TeX, LaTeX and Friends

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Jasper

04:28

I have searched diligently, but cannot find the documentation which describes the command \l@section. Could someone help guide me in the right direction?

3 hours later…

daleif

07:33

@Jasper according to source2e.pdf the definition is up to the classes. It is only stated that is is given two args

Jasper

07:49

@daleif I should mention: tex.stackexchange.com/q/737105/319072

cfr

08:07

@Jasper latexdef will give you the standard definition or, with options, the definition relevant to the class and/or packages you use.

I really wish there was some hope TL2025 would include a fixed version of texdef but I know that is a completely vain hope.

Joseph Wright

08:24

@cfr What's up with it\?

daleif

@Jasper as that question is stated I do not understand your end goal. The main thing to know is that it is a macro that is given some arguments. And that these arguments can be "strange" look in the toc file. And go from there. I probably would not attempt to do this using high level packages.

Skillmon

@JosephWright some Perl version issues, texdef prints a lot of warnings with a recent Perl.

Joseph Wright

@Skillmon Ah, must be Linux-specific then

Skillmon

08:40

@JosephWright well TL on Windows ships its own Perl, so obviously isn't affected.

Joseph Wright

@Skillmon Also fine on the mac

Skillmon

@JosephWright probably also fine on all the Debian based distros. But if you're on a distro leaning more towards bleeding edge (I use Arch btw.) you'll get the warnings. Started last year in summer, iirc.

Jasper

@daleif Thank you for your insights, I apologize for being a bit out of my depth here. I will check out the TOC file, as well as the resources mentioned in the comments. Thank you for your time.

Skillmon

% texdef empty
Duplicate specification "Find|F!" for option "find"
Duplicate specification "no-list-def|no-L" for option "no-l"
Duplicate specification "no-list-def-all|no-LL" for option "no-ll"
Duplicate specification "environment|e=s" for option "environment"
Duplicate specification "pgf-Keys|K" for option "pgf-keys"

\empty:
macro:->

@JosephWright ^^^ that's how it looks for me

Ooh, easybook had a palindrome in its TL revision on my last update:

[ 5/26, 03:19/14:20] update: easybook [712k] (73737 -> 73934) ... done

Joseph Wright

08:57

@Skillmon Well it will only get fixed if someone talks to Martin ....

Skillmon

@JosephWright that's correct :) Maybe I'll remember this evening when I'm done with dayjob and find a minute on my own PC

Joseph Wright

@Skillmon :)

@Skillmon Martin is not really active, so I think a fix will need someone to do the work

@Skillmon You remind me I asked Martin about something else - I've just pinged him to see if there's any news

cfr

10:02

@JosephWright I posted a patch for it on github a while ago. it needs to be applied, but the change required is tiny. right now, they are warnings. but they will become errors and then it will break properly again. and Arch is just the canary. it will break on macs in the end.

Joseph Wright

10:20

@cfr I guess I take a semantic version view: Perl is 3.x.x, so unless they go to 4.x.x, nothing that is there should become an error

Skillmon

10:31

@JosephWright just because you take a semantic version view doesn't mean the maintainers do :P

Joseph Wright

@Skillmon I think it's also influenced by working on a product that has a mode to work with sources from the late-1980s onward

(Also, I use ORTEP and SHELX, and they are from the 1960s and 1970s, respectively, and still work)

Skillmon

@JosephWright I share your preference of semantic versioning, one just have to keep in mind that not every project follows it.

Joseph Wright

11:02

@Skillmon Oh, sure - but stability doesn't need semantic versioning - you can do all sorts, like use Greek letters :)

4 hours later…

David Carlisle

15:21

@JosephWright perl 3, really???? not 5?. perl 3 is from 1989.

Joseph Wright

15:44

@DavidCarlisle Oh, sorry, misread teh version string - 5.34.1 on my mac, so I parsed as 3.4.1 :)

David Carlisle

@JosephWright but perl versioning is tricky as perl 6 is so incompatible they decided not to call it perl at all, then there is a perl 7 numbered so as not to confuse with raku that used to be called perl 6 but perl 7 is scheduled to come out sometime after latex3

Skillmon

@DavidCarlisle so thanks to L3in2e it'll be out any moment now?

David Carlisle

@Skillmon probably in a matching 7emulatedin5 mode:-)

cfr

@JosephWright well, texdef was broken on Arch for quite some time before and I've never had anything but 5.<something> that I know of. it spewed warnings for months first.

@JosephWright 'semantic versioning' is misnamed. any sane versioning scheme is semantic.

Joseph Wright

16:22

@cfr In the end, all we can do is ask Martin if he either has time to look at it, or to hand it on to someone who does

cfr

16:46

@JosephWright I know. I wasn't asking you to fix it.

@JosephWright & Thanks.

3 hours later…