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03:00 - 05:0005:00 - 00:00

03:01
in RPG General Chat, 14 mins ago, by BESW
I think I've got the "brainstorming puzzles in Fate" thing set up and ready, whenever we've got at least three people to run it.
03:36
Sound off: people who can do the brainstorm now, or within the coming half hourish?
It'd be nice to have one more person, but I could run a character...
@BESW Happy to help but uselessly ignorant :P
@Miniman I think we can work with that.
03:39
A decent aspect, that.
a little long winded, but it could work as one
Oh, if ignorant's okay, I'm here too. I know nothing of Fate, and I've only played 3.5e D&D.
Ignorant is fine
I'm interested, but should be working... so I'll just spectate...
03:40
we will just need to help you along a little is all
Dibs on Calariel
@BESW I like the look of the halfling grifter, but that's just cos 'Don't Mind Me'
I like Abraxis then
I can work with Thrumin though, if someone else cares all that much
@Smurfton You okay with the dwarf?
Guess I'm watching the...
@BESW yes!
03:44
Awesomesauce.
Let the experiment begin! I'll be pasting in blocks of text modified from ARRPG to explain things as we go along.
> In a brainstorm, the PCs (and their players) make observations, recall their training, investigate their surroundings, and poke things with sticks in an attempt to gather evidence about the nature of a puzzle and its solution. This can take a few minutes, or a few hours. It all depends on the context of the scene. Ideally, the result of all of this is a hypothesis. And because we’re talking about highly trained and talented adventurers, it is always true.
> In other words, whatever explanation the players collectively establish will steer the course of the dungeon crawl.
If anyone wants a moment to install the Fudge dice script, feel free.
We'll be rolling 4d6 for dice, and without the script treat 1-2 as minus, 3-4 as blank, and 5-6 as plus. Sum the minuses and plusses for your roll's result (between +4 and -4).
Thanks. Do you just download it, or...
@Smurfton Greasemonkey
leme see if mine is working
d6
(not an insult)
03:47
hmm, no
Just installed it, didn't work either. Hmmm.
...mine's broken too!
@Magician Oops, yeah. Greasemonkey is an addon that allows you to install custom scripts
03:48
Well, I downloaded it (and didn't do anything), and I can see the roll.
Reloading the page worked
4d6
@Smurfton The dice bot itself is inherent to the chat. The script just changes the dice from pips to +s and -s.
Confirmation that Google Chrome is magic?
hmm
I might need to log out and in again
03:51
Got it.
Anyone want a little more time before we start?
I'm fine.
Reminder you can use 4d.
4d
03:52
hmm
ok, I have no idea
4d3
hm
(because XdY defaults to 1d6 if omitted. So if you only say 4d, the Y gets filled in as 6.)
Wow, even the X defaults. Did not know
03:53

 Dice roller & formatting tests playgr

The roller supports: d4, d6, d8, d10, d12, d20. You can roll ...
4d10
if you want to play around with dice please use that room ^
Are we ready?
the fudge dice script can be activated in there
03:54
@doppelgreener I'm still really proud of my contribution to chat in suggesting that :)
I am
@doppelgreener sorry.
I can manage without seeing them as fudge dice
@Miniman that was you? nice one
It will just take me a couple seconds more to read the d6 propperly
03:54
@doppelgreener I didn't make the room, just suggested we needed one
Okay, so here's the scenario. Assume you've been hacking your way through hordes of [insert enemy here]. (If it's important to the puzzle you can define them during the brainstorm.)
> You’re standing in a moonlit jungle clearing next to a cliff-face. Embedded in the cliff, partly obscured by vines, is a set of double stone doors twenty feet high. They’re flanked by rows of statues that look like feathered serpents, and the cliff around the doors is deeply etched with curlycue patterns. The doors themselves, however, appear utterly smooth: no handles, no knocker, nothing.
One of you asks the obvious: “So… how do we get in?”
1-2 is - 3-4 is neutral, and 5-6 is +
> STEP ONE: Begin the brainstorm.
Everyone taking part cites a reason why they’re getting involved by compelling one of their aspects: tell the GM which of your character aspects is leading your character to be part of the brainstorm, and get a Fate point for it.
@BESW Er. As in, why we want to get into the door?
Or as in why we would know something about this situation?
03:56
Or why you feel like you should be part of tackling the puzzle.
I assume everyone else/at least one other person, is going to participate
everything is better when you do it with freinds
I'm a professional engineer. I'd be interested in this door, by virtue of having never seen one like it before.
Being, as I am, an Elven Guardian of the Forest, I'm here to free this jungle (however strange a forest it is to me) from the [vile enemy we've been hacking]. All signs point to this place being significant to them.
So we've got two people compelling their character's interest in the activity itself.
Nice.
Lots of fiddly bits. If this door's mechanism isn't just pushing, there must be some kind of machinery involved.
03:59
Also, these are stone doors. That has dwarf written all over it.
Okay! Everyone bring your Fate point total from 3 to 4 on your character's stat block, and we'll begin trying to figure this door out.
So the fiddly bits are inside the door, then?
@Smurfton Kove is assuming that a door without handles has fiddly bits instead.
Somewhere.
@BESW I don't think I can actually edit it.
Try refreshing.
04:00
Ok, cool, thanks :)
@BESW Or possibly just needs to be shoved open by main force.
@trogdor Increment your FP.
I suppose that the curlicues on the door are the fiddly bits, then.
just a sec
04:01
@Smurfton Curlicues, incidentally.
Curlycues, curlicues, it's correctly spelled several different ways.
Also, the curlicues are on the cliff around the door. The door is smooth.
I think we're getting ahead of ourselves. These ideas you postulate would likely have a place in the process we're about to follow.
there we go
04:03
Right, so Kove can assume this all he wants, but if he wins a roll to establish a fact then he can tell us he's discovered it's true!
> STEP TWO: Establish the first fact
Next, all participants roll simultaneously to create an advantage using a relevant skill against a difficulty of Good (+3). Each player can (and is encouraged to) use a different skill. The relevance of the skill here will depend entirely on the situation at hand, but t should be a skill that covers something the player will want to talk about more, or that sparks an idea.
So declare the skill you're using to roll, then roll 4d6 and tell us the total result.
Do we want to have something in mind to do with it first?
Lore 4d6 (+6 to create wilderness advantages, I can't possibly fail here)
4d6
@Smurfton No, you just have to tell us the skill you're using.
nice
Notice
4d
04:05
(If you win, then you tell us what you've discovered.)
So, do I have to prove that there is complicated machinery to invoke my aspect for it?
@Miniman Nope. If you win, then it's assumed there was!
Mechanics +4 (Lots of fiddly bits)
4d6
04:06
(Or you could establish a fact like No moving parts, which would be hilarious.)
looks like I got 4 overall
I beat the rating we need,.. but I didn't "win"
notice 4d6 (+2) (Maybe +2 for the impending danger?)
or does that even make a difference yet? do we just all have to beat the rating?
04:08
Calariel got +9 (wilderness) Lore
Kove got +6 Mechanics (fiddly bits)
Abraxus got +4 Notice
Thrumin got +5 Notice (danger)
Does anyone want to spend Fate points to modify your rolls? You can spend one Fate point for a +2 to the roll, but you have to point at an aspect which would reasonably help your action.
I suppose I could have motivated everyone else and gotten a better result than that
@BESW Or to reroll
oh well
The floor below the door isn't exactly the most solid. Will probably break if we try to ram the door. Might let us into the dungeon, though.
I'm good
04:09
Nobody wants to re-roll or get a +2?
Nah. Do we go in order, or just whenever?
I don't see a reason to just yet
@BESW Why should I?
@BESW I already have +5
@Smurfton you probably shouldn't right now
A reminder only the person who won the roll gets to establish facts
Which is presently Calariel, who will get to say something that becomes fact
04:11
ah.
Everything else is words in the wind
> Whoever succeeds and has the highest result (make a note of number) is the “winner.” The winner gets to do two things.
First, they record one or more victories, depending on the margin of success (see p134).
Second, they get to introduce a fact. This takes the form of a situation aspect, and must follow three guidelines.
If no one succeeds on the roll, nobody establishes a fact or places an aspect—nothing useful comes out of that segment of the investigation, and it’s back to Square One.
If there’s a tie for the highest total, each tying player gets to establish a fact, but only one victo
but anyone wanting to beat 9 would need plus 4 at least
There'll be more rolls :)
My mechanics can make +6 with architecture.
04:12
@Smurfton I mean to add to the roll you already have right now
that's what Fate Points are for
Oh, yeah.
but I honestly don't suggest spending 2 of them on our first roll of the game, especially under these specific conditions
@Magician Calariel succeeded by 3 or more, so he/she has two victories.
Now, here are the guidelines for establishing a fact:
> - It clearly derives from the skill used to create it.
- It clearly relates to the situation.
- It can be stated as an objective fact—an observation of something in the scene, a remembered bit of research, or some other piece of factual information that relates to the situation.
The fact doesn’t have to be something previously established in the fiction. Whether it comes from something the team’s already done or seen, or whether it’s something the player has invented from whole cloth, it’s equally valid in the brainstorm.
Calariel, please give us a pithy phrase describing the fact you've discovered.
Incredibly Sturdy Vines. We've been tracking through the jungle for a while, and seen these thick vines before. Why, I wouldn't be surprised if they could pull apart the stone gates on their own.
Now we are going to establish a second fact. This is the same process as before, but the difficulty is now equal to the previous round's winning roll: +9.
04:16
oh god
...
I'm so sorry.
So, declare the skill you're going to use, and roll!
yeah,.. that is gonna be one of the reasons not to just throw away FP
(magician internally: what have I doooooooone)
(BUT!! you all have lots of fate points available.)
@doppelgreener Nono. Externally it's that. Internally there's an evil grin.
04:17
mechanics (architechture) then.
@Magician that's the spirit
Tact (Don't mind me)
4d6
04:18
Lore again, 4d6
4d6
Intimidate, I think everyone else needs a "pep talk"
4d
....3
04:19
4, as I don't intend to create a wilderness advantage this time around.
Thrumin got +7 (architecture) Mechanics
Kove got +7 Tact (unnoticed)
Abraxus got +3 Intimidate (pep talk)
Calariel got +4 Lore
reroll
4d
**************************************************
this pep talk is definitely not landing very well
2
04:20
Thrumin and Kove, you're each one Fate point away from succeeding.
I'll add +2
@Miniman What aspect is helping you?
I've noticed. I'm thinking about it.
@BESW Wouldn't that be success at a minor cost?
Subtlety
04:21
@Magician Yes. Cost is GM's discretion.
w/e let's tie.
@Miniman Your aspects are the phrases in italics.
Ah, sorry
I do things my own way, then
The words with numbers by them are skills, and the bold phrases with sentences after them are stunts (like D&D feats).
...wait, this means the difficulty will stay at 9.
04:22
yes.
Okay, so Kove gets +9 (tie) with Tact (being unnoticed) while doing things his way.
Thrumin's spending a Fate point, too? What aspect is he invoking to get the +2?
These are your aspects:
- Dwarven siege engineer
- My faith guides my hammer
- Scars from the War
Oh, um. hm.
Wait, Dwarven Seige Engineer counts?
Alright then, DSE.
So Thrumin gets +9 (tie) with (architecture) Mechanics because he's a dwarven siege engineer.
@Smurfton yep, your concept is an aspect too, often one of the most reliably invocable ones
You both get to establish a fact about the puzzle you're facing! Mechanically it's an aspect, a short pithy phrase describing something which is true.
It should clearly derive from the skill you used, and the aspect you invoked.
It shouldn't contradict the previous fact which has been established.
It should clearly relate to the situation and be an objective fact--not a hypothesis or opinion.
04:27
Hold on, what was the description of the door, again? It's gone off the top of the page.
> You’re standing in a moonlit jungle clearing next to a cliff-face. Embedded in the cliff, partly obscured by vines, is a set of double stone doors twenty feet high. They’re flanked by rows of statues that look like feathered serpents, and the cliff around the doors is deeply etched with curlycue patterns. The doors themselves, however, appear utterly smooth: no handles, no knocker, nothing.
The Statues Can be Moved: While you guys were messing about at the door, I was looking at the statues.
The Serpent Statues are nearly ideal for ramming things with.
...well done
...Yes? Uses unnoticed and doing things my own way
04:29
Damn, Miniman, go team.
So The Statues Can Be Moved and... how about The Statues Are Tougher Than The Door?
Heh, accidental
Is that satisfactory?
The Serpent Statues are nearly ideal for ramming things with. Not only does my expert eye see them as sturdy, they also are not coiled at all.
How's that.
The idea is that the fact is also represented by an aspect.
04:31
The Statues Are Great For Ramming Things, then.
The full details are excellent, but BESW was also suggesting a short phrase which could serve as the aspect representing that fact.
Aspects are generally best at three to seven words long, abrupt and to the point.
@doppelgreener "The Statues are Great for Ramming", is fine, then.
The tie gives us one victory toward figuring out the puzzle, but at a cost. I shall say the cost is... The Statues Are Booby-Trapped.
Now we're moving into the third and final fact-establishing round.
Works the same way: Difficulty is still +9 because that's the winning roll last time.
Declare a skill and roll.
Lore, probably with +2 for wilderness
4d6
04:35
If you have a free invoke on an aspect from the previous rounds, you may use it for a +2 on this roll.
Toughness, +2(?) for receiving a non-weapon physical attack
4d
I think same as last time, intimidate for (better hopefully) pep talk
4d
04:36
Sorry, can't attack here. We're still in the "discovering facts" stage.
better?
I seem to have a 6
I'll spend my free invoke of Incredibly Sturdy Vines to reroll
4d
...figures
04:38
@Smurfton I'm not sure how that's going to establish a fact about the puzzle.
Mechanics (fiddly bits) +4
4d6
Couldn't it establish a fact about the booby trap?
Interesting. I'll allow it.
Not that I nearly succeeded.
04:39
@Smurfton You can spend a fate point to reroll, provided you have an aspect that can justify it.
E.g. recently my half-troll rolled very poorly for a physical feat, and I rerolled with the justification that because he's a half-troll, he could not possibly have botched it up that badly.
(I think that's legit. I'm going to check now.)
So I can invoke The Statues Can Be Moved as long as I have an excuse to apply it?
Yes.
Anyone can invoke it, but you can do it once for free.
04:41
Not that the reroll helped, of course :)
Thrumin has Scars from the War which implies he's had some combat training--that could be good for a re-roll.
Scars from the war: I really know how to get hurt, and how much it will hurt.
4d
Calariel has +4 for (wilderness) Lore related to sturdy vines.
Abraxus has +6 for Intimidate (pep talk).
Kove has +4 for Mechanics (fiddly bits).
Thrumin has +1 for Toughness (interacting with a trap) (in a painful way).
The difficulty is still +9.
04:42
So, on buying a reroll, you're betting you'll get more than +2 over your first roll?
Seems legit. You just have to explain why the aspect's relevant.
@Smurfton ouch, that sucks when that happens XD
It's possible that we fail to find any new facts this round.
oh wait, you did reach -2 though!
Is anyone going to spend more Fate points to try hitting +9?
04:43
I will spend 2
@BESW Tempted as I am to spend everything I've got, no.
I think it is proper use to use my friends aspect and my concept
I don't have enough.
I'm curious to see what happens when we fail
04:44
@Magician We do, however, have three victories already, which is exactly enough to formulate a hypothesis.
@BESW I thought ties didn't count?
@Miniman Ties give one victory for the whole round.
@Miniman Magician got two victories, remember?
Oh my. Abraxus has succeeded at +10 on Intimidate (pep talk) by talking to his friends in his role as a paladin of the Burning Hate.
Abraxus, please lay a Fact on us!
hmm
"It can't be that hard to figure out" ?
or do I have to actually say something about the door?
04:47
that's an opinion
(Actually, technically it's the number of facts that lets us form a hypothesis --you need at least three-- and the number of victories which determines how many free invokes are laid on the hypothesis's aspect.)
facts gotta be facts
It must be objective.
mk
ooh,.... heehe
Maybe as a paladin you know lore about the people who built this... temple...
04:48
Best pep talk ever?
"It's probably possible." -trogdor
The door isn't very thick
(Thus declaring that it's a temple and something about it.)
But you have to present this as something rising from intimidation.
grr
this isn't easy
(I put that stunt in there because I wanted to see if anyone would try this.)
The door isn't as thick as your thick skulls?
04:49
@BESW I did
36 mins ago, by BESW
> - It clearly derives from the skill used to create it.
- It clearly relates to the situation.
- It can be stated as an objective fact—an observation of something in the scene, a remembered bit of research, or some other piece of factual information that relates to the situation.
The fact doesn’t have to be something previously established in the fiction. Whether it comes from something the team’s already done or seen, or whether it’s something the player has invented from whole cloth, it’s equally valid in the brainstorm.
and now I almost regret it
Bah! That got snipped.
As an intimidating version of 'the door isn't very thick', I mean
> - It clearly derives from the skill used to create it.
- It clearly relates to the situation.
- It can be stated as an objective fact—an observation of something in the scene, a remembered bit of research, or some other piece of factual information that relates to the situation.
The fact doesn’t have to be something previously established in the fiction. Whether it comes from something the team’s already done or seen, or whether it’s something the player has invented from whole cloth, it’s equally valid in the brainstorm.
04:50
@trogdor Yeah, I think the trick is to start out with an idea for a fact you'd like to add, and only then look for a skill or aspects to invoke.
hmm I guess it doesn't actually have to be about the DOOR
cause we have vines in here
And curly carvings nobody's paid any attention to.
@BESW They stole my aspect :P
how about this?
04:51
you could make observation about the wind, or what the [INSERT ENEMY] was doing here, or how you can hear a waterfall, etc
"These carvings are made by Kobolds, this kind of Kobold door isn't made very thick, we can smash it open pretty easily"
Intimidate us!
That's more Lore-ish, isn't it?
I'm imagining Abraxis slamming his fist on the door to make a point, and the door makes a hollow noise.
ok
that works
The Door Trembles Before My Hate
2
04:53
(aside from the viability of using Intimidate in this exercise, I am fascinated that you turned Intimidation into a positive force through interpreting it as a sheer terrifying force of personality)
maybe add in that he suggests smashing it,... or one of you guys
Smash Door or smash YOU
Still gotta be a fact, not an opinion or hypothesis.
I've Smashed Skulls Thicker Than This Door?
Carved Idols Fear My Hateful Light
@BESW pretty sure I already established the fact I wanted
04:54
So what's the aspect?
I like The Door Trembles Before My Hate and I've Smashed Skulls Thicker Than This Door.
The second one sounds good to me
Excellent!
Now for the last part of the brainstorm.
We check how many facts we've got: four facts have been established.
That's three or more, so we know enough to formulate a hypothesis (if we had two or fewer, the GM would get to place an aspect regarding your inability to fathom the challenge).
> If you now have at least three facts, everyone rolls again. There is no difficulty to hit, it’s just an opposed roll for the highest total. Whoever wins this final roll gets to come up with a hypothesis that dictates what’s actually going on. This becomes the truth of the situation. The hypothesis must take into account and build on the facts already generated during the brainstorm.
Do we have to use a skill with this?
Yup.
Can it be a skill we've used before?
04:58
Yup!
Tact(Don't Mind Me)
4d6
Lore (wilderness)
4d
04:59
Well, Mechanics (pro engineer) (+6)
4d6
every time.
03:00 - 05:0005:00 - 00:00

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