerry Coffin

03:23

@Edward Bye Ed.

ChrisW

@rolfl I posted some thoughts. They're probably similar to yours.

Stack Exchange

04:31

0

Q: Python 3 tips for a new programmer. Terrible code included

I have been teaching myself Python 3. I watched a video on YouTube entitled "stop writing classes". The Gtable class doesn't even have an init function, so I can't help but wonder if I should have done something different. Also as someone teaching themselves a language for the first time I would ...

clean-code code-organization python3 dictionary

Stack Exchange

04:50

0

Q: Another even Fibonacci numbers implementation

This is intended as something of a comparative study. I'm including not just one, but two separate implementations of code to implement the Project Euler problem to sum the even Fibonacci numbers up to 4,000,000. The first is a very C-like implementation. The second attempts to make much more use...

c++ fibonacci-sequence comparative-review

rolfl

^^^ C++ ... who cares ... ?

oh, you, @JerryCoffin ?

Jamal

Do we need a comparative-review tag?

rolfl

close-as-self-review ?

@Jamal No. This is just an unusually long A-vs-B question.

I'm tired, going to bed.

TTGTB, SYITM. SW.

DLTBBB

Jerry Coffin

Good night.

Jamal

Goodnight

Jerry Coffin

05:00

@Jamal I'm not sure we need it, but at least to me it seems somewhat useful.

chillworld

05:36

Monking

Donald.McLean

WTHITDWATSA?

Morwenn

07:39

That said, monking.

Morwenn

07:51

Academia.SE just graduated. Is it worth comparing their stats with CR?

NiallSzalkai

08:25

yes

What is the graduation process?

Morwenn

@NiallSzalkai When SE mods think you are ready, the site graduates.

From what we have been told, there are no "strict numbers". When they feel the community is ready, that's it.

skiwi

Morning

Morwenn

@skiwi Hey :)

skiwi

:o interesting course I have later today, first lecture

I thought it was a pretty crowded course as the teacher mailed that there was barely enough room, turns out there are just 34 people

Vogel612

Monking.

NiallSzalkai

08:43

Morning all

skiwi

Morning @Vogel612

NiallSzalkai

@Morwenn It still might be a nice idea to compare with a recently graduated site :)

skiwi

Perhaps it's time to start working out the structure I want in my TCG game

Uri Agassi

@janos OP likes! Simply in a different time-zone...

Morwenn

@NiallSzalkai @rolfl probably some queries ready to run to compare the stats :)

Community♦ still has 5 rep on meta here. And 2 badges on Area 51...

skiwi

09:02

hehe

link?

Morwenn

area51.stackexchange.com/users/-1/community

chillworld

morning all

Morwenn

@chillworld Morning :)

skiwi

Nice badges there :p

chillworld

<tag>open for voting</tag>

damn must be [tag:open for voting]

Morwenn

09:06

Even better: look at the badges subsection.

Simon André Forsberg

Monking

chillworld

help

lols now it work :D

skiwi

Monking @SimonAndréForsberg

chillworld

@SimonAndréForsberg monking

skiwi

Hmm, my TCG has currently got a model for the Deck, Hand, Graveyard, Card and subtypes. Did I miss any low level model?

Morwenn

09:17

Deck, Hand & Graveyard? No card on the battlefiled?

skiwi

That belongs to the Player I'd say, which I still have to do, same holds for the Game object

Though.. I might want to abstract away from it, similarly as I've done witht he Hand

Vogel612

Player
 +--- Hand
 +--- Deck
 +---Side
       +--- Graveyard
       +--- Slots (monster / spell)
Field has 2 Sides

skiwi

Well, a Graveyard belongs to one player though, and so does the slots

Vogel612

@skiwi correct....

skiwi

Hmm, why distinct between Player and Side, isn't that always 1:1?

Unless there's a good reason to do it that way :)

Vogel612

09:23

well in my TCG it's that the Side is a part of Field...

and the Field is just containing Map<Player, Side>

skiwi

I see

Hmm, I think I might need to disallow empty monster names ^^

Vogel612

might

skiwi

Great, that'll also mean I need to create more tests!

Vogel612

@skiwi meh. that's a single test case...

@Test(expects=IllegalArgumentException.class)
public void testConstructor_EmptyCardName_ThrowsIllegalArgumentException(){
     MonsterCard cut = new MonsterCard("", 100, 200);
}

skiwi

Not if I add utility methods... because they also need to be tested :D

public static String requireMinimalLength(final String value, final int minimum) throws IllegalArgumentException {
    Objects.requireNonNull(value);
    Arguments.requirePositive(minimum, "minimum");
    if (value.length() < minimum) {
        throw new IllegalArgumentException("the length of the value must be at least the minimum: " + value.length() + ", expected: " + minimum);
    }
    return value;
}

Maybe I"m going too far with that approach, but just testing it on this project

Now I can feel like I am doing useful things though

skiwi

10:03

Uni time, ttyl

rolfl

10:32

@Morwenn & @NiallSzalkai - we're about twice the size of academia:
CR: http://data.stackexchange.com/codereview/query/161411/site-activity-and-votegraph#graph
AC: http://data.stackexchange.com/academia/query/161411/site-activity-and-votegraph#graph
Area51 says we have 3-times the traffic per day compared to Academia
CR: http://area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/11464/code-review
AC: http://area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/16617/academia

Monking CRitters!

Vogel612

Monking @rolfl

rolfl

@Mat'sMug - ;-) You've earned the "Necromancer" badge for Why don't people on code review use the SE chat system?. <--- apparently chat was dead....

3

Hey Vogel612

NiallSzalkai

@rofl What is academia doing differently to get graduated, maybe length of service?

Christ the one time I actually need SO and I can't post a question :(

Transcript for