The Awkward Silence

Extroverted Main Man

03:42

0

Q: Mother keeps hassling me to apply to jobs that are not a good fit

I graduated from school a few years ago. I have had a lot of trouble finding a permanent job for what I went to school for. In general my mother gives me a really hard time about it, we've gotten in several fights over it. I've tried to ask her not to talk about the subject but she doesn't listen...

avazula

06:17

@ExtrovertedMainMan Mother, tell your children not to walk my way...

JAD

07:17

@Tinkeringbell barely. Most games they play don't really interest me tbh

good morning btw

avazula

@Tinkeringbell as always, yes! Do you? :p

I already bought the T-shirt and poster for Mr Ava. Soon all his wardrobe will be about GDQs haha

@JAD Morning :)

JAD

btw, I'm going to a Dream Theater concert next saturday :D

avazula

@JAD yay!

JAD

It's their Distance over Time tour, but according to the website, they're also playing the entire Metropolis part 2 album, along with other hits. Sounds like it's going to be a long show :O

avazula

:)

Tinkeringbell

07:30

@avazula Only in my spare time ;)

But yes, I do like listening to it (watching, sometimes, not so much)

btw @Ælis I've finally got an inquisitive badge too :)

Ælis

@Tinkeringbell \o/ Congrats! Now you onlu have to win it at IPS meta since I got it before you there too :p

Tinkeringbell

Aaaagh :P

Oh well, only two more ;) I should be able to get that some day ;)

I have a lifeboat badge there though :P

Ælis

Lifeboat are useful. I don't have one anywhere I believe

Tinkeringbell

07:56

I think the one on IPS Meta is also my only one :)

They're useful, but also very rare

CaldeiraG

08:32

Morning :)

Belle

08:54

Morning

A J

Afternoon!

Belle

Today is Tuesday and that's the best day of the week! You know why?

We can all agree Mondays are the worst day of the week, right? Well, on Tuesday it takes longest for it to be Monday again and that's why Tuesday is the best day of the week.

A J

Perhaps, true. I came in the half-day today.

Belle

Nice, that's an extra good Tuesday

A J

Earth to Moon is 384k KMs and Moon to Earth is 384k KMs, then why is it 6 days between Monday to Sunday but not between Sunday to Monday? Pfft!

CaldeiraG

09:05

Finland prime minister is proposing 4 workdays with 6 hours each, let's hope it goes well!

Belle

@CaldeiraG I'm moving to Finland if that goes through :O

CaldeiraG

@Belle yeah right! it's cold in there tho x)

Belle

@CaldeiraG True that. I fear for my plants. Can't Finland move south-west?

avazula

@Belle me too!!

CaldeiraG

09:28

@Belle I wish so :)

Just moving out from Portugal to elsewhere in Europe I would feel the difference

A J

@CaldeiraG Doesn't matter if it gets approves there or not, it's not gonna implemented here. The government here is thinking of increasing working hours from 8 to 9.

CaldeiraG

@AJ That's no good :( but because Finland is within the EU, it could go bigger if succeeded

reddit.com/r/portugal/comments/eksjju/…

This is interesting, it's actually somewhat true because probably 90% of residential houses in PT don't have some sort of heating

Tinkeringbell

12:07

Just dodged a bullet ;)

Don't have to take the same train home as the new scrum master :P

Belle

Is that a bad thing?

Tinkeringbell

Yeah, I want to spend that time crocheting, not figuring out someone's accent :P

Belle

12:24

Not such a social bird, eh? ;)

Don't worry, I understand. I'd probably feel the same. And figuring out people's accent is extra socially tiring.

Tinkeringbell

Oh, I can be very social... but my train ride is kinda my private time, so spending it with a scrum master isn't ideal as we're bound to end up talking about work, and it's probably also the combination of accent + high pitched voice that makes it extra annoying. The accent is Eastern European, Polish I believe.

CaldeiraG

12:46

If i get to any sort of public transportation I just want peace and having my own time because after I arrive I need to either work/do something else

avazula

@Tinkeringbell mutter "nazdrovie" and see if they react :p

Loong

@AJ Your units have 12 typographic mistakes; that could be some kind of a record. Maybe I take that as an example how not to write units in my meta post.

JAD

13:01

@Loong lemme guess. Days is not an SI unit?

Extroverted Main Man

0

Q: What to say to someone going to a funeral they are looking forward to?

When a family member or friend is going to a funeral for someone they deeply hated (and have practically been celebrating their death), what do you say to sign off a conversation on the topic? Have Fun? My Condolences? Congratulations? Some of those feel extremely crude, yet the traditional thin...

conversations family

Belle

Me: "Something about Keanu Reeves". My colleague: "Who is Keanu Reeves?" I'm disappointed in my colleague xD

avazula

:o

A J

13:23

@Loong O,o

CaldeiraG

13:38

@Belle You might be right, yesterday was a complete mess for me, not much done, today is going way better :P but my boss also returned to the office today so yea

Rainbacon

13:49

I was listening to a podcast today that mentioned the term "digital citizen", which got me thinking. I've always considered myself a citizen of the internet, and I often think of the sites I frequent as sort of my home on the web.

Do you all consider yourselves citizens of the internet?

avazula

@Rainbacon what does that mean?

Rainbacon

If you think about "where you are from" as referring to where you live most of your life, well I live most of my life online

It's where most of my socialization happens

It's where I spend my free time

etc

avazula

huh, okay

I don't think I would call myself that but it's more because living online (which is something I do quite a lot) is giving me anxiety and I don't want that to be part of my identity

I'd rather think I'm more of a European citizen but this gives me anxiety too these days xD

(had insomnia last night because we talked about the Iranian-American conflict with Mr Ava until late and it scared us)

It's a bit difficult to picture our future these days, I think

(why am I so negative haha)

Extroverted Main Man

0

Q: How to quickly end a date?

I have agreed on a date using dating app with a person which I have never seen in person. Usually I spend 1-2 hours to go for some coffee etc. But what if I realized in first 2 minutes that I don't want to continue this date and I want to end it as fast as possible? So what is the best and poli...

relationships online-relationships

scohe001

15:17

@Rainbacon hmm I do consider some of the places on the web homes away from home--places I can fall into and relax. But I'm not sure I'd go so far as to call myself a "citizen" of those places. More like I have a vacation home there for when the weather gets bad :p

Belle

15:31

My fiancé just received his December payslip. He worked 327 hours. He works for a webshop, so December is a busy period. We didn't realize just how busy until we got the payslip.

13th month gets a completely new meaning that way

scohe001

There were 21 weekdays in December (not counting xmas). Assuming he didn't work any weekends, he was doing 15.5hr days. Holy moly

When did he sleep??

Belle

I don't recall seeing him much. He woke up before me and got to bed as soon as he got home, which was around the same time as me. He did work weekends though, so it was 24 days at 13.6 hours per day.

scohe001

Yeesh that's still crazy. Poor guy :/

Belle

He and his colleagues are so happy Christmas is over

CaldeiraG

Can I ask a quick question if I was polite in a message? I may had come out as rude since the guy hasn't replied in 2 days :(

Belle

15:41

At least he's paid hourly, so the paycheck is double too

@CaldeiraG Which message?

CaldeiraG

@Belle I'll quote here: "Good afternoon, I saw your ad about a Ryzen 5 2600 and I would like to know if it's still available, if you can send it by mail and how much can you lower the price you're asking. I just saw the same CPU selling (new) for the same price on Amazon as the one you advertised. Best regards."

Belle

@CaldeiraG Seems fair

CaldeiraG

Well, they didn't answer me yet but I think it's a reasonable thing to say

Belle

Is it on ebay or something like that?

CaldeiraG

15:57

It's second hand market, not eBay

OLX to be exact

Em C

if it's anything like Craigslist, they could just not want to mail or lower the price, or they've already sold it and never bothered to update the listing..

CaldeiraG

@EmC The latter might seem the reason, the ad has more than 1 week

Belle

Ah yes. What @EmC says. Also, be careful with sites like that. Pick up in person if you can. I got scammed before.

CaldeiraG

@Belle It's not that easy, PT is a small market and they're literally no one selling Ryzen close to me, the closest one I found is about 100km away

Em C

@CaldeiraG I wouldn't worry too much, your message sounded polite enough to me :)

CaldeiraG

16:00

@EmC Thanks :)

Em C

are you planning to build a computer?

CaldeiraG

Planning to get a CPU+MB+RAM only

Em C

well, that's most of one :p

CaldeiraG

The rest of the computer is good enough, the problem is most people sell entire builds

Which also have absurd prices

Em C

I see, that's annoying

CaldeiraG

16:04

People don't seem to look at the price parts are currently selling now on the second hand market but the price they paid minus a few

Belle

If you don't mind a bit of unsolicited advice: pay with a reversible method if you can. I never saw my €250 for the GPU I tried to buy back :(

CaldeiraG

@Belle Wouldn't PayPal be an option?

Belle

@CaldeiraG PayPal is decent for that.

Em C

if you do paypal though, you have to send it using the "paying for goods and services" way (whatever it's called, the one with a fee) - the "family & friends" option doesn't have any protections

CaldeiraG

@EmC I'm aware of that

Em C

16:08

ok good :)

CaldeiraG

Oh wait a sec "There’s no fee to use PayPal to purchase goods or services."

To receive there is a fee tho, should be good then :)

Em C

oh right.. I've seen a lot of ads where the seller asks the buyer to add on the extra fee if they want to send money that way :/

CaldeiraG

I've not seen any of those, people don't usually use it here it appears

Bank transfer are preferred but lots of scams been happening this way

Ælis

18:20

So, I had part one of my annual review today (there is two parts/meetings). I believe it went well and my manager told me that it was customary to ask for a raise in the second part/meeting. The think is, I have no idea about how much I should ask for. Any help? @ava @Tink @Rain @Scohe @EmC

Rainbacon

Oh gosh, I don't know. I've never asked for a raise because my company has a very strict pay scale. Every person has a level designation (for example mine is A2) and every person with that level makes exactly the same

user15026

@Ælis I am glad to hear it went well! I am not sure how much to ask for - are you thinking like a percentage?

user15026

I have never had a job where I felt asking for a raise was practical or useful or possible.

Rainbacon

I would think there could also be cultural differences

Ælis

@Ash A percentage would be nice indeed, but I'll take anything ^^'

Rainbacon

18:24

It very well might be typical in the US to ask for X% more, but that might not be seen well in France or vice versa

Ælis

@Rainbacon Right now, I envy you ><

user15026

Yeah, I am not super sure how it works, honestly.

Rainbacon

Perhaps this article would be good to check out

Ælis

@Ash Apparently, at my company, you are supposed to ask for a raise every year ><

Rainbacon

Same with this one

@Ælis It is one of the things I really like about my current job

Ælis

18:27

@Rainbacon Do you know if the next one will have the same system?

Also, thanks for the articles :)

I'm currently feeling very inline with the beginning of this question (but I will definitively ask for more than 1%!!!)

Rainbacon

@Ælis Sadly it doesn't. They asked in my interview process how much I was looking to make. I hope that I didn't undersell myself, though I did manage to get about 8% more than my current position, so that's good

Also you're welcome!

Ælis

@Rainbacon Oh, 8% more is nice. How long was it since your salary last increase (due to raise or to changing job)?

Em C

@Ælis I've never asked for a raise either >.> but at my last job the standard annual raises were done by percentage - about ~2% for "average" (because it's roughly cost of living increase), up to 5% (which pretty much never was given out, usually the highest anyone got was 4%). that's about what it seems to be at my current job too (based on 2 data points :p)

so I'm surprised the articles @Rainbacon linked say to aim for 10-20% :o

Ælis

@EmC Well, according to this answer I'm supposed to ask for at least 5%, especially since I'm in the beginning of my career

Rainbacon

@Ælis everyone got a small raise for cost of living adjustments back in July, my last promotion raise was about a year ago

Em C

18:35

@Ælis welp

Ælis

@Rainbacon Do you remember how much of a raise it was?

@EmC Maybe you are underpaid and should switch job then :p

Em C

@Ælis I probably (definitely) was at my last job :P this year I will make basically 2x as much as there..

Ælis

@EmC Oo Indeed!

Em C

so maybe don't listen to me xD

hahah I like how one of the answers on that Workplace question quotes the Ferengi Rules of Acquisition

Ælis

@EmC Don't spoil me, I haven't even finished reading the first answer :p

@EmC I can't promise you anything here :p

Rainbacon

18:49

@Ælis The promotion raise was about about 8-10% I believe. The cost of living raise they gave everybody was like 1%

Ælis

@Rainbacon Seems like 10% might be a good amount for me to ask then. Fortunately, I still have a full week to thing about that

Rainbacon

I'm not sure how comfortable you are with your coworkers, but could you ask them how large of raises they typically ask for?

Ælis

It's planned, I hope I won't chicken out, though :p But the ones I'm most comfortable with have been here for the same amount of time as me, so it was the first time for them too

Plus, they are around my age, so they can't talk that much from "experience"

Side note: I just found the cutest video ever *-* Warning though, it's about a mouse: facebook.com/thedodosite/videos/2573379632940170

Tinkeringbell

19:04

@Ælis Oof... I'm sorry to say that I don't know that either :| If you're doing percentages, look into inflation rates and go be a bit above that?

Rainbacon

@Tinkeringbell How does NL do it?

Ælis

@Tinkeringbell No worry :) And also, it seems that, when you are at the beginning of your career, you should ask for much more than just inflation rates. Like 5-10% or even up to 25% (which is maximum)

Tinkeringbell

@Rainbacon No clue :P My company does something like below, on, or above expectations (where you set the expectations at the beginning of the year), and the people that meet expectations get something like 2-3 percent extra for that year, and the ones that are exceptional can get up to 8-9.

@Ælis That sounds very American. Don't know how close your company is to that, but I'd personally stick to the lower end there. Ask a French male too though :P Males are apparently more aggressive when it comes to salary negotiations, which is one of the reasons females sometimes earn less, I've heard.

Ælis

@Tinkeringbell I have heard the same thing about male vs female negotiation. I'll try to find a male coworker to ask about that. And also, I definitively won't ask for 25% (which was indeed suggested by an American article ^^). I'm thinking a 5 or 10% raise would be nice, but it still means that I should ask for more first

Tinkeringbell

Yeah, asking some coworkers about this may work best. Do any of them know about your autism?

Ælis

19:17

Unfortunately not :/

Tinkeringbell

Hmm. Any you're at least a bit close with, at least at work? People that help you out a lot and seem friendly about it?

Ælis

There are some, yes. Not sure how willing they would be to talk about money though. That usually not something French people talk about and if they do, it's always in private

Rainbacon

Ooh, speaking of autism, @Ælis and any others on the spectrum who pop in later: Do you ever find yourself not being assertive about things unrelated to your autism (such as a pay raise) because you are afraid of being seen as a burden so you want to save up the things you are assertive about for the things that you truly need?

Ælis

@Rainbacon Yes

Tinkeringbell

@Ælis Yeah, that's why I'd suggest picking one you're close with ;) Perhaps you don't really need to talk money as in what the total sum you deserve should be/what they earn... but you can talk about percentages/amounts added that should be reasonable to ask for :)

People over here at least are a bit more open about the latter ;)

Rainbacon

19:21

@Ælis Me too

Ælis

@Tinkeringbell Yeah, talking about percentage should be a good way to go. I have zero idea about how much anyone else earns in the company (which kind of makes me frustrated and sad, but people are really weird when it comes to talking about how much they gain)

Tinkeringbell

Yeah, but that's the same everywhere, I think ;)

Ælis

@Rainbacon As a matter of fact, I was planning to ask for a raise if I didn't get my part-time (which I asked for earlier "this" year) but since I had it, I was thinking that I shouldn't ask for a raise or I would look bad

Rainbacon

Are you paid hourly or on salary? And did your pay change when you went to part time?

Ælis

@Tinkeringbell I don't know, I think it might be easier in some part of the world than on others. I think the USA is one of those countries where it's easier than in France

Mithical

19:26

@Rainbacon isn't that every introvert ever

Like, uh, me

Rainbacon

@Mithical Maybe? I attribute it to my autism, but it certainly seems plausible that others might engage in the same behaviors for reasons unrelated to autism

Ælis

@Rainbacon I'm still earning the same amount per hour, but since I'm making fewer hours, I'm paid less. I think I was at 2200€/months (after the taxes) and I'm now at 1700€/months (after the taxes)

Rainbacon

Ok, in that case I see nothing wrong with asking for a raise per hour

Ælis

@Rainbacon Does it change anything compare to the other option?

Rainbacon

Well, if you had been making the same per month while working less hours then I'd say you technically got a raise, but since you are making the same amount per unit of time worked, there's nothing wrong with saying you should have a raise because you are now more experienced and thus doing better work than when you started

Ælis

19:34

@Rainbacon True. I will now try to convince myself of that :p Plus, thanks to me being there, my company is now paying fewer taxes! Also, I'm technically doing (give or take) the same amount of work, since my brain was too tired before and I was unable to work all day even if I indeed was at the office all day

scohe001

@Ælis I'm a little late but...at all the companies I've worked for (3 so far), they do 2-3% raises every year just to keep your salary up to date with inflation. Depending on how you feel about your performance, I'd probably ask for something like 5-7%. Since you're so young/early in your career even a few percent now can let you retire a year or two earlier.

Just remember, the worst possible thing they can say is "No," and then to that you can follow up with "What do I need to change to be able to get that raise?" and turn it into a productive conversation anyways ;)

Ælis

@scohe001 Thanks for your answer :) 5-10% seem to be the numbers that come up the most. I'm probably gonna ask for a 10% increase then

scohe001

Do it! You got this!!

Ælis

Thanks :D

@scohe001 Well, actually the worst is they say "no" and I go in a panic attack/break down in crying/freeze and I'm unable to function anymore. But yeah, I get the idea. The worst they can do to me is say "no" (and the worst I can do to myself is awful, so let's not think about that)

Rainbacon

Ooh, I just passed my background check for my new job :)

Ælis

19:46

@Rainbacon I have no idea if something like that is done in France too. In any way, congrats! :)

Rainbacon

Thanks!

It's not hard, I've never done anything illegal, so when they checked to see if I'm a criminal they found out I'm not which is basically all it is

El'endia Starman

@Rainbacon You've most definitely done illegal things. You've just never been caught. ;)

Rainbacon

@El'endiaStarman I mean, sure I've committed some minor infractions such as speeding, but I've not committed any felonies

Ælis

@Rainbacon Would they be notified if you had robbed some food in a grocery store sometime in the past?

Rainbacon

If you had been arrested and punished for it then probably yes

Ælis

19:50

:/

M.A.R.

@Rainbacon Except DOWNLOADING MUSIC

DUN DUN DUUUUUUUUUN

Rainbacon

@El'endiaStarman Fun horror story from work, today I had to design a workaround to mimic the resuls of django's union because we're on a django version that doesn't have that operation

El'endia Starman

Oh noooooo...

Rainbacon

Yep, we're still on django 1.8

M.A.R.

I think that's bad

El'endia Starman

19:56

"April 1 2015" :/

Rainbacon

There's been an effort to upgrade django, but it's lower in priority than the effort to get off of python 2

Ælis

Oh dear :O

El'endia Starman

Why do you hurt me in this way. ;_;

user15026

@Rainbacon hooray!

Rainbacon

@El'endiaStarman It would probably hurt you more if I told you that the software I'm working on has on the order of 10s of millions of users

El'endia Starman

20:00

gahhhhh

Em C

@Rainbacon ... oh dear

Rainbacon

One of the engineers at this client told me that they lost a lot of time because they grew so fast in terms of user base that for a couple years all of their engineers spent close to 100% of their time just doing maintenance to keep the code running so they weren't able to put out a lot of new features or do important projects like upgrading django

M.A.R.

That sounds kinda familiar, huh

Em C

dang. sounds like a lot of maintenance

Rainbacon

Well, when you wake up and suddenly have a few million users it can take some work to keep the code you wrote for a few thousand users from crashing

Tinkeringbell

20:14

Waaaait... you're getting to work for SO? :P

Rainbacon

You caught me

Tinkeringbell

Hah!

I'm good at that :D

Rainbacon

I did actually apply for a job at SO once

Tinkeringbell

Oooh, awesome :)

Rainbacon

I didn't get an interview, but that's ok. I'm not sure if I could handle having my work so much in the public eye like that.

Tinkeringbell

20:37

Well, sounds like the current application you'd be working on might not be much different :)

maybe the crowd is less vocal about what they think of it though ;)

Rainbacon

Well, the users of my current project are not primarily composed of developers, so they have fewer vocal opinions (also there's not a public meta site where they can discuss it freely and see who I am)

Tinkeringbell

Sounds waaaay more relaxed ;)

Rainbacon

It is when things work as expected. But when something breaks in prod all hell breaks loose

Tinkeringbell

Yeah, I can imagine that... I can still relatively safely break prod (though people won't be happy!)

El'endia Starman

> still relatively safely break prod

uh WHAT :P

Tinkeringbell

20:48

As in, the world doesn't end? :P

Rainbacon

@Tinkeringbell What sort of thing does your software do?

Tinkeringbell

@Rainbacon Very basically, automatically register new/repaired gas pipelines and electricity cables :)

El'endia Starman

...that sounds way more interesting than I expected.

Rainbacon

That sounds interesting

Tinkeringbell

It is pretty interesting!

El'endia Starman

20:59

Have you ever played Factorio? :P

Tinkeringbell

Any time a builder goes digging, they have to request and get a map of where the important stuff is, so they won't hit it while digging, and those maps are based on the stuff we automatically add/remove...

And everytime someone changes something, we get a change we have to automatically process. That's the interesting bit: make it so that as much as possible can go automatically :)

@El'endiaStarman Nope, but my brothers do, so I know a bit about how it looks. I may try it someday... for now I haven't even touched the Stardew Valley update yet :P

Rainbacon

It's way more interesting than most of the projects I've worked on in my career, and certainly not less interesting than the cooler projects I've done

Tinkeringbell

(And here I thought it wasn't actually all that cool, at least it definitely isn't as cool as working on e.g. Galileo :P)

Rainbacon

What's Galileo?

Tinkeringbell

Galileo (satellite navigation)

Galileo is the global navigation satellite system (GNSS) that went live in 2016, created by the European Union (EU) through the European GNSS Agency (GSA), headquartered in Prague in the Czech Republic, with two ground operations centres, Oberpfaffenhofen near Munich in Germany and Fucino in Italy. The €10 billion project is named after the Italian astronomer Galileo Galilei. One of the aims of Galileo is to provide an independent high-precision positioning system so European nations do not have to rely on the U.S. GPS, or the Russian GLONASS systems, which could be disabled or degraded by their...

Rainbacon

21:06

Ah, yeah, that'd be way cooler than anything I've ever worked on

I think the coolest project I've had was a web dashboard to monitor oil rigs in real time to prevent oil spills

Tinkeringbell

That's cool too! And good for the environment! :D

El'endia Starman

@Tinkeringbell I'm a liiiitle jealous now. :P

Tinkeringbell

@El'endiaStarman Go apply? The company kinda has offices anywhere, you can go from there :P

Rainbacon

@El'endiaStarman Or you could move to NYC, my new company is hiring :)

El'endia Starman

Oooh, tempting lol. But I'm very happy at my current job for now. :)

Rainbacon

21:08

My new job is going to be in real estate

Tinkeringbell

Give them my name when you do though, I get a big money bonus if I find new developers for the company :P

@Rainbacon Oh, that sounds fun too!

El'endia Starman

@Tinkeringbell "Yeah, a talking red parrot named Tinkeringbell recommended I apply here."

Tinkeringbell

Oh, they'll know who you're talking about :P

Rainbacon

Yeah, the company buys and sells houses. Some how machine learning is involved and I have no idea how I'm going to be involved in that process

Tinkeringbell

I guess the machines will learn you!

El'endia Starman

21:10

@Rainbacon I'm betting it's risk/value estimation.

Rainbacon

@El'endiaStarman It might be, but I think they might also use it to suggest houses to people looking to buy based on other house they've looked at

Either way, it should be fun

Even though I'm still super nervous

scohe001

22:24

2

One of the devs on my team just sent this. It's brilliant lol

scohe001

23:34

@chumpbot tp but let the answer OP read it first?

chumpbot

Marked this comment as flaggable (tp). Currently marked 1tps/0fps. beep boop My human overlords won't let me flag that, so you'll have to do it yourself.

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