"it puts the onus on them to not end things awkwardly" - all conversations are secretly a game of hot potato, and the loser's punishment is an awkward silence. — A_S00 51 secs ago

Hi Thanks for answering me, It makes sense when you explain it, although is a bit confusing, I mean I am expecting that at some point all my comments with Catija will get deleted, but the chat with Catija was helpful, even if chatty. However simply stating like that person did "This is not SO" is antagonizing, If you read my question I mentioned SO, just to explain to what I am used to. It is clear already that I know this site is not SO, and in no place in my question I ask for this site to be like SO, how restating it helps? — Mykazuki 1 min ago

I'm not sure where you live, but 'I'm trying to' meaning 'I am' or 'I'm going to' is a not uncommon expression in the US — Shane 1 min ago

I would go further and say that you (the OP) should (have) actually want(ed) to know the answer to this question! You should want to know what the feedback actually was, not just that it was positive, so you know where you're strong, where else you could possibly improve, and what it is that the customers actually appreciated. — Derek Elkins 1 min ago

@Mykazuki I'm assuming it was inspired by your phrase "In this context, I am more used to Stack Overflow, where whether for sheer volume or for some "cultural" reason they are not so aggressive with comments like in this site." - just to emphasize that, yeah, things are a bit different here. I don't think it was supposed to be antagonizing; I didn't read it that way. — HDE 226868 ♦ 1 min ago

So, maybe this is an English thing, but I read it similar to you telling me about something and you give as an example how things are done in your country and I answer you "This is not your country". Anyways I won't be flagging any more comments on meta to save moderation time. Thank you. — Mykazuki 52 secs ago

Sorry about that, it looked like you were asking us to rehash a lot of conversations that had already been had and settled. Seemed more appropriate to direct you to read the aforementioned discussions than to have them all over again. — apaul 22 secs ago

@apaul O no, your comment was useful, I mean I had read already some posts about comments, but If I hadn't It would have been useful, because apparently comments here are a big deal, unlike SO, where I haven't seen so much discussion about them. — Mykazuki 1 min ago

As someone who is in a similar situation: It's entirely about how you think your SO will react. My wife makes (good-natured) fun of me for having a crush on one of our mutual friends, but then I've had at least one girlfriend in the past that would've been livid over it. I understand your desire for catharsis, but if you personally believe there's no danger to your relationship, then consider carefully whether your desire to tell him could end up doing both of you more harm than good. — kungphu 55 secs ago

Sorry. I won't do this again. I redirected the question now. — Canada - Area 51 Proposal 40 secs ago

DO NOT edit questions after they've been answered to drastically change what they are about. — Catija ♦ 45 secs ago

@Catija Isn't this the nature of editing questions? — Canada - Area 51 Proposal 24 secs ago

You changed it from being about one question to being about a completely different question. No, that's not what editing is about. — Catija ♦ 38 secs ago

If you ask on meta requesting for your question to be reopened, you need to actually make a case for why it should be. Address earlier concerns and the issues that led to it being closed, and explain why your question, in its current form, deserves to be open - in more than one sentence. It behooves you to explain all this as clearly as possible. — HDE 226868 ♦ 1 min ago

Must be awfully warm and cozy being a dumpster fire. — apaul 1 min ago

In addition, the current question doesn't contain a question in the body, and the dupe asks how to "cope", which is too vague. — Monica Cellio 12 secs ago

If you want to slightly re-word an old question you are supposed to edit that question, not make a new one. — Jesse 18 secs ago

This is still off-topic, we can not make your decisions for you. Try to clearly explain what your goals are and what your methods of communication are. — Jesse 28 secs ago

This will be difficult to get re-opened because you need to outline what you want to do for us to be able to answer it, but what you want to do is what made this off-topic in the first place — Jesse 1 min ago

@gnasher729 a point well made. — Arcanist Lupus 1 min ago

@mickeyf Feel free to replace "Have a nice day!" at the end of the last response with an appropriate level of rudeness. There are many lovely options you can use that begin with "Now go..." — Arcanist Lupus 1 min ago

In addition to the specific example, explaining specifically what was "lacking" about its result would also help us understand what sort of answer you are looking for — Jesse 1 min ago

You may want to look at the way that a (somewhat) similar question was raised on the Academia site, and the advice that asker receives. There, the asker has identified that the student's case is covered under the university's disability policies, and the question is a specific about whether/how to pursue a lawsuit. academia.stackexchange.com/questions/107883/… — cactus_pardner 49 secs ago

@Catija My understanding of Gender Fluid pronouns is that it varies from person to person. "They" very purposefully is a non-constricting pronoun and does not actually rule out the use of any other pronoun (They could still wish to be called "he"). Since the question did not specifically state that they were a "they" or put any unusual emphasis on the word I think that it is open enough to interpretation that we should not hastily rule out any answer for not noticing the unwritten emphasis that we know was meant to be implied — Jesse 51 secs ago

I meant that as a person, I don't have any problem with him, but when it comes to flirt, then it is something different ;) — Moslem Cherif 1 min ago

@MonkeyZeus I never thought about this. I think I'm gonne delete my answer. Because this answer is not so good. — Doggo 41 secs ago

Voting to close as unclear. Are you asking how to establish boundaries (title) or how to avoid setting boundaries an beat around the bush (question body)? — henning 23 secs ago

@Tinkeringbell I know, when I posted my comment there were only two answers, this and the one posted by Mafii. I feel that, while there's nothing wrong with Mafii's answer, the one from chauxvive is as valid but had score of -1. That downvote made no sense to me. — r41n 8 secs ago

Voting to close this as unclear what you're asking until you've provided the details asked for above. In it's current form, this question is lacking detail. The most important one for me being that we don't know Taylor, so we don't know how she will react to any of this, and the fact that this still reads a little a like 'I want some advice on how to write my first message'. — Tinkeringbell 27 secs ago

Also, the situation you describe suggests there is no conversation going on at the moment, and so the question makes no sense — Tinkeringbell 12 secs ago

If it were me having constantly my questions "DV / closed / argued over" (and so on...), I'd start thinking about my way of using this stack, and not why this stack doesn't understand me :) — OldPadawan 30 secs ago

I think we are too involved in the context of "paid sex" that we have missed the real problem? I feel the real problem is about setting boundaries, or in other words, "give me space/privacy" or "have some faith in me". So for example, if I said I am going Hong Kong with my friends for vacation for a 4D3N, the answer of "I am going there just to take breaks with my friends" should be suffice enough for my family. — Yoshiaki 15 secs ago

Well, of the two options you gave, the second (telling her what not to wear) is offensive, so don't go with that one ;) But as others have said, probably less awkward overall just to let if go completely. Start afresh. — trr 1 min ago

Since the conversation you are talking about has ended, I think a more accurate question for your scenario would be "How to start a more varied conversation with someone when all you have talked about before is Taylor Ham?" — Jesse 5 secs ago

Exactly my point; I think the second response should be stronger. After you have already said "I feel better without it." once, the other party should not attempt to dispute that, and if they do then it's reasonable to continue with "Because that is the truth". — user21820 53 secs ago

What's keeping your from using the conversation starters everybody uses in day to day life? What makes you think they won't suffice? — Tinkeringbell 30 secs ago

You keep talking about social norms. However, you seem quite ignorant about what some of the newer social norms are. (Newer meaning compared to some prior decades.) That's my insight, but maybe I'm from an area that has some different social norms than you. As is, although you have some good points, they seem buried in insults for the woman who might just be filling what she considers to be modern social norms. — TOOGAM 1 min ago

Since he has deleted the folders already, what do you want to stop? The many questions at the end make this un-answerable, you really need to think about specifically what your goal is and then explain it in simple terms. — Jesse 22 secs ago

@stacy he's a very outgoing person. Free time for him is partying, hitting the gym, playing sports or just exploring the city. For me it's picking up a book or spending time on some websites. That's the entire problem. I can never seem to relate to his interests — kiiler 48 secs ago

“What should I do?”-type questions aren't a good fit for this site. We don't know your husband, and we can't diagnose him as having just a habit or a serious addiction. Also, how bad this is is primarily opinion based, and we don't do questions determining right from wrong either. You can't look into his head, neither can we, so we can't tell you if he feels actually guilty. And lastly we can't change him, or force him to do anything, so we can't ensure he won't do this again. What interpersonal skill would you like help with here? — Tinkeringbell 30 secs ago

This is pretty broad. I recommend focusing on one interpersonal problem you'd like help with. As it is now, this is 6+ questions wrapped into one, some of which themselves are off topic for this site. — Magisch 1 min ago

Figures. Well, y'all have a nice day then. — R. Schmitz 1 min ago

Just as an brainstorming for on-topic questions about this: Have you thought about understanding his motivation first, before judging his actions? Have you thought about the intrusion in his private space that happened on your side? Interpersonal matters usually involve two people so it may help to focus more on the transactions between you two. — Daniel 37 secs ago

So woman of you. Guy has already deleted the Folder, said sorry, but you are still unpleased. Moreover, its not good to use other people gadgets without them knowing about it. Its called privacy and every person should have a bit of it. Dont bring it up again for your and his sake. — Deutche Knabe 23 secs ago

"Frank told me Dave had repeatedly insulted him, which Frank tried to cope with by joking, which Dave in return believed was bullying." This sounds kinda weird in the abstract. Do you know what exactly went on? Is it clear to everyone (including Dave) that the insults were insults (not just some miscommunication)? Does Dave admit to the insults and if so does he say why he insulted the others? — AllTheKingsHorses 18 secs ago

I have bought few t-shirts with text like "I have social anxiety, please don't make me do team building" for company parties, "I don't like loud noises and crowded places" "I know 5 language and I don't speak in all of them". And when approached by host (or other attendants) that don't know me I just point on t-shirt. I also usually attend parties organised by me closer peers so they know that I'm misanthrope so I will have headphones or book with me. — SZCZERZO KŁY 1 min ago

Did you try... huh... going there in person? — LinuxBlanket 46 secs ago

Thank you for your Answer. Just to be clear, do you reject the Add relevant but minor or transient information to a post from the help-center as a valid reason to comment on this stack? — Daniel 48 secs ago

I suppose there's not much room for improvement in this area of conversation, it's just that I enjoy discussing freely about any topic and don't wanna be that guy who says "we can talk about anything but THIS". If I say like I don't wanna talk with him about this topic anymore wouldn't that entitle him to his opinion even more? — Alexander Aeons Torn 58 secs ago

In the context of this, are you trying to provide supplemental support in addition to something like therapy or are you the brunt of this person's support system? — Magisch 7 secs ago

The option to delete comments that are no longer relevant is already a flag option. — Magisch 1 min ago

I think that that's more for cases like this: People ask for sources, and you happen to know some. I think minor information is okay. If I write an answer and you have a good source explaining it, backing it up, feel free to add it. That's different enough from saying 'me-too' to not warrant a 'me-not'... I'm not so sure what transient information is, I'd have to look up what is meant by that. But all comments are transient... I just fail to see how that works for information specifically ;) — Tinkeringbell 1 min ago

I've looked at that, and the help center already gives examples on this: e.g. a link to a related question, or an alert to the author that the question has been updated. I have addressed the links to related questions already. I think comments that are meant as alerts can be removed as obsolete once a post is edited or an edit is 'accepted' (OP confirms in a comment this is okay with them) for example — Tinkeringbell 1 min ago

Another type of such comments may be leaving sources that you happen to know, like it was done here. As you can see, that comment has been left alone for a long time, waiting for the OP to decide to add that into the answer. — Tinkeringbell 1 min ago

@Tinkeringbell: It seems like you just repeat the current strict policy. Don't you think IPS could be better with other rules? I think the idea is to have a website which answers questions. Should the questions and answers and comments change or should maybe the website policy change? — Edgar 5 secs ago

@Edgar, I have quoted the current policy and reasons why I think it's a good idea. You wrote an answer saying why they're not... For me, this is about comments and the questions/answer they're made on. For you, apparently, it's not. Make your case for website policy change in your answer, and let people decide if they think it's a good idea or not. I personally think IPS would not be better with other rules, because I've seen the state this was in before these rules we have now, and part of what your answer is suggesting is inviting IPS back to a state before those rules. — Tinkeringbell 1 min ago

These are all publicly available pictures - what makes them indecent? Clearly the person involved doesn't have a problem with sharing them with the world. — Erik 17 secs ago

@Yoshiaki Are you psychic or have some other ability to know better than me what the real problem is? It's only a problem when it's a paid sex only vacation. Saying "I am going there just to take breaks with my friends" is not a problem (in this case I'm going alone so that's already too big of a lie) I still need to answer something to the question that will be asked when I return "How was your trip what did you do there?". — snart 27 secs ago

One serious downside to the delete option you're considering is that people can make trivial edits, and singlehandedly remove comments. So, if people are asking for back up, change a word or two, and remove the comment. That's not really true to the nature of comments, because the commenter doesn't have the clarification they were after/the answer wasn't improved — Tinkeringbell 29 secs ago

@Tinkeringbell: Interesting, I was not there at that time. Do you have any links i.e. to questions from that time? Or was this all cleaned up? Sometimes it's easy to imagine things would be better with other rules but experience is obviously better. — Edgar 16 secs ago

@A_S00 There is so much truth to your comment that it pains me, lol. I would update my question to point out the wisdom in your analogy/metaphor but I think your comment deserves the upvotes. — MonkeyZeus 43 secs ago

@Edgar about all of it was cleaned up. I'm talking about times when there isn't much community flagging, so the flags that were raised sometimes spent 6 hours sitting for a moderator to clean them up, attracting huge amounts of discussion and nastyness. It led to some discussion about moderators from different timezones, and the conclusion was basically that we as a community should pick up flagging instead of relying on the moderators... So far, we already seem to be doing a lot better (with a massive amount of improvement that can be done too, but hey..) — Tinkeringbell 1 min ago

Excellent answer I would upvote 5 times if I could, why is it negatively scored?. Fully answers the question from the boundaries angle (the only one I was allowed to ask about). The question was closed again for some other reason which I find very strange (people who reopened said it's a decent question now) so probably no more answers. I will accept yours or Sentinel's(it's very funny) if I will get the chance and the answers and my question won't be deleted. — snart 44 secs ago

"he has unknowingly broken their trust." No, he hasn't. We all fantasize about some of the people of the opposite sex we know. But what you're accusing him of is a thought crime. And really, you can not control his thoughts. Instead, you should ask him to imagine him finding pictures of all the guys you knew in your life on your computer, just as you found all of his, neatly sorted in subfolders and sorted alphabetically. Would he be happy about that? Of course, not. This would bring up all kinds of insecurities for him. Explain your feelings of jealousy in those terms, but also stop snooping — Stephan Branczyk 1 min ago

@Jesse Except you have zero knowledge that the person being discussed ever identifies as female at all. Using pronouns you don't know to be appropriate when there's an appropriate one available to you seems problematic to me. — Catija ♦ 36 secs ago

@henning In this version of the question - establish boundaries. It's very clear from the body and from the title. The body additionally explains why I want those boundaries. It was clear to the people who reopened it. Please work on your reading comprehension skills, your current level causes you to close clear questions. — snart 1 min ago

Sadly, we're not here to tell you what to do. Asking whether or not you've left it too long is primarily opinion based as well. As for how to ask it back without seeming rude, that's borderline asking us to write your text for you, as long as you can't provide us with details on what you tried/are thinking of trying and on what you are afraid might go wrong. Also, to avoid answers telling you to 'just let it go', you might want to include why you feel you need to ask all of sudden, and why you're so intent on getting those 25 pounds... — Tinkeringbell 1 min ago

I've seen this discussion in many forms, across many different stack exchange platforms. The answer to "are comments moderated too strictly?" is invariably "no, they are not. Comments should always be viewed as transient, subject to deletion at any time." — Beofett 52 secs ago

please Edgar, please, don't answer "should I" type of questions. They're not suited for the site (see @Tinkeringbell comment below OP). — OldPadawan 49 secs ago

So basically if you assume everything will turn out the way you want it on its own, everything will turn out the way you want it on its own. — Raditz_35 1 min ago

@snart It ws a$$ — fkraiem 9 secs ago

@Daniel A key part of the add relevant but minor or transient information to a post is transient. I've always interpreted that as "this type of comment is appropriate, but not expected to be permanent additions to content". The guidelines I've typically seen are "good comments could result in changes to the question/answer, and once that happens (or fails to happen), the comment should no longer be necessary". — Beofett 26 secs ago

Thanks so much - I will try this :) — D.Hutchinson 1 min ago

I do not imagine her taking it well, if you tell her that you are too busy to meet her, and then she eventually sees you hanging out with your other friend. Did that myself, did not go well at all. Try something more honest, even if it is harder. — Lot 1 min ago

@Tinkeringbell: Thanks for the explanation! An thank you very much for the thought presentation of the current policy. Much appreciated answer! — Daniel 29 secs ago

@Beofett: Can you give some references? — Daniel 24 secs ago

@fkraiem Great edit and great advice! — Lord Farquaad 1 min ago

@Lot yeah, I thought about what you said and agree. I've edited my answer a bit to address the health concerns - and the need for some distance - more honestly. Thanks, — D.Hutchinson 46 secs ago

Accepting this answer because it's closest to how things turned out. He finally called me back about something else and brought up graduation on his own, so luckily I didn't have to start the conversation. Leaving my preferences open-ended like you suggest seemed to work well :) — Em C 42 secs ago

I really appreciate this answer - although it worked out without having to explicitly talk about this, it was clear from other things he said that he was sensitive to the situation, so I was glad to have this advice in my back pocket just in case :) — Em C 49 secs ago

Hi Maulik! Welcome to IPS! Unfortunately, your answer is a bit short to understand what you mean. Could you please expand a little so as to explain why you think this is a good idea? — avazula 1 min ago

@TOOGAM: I am not insulting, but providing objective reasons. None of the upvoted anwsers did this. They merely refer to misandrous and sicence denying social norms that I do not support, and I personally find insulting to men. Since OP did not specify that he is part of an extremist man hating social circle, my advice is valid for the general population outside of ultra-liberal US groups. Again: You are only right if your social norms are accepted without questioning and I gave reasons that they aren't. — problemofficer 52 secs ago

@Catija "he/she" != female — Jesse 1 min ago

This answer would benefit from providing your cultural background and describing if you have any relevant experience talking to women in situations like this, and if so how they reacted. — Em C 22 secs ago

We expect answers to be more substantial than just saying "Do this". Unless this answer gets an edit it is likely to be deleted. — sphennings 20 secs ago

Can you please give some examples of the sorts of conflict you're describing? — HDE 226868 ♦ just now

@Catija I don't think I would consider "he/she" to be using pronouns, but rather prompting that the preferred pronoun was never actually mentioned — Jesse 10 secs ago

This answer is needlessly rude and violates the Be Nice policy. — D.Hutchinson 29 secs ago

@HDE226868 remember when Magisch asked a question on how to apologize and was nearly crucified? Are you asking because you want the question stronger, or because you can't remember any incidents like that? — Richard U 52 secs ago

@EmC: I don't think cultural backround is relevant for this question. My main point is that all men are hard wired to react to visual stimuli of female breasts. Therefore it is not a choice and woman should not provoke this behaviour, if they don't like it. Obviously I am only talking about looking and nothing else. — problemofficer 1 min ago

@RichardU It's a good idea to have examples as part of the question so that people can understand the context of the question without needing to have been there to see how bad the comments got before they were deleted. — sphennings just now

@RichardU I'm asking because I don't see everything that goes on here and may have missed the incidents that are being referenced here, and because the same may be true of a lot of other people reading this. Also, it's not just about when there's conflict; it's about when that conflict stems from the interpretation of the Be Nice policy. — HDE 226868 ♦ 8 secs ago

@sphennings that's why I asked the question — Richard U 1 min ago

I think it is quite relevant to your answer. As TOOGAM commented earlier, their cultural experience does not align with your experience, so clearly this is not a universal solution. Can you add the experience/sources that inform your opinions and assertions here? In particular, have you ever used this technique or seen it used successfully? — Em C 1 min ago

@RichardU also note apaul's answer to my recent meta question: interpersonal.meta.stackexchange.com/questions/2744/… ... and note that I am doing my best to not respond to him, and just flag instead. But it's hard to always have to take it on the chin and just keep watching him insult me and push me around and belittle me - over and over again, in chat, main, and meta. But still, I'm doing my best to not engage him, because that will clearly not end well for me ... so I just have to stay positive and contribute where and when I can ... — D.Hutchinson 17 secs ago

@HDE226868 - I asked the question to give an answer actually give me 30 min please. — IHatePeople 37 secs ago

@RichardU I don't think I was around for the question you are talking about. There are plenty of other examples of people not being nice on this site. This question would be improved by bringing up some specific examples so that everyone can be on the same page about we are talking about. — sphennings 42 secs ago

@EmC Glad it worked out well! — Beofett 24 secs ago

Guys Please stop bickering in Comments to my question. Take it to Interpersonal Skills Chat — IHatePeople 38 secs ago

A lot of the scenarios you proposed involves content that should just be put in the answer or post itself - no need to leave it lying in a comment. Having it separate from the answer means that people might miss it. — HDE 226868 ♦ 23 secs ago

@HDE 226868: Could you care to be a bit more specific. Currently I fail to see how any of the points I made could be solved by your suggestion. — Daniel 13 secs ago

Gaming discussion, which references this meta.se discussion. Note in particular the `When should comments be deleted? section of the linked answer. — Beofett 28 secs ago

Downvotes on meta usually indicate disagreement/disapproval.. which I think isn't really supposed to be the case except on feature requests but since the points don't matter here it happens anyways. In this case it might be because we have a lot of discussion on comments already, and because answers-in-comments are always bad manner on StackExchange. — Em C 10 secs ago

@EmC psychologytoday.com/us/blog/evolution-the-self/200904/…: But, regardless of such restraints, the very sight of a female (real, or merely "fabricated" in their mind) can't help but fan this not-to-be-denied libidinous flame. — problemofficer 1 min ago

I´d also like to encourage down voters to contribute why you think this is not a worthwhile discussion to have. If you think all is well as it is, it would serve your cause much more to up vote the question as well as Tinkeringbell´s answer. — Daniel 1 min ago

Ehh... is this about discussing the need for a new/revised be nice policy, or about suggesting what should be changed? Because usually we have the discussion first, and only start suggesting changes and voting on them in a second meta post? — Tinkeringbell 1 min ago

Exactly what constitutes as "casting judgement" probably needs more defining — Jesse 2 mins ago

These are all good points. I think they lack the Specific and Measureable aspect that is important in policies. For example how would you objectively measure number 4. — IHatePeople 41 secs ago

Sources should be edited into your answer. Comments are subject to deletion by mods. — Em C just now

Could you expand on number 8... maybe in its own answer. I think that would be huge benefit personally — IHatePeople 55 secs ago

@HDE226868 - I think this site would be a great place to pilot this, but I am hoping it will go SE Wide sooner rather than later. — IHatePeople 49 secs ago

@Tinkeringbell - The proper way to follow the SE process is if you disagree with the idea posted you down vote the question on meta. Meta a downvote is not about the quality of the question or answer but rather agree or disagree with the premise. — IHatePeople 21 secs ago

Let's consider your second scenario, for instance (B). If that parable/anecdote really does give the question more context, then it would be helpful for the OP to edit it into the post themself (or if the person writing the comment is the OP, a direct edit would be preferable. — HDE 226868 ♦ 59 secs ago

Note that on meta, votes are typically interpreted differently, since they do not come with a reputation benefit/penalty. Downvotes frequently indicate general disagreement. If you're concerned about downvotes anyway, phrasing the question more neutrally might help, since I expect you're getting downvotes from people who disagree that comments are moderated too strictly, and upvoted by people who agree. — Beofett 48 secs ago

@sphennings - I focused the question on my perception it is a problem. If you disagree that it is a problem the proper method is to vote. Voting is a wisdom of the crowd solution. — IHatePeople 1 min ago

Even if you were playing for fun, one doesn't have the right to tell you anything about what you're doing with your free time. Even more when you do have a stable life, a career, and that you're not taking heroïn around the corner. I mean what the hell does he think he is ? — YCN- 1 min ago

I'd like to know why you think there is a problem. Saying "I think" is entirely subjective and non transferable. If you provided some examples of the problems you are seeing we could then have a discussion about how to fix these specific problems, rather than hope that everyone is on the same page about what the problem is. — sphennings 1 min ago

@HDE 226868: This would result in OP partly answering his own question. The same logic could also be applied to links to related SE-Topics, which somehow seem to be ok. It is also a touchy subject to edit someones original post regarding content. To my experience this brings more problems than it solves. You may not think it important, but the reality is that currently such information is simply lost for good on IPS.SE - an all further thoughts it may have sparked with it. — Daniel 1 min ago

@sphennings - No I do not want to call anyone to the carpet here. That is not the intent of the question. The intent is to improve the site as a whole. If you disagree with the premise then I suggest you downvote . — IHatePeople 26 secs ago

I have downvoted this, and also voted to close it as unclear what you're asking here: suggestions for a new help center text, guidelines on how to be nice or if you want to discuss the actual need to change the help center text. — Tinkeringbell 1 min ago

I don´t know but that somehow feels like people did not read the argument but only voted on the title. This puts up the general question what those votes are worth. I´ll try to change it. — Daniel 1 min ago

If you don't want to link to specific situations, that's ok. Could you instead describe in general the sort of behavior you are seeing, so that we can get on the same page. — sphennings 1 min ago

I don't understand why you are resistant to posting examples in your question, but posting an example in your answer is fine. — Beofett 1 min ago

@snart Just be a little bit wary with them German showerheads in the sauna. You can't trust them apparently. — Sentinel 1 min ago

I feel like this is already addressed by Your tone should match the way you'd talk in person with someone you respect and whom you want to respect you. which is in the be nice policy. — Magisch 10 secs ago

@Jesse - Yes Theft is immoral is casting judgement. But i think saying it that way is one of those grey areas. I think if you said "I believe theft is immoral" it would be fine, "Theft is immoral so you are a bad person for stealing" is not. The problem is the projection of blame. — IHatePeople 1 min ago

@Sentinel haha Dying surrounded by a hundred naked beauties is a good way to go ;-) — snart 20 secs ago

Also interesting how I am asked to provide sources but the other answers were not. Talk about discrimination. — problemofficer 1 min ago

@snart Yoshiaki is defending your question. I think you missed that. — Sentinel 28 secs ago

@Magisch not really. — Richard U 1 min ago

Calling someone outright immoral and insinuating they're a bad person is completly counter to #1 of "be nice", don't you agree? — Magisch 40 secs ago

@Sentinel Yes, after rereading it you're right, thanks. I was being truthful as to what it really is about. — snart 1 min ago

"Do not cast judgement on the questioner" would help in this case. But it does not cover "This won't work because"... but excluding that specific bullet point might be a good thing anyway. Commenting or answering with a significant flaw can be helpful — Jesse 29 secs ago

@Beofett - Because I calling out a specific set of problems in the question tends to limit the question responses to those specific problems. I am attempting to address a larger set of problems with the culture of SE. This is just the place that I see that could benefit most from it due to my lack of engagement due to my desire to avoid the conflict altogether. — WeAreAllInThisTogether 1 min ago

@Magisch what on earth are you talking about? — Richard U 14 secs ago

It would help if we knew what that "Specific set of problems" were. Could you edit your question to list what they are? — sphennings 25 secs ago

I understand that, but in this case, you seem to be saying our community is not nice enough. That's very general, and unless we can understand why you feel the existing "be nice" policy isn't sufficient, and in what ways it is currently failing, it becomes difficult to have a focused, meaningful discussion. — Beofett 21 secs ago

@sphennings - That is the thing it is not a specific set of problems I am trying to address. Rather trying to move the mountain so that we are addressing the problems before they happen rather than after they become an issue. — WeAreAllInThisTogether 27 secs ago

I'm unclear what you mean by "call-out culture". Could you elaborate? — Beofett just now

It's not lost for good. The comments can still be accessed by mods. If you want to add something to your answer that was in a deleted comment, just ask. We'll tell you what it said. — Catija ♦ 22 secs ago

Also, you're now asking if we can improve... as in, is it technically possible for a site to have their own version of be nice... You can either ask whether it should be done (and make your arguments for why it should be done, together with the set of such changes should remedy) or you can use your question to suggest a change, because it solves a specific problem... Right now, it's still unclear to me what the goal of this question is.. — Tinkeringbell 30 secs ago

Note that current answers range from "stay on topic" (paraphrasing) to "positive/negative vibe" to a "call out culture". These all seem rather disparate to me, and none of those answers seem to suggest a single solution to a problem. — Beofett 1 min ago

On a side note, "what on earth are you talking about" seems, ironically, to be a good example of where tone could be softened. — Beofett 32 secs ago

Ahah well I would have add in your answer, that the target is to get friend with one of them and then get into the group. It's the only way not to be unwanted. A — YCN- 22 secs ago

@Catija: Sorry if I was unclear - it is lost for other users of the site. — Daniel 58 secs ago

@Beofett - I have updated the question does that address your concerns enough? — WeAreAllInThisTogether 32 secs ago

The point of comments is that they are transitory. Something is important enough that it's loss will affect other users on the site, it should be included in the post itself. — sphennings 22 secs ago

@Tinkeringbell - I updated the question please reread and ask if you have any more questions. I think I am on to something huge. I know what I am thinking, but I also know I may not be giving enough information. I want to avoid getting bogged down in specifics, and focus on improving something that is already good into something great. — WeAreAllInThisTogether 49 secs ago

@sphennings: If transitory means they disappear in a matter of minutes, why bother having a comment function. Nobody out of your timezone can read your comments anyways so you could just go down to the pub and have your discussion there. — Daniel 20 secs ago

@RichardU You're arguing against call out culture. I'm arguing flat calling out is already against the rules right now. — Magisch 32 secs ago

I appreciate what you're trying to do, and I do think the edit helps, but I don't know that it helps enough. To clarify: your premise seems centered on conflict over differing interpretations over the be nice policy. My perception is that the conflicts I personally notice are more based upon ideological differences, where each side sees the other side's entire perspective as fundamentally "not nice". — Beofett 54 secs ago

Because they never should have been posted in the first place. We are under no obligation to allow users to misuse the comment function on this or any site. Existing for only minutes is good. — Catija ♦ 9 secs ago

@Magisch no, I am arguing FOR allowing people to save face and stating that it is an art that has been lost. In other words I'm saying "DO THIS" — Richard U 40 secs ago

@Beofett "call out culture" is essentially the opposite of allowing someone to save face. It is the deliberate humiliation and/or embarrassment of someone you disagree with. — Richard U 35 secs ago

@Beofett - I believe the problem is not the be nice policy. But rather our interpretations of it. I also believe we can tweak that policy in a way that is transformative to remove the ideological differences as something that is permitted to be addressed directly. I also believe that as a community we can address this issue and find that transformative solution. — WeAreAllInThisTogether 45 secs ago

@Beofett - Based on the comment above do you feel you could edit this question into something acceptable to the community? If we can figure it out here I would take it to Meta.SE. I am not ready to do that yet. But I think there are enough minds here to figure this out. — WeAreAllInThisTogether 22 secs ago

Negatively scored answers are typically subject to more scrutiny; not everyone reads every answer. I just skimmed the top three and they all give some background (I am a woman and would prefer this, I am a man and this worked for me). This site is community moderated - if you think other answers are lacking you are free to ask them for clarification or flag as appropriate. — Em C 26 secs ago

Thanks for the clarification. I'm not sure I agree that its a "culture" here. I'm sure it occurs, but "culture" implies to me more than what I've witnessed. — Beofett 47 secs ago

Please don't rely on links for content. Your answer shouldn't require visiting another site in order to be an answer. Including links for sources is good but you need to quote the relevant content in your answer. — Catija ♦ 52 secs ago

Poke, poke... is there any update? — Tinkeringbell 14 secs ago

@Catija The link is a definition, not the content. I only included it because someone might not know what the definition is. Edit or delete if you find it insufficient. — Richard U 42 secs ago

@Beofett I'd post the link to the definition of callout culture, but apparently posting links to definitions is frowned upon. — Richard U 7 secs ago

I don't know if I can. My concerns are two-fold: one is that I am part of this dichotomy, and I have been unable to find a way to present my perception in any other way than "I'm right, and the other side is wrong". I see no benefit in any discussion that stems from my inability to reconcile with an opposing viewpoint. The other concern I have is: are you and I even talking about the same problem? I truly don't know. — Beofett 33 secs ago

If I don't know what "save face" means, I have to go to the link... either include it here or explain the term. It's the main point of your answer and it's unclear. — Catija ♦ 57 secs ago

@Catija: wow this is a really strange answer. I thought the philosophy behind stack overflow was that it should mainly be self-moderated by the community? Now you allow users and censor to your will what you deem is misuse? Non of the stacks is self-serving - it lives and capitalizes of the users. That kind of attitude really explains participation problem you are currently having on this site. — Daniel 1 min ago

Ideally once a a post is edited to clarify something that was brought up in the comments those involved in clarifying the comments would delete their comments since they were no longer needed. — sphennings 52 secs ago

Many of the comments are removed by the community. I'm not sure what I said doesn't include that... comments get flagged by users. If they accumulate three flags, they're removed... or if a moderator sees the flags and agrees, they are removed. That's community moderation. — Catija ♦ 1 min ago

@RichardU Posting links isn't frowned on. Posting links without providing enough information from the linked resourced so that people can understand enough about the relevant information without having to leave the site is frowed on. — Beofett 22 secs ago

@Catija: Further you say they never should have been posted in the first place but you fail to address any of the concerns I have mentioned which come with such a policy. I´d be really happy to learn why the current approach to comments is beneficial - but to me it seem this approach only lead to those kind of low-quality, borderline off-topic answers that get constantly criticized. — Daniel 56 secs ago

I believe the problem is not the be nice policy. But rather our interpretations of it. > that's why it's more important to make rules based on the policy (like here for question scope for example). If you frequently see rude/abusive comments, that means the comments aren't moderated well, and that we need to revisit the comment policy and what we'd allow based on be-nice. Same for answers: if they're regularly being used as soapboxes for opinions, you could make a rule that everything needs a back up or is subject to removal — Tinkeringbell 34 secs ago

You seem to have missed the gender-fluid bit. This is why it's better to pass on questions that you don't have much personal experience with. — apaul 42 secs ago

I think this may indeed be a case of 'hey, this could be a solution to ... rude comments/bad answers/ questions asking for opinions instead of skills ... but then you'd need to make the case of how a be nice policy would be the way to fix it, what would be interpreted wrong about it that can allow such behaviors — Tinkeringbell 11 secs ago

The comments section isn't a forum. It exists for a specific purpose. To request clarification, to suggest improvements, and to provide minor transitory information. Any post that isn't in one of these three categories shouldn't have been a comment to begin with. — sphennings 37 secs ago

If you think an answer is low-quality, borderline off topic, you should be voting it down, and asking them why they think their answer is appropriate, not pointing out where the fault that you see lies... you may just as well be wrong in your opinions as they are in their answer... so what makes that comment of value? You've only cast 16 downvotes ever on this site if the number of poor answers is so endemic, why aren't you downvoting more? Downvotes are a form of community moderation and one of the most effective ways of saying "this answer is bad". Use them. — Catija ♦ just now

" Now you allow users and censor to your will what you deem is misuse?" No. The moderators enforce the policies set forth both by the community, and (where there is no overriding local community consensus) stack exchange. Removing comments that are a misuse of the comment system, as defined by both the platform and the community is hardly censoring to the moderator's "will". — Beofett 20 secs ago

@Beofett: As stated, I would have considered that relevant but minor or transient information a lot of readers also did, in that specific example. So yes, it kind of is. IF it had been deleted once an answer was found and accepted that would have been a different story. Currently I think this hurts the site and your failure to argue otherwise does not help to convince me that this is anything but arbitrariness. — Daniel 1 min ago

@Tinkeringbell Not that I'm aware of. It's been about 1-1/2 years since renewed Q&A development has been just around the corner, so I have to back away from this and let someone more in-the-know answer. — Robert Cartaino ♦ 42 secs ago

@Tinkeringbell - what would be interpreted wrong I do not know that we can address that. but I think we can address avoiding the interpretation in the first place. — WeAreAllInThisTogether 17 secs ago

"It happens oftentimes that my boyfriend tells me he finds a woman beautiful while we're crossing the street. I'm not at ease when he does this because I'm not confident about my own beauty" -- whether you're at ease or not with your beauty is not really relevant. It's about whether he might or might not act on it, and whether you're at ease with such a possibility. — Hejazzman 1 min ago

I'd love to see that, but about all things are interpreted in one way or another... If you do think there's parts that regularly are misinterpreted though, it might be good to use those as an example, put in the meta question also the way they are misinterpreted and the behavior that misinterpretation leads to... and then we can either discuss the suggested change in term of whether or not it will actually solve the problem, or if it's the right way to go about changing the problem ;-) — Tinkeringbell 35 secs ago

I looked for a duplicate but didn't see one. If I missed one please let me know. Also I am new here so if there are any tips to improve my question asking please also let me know. — IceC 12 secs ago