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vzn
1:01 AM
@Semiclassical theres now experimental evidence Zitterbewegung is real. an eminent "fluidist" pointed out this ref to me not too long ago, A Search for the de Broglie Particle Internal Clock by Means of Electron Channeling / Catillon et al link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10701-008-9225-1
 
 
4 hours later…
5:10 AM
Jesus . . . this guy is on fire. hmm is so this is what physics for econ/finance can look like huh interesting
Let me see if I can locate some trivial videos on QED, and basic gauge theory . . .
I like the mathy stuff with all the symbole $\otimes$
$\oplus$
and quotients though
looking for a baby math (algebra ) + some diff geo stuff. algebra driven
then want to tie it up with some proper physics qed
 
6:09 AM
@JohnRennie, is it true you once were the editor of scientific americal magazine?
 
@nielsnielsen that is a different John Rennie
I don't think he was editor of the whole magazine
I forget exactly what he did. Possibly editor for a particular area of science.
 
@johnrennie got it, thanks for that. quite the coincidence nonetheless.
 
Rennie isn't that rare a surname. There seem to be lots of Rennies in the US. It's a Scots/Irish name i.e. it originates from the Gaelic kingdom.
 
I'm the cow in the video
Consulting the spirits of gauge theory tonight :D
 
7:05 AM
@Cows Boooo I'm the Fadeev-Popov ghost
 
 
2 hours later…
@Danu nothing new there.
 
All cranks assemble :D
(in the comments section)
 
Quanta articles are generally pretty good, but that one is somewhat underwhelming.
@Danu ah yes :-)
 
It's too layman-y
But I do think that the philosophical POV is something new to most laymen
 
9:53 AM
damn laymen
get off my lawn
 
10:36 AM
Oh hi @Blue
 
Anonymous
@NovaliumCompany Hey
 
@Blue So what are you up to?
 
Anonymous
On the road to the canteen :P
 
Chatting while walking?
 
Anonymous
Yup
 
10:38 AM
Careful to to bump into a pole :D
 
Anonymous
Can't talk physics now though..lol
 
Anonymous
Hehe
 
Oh no problems, we can talk whenever you want :)
 
Anonymous
I'll see you in the evening
 
See you :)
 
 
5 hours later…
vzn
3:23 PM
> A more dramatic conclusion is that all traditional descriptions of fundamental physics have to be thrown out. Particles, fields, forces, symmetries — they are all just artifacts of a simple existence at the outposts in this vast landscape of impenetrable complexity. Thinking of physics in terms of elementary building blocks appears to be wrong, or at least of limited reach.
 
So suppose I have 2 sound waves given by a function $a_n(t)$ which represents the amplitude $a$ of the sound $n$ at time $t$. And I want to compare the two waves. How much effective is this approach:
1. Imagine a vector, $\vec{r}$, fixed at (0,0) on the $a-t$ plane.
2. The vector is given by $\vec{r} = <a_n(t), t>$.
3. I calculate the average rate of change of the vector divided by the total time length $T$ of the wave $n$ and call this the score $S(n) = \dfrac{d\vec{r}}{dt\cdot T}$.
4. I compare $S(n)$ to see how much the sounds match.
 
vzn
> Perhaps there is a radical new framework uniting the fundamental laws of nature that disregards all the familiar concepts. The mathematical intricacies and consistencies of string theory are a strong motivation for this dramatic point of view. But we have to be honest. Very few current ideas about what replaces particles and fields are “crazy enough to be true,” to quote Niels Bohr. Like Alice and Bob, physics is ready to throw out the old recipes and embrace a modern fusion cuisine.
 
I mean I find it very sensible
 
vzn
crazy enough to be true™ :P
 
4:11 PM
hello
 
4:39 PM
@EmilioPisanty Thanks.
@JohnRennie Do you know what it means originally?
 
4:58 PM
@ACuriousMind thanks to you, good sir
for keeping this chatroom clean and free of trolls
though admittedly with a 24-hour delay
 
@EmilioPisanty Life, y'know :P Might have been quicker if you had pinged the other mods, too ;)
 
what is this "life" you speak of
the internet is life
 
@ACuriousMind fair
@enumaris merge those comments and you get a star
 
does not compute
 
@enumaris Life aka Adventures in Meatspace aka The Place Where You Can Be Punched.
 
5:03 PM
you mean you don't interface through a remote controlled avatar bot?
Aren't you worried about germs and getting punched?
 
@enumaris The danger is part of the thrill
 
seems too dangerous for me
 
::chicken noises::
 
D:
 
 
2 hours later…
6:49 PM
Completely forgot where $V\frac{d^3 \mathbf{p}}{(2 \pi)^3}$ came from for ages... If a particle has length dimensions $h$ then it fills a volume $h^3 = (2 \pi \hbar)^3 = (2 \pi)^3$. The dimensions of $h$ are $[h] = [E][T] = [M][V][L/T][T] = [p][L]$ so that phase space is in units of $h$. This means the number of states in a volume $V$ with momentum in the interval $d^3 \mathbf{p}$ is $\dfrac{V d^3 \mathbf{p}}{h^3} = \dfrac{V d^3 \mathbf{p}}{(2 \pi)^3}$.
 
hmm
shouldn't it be $V \,d^3p/\hbar^3$?
I remember the $(2\pi)^3$ factor as showing up when doing $d^3 k$ not $d^3p$
 
I don't recall seeing it that way, have a few sources using the above one, but it kind of is just a convention
 
true enough
I mostly remember it in the context of computing partition functions
and who gives a **** about an extra factor in a partition function
 
I can't believe I forgot that, looking directly at $V\frac{d^3 \mathbf{p}}{(2 \pi)^3}$ I just kept twisting into pretzels making sense of it :(
 
7:04 PM
lol
oh wait, yours is compatible with that since $p=\hbar k = k$
derp
 
Oh yeah
Good point
 
i remember this stuff mostly from having to compute density of states
which is a big deal in condensed matter
 
I have literally interchanged $p$'s and $q$'s without remembering that as mere notation
 
heh
it helps that solid state people love talking about k-space
so that's the version you tend to see
 
Yeah I seen a derivation of $V\frac{d^3 \mathbf{p}}{(2 \pi)^3}$ from that thinking, wave function boundary conditions $k_x L_x = 2 \pi n_x$, $k_y L_y = 2 \pi n_y$, $k_z L_z = 2 \pi n_z$ gives $dn = dn_x dn_y dn_z = \dfrac{V d^3 k}{(2 \pi)^3}$, another way of getting it I just wasn't happy with
But it's equivalent to what I did above, but $dn_x dn_y$... :\
 
7:25 PM
Meh. Ultimately it's all about trading complicated sums for simpler integrals
 
8:07 PM
Just use super-natural units with $2\pi = 1$.
::hides::
 
Wassup guyz.
@ACuriousMind You hiding from me? :(
 
That would have driven me nuts, $V d^3 \mathbf{p}$ the number of states in $V d^3 \mathbf{p}$
 
He's hiding because he uttered blasphemy
 
@NovaliumCompany Nope, I'm hiding from the well-intentioned explanations why $2\pi = 1$ doesn't work :P
 
changing to a transcendental basis sounds legit
who needs binary when you can have $2\pi$-ary
oh wait, I guess that would be $2\pi=10$...so actually...it's $\pi/5$-ary?
 
8:12 PM
Indeed, sounds legit
 
I ordered Kindle E-reader 5 a few hours ago, I'm excited.
 
I read stuff on my ipad mini
but ever since I finished reading my RL book
I'm out of material to read
hopefully my new company desktop will be ready to use soon though...
 
@ACuriousMind reminds me of how one of my favorite approximations is $\pi^2=10$
 
Well, IPads and tablets hurt my eyes and also are heavy to hold. An E-reader doesn't have a frames per second, it doesn't update, it only updates where there is change... (something like that) and also it's light.
 
is $\pi = 0$ or $\pi = 3$ by that metric? :p
 
8:16 PM
$\pi=1$
 
What is that pi = 1 thing... or whatever you are talking about?
 
@Semiclassical That's actually pretty decent as an approximation so it's plays in a different league ;)
 
$\pi=1$,$\pi^2=10$,$\pi^3=10$,$\pi^4=100$ etc
 
ya really
 
No, pi = 3.14...
 
8:17 PM
pi^2 = 10 to within 2% of the true value? yes plz
 
no, $\pi=1$ to the level of my accuracy
 
Whaat, pi is equal to 3.14..., what are you guys talking about???
 
being off by a factor of 3 is less than an order of magnitude and therefore acceptable
 
@NovaliumCompany mostly we're being silly
but pi^2 = 9.8696... is less than 2% different than 10
 
Yep, I checked that.
 
8:19 PM
which makes it really really useful for approximations
 
Oh yeah $10^0 = 1$ duh
 
also, there's a nice explanation for that approximation in terms of the series 1+1/4+1/9+... = pi^2/6
 
I'm looking forward to reading a book on chemistry and electronics this summer. #excited.
Chemistry For Dummies and Electronics for Dummies, are these good?
 
I tried to read a chemistry book, it did not go well
 
I read books on quantum mechanics, does that count :P
 
8:23 PM
Count as what :D?
 
chemistry
 
Ha, I guess... xD
 
i mean, chemistry is just applied QM really
well, that and applied electromagnetism
 
I tried reading QM for Dummies, stopped on the 10th page... too complicated for me.
 
8:25 PM
and statistical mechanics, and kinetics, and a bunch of memorized materials people seem to know gigantic lists of and their properties
and that's not even organic chemistry
 
What is the simplest book on Quantum Mechanics that I could read?
 
@Semiclassical have you tried to calculate the bonding energy of Benzene bonds starting from QM first principles?
@NovaliumCompany what level of rigor do you want?
 
@enumaris Something that doesn't involve complicated math or complex english words.
 
A good starting point is maybe Griffith's Quantum Mechanics. I find the exposition there to be clear and easily understood.
but it's not as (mathematically) rigorous as say...Ballentine.
What counts as complicated math?
 
This is a good quantum mechanics book with just words:
 
8:29 PM
Calculus.
 
like up through differntial equations and linear alg?
 
don't peddle that superstring stuff in my chat
(jk)
 
Griffith's Quantum Mechanics involves complicated math. (Derivatives, integrals...)
 
Only up through differential equations and linear algebra
it barely touches on Hilbert spaces and dual spaces and the like
Ballentine is much more involved in that department
no group theory in Griffiths either
 
8:30 PM
@enumaris nah, but can't be thaaaat hard. (yes it can)
 
or differential geometry
 
The Elegant Universe: Superstrings, Hidden Dimensions, and the Quest for the Ultimate Theory look pretty good actually, might read it.
 
That's like...
for laypeople tho
 
@enumaris ::ahem::
 
but I haven't read it so I don't know if he's rigorous
 
8:31 PM
Yeah but it's still a great book to motivate study if you don't know derivatives etc
 
runs from ACM
here's a legit question
 
@enumaris I think the longer QM intros stay away from differential equations, the better. The heart of QM is in the algebra, not in knowing how to compute Hermite polynomials :P
 
I will actually read a book on calculus, any good recommendations that don't involve too complicated English grammar?
 
How much has changed since Greene's book with regards to our conceptual understanding of string theory?
 
8:33 PM
By conceptual understanding I mean like at the level of his book's exposition. If Brian Greene had to rewrite his book based on new advancements, how much would he have to change?
 
@enumaris Since I haven't read it, I can't really comment
 
@ACuriousMind but you're the resident string theorist
you mean to tell me not every string theorist treats The Elegant Universe as a bible?
 
o/
 
@enumaris I do mean to, yeah :P
@Danu \o
 
hmmm
 
8:35 PM
Omg I am actually hyped about the elegant universe, I'll read it, thanks @bolbteppa for suggesting.
 
@NovaliumCompany watch the videos on it first maybe
 
@bolbteppa you may have created another string theorist in the making, you proud of what you've done?
 
@ACuriousMind did you ever learn a bit about moduli spaces of string theories?
 
I am currently stroking my GSW so you can imagine
 
^this sounds really weird :D
 
8:36 PM
Any good Calculus introduction books? (With simple grammar)?
 
gun shot wound?
 
Green Schwarz Witten
 
what kind of calculus?
 
GSW: The bible of String Theory
haha
 
Is it really though?
I never read it; but it's so old
It can hardly be adequate these days
OTOH, Witten partially wrote it :P
He might've seen a lot coming haha
 
8:41 PM
oh wow
 
It's from 87, not that bad :p
 
just saw the news
Argentina loses to Croatia 0-3
shocking...
 
@Danu Only a tiny bit and I have to admit it never really fully made sense to me because the explanations were very...physics-y :P
 
I've got a sorta unclear question
maybe you can help clearing it up/solving it?
 
ACM knows all about String Theory
no fear, ask away
 
8:42 PM
We'll never find out if you don't ask it ;)
But chances are if it's not "elementary" string theory or about spectra of compactifications, I won't be able to help
 
@enumaris lol
 
@enumaris what's happening this time
 
So lemme give you some background
 
None of the big teams are winning
 
My work is on these quaternionic Kähler manifolds (holonomy contained in $Sp(n)Sp(1)$; important waht it really means)
the constructions we are working on come from physics
where initially these spaces were "discovered" or viewed as moduli spaces of... string theories I think. The original reference is this paper by Ferrara, Cecotti and Girardello.
 
8:44 PM
@AvnishKabaj there is a disturbance in the force
 
I don't really even want to precisely know what they were doing, a priori. Not too interested in those details.
However, here's my problem
My supervisor turned all of this into mathematics and wrote a bunch of papers on it. However, whenever he or his collaborators write about it, these spaces are introduced as target spaces of scalar fields of a 3D supergravity theory
I don't understand how these two POV's are supposed to be equivalent.
also, they are not exactly talking about the same spaces, to complicate matters.
 
@enumaris Just overall introduction to limits, derivatives, integrals...
 
hmmmm
It's been so long since I've done that...I don't think I can recall which book I used...
 
Meh, ok, I'll find one.
 
sorry :(
 
8:47 PM
No problems :)
 
but almost the same; I think the physicists always end up with a direct product $Q\times S$ where $Q$ is quaternionic Kähler and $S$ is the "universal hypermultiplet" manifold (= complex hyperbolic space $\mathbb C H^1=SU(1,1)/U(1)$)
that factor $S$ is supposed to parametrize the (coupling constants featuring in the) univeral hypermultiplet
In general, in the string theory POV these spaces parametrize possible values of couplings
So I'm looking for something like maybe a correspondence between "space of coupling constants" and "scalar field target space of (low energy effective?) sugra theory"
@ACuriousMind Did I lose you yet? :P
 
Hmmmmmm
 
Hmmmmmmmmmm
 
your question is currently being process through ACM's neural net. Please allow a few minutes for an output.
 
I see the ACM worshipping has only increased in my absence :P
 
8:55 PM
You see, in compactification of SUGRA/string theory/M-theory, the cohomologies of the target space basically generate particles in the effective theories, and something like intersection numbers translates into coupling constants of these particles
 
The first part of the sentence, I know about/am OK with
 
Actually, the coupling constants/charges come from ADE singularities in the target space in the case I'm thinking about
So I think this is not quite what you're looking for since away from the singular points in the "space of target spaces" (which is the moduli space afai understand), there's no charges/coupling constants
 
I'd like to see that second part elaborated. And it seems to assert that the scalar target space of SUGRA (not the target space in your sentence, which is the one in the original string picture) is given by these intersection numbers, since the coupling constants for the scalars are the metric components. Now what about relating those to the original string theory couplings?
Oh, OK, so it's something different?
 
Yeah, I think I'm thinking about something that has nothing to do with what you're thinking about ;)
 
That makes me a little sad
but it still sounds interesting
Does it have anything to do with Witten's paper on intersection theory and 2d gravity? :P
 
9:00 PM
@Danu No, what I'm saying is basically standard string theory model building lore about how to relate the charges of the particle content of the compactified theory to the shape of the compactification manifold
 
I never learned about that. I only learned how to get the (massless) spectrum
First question, maybe: Does what I'm talking about sound deeply misguided/misunderstood? Or does it make sense to a zeroth order approximation?
 
@Danu It sounds a bit weird to me since it sounds as if you want to relate the moduli space of a generic theory - the "space of couplings" - to the target space of a specific theory.
 
Right, I think I forgot something important
 
I.e. on one hand you have a space that parametrizes a family of theories, and on the other the target space of a single theory. However, there is the idea of "dynamics on moduli space", which I know nothing more about than that it exists
 
in the stringy POV there is also already somehow a fixed CY that you want to compactify on
 
9:06 PM
So if your 3d SUGRA is this "meta-theory" that governs dynamics on moduli space, i.e. the dynamical selection of specfiic theories, then it would make sense again. Unfortunately, I know nothing about that :/
 
The first paragraphs/the abstract of the paper by Cecotti etc I linked has an explanation that sounds really clear to me, yet I cannot understand it :p
Do you have access/mind taking a look?
 
@Danu I don't have access - not affliated with a university any more!
 
Can I send it to you somehow?
(also feel free to decline if you're not interested)
 
@Danu Sure - you still have my email?
 
I might...
But I don't remember what it should be, haha
 
9:13 PM
@Danu Heh, no worries: Send it to [interested parties can look at the history of this message].
 
Done
 
lol, spam filter ate it, but it's here
 
Ghehe.
First thing I don't understand: How do they compactify "on a (2,2) superconformal system"? They seem to say on the second page that this is some kind of stand-in for a CY
My title probably triggered your spam filter
So, actually, they literally establish this correspondence, supposedly, on page 2
LMAO can't believe I never made it in this far
the only problem, now, is that I don't understand at all what their argument is :P
 
My guess is they mean they take the usual 2-D superstring theory in 10-dimensions with it's superconformal symmetry, which is $N = 2, D = 2$ superconformal symmetry, and compactify this 10-D theory down to four dimensions to get a 4-D effective action, in other words, to try link string theory to 4 dimensions
In mathematical physics, the 2D N = 2 superconformal algebra is an infinite-dimensional Lie superalgebra, related to supersymmetry, that occurs in string theory and two-dimensional conformal field theory. It has important applications in mirror symmetry. It was introduced by M. Ademollo, L. Brink, and A. D'Adda et al. (1976) as a gauge algebra of the U(1) fermionic string. == Definition == There are two slightly different ways to describe the N = 2 superconformal algebra, called the N = 2 Ramond algebra and the N = 2 Neveu–Schwarz algebra, which are isomorphic (see below) but differ in the choice...
 
No, they said compactify on a (2,2) superconformal system (literally)
Starting from IIa or IIb
(or heterotic)
 
9:26 PM
So, I don't completely understand what they're talking about either and you probably have to look at their Ref. 5 to see how the system actually relates to a CY, but here's how I'd make sense of it:
A well-defined string theory needs a total central charge of 0
In superstring theory, the "actual" particles contribute $3/2 d$, and the ghost system contributes $-15$, leading to the famous $d= 10$ constraint
In compactification, these systems can be divided into system on the "real space" $d= 4$ space and the theories on the compactified space.
The charges cancel separately, meaning that the theory on the compactified space is a theory with an "actual" theory of central change $3/2 \cdot 6 = 9$.
Since we also know that preserving SUSY in 4d forces the comp. manifold to be CY, heuristically such a theory has to correspond to some compactification CY manifold.
 
How come the charges cancel separately?
 
@Danu In compactification, the spacetime is just a product between the 4d space and the comp. manifold
 
But the central charges don't know/care, do they?
 
Or, wait, they don't have to cancel separately
But we do know that the 4d theory has $3/2 \cdot 4 = 6$
So there has to be a theory with central charge 9 living on the compactification manifold to cancel against the total -15 from the ghosts
 
OK
 
9:34 PM
Compactification to 6d on a 4d comp. manifold is special because of K3 being basically the unique Kähler you can compactify on
 
I see
So now really what we go to
is looking only at the moduli space of the theory on the compactification manifold
 
This is that uniqueness of Seiberg they are talking about - you find that there's no gain from considering the conformal theory instead of the manifold because it will just correspond to the various choices of structures you have on the K3
 
@ACuriousMind But we're not going to 6d in this case right?
@ACuriousMind Oh, yeah, I read that too. Makes sense.
 
But in the case of compactifying to 4d, the choice of comp. manifold is much broader
 
I see
Btw before we skip over it, the paragraph above Seiberg is the most important one for me
 
9:36 PM
So instead of trying to construct various 6d CYs, they take a "dual" view and just look at the c=9 superconformal theories that can exist and live on it
 
I see
But that's crazy
that's like trying parametrize all complex/Kähler/whatever structures they're varying of ALL CY 3-folds simultaneously
 
Well, it sure beats the tedium of doing all the enumeratic algebraic geometry required to index families of CYs :P
 
I was wondering if there are some people who have great knowledge about quantum optics and if they could maybe have a look at this question ;)
https://physics.stackexchange.com/questions/410790/the-purcell-effect-its-influence-on-the-lifetime-and-quantum-yield-of-fluorop
 
@Danu Yes, it sounds exactly like that - they're trying to vary over all CYs instead of varying the structures on a single given geometry.
I guess that's why they call it an "abstract" CY
 
I thought they were doing it like on a "generic" one somehow
This sounds so much like "ehh yeah we don't really know what we're doing but we'll trust Witten that it makes sense"
 
9:42 PM
Well, I'm willing to wager that it is not certain that each of these SC models really corresponds to an actual, existing CY
 
and these charges given in equation (1.1)... Those are the extremal allowed charges right
what are those corresponding states called again
simply chiral?
(and anti-chiral)
 
I mean, that would be a really major theorem, wouldn't it? That a representation-theoretic space, that of all representations of the $(2,2)$ super-conformal algebra with a fixed central charge 9, corresponds to the purely geometro-algebraic space of all 6d CYs.
 
theorem? :)
 
And indeed they say after that that the correspondence is not unique (the part about the choices of Lagrangian)
@Danu theorem. :)
 
In general, trying to parametrize the space of all manifolds of a given type
just sounds like insanity
But what does this "uniqueness" really mean?
 
9:45 PM
@Danu I think so, yes
@Danu Uniqueness of Lagrangians for SUSY theories is a really neat thing that goes back to Nahm, Olive, Scherk, etc. but isn't really explained in sufficient detail anywhere I've seen :/
 
Also, how come they say"Roughly speaking, the moduli space is just the manifold of classical vacua for the low-energy theory"?
That's actually the only piece of the argument I don't really get, modulo the technicalities about non-existence of these chiral states (whatever)
lmao, automatically typing "moduli" instead of "modulo" by now
 
@Danu I think they may be mixing up different meanings of "moduli space" in physics, there. Obviously I'm not an expert on moduli space, but I do think that it is sometimes used for "the space of vacua" and sometimes for "the space of parameters of a theory", the two not being actually related. physics.stackexchange.com/q/295056/50583 supports the idea that this is a confusion that exists
This discussion epitomizes everything I find interesting about theoretical physics and much of the reason I left it behind :)
 
lmao
But Y U NO MATH
We miss you here in Hamburg
The more physically oriented PhD students here don't know enough mathematics for them to help me understand anything, and vice versa I don't know enough physics.
But I like to think that I try, at least
 
@Danu I'm afraid that I'm very happy with my choice :P
 
But I'm not! :D
 
9:55 PM
lol
 
Also
 
But yeah, bridging the gap between math and physics seems to grow exponentially more difficult the deeper you get in, not least because the descriptions grow exponentially more cryptic and pithy :P
 
If one would be interested in being a good candidate for positions that may involve some programming, in a company looking for PhD mathematicians, what would be a good first programming langauge to learn (obviously asking for a friend ;D)?
 
gosh, getting visual studio and TFS set up on my company computer is turning out to be a pain...-.-
@Danu Python is really hot right now, and it's pretty intuitive and easy to pick up imo
 
@Danu If you're looking at a specific company, it depends very much on what the company is doing. But on the other hand, learning programming languages gets much easier after the first one or two
 
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