The h Bar

@heather FYI if you want to know whether someone is suspended (not banned, we don't really do bans), you can look at their profile. If they are suspended, it will say so.

heather

@DavidZ but if their profile is deleted...

Sir Cumference

9:04 PM

@BernardoMeurer No, not at all, really

Alex

@heather Yes sorry about that.

Sir Cumference

Nazism isn't very funny

David Z

@heather Then they're deleted. Not suspended.

heather

@Alex, not a problem, I assume it is a joke?

Bernardo Meurer

@heather Weird indeed

@SirCumference No, but some Indian kid being a white supremacist is ironical

Alex

9:05 PM

@heather Yes of course.

heather

@DavidZ, i didn't know if a user who was banned forever is deleted ::shrugs::

Sir Cumference

@BernardoMeurer I don't see the humor in it. Mafia was stressed from accusations about that stuff

David Z

@heather No, they are not. (1) "suspended" not "banned" (2) there are no true permanent suspensions (3) accounts are never deleted because of a suspension

Bernardo Meurer

@SirCumference Too bad

Alex

@heather I stayed in the US for a year actually...Anyway, jokes and useless information aside. What did you think of Obamas final speech?

heather

9:06 PM

okay @DavidZ, thanks

Bernardo Meurer

@DavidZ Accounts are only deleted upon request?

Sir Cumference

@BernardoMeurer smh

heather

@Alex well, to be honest, i didn't listen to it. being an 8th grader who doesn't care about their future, i don't follow politics =P (i do, just not much.)

JamalS

Did anyone see the Trump press conference?

anonymous

@Alex What did you think of it ?

Sir Cumference

9:08 PM

@JamalS Oh God, don't bring politics here

David Z

@BernardoMeurer Spammers' accounts are also deleted, when they're new. But for someone who has a lot of reputation (thousands), I can't think of any reason the account would be deleted except by request.

heather

okay, random question: which is easier to learn, general relativity or quantum mechanics?

JamalS

@SirCumference They were just discussing politics...

heather

just curious what people think.

anonymous

@JamalS I saw and laughed a lot. :D

@heather GR (according to me). No one understand QM and QFT completely even after say 50 years of experience. Take John Rennie for example :)

Bernardo Meurer

9:08 PM

@DavidZ They join Scientology and become spammers, there

JamalS

Damn, I just got rick rolled.

heather

@anonymous taking into account prerequisites?

David Z

@BernardoMeurer Maybe sockpuppetry, I guess.

@BernardoMeurer ... lol

Sir Cumference

@heather I don't know much of either, but I know more people knowledgeable on QM then on GR

Alex

@JamalS Yeah I saw it. The usual trump media bashing. Although he did admit there was russian interference in the election...So yeah.

Bernardo Meurer

9:10 PM

@Alex What?

JamalS

@Alex Trump doesn't need the media to make himself look like an unqualified pleb.

Sir Cumference

@Alex God, I just want to put the electrons behind me

heather

@SirCumference lol, electrons

Alex

@BernardoMeurer Sorry hacking not interference...But it really amounts to the same thing. Just he didn't use those words.

Sir Cumference

The fact that he's appointing all these businessmen to government positrons is stressful

Sigh, *elections

heather

9:11 PM

positrons...you're on a roll today @SirCumference

=D

Sir Cumference

God, my phone sucks

heather

this is fabulous, though: politics for physicists

Alex

@SirCumference Yeah scary time for the world...but at least not boring.

David Z

@JamalS I think that's the sort of thing SE is trying to cut down on

2

JamalS

@DavidZ Actually, it says "respect those that disagree" but it's not been established that he disagrees with me. One could believe that Trump is being bashed by the media, in addition to him being deplorable.

They're not mutually exclusive or contradictory.

Also, what's with the Sith references in that post? Lol.

David Z

9:15 PM

But it doesn't say respect only those that disagree. Anyway, my understanding of the post is such that we should not be calling people unqualified plebs in primary site chat rooms.

Bernardo Meurer

@JamalS If you need to badmouth someone to criticise them it generally means you don't have good enough critics to make. Watch out.

JamalS

@BernardoMeurer Actually, no - that argument is along the same vein as people that say those that curse to express themselves have poor vocabulary. Expressing oneself with very unmannerly terms does not reflect necessarily a lack of sufficient legitimate critiques to make, it simply reflects the fact a person holds that opinion strongly.

Alex

Have a good night/day everyone, going to have some tea...Apologies to the room for starting the Trump discussion, next time I will stick to physics, maybe religion...

Bernardo Meurer

@JamalS Actually no it isn't, it's a well documented logical fallacy, Ad hominem

David Z

@Alex hehe, well that may be a good idea. See you later.

anonymous

9:18 PM

@Alex Please don't bring in religion :P

OVERLOAD!!!

JamalS

@BernardoMeurer Logical fallacy? What are you on about? Calling someone a jerk or whatever term doesn't mean you don't have the facts to back up that claim.

Bernardo Meurer

@JamalS No, but it means you're not using them and appealing to Ad hominem instead, which makes what you're saying useless

If there's no critique of the actual idea, but you're just calling him a deplorable it's an Ad hominem, and it's plain useless

JamalS

If that's true, then saying the media are bashing Trump is equally useless without explicit explanations.

Bernardo Meurer

@JamalS What? I think you just committed false analogy

Sir Cumference

Oct 21 '16 at 20:16, by MAFIA36790

No politics.

heather

9:21 PM

whew, forget about the politics post, i think there needs to be an arguments post

"useless"

AccidentalFourierTransform

ken bone for president

heather

who's that?

Bernardo Meurer

@AccidentalFourierTransform HUMONGOUS BONE

AccidentalFourierTransform

@heather a beautiful human submarine

heather

what now?

::googles::

Bernardo Meurer

9:23 PM

@heather The man of my dreams

heather

b-ball coach...what's so special about him?

AccidentalFourierTransform

ObiWan Kenboni

Bernardo Meurer

That's god

heather

so confused.

anonymous

@heather Bone has been recognized nationally as a top offensive-minded coach both as assistant and head coach. His teams at Seattle Pacific University, Portland State, and Washington State routinely ranked amongst the nation's elite in offensive efficiency-Wiki

Bernardo Meurer

9:24 PM

I was going to say "gold" but the typo made it better

knowyourmeme.com/memes/ken-bone

@heather Read that

JamalS

@BernardoMeurer I disagree; simply saying the media are bashing Trump does not enlighten us in any way, it would be as equally useless in your sense of the word as my claim he is unqualified.

AccidentalFourierTransform

he did a reddit AMA and it was hilarious

heather

that's weird.

why does anyone care?

Bernardo Meurer

@JamalS It does enlighten us because it is not a judgement of value. When you state he is unqualified and a deplorable without basis all you have is an Ad hominem. When you say the media is bashing him it is easily verifiable and relatively "factual", although you providing some sort of proof would have brought strength to it (not that I think it required it)

AccidentalFourierTransform

@heather its the internet

Bernardo Meurer

9:27 PM

@heather Because he is ken bone

AccidentalFourierTransform

why do people do anything?

anonymous

@heather quora.com/Who-is-Ken-Bone-Why-has-he-become-so-famous

Physics Meta

0

Q: What's wrong with my post?

I posted this finding acceleration in a pulley system with D'Alembert's Principle And it was put on hold, then I added more info and explained that this is my attempt to a solution, but I got no answer and it's still on hold? Thank you for your help

support

JamalS

@BernardoMeurer Actually, it's not easily verifiable. Since he has done many questionable and even obscene things, separating the effects of the media, and what would be the sole effects of reporting entirely objectively his deplorable actions is somewhat subjective. Or at least, it is as equally subjective as examining whether he is fit for Presidency, since there is no set criteria for that and it would require some subjectivity as well.

Bernardo Meurer

@JamalS Nope, you just state that they are bashing him, not that it is rightful or correct

AccidentalFourierTransform

9:32 PM

btw any Bojack Horseman fan here?

I was thinking of rewatching the whole series again

JamalS

@BernardoMeurer Out of curiosity, what is your opinion of Trump?

Bernardo Meurer

@JamalS I don't know yet. I think he's someone who changes his facade to win whatever he is going after, and I think he is a smart guy (note: this does not make him competent or anything else a priori). I think he won't do most of the things he said because it was just a facade. Although that's not very ethical on his part, I think everyone in big politics does it, so it doesn't speak too badly of him in comparison to others.

Note that I wrote I think so many times because I have no way to know, ask me again past 2 years of presidency or so and I will have a more solidified opinion. Until now for what I can see he is just an actor.

JamalS

@BernardoMeurer So you think he genuinely doesn't really have his own point of view on most issues, if most of it is acting?

Bernardo Meurer

@JamalS That's not what I said. I said he doesn't express his real point of view or objectives

JamalS

@BernardoMeurer Do you think he will make those genuine points of view known and implement when in office, or continue to sway with what suits him best?

Bernardo Meurer

9:40 PM

An actor doesn't lose his persona while acting, he just hides it, they don't have amnesia

@JamalS Everyone, with rare exceptions, is swaying with what suits them best

Do note though that by the time he enacts things that are of his "true interest" it becomes visible, so he cannot hide from what he does. He can try to deceive the reasoning behind the action though

AccidentalFourierTransform

no bojack fans then?

:-(

anonymous

Did anyone try the Trump sandwich yet ? :D Looks quite tasty but I don't know how I would bite into that humongous thing :P cdn-jpg.thedailymeal.net/sites/default/files/story/2016/…

JamalS

Yeah, I absolutely detest food that is not practical to eat.

AccidentalFourierTransform

@JamalS you're not trying hard enough

make that bologna sandwich your bitch

anonymous

9:55 PM

@AccidentalFourierTransform By squeezing it ? :P

AccidentalFourierTransform

easy peasy sandwich squeezy

JamalS

The sandwich is not worth the struggle.

anonymous

Once I tried that ^ and ended with up a mouth-ache which lasted for a week:P

Nowadays I just removed the veggies from in-between and then eat :D

AccidentalFourierTransform

10:15 PM

chat ded

heather

@AccidentalFourierTransform, well, after the sandwich thing, people were like "this chat is just a bunch of baloney, i'm getting out" =P

$\mu$ $\nu$

hmm.

why do greek letters have to look so much like english letters?

AccidentalFourierTransform

i blame it on trump tbh

thanks obama!

heather

I thought $\nu$ was $v$

@AccidentalFourierTransform wat

what are "indices"?

AccidentalFourierTransform

and $\pi$ looks like a hand written r, and $\rho$ looks like a hand written p

and $\Gamma$ is an L upside down

and so is $\gamma$

heather

gammy looks like y

AccidentalFourierTransform

10:19 PM

its an $\ell$ upside down

heather

$\beta$ looks like b

anonymous

@heather Everyone likes to speak nonsense once in a while :D

heather

@anonymous including me =)

$\chi$ looks like x

greek letters just have a little extra "squiggle"

AccidentalFourierTransform

and then there is $\Xi$

heather

E maybe?

no, wait

that's a baloney sandwich, i know it.

AccidentalFourierTransform

10:22 PM

ok what about $\Theta$? and $\Upsilon$?

heather

well, $\theta$ looks like o written in some fancy font

$\Upsilon$ looks like y

$\omicron$ looks like o too.

$\omicron$ - omicron $o$ - o

I see absolutely no difference.

anonymous

@heather Greek letters were used as scientists had exhausted all English letters for some physical quantities ! And Greek letters are quite similar too (and that's one of the reasons it was the preferred second choice for symbols)

The third choice is Hebrew letters

hebrew is cool

like ℵ

looks like n

10:25 PM

(Aleph)

AccidentalFourierTransform

yeah Cantor new that

anonymous

And fourth choice is Chinese most probably

AccidentalFourierTransform

$\aleph=|\mathbb N_0|$

anonymous

力 for force

heather

ooh, we can cast spells and write equations at the same time =D

the magematician

AccidentalFourierTransform

10:27 PM

and what about roman numerals?

I, for one, like them

anonymous

@AccidentalFourierTransform They are not used as variables in physics

AccidentalFourierTransform

it was a joke

too subtle maybe?

and they are used to denote derivatives

the $'$ in $f'$ is actually the number $I$

heather

oh

anonymous

Toooooo subtle :)

heather

i thought some physicist just hit his apostrophe key and was like, hey, this might be useful...

anonymous

10:29 PM

@AccidentalFourierTransform Doesn't look like that

heather

(of course, the use of the apostrophe probably came around long before computers. whatever.)

anonymous

@heather I like the dash notation more than the dot notation for derivatives...strange choice maybe !

AccidentalFourierTransform

Notation for differentiation

In differential calculus, there is no single uniform notation for differentiation. Instead, several different notations for the derivative of a function or variable have been proposed by different mathematicians. The usefulness of each notation varies with the context, and it is sometimes advantageous to use more than one notation in a given context. The most common notations for differentiation (and its opposite operation, the antidifferentiation or indefinite integration) are listed below. == Leibniz's notation == The original notation employed by Gottfried Leibniz is used throughout mathematics...

heather

@anonymous oh, the use of dots for derivatives vs. the use of the apostrophe for derivatives. the other annoying thing about using ' for derivatives is it is sometimes used on variables like there's x and then there's x' (a variable that's not x but is somehow related to x)

AccidentalFourierTransform

huh, it seems that it was always a prime

anonymous

10:32 PM

@heather I agree...I used to make many errors due to that in my early calc days

AccidentalFourierTransform

and the roman numerals came later

anonymous

Does anyone here know how the integration formulas are derived ? Like for sin(x) and cos(x) ? I never found it in my books :(

I only know the derivation of integration of linear functions like f(x)=ax+b

user228700

@heather: Will u please do me a favour? Will u ping me?

AccidentalFourierTransform

@Kaumudi.H

heather

@Kaumudi.H

anonymous

10:36 PM

Or is it just that you compile a list of differentials and then match it with the integrals :/

@Kaumudi.H @Kaumudi.H @Kaumudi.H !!!

AccidentalFourierTransform

@anonymous essentially, yes

anonymous

@AccidentalFourierTransform Then that is only thing in maths that disappoints me :P

user228700

Damn. It didn't work :-(

user228700

Thanks, guys.

anonymous

@Kaumudi.H ? what

user228700

10:40 PM

Hang on, will somebody do it again?

anonymous

@Kaumudi.H

heather

@Kaumudi.H

would someone mind explaining indices, in the context of general relativity?

anonymous

@Kaumudi.H

heather

@0celo7 hello

counting down the days until you arrive back

and then Banach spaces =)

AccidentalFourierTransform

2 hours ago, by Sir Cumference

I miss 0celo...

we all do buddy, we all do

Bernardo Meurer

10:42 PM

@0celo7 "I will not be returning to the chat"

He just sent me a text

heather

wat

never!?

not to...why?

Bernardo Meurer

"Unless obe and obliv return"

"and slereah becomes more active"

AccidentalFourierTransform

who's obe?

Bernardo Meurer

He chaged name a lot

3507

IceLord

AccidentalFourierTransform

whats his current name?

heather

10:44 PM

obliv: "Sorry to those that have got to know me at the h-bar. I will one day return but right now things are changing so I can't with good conscious remain active there. Thank you for everything :)"

AccidentalFourierTransform

I need to see his picture

Bernardo Meurer

@AccidentalFourierTransform Deleted account

heather

obe is...is gone. forever, i think.

so there's no hope.

let's make an obe-bot =P

AccidentalFourierTransform

you think you could find a link to his profile?

even if it 404s

im curious now :-P

Bernardo Meurer

"It's clear the mods don't like me. It's not worth the abuse. If she [heather] wants to talk to me, figure something out (Skype, etc.)."

Obe is alive, me and Ryan have talked to him

heather

10:47 PM

if you don't want to talk here, why do you hang around @0celo7 (no offense)

Bernardo Meurer

Because he is attached

heather

(also, for the record, i unfortunately cannot skype...i think my parents would be more than a bit adverse to that.)

@BernardoMeurer yeah. that makes sense.

Bernardo Meurer

@heather I think by Skype he means Skype messages

anonymous

@heather Skype has only messaging facility also. You can switch off your camera

heather

@BernardoMeurer, that's a thing?

huh, did not know that.

Bernardo Meurer

10:48 PM

@heather "I was looking for ACM, also I check my pings"

@heather Yeah, you can just use Skype for messages, with no audio/video whatsoever

Skype is total shit though

Use Tox for messaging, it's OSS

heather

Tox? ::googles::

anonymous

Whatsapp is also good :)

@BernardoMeurer never heard of it

AccidentalFourierTransform

and tinder

anonymous

@AccidentalFourierTransform LOL :D

Bernardo Meurer

@AccidentalFourierTransform lol

@heather Add me on Tox :)

heather

10:51 PM

@BernardoMeurer, i don't have the space on the chromebook to download tox

i have storage issues =P

Bernardo Meurer

:(

it's like 40MB

anonymous

Google hangouts ? It is online without any download.

Bernardo Meurer

That too

AccidentalFourierTransform

or.... just use the math.SE chat?

till you get banned and then the TeX.SE chat

and so on

there are around ~100 SE's

anonymous

@AccidentalFourierTransform All chats are connected on SE

heather

10:53 PM

google hangouts seems like the best off-SE option

anonymous

If you are banned on one then you are banned on all

AccidentalFourierTransform

Physics Problems Q&A chat please

user228700

@anonymous I've an app called "Pushbullet" on my phone--it syncs my phone to my laptop. You know how you don't receive desktop notifications if the tab isn't open at the time? So I have the SE app on my phone which notifies me of pings so now even without the tab being open I can view all this from my laptop. Yay! It worked just now.

anonymous

@heather Indeed but it ruins your anonimity

heather

@AccidentalFourierTransform not complete yet =/

@anonymous that is one problem, yes

AccidentalFourierTransform

10:55 PM

@heather what will be the rules there?

can people swear?

cause im holding my tongue here all the time =P

heather

lol