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1:00 AM
@samcarter Depending on your preferences for the weather, you may or may not implement this for a `cast shadow` option (requires `shadows.blur` but I could redraw without that library if that's better)
\fill[gray,opacity=0,blur shadow] (1.5,0.2) arc(60:405:8mm and 2mm)
to[out=50,in=-130] ++ (0.4,0.2) to[out=50,in=50,looseness=0.5] ++ (-0.2,0)
to[out=-130,in=0,looseness=0.5] cycle;
I forgot to mention that people may need it at groundhog day.
5 hours later…
5:33 AM
@UlrikeFischer Grazie! Is it Mondello? Maybe @Sebastiano is there.
6:12 AM
A: What does constructive criticism of a design change look like?

Shog9I really like this guidance, Jon; giving constructive feedback on design changes is something I've struggled quite a bit with over the years, both as a user and as an employee of the company making the changes. It's easy to say "I don't like it", much more work to articulate why... And I've often...

As suspected, the three column business comes down to needing to make money
1 hour later…
7:40 AM
@CarLaTeX you are good ;-). And you can't read it at this resolution but one of the ducks is reading a book playing in Sicily.
@UlrikeFischer :)
1 hour later…
8:52 AM
@UlrikeFischer @CarLaTeX @egreg @marmot @Bernard @Mico ecc. Buon ferragosto with all my heart. I'm in Eastern Sicily :-) and I prefer to stay at home. There are a lot of people at sea and the weather is not the best. There are clouds, sun and even wind. Unfortunately on our beaches and in the clear sea there are many who do not respect cleanliness. I prefer to wait a few days to go to sea. A greeting and a hug to everyone.
@DavidZ Good morning also to you.
@egreg Halo'. :-)
@Sebastiano Thanks! It's late at night where I am, though.
(same to you)
@DavidZ So I wish you a peaceful night and a good night's sleep when you go to sleep.
1 hour later…
10:08 AM
@JosephWright with an important little detail: the useless empty left pane is to-become an advertisement to money-making thingies.
1 hour later…
11:37 AM
@marmot Oh, your marmot can fly :)
(for now it is just a simple ellipse, need to figure out something to bring your marmot back to the ground :)
@marmot Can you ask your cousin Phil what the probability is that he sees his shadow?
Found a statistic: "According to the Groundhog Club's records, the various incarnations of Punxsutawney Phil have predicted 103 forecasts of more winter and 17 early springs. "
1 hour later…
1:15 PM
@samcarter Jump, not fly
\documentclass[tikz,border={1cm 3.14mm 1cm 3.14mm}]{standalone}
\foreach \X in {0,10,...,350}
\path[use as bounding box] (-0.5,-1) rectangle (3,3);
\fill[gray,opacity=0,blur shadow] (1.5,0.2) arc(60:405:8mm and 2mm)
@samcarter Sooo nice!!! (I am wondering if one could make the shadow angle depend on the local time.... just kidding ;-)
@marmot :) Unfortunately the azimuth angle of the users screen is not known
@marmot From the jumping speed I assume it is a Lunar marmot - Is this the explanation for the many craters? Are they entrances to marmot burrows?
@egreg ... stress $\sigma\textsubscript{a} [MPa]$
@boycott.se-yo' I keep seeing this. :-(
@samcarter Hmmh, if you adjust -delay in your convert (s)he will become a terrestic marmot ;-)
@samcarter Good point. The LaTeX gurus have to work on that. My iPad also knows if I am holding it upside-down ;-)
@marmot I already reduced the -delay to 0.
1:29 PM
@marmot -- looks like you've accomplished levitation. (even the jumping image looks more like you're levitating. or maybe being hauled up by an unseen string. no evidence of a gravitational effect. apologies for nitpicking.)
@samcarter Here is -delay 2. Perhaps -delay 0 doesn't work?
@marmot Oh, thanks!
user image
@samcarter I realized I screwed up. Needs to be \begin{scope}[xshift={cos(30)*\Jump*1cm},yshift={sin(30)*\Jump*1cm}], i.e. one has to multiply by 1cm since otherwise TikZ uses points
@barbarabeeton You were watching the slow motion version. ;-)
@marmot -- yes. this one's much more compelling. good job!
@marmot This is so great! I could watch him for ages!
1:47 PM
user image
@samcarter ooh a balloon
@samcarter How do you know the marmot is a he? ;-)
@marmot You mean it should be it, because of "das Murmeltier"?
@TeXnician No, marmots are either she or he.
@marmot \usepackage{heshe}
2:05 PM
@PauloCereda Here is also one for you:
user image
@samcarter yay
@marmot It was faster to type and I was under time pressure to edit the message in the allowed time :)
@samcarter this looks as if the ballon is coming out of the navel.
@marmot shouldn't it be a square function to calculate the height, not a sine?
@Skillmon What do you mean? A square function does not oscillate. But if you ask whether I solved the equations of motion, the answer is no.
2:32 PM
@marmot While airborne, it should be a parabola, which I suppose is what @Skillmon meant by square function. While feet are on the ground, who knows what is an appropriate function? Perhaps another parabola, if the jumper is pushing against the ground with a constant force. Or perhaps like a piece of a sine function, if legs act more like springs. I imagine cangaroo legs are rather like that.
@marmot basically what @HaraldHanche-Olsen wrote :) square function is the wrong term, I guess, stupid English maths.
@HaraldHanche-Olsen I agree with the parabola part. However, if you also add the acceleration in form of another parabola, then the result agrees with a sine to second order in a Taylor expansion.
@marmot Sure, just be careful what point you expand the Taylor series around. After all, at t=0, the quadratic term in the Taylor series of sin(t) is zero. If you expand around t=π/2, the quadratic approximation will be better, and probably hard to distinguish from the sine in the first half period (0 to π). A different issue, though, is how energetic the jumper is. The acceleration profile while on the ground could be greatly different from when airborne.
2:49 PM
@HaraldHanche-Olsen Absolutely. It also becomes a biological question: how do marmots jump? ;-)
3:07 PM
@UlrikeFischer That only gives me an obscure error message (An error occurred.)
@marmot Well, given relatively short legs, if they are to jump to a reaonable height, the acceleration on the ground must surely peak at more than 1g.
3:23 PM
Google translate tells me that he's looking for other type of latex... tex.stackexchange.com/questions/446161/latex-anzug-unter-18
@HaraldHanche-Olsen Well, that's independent of the length of the legs. On the surface of the earth you will always have to overcome the gravitational pull.
3:40 PM
@marmot My point is this: If you are to jump higher than your legs are long, then you must accelerate upwards at more than 1g, simply because you have less distance available in which to reach the required velocity. And since you already need to overcome gravity, as you say, the conclusion is that at that point, your legs must provide a force greater than what is needed to support twice your weight.
@HaraldHanche-Olsen I agree with almost everything except for "twice". 1+\varepsilon is enough. Then you have a net acceleration of \varepsilon
@marmot If your leg length is s, and you provide an acceleration a, starting from a standstill, then at the time t satisfying s=½at^2, you legs will have left the ground, and you cannot accelerate further. You are now accelerating down at a rate g. (Let us put g=1, as you seem to have done, to simplify the argument. This can always be done by appropriate scaling. [to be continued]
[…] At this point you have an upwards velocity v=at. The two equations give s=½v^2/a. This will propel you to a height h given by h=½v^2/g=½v^2 (g=1, remember?). So h=as, and you need a>1 to get h>s.
3:58 PM
@HaraldHanche-Olsen The pull to earth is F=-m g. To overcompensate it, we need F_\mathrm{jump} = m a with a > g.
user image
^^^ A post-honey-liquor-marmot
@samcarter Oh my. (S)he has drunk a lot, it seems. ;-)
@egreg Please, do you know the reason why Springer math articles look so ugly?
@samcarter One could add some ding-dong sound ;-).
4:13 PM
@UlrikeFischer Indeed :)
@marmot I totally agree. What I seem to be unable to communicate, is that my calculation is about trying to jump higher than your legs are long. Or to be more precise, to raise your center of gravity higher than the point where your feet leave the ground because your legs don't reach anymore, plus the length of said legs. Sorry if I did not make that clear.
4:30 PM
@HaraldHanche-Olsen I see. But even then it is more tricky. Let's assume that the legs excert a constant force over some time \Delta t. Then the velocity at the end of the "marmot is using her or his legs" period is v_0=(a-g) \cdot \Delta t. Then (s)he will feel the gravitational pull only and the velocity is v=v_0-g t. Obviously, the marmot will start falling down when v=0, i.e. t_1=v_0/g. This is when the initial kinetic energy equals what is usually called potential energy, [cont'd]
[cont's] i.e. m g h= \frac{1}{2}m v_0^2. Can you tell me now how h is related to the length of the legs? (Sorry if I am doing something stupid.)
@boycott.se-yo' No. But books used to be well printed.
4:48 PM
@egreg well, it's a strange mixture of fonts with ridiculous design decisions...
@marmot I'll be a bit busy now; will read what you wrote and follow up later.
@samcarter It looks as if there was a large interest in \usebeamertheme{Marmots} ;-)
Hi folks. Looking for a thicker line than that provided by:
Oh, never mind, that's not an actual command. Please ignore.
\soutthick, I mean.
5:04 PM
@FaheemMitha \tikz{\draw[line width=4mm](0,0)--(3,0);}.
@marmot Thanks. I've been using:
    \renewcommand{\ULthickness}{.4pt}% Resetting to ulem default
What does the tikz line height default to?
Of course that depends on the context. My suggestion works if you load tikz, but you probably load it anyway because of tikzmarmots ;-)
@FaheemMitha TikZ just draws a line. To align it with the text, you need to do more. Really depends on the context. (But you are really using ulem, not soul?)
@marmot I think I'm using ulem, yes. Why?
@FaheemMitha I don't know, I thought soul is much better, but this just my opinion.
@marmot Oh. I've got no opinion. But then I'm not the one with 50k.
5:16 PM
@marmot it depends, there are edge cases where you can't use soul but ulem and vice-versa.
@FaheemMitha one could say that roughly 49k of that is based on TikZ :)
I'm just trying to draw a black line on top of some text to hide it. Nothing fancy.
@Skillmon Three cheers for TikZ?
And marmots, of course.
@FaheemMitha my reputation is hard and well earned, with not much TikZ in it. I have the feeling that TikZ answers give over proportional much reputation.
@FaheemMitha I think in this case, soul could be better with its \hl macro.
@FaheemMitha \colorbox{black}{you can't see me} and load xcolor
@Skillmon It's a cruel and unfair world. Sadly.
@marmot not line breakable
5:20 PM
@marmot Huh?
@FaheemMitha don't use it, it won't work properly.
@Skillmon I'll just stay with what I've got. This thing is taking too long already.
@FaheemMitha but your \soutthick could be defined in a better way.
@Skillmon No doubt. I'm open to suggestions. I just copied it from some answer.
@Skillmon Yes, not line breakable. And your statement on TikZ is probably true. There are a few other topics which are similarly overrated, though, I think.
5:22 PM
@marmot namely? I think TikZ is the one which is the fastest way to earn reputation (sadly rabbits are not good enough in it to post answers as fast as marmots)
@Skillmon Matrices. And Tables.
@marmot you don't earn reputation as fast with tables (trust me, I did a lot of tables).
@marmot if I sound bitter this is completely unintended (just to make clear)
@FaheemMitha do you want to completely cover the content, or should it stick out at the top and bottom just a bit? (So, are the results you currently get satisfying?)
@Skillmon I wouldn't say that tikz is fast, you can spent quite some time on a picture and the pictures from @marmot are quite elaborated. My best time/ratio answer lately was this: tex.stackexchange.com/a/445981/2388. 2 Minutes to insert a % and earn over 100 points.
@Skillmon Completely cover. But it's not nuclear launch codes. My current results appear to be adequate.
I guess I'm open to better recipes in theory. But it seems too trivial to be worth writing a question about.
@FaheemMitha then you might want to give the following a try


5:28 PM
@Skillmon No, I think you have a point. Yet I should also say that generally the best answers are not the ones with the most votes. And it is also clear that the reputation is not meant to indicate the skill of a user. At best they can help to compare the qualities of answers to the same question.
@FaheemMitha no need to reset the width, as the change is made locally.
@marmot fully agree.
@Skillmon Ok, I'll try that. But if you are tailoring to LaTeX text, I should mention that the text I'm trying to cover is on PDF document which certainly wasn't created by TeX.
@marmot but there is a correlation between skill and reputation.
@FaheemMitha so you include a graphic and want some portion of it to be blacked?
@Skillmon No, the PDF is entirely text. I'm just trying to cover some of the text.
@FaheemMitha but you have to input it in TeX in some way if you want to use ulem or soul. How do you do that?
5:31 PM
Some people are forcing me to send them a bank statement. I'm trying to give them the middle finger by covering much of it with black lines. Like the security people do.
@FaheemMitha than use Inkscape or Gimp. TeX seems like the wrong tool for that.
@Skillmon Ah, I'm including the PDF in a TeX file, then writing on top with TikZ, everyone's favorite secret weapon. Even marmots.
@Skillmon I like TeX. Perhaps I'm a freak.
@FaheemMitha then you don't need ulem or soul at all, just use \draw (start) rectangle (end);
@Skillmon Really? Now I am higher up in the charts than Christian Feuersänger, who has only a bronze badge for pgfplotstable. And I am higher up than Marcel Krüger. If you read his answers, you will see that, unlike me, he really understands latex. My only qualification is that I know that if you put things in quotes, you can find two word expressions in the pgfmanual. ;-)
@Skillmon So I think that all these things strongly suggest that reputation is not very meaningful.
@Skillmon I suppose so.
5:33 PM
@Skillmon ... if you load tikz, of course... and this is not breakable, too
@Skillmon Sorry I didn't explain what I was doing initially.
@marmot yesn't. There is a correlation, as I said. But it might not be a strong one. When was the last time Christian was online and how big is his online/offline ratio? Yours and mine are probably much higher. That of course has a bigger impact than skill to the reputation. Correlation doesn't mean main factor.
@marmot but if he is blackening an existing PDF he doesn't need anything linebreakable.
Christian Feuersänger sounds familiar. Is he one of the TeX developers?
@Skillmon Agree, of course.
@FaheemMitha He wrote pgfplots and pgfplotstable, two extremely amazing packages, and other amazing things.
@Skillmon Unlike Inkscape and Gimp (at least in graphical mode), TeX gives very precise results with comparatively little overhead.
5:36 PM
@Skillmon Yes, but why is then the \colorbox not equally good?
@marmot Ah, a PGF/TikZ expert.
@Skillmon Thank you.
I believe GIMP is scriptable, but I have no idea how it works. I suspect programming black lines in GIMP would be considerably harder than with TeX.
@marmot positioning of the black areas (based on the assumption that only certain parts of the included pdfs should be blackened)
BTW, what were the differences between 3.0 and 3.0.1? Bug fixes?
5:39 PM
@FaheemMitha of which package?
@Skillmon But this is what colorbox does. Everything inside is blackened. And you send the pdf to someone who has pdf2txt, and all the hidden stuff reappears. ;-)
@Skillmon Oops, sorry. PGF/TikZ.
@marmot I think this argument will not lead to anything as we both do not fully know (at least I'm certainly not) what @FaheemMitha is trying to achieve.
@marmot Actually, that's a good point. When I did a scan, I had Tesseract running, and that PDF has a bunch of the text I was trying to hide embedded in it.
@Skillmon So, I did a scan of a page of my bank passbook, under protest.
@FaheemMitha honestly, I have no idea. Perhaps looking at its repo might help
5:42 PM
There is one relevant line in that page. But the people asking for it weren't satisfied with that.
They said to send a photo. So I'm taking a scan, and I drawing lines over parts of it.
It's all a bit pointless, really.
@FaheemMitha blacken it, export it as a png or something like that, convert that to pdf.
@FaheemMitha but that sounds like a single page. That would be faster done with Gimp.
@Skillmon Ok. I thought that people who use TikZ a lot might have an idea.
@Skillmon I'm only writing over a few of the lines.
@FaheemMitha even faster with gimp
@FaheemMitha not everything is to be done in TeX. You should always choose the right tool and after that is done, redo it in TeX for procrastinating reasons.
@Skillmon Hmm. What should I use for that in GIMP?
I mean, what tool?
@FaheemMitha drawing with anything. Using the pencil tool, click on the first spot of the line you want to blacken. Press Shift and click on the second spot. A straight line should be drawn between the two points. If the line is to be perfectly horizontal, press Shift and Ctrl together while doing the second click.
@FaheemMitha and of course you should set the used thickness to an appropriate value, before you do that.
5:49 PM
@Skillmon I see. I wonder how hard it is to program such things with GIMP.
@FaheemMitha I have no idea, but why would you? Do you have to blacken 200+ pages or just a single one?
@Skillmon I'm just interested in scripting things, in general.
In this case, it isn't a particularly automatable task, but I can think of things in GIMP that would useful to automate.
Pointing and clicking is just so passe.
@FaheemMitha There is a Python API if I recall correctly.
@PauloCereda Is that different from Script FU, or whatever it's called?
Has anyone here ever done scripting in GIMP?
@FaheemMitha Script Fu requires Scheme scripts.
5:53 PM
@PauloCereda Oh.
@FaheemMitha: I found this resource about Python scripts, looks interesting: gimpbook.com/scripting
@PauloCereda Thank you.
Wow, that's a lot of text.
If I used GIMP more, I'd buy a book.
@JosephWright Shog9 commented about Teams, in reply to you.
@PauloCereda I saw, more-or-less what I thought he'd say
@JosephWright Me too.
6:02 PM
@PauloCereda Misses the point that for most sites this is a total waste of space
@JosephWright: they are choosing very carefully which words to use and to who they are replying. :)
@JosephWright agreed.
@JosephWright: no PTB commented on percusse's post.
@PauloCereda Of course not: @percusse tends to make forceful-but-valid points
@JosephWright see first comment on his post. It's pretty much accurate.
Glad I'm not the only one who thinks the new design is crap. Over on U&L we aren't too thrilled either.
@FaheemMitha I'm not sure anyone on a site which had a custom design is exactly thrilled ...
6:12 PM
@JosephWright I gather only a select few sites have been honored with this attention thus far.
Apparently U&L and TeX are among those.
@FaheemMitha Yup
@FaheemMitha Found the meta thread: same fundamental complaint about use-of-space as we've raised
@JosephWright Which meta thread?
Q: Unix & Linux new site theme is live

Joe FriendWe rolled out the new site theme for Unix & Linux. It is now live. What new theme? If you're like, "What the heck are you talking about?", then you should read the Meta Stack Exchange post entitled Rollout of new network site themes (and maybe the posts it links to for the full background). ...

@JosephWright Ah, that meta thread. Yes, we're all quite peeved. But we've not come up with strategies to improve it with custom JS and so forth. Cultural differences, I guess.
@FaheemMitha Much the same for TeX: there's a whole meta thread of CSS, etc., 'fixes'
6:18 PM
@JosephWright Oh, there is? On U&L Meta? I must have missed it.
@FaheemMitha I meant on TeX: I'll find it
Q: Make TeX.SX look nice again!

samcarterA collection of user scripts to make the main site look a bit better again, after the new design has gone live on August 3, 2018. The scripts can be used e.g. with Tampermonkey (Chrome) Greasemonkey (Firefox) A fix for recent versions of Firefox and GreaseMonkey (4.x) by @PaulGaborit. A use...

@JosephWright I think it's been starred, over on the left.
10 stars.
@FaheemMitha That's the one
My point was that we didn't try to come up with fixes on U&L.
Hence my comment about cultural differences.
@JosephWright funnily enough, the top voted answer gives exactly the same problem as @DavidCarlisle points out all the time :-)
6:23 PM
Omg who made this masterpiece? https://t.co/wnXToTLSYr
@FaheemMitha Ah, right
@JosephWright @DavidCarlisle ^^
Maybe someone is interested in this: overleaf.workable.com/j/B5FA00D984
@CarLaTeX I love this bit
> What's the best LaTeX package ever, and why?
EVERYBODY knows it's longtable (@DavidCarlisle)
@PauloCereda nono, it's xii of course :)
@CarLaTeX I really consider applying!
6:33 PM
@FaheemMitha -- there's a more secure method, which requires real manual intervention. take a piece of paper (in your case, black would be appropriate) and a pair of scissors. cut out slivers (or larger chunks) of paper that are the appropriate size and shape to cover the material to be hidden. then apply them with (peelable!) sticky tape to the document, then scan. absolutely no possibility of anything you want obscured to be in any pdf file.
@boycott.se-yo' ooh :)
@PauloCereda A question to identify an actual TeXnician :):):):)
@boycott.se-yo' me too LOL
@barbarabeeton Yes, that would be really secure. Thank you.
@boycott.se-yo' What problem is that?
And does this boycott include chat, or not?
@FaheemMitha too narrow text on some window widths
@FaheemMitha only support on the site
@boycott.se-yo' Ok.
@boycott.se-yo' I see.
6:45 PM
@boycott.se-yo' -- do it. you've got the knowhow. and you might be able to express some of the anguish that you really can't while you're editing a journal.
@barbarabeeton nicely said. However, I've got my 3 jobs, you know :D
@boycott.se-yo' -- hmm. well, i'm retiring from ams next feburary. i suppose they need someone before then ... and i really don't know tikz at all well.
@barbarabeeton well, I'm not available before the end of the year either, actually. On the other hand, if they hired me... I'll write you an email :)
@CarLaTeX I'm really thinking whether I should apply...
@boycott.se-yo' hah, you disqualified yourself :) xii is not a LaTeX package :)
6:56 PM
@CarLaTeX I know, and am frightened having to compete with @boycott.se-yo'
@Skillmon :)
@Skillmon goodness, I shouldn't have said that :D
@CarLaTeX and you consider it, too, it seems. Maybe I should not do it. I have to study, so I finish my studies in time. And I really don't want to compete with you guys. It's just a thrilling idea to actually earn some money during all this procrastination :)
@Skillmon I already have a full-time job, I can't apply :)
@Skillmon well, don't forget that applying for a job and not taking it is not a deadly sin!
7:04 PM
@boycott.se-yo' thanks for reminding me.
@Skillmon just explain your situation and make clear how much time you can devote to it; then it's up to them
\input /usr/local/texlive/2016/texmf-dist/doc/plain/xii/xii.tex
@Skillmon ^^
@boycott.se-yo' ooh
@barbarabeeton mail sent
@PauloCereda Are you on Gtalk?
7:20 PM
@boycott.se-yo' I know about cheating plain into LaTeX, but well done nonetheless. Still this doesn't turn xii into a LaTeX package, imho.
@Skillmon of course not, but I couldn't openly say that I was wrong, that's not popular at SE now :)
@marmot You didn't do anything stupid, but you left out one important equation: In addition to (1) v_0=(a-g)·Δt and (2) gh=½v_0^2 (I cancelled out the g), you need the distance traveled while the marmot's legs were pushing: (3) s=½(a-g)·Δt^2. Eliminating Δt from (1) and (3) yields (4) v_0^2=2s(a-g), which inserted into (2) yields gh=s(a-g), which I rearrange into h=s(a/g−1).
@marmot And my point is that s is necessarily less than the length of the marmot's legs, assuming of course that the jump is powered by the legs only.
@marmot I don't know who downvotes that user, but sometimes he doesn't deserve that treatment, I think the downvotes come for his past "bad" behavior
@boycott.se-yo' why are you boycotting?
@FaheemMitha I don't know your use case, but beware that this will not stop a reader from copying the hidden text out of the pdf file. I have seen pdf files with “redacted” information that was trivially unmasked in this way.
7:35 PM
@HaraldHanche-Olsen I agree with all these equations, of course. So we agree that the total elevation of our friendly marmot is s+h, i.e. the distance traveled during the push plus the one afterwards. So h is the additional height gained. So I guess that, as you say, we were just not agreeing on which quantity we are interested in. ...
@marmot Indeed, if we were in the same room in front of a blackboard, the misunderstanding would have been cleared up in seconds. Chat is a difficult venue for such discussions.
... I was thinking only about h, and your last equations says that, if a=g+epsilon, there will be a nonzero h. And yes, if you consider the total height h+s instead, then h=s is achieved for a=2g, as you say.
@HaraldHanche-Olsen Yes, but not too difficult, you cleared it up. ;-)
@CarLaTeX Yes. I guess most of us have also a very clear idea who that user is. It is a bit sad, I would say. (Personally I only downvote if there is some case of "academic dishonesty" going on, which I'm allergic to. I don't think one should downvote if there is another, more elegant answer ... )
@HaraldHanche-Olsen I removed the OCR layer.
But thank you for the warning.
Fortunately, this was easy to do, since it was my own scan.
Other, apparently not that easy. In fact I could not find a general method.
@marmot Yes, I agree.
@FaheemMitha Ah, but all the scanned information will still be there, even if you paint stuff over it. It can still be recovered, but not quite so easily. It could be that the entire scanned page is just one image, which you can then recover with a program like pdfimages. If it's more complicated, as some modern copying machines do it, the easiest way to defeat it is probably to inspect the file, identify the new paint, and remove it.
Such pdf surgery is not so easy, but eminently doable if someone has the knowledge and motivatiion.
7:47 PM
@boycott.se-yo' oops will connect now!
@HaraldHanche-Olsen I see what you mean.
Yes, I think it's all one image. At least pdfpages thinks so.
@FaheemMitha pdfpages doesn't know the contents of the file in such detail. To it, each page is an image, no matter how complicated it is.
@HaraldHanche-Olsen Oh.
@HaraldHanche-Olsen Sorry, I meant pdfimages.
@Skillmon are you now harvesting reputation with TikZ questions: tex.stackexchange.com/a/446188/121799 ? ;-)
@HaraldHanche-Olsen you're right. I was able to remove the image from the PDF.
8:07 PM
@StrongBad because the powers are ignoring users' opinions, they are not fair towards the users (to the point that Shog9 has to try to correct the situtation, after weeks of fights). Also, I think that SE is slowly sinking and they are only supporting this by their decisions.
@boycott.se-yo' I found the posts about the site redesign. It is definitely not very appealing. I know we are the product to SE and that their goal is to monetize us, but sometimes I think they do things just to piss people off.
@StrongBad yep, that's what I feel too
@StrongBad They want to monetize the concept: users on most of the network sites are just advertising
@JosephWright and they weren't fair in communicating this, which pissed me off really.
@JosephWright but if you piss off users, you lose users and hence cannot make money (I think). You leave it the same and just stop supporting it, the users will stay until it breaks and then you have an excuse to fix things.
8:14 PM
@StrongBad but that's happening, just not on "established sites". However, even here you wait months for simple bug fixes...
@boycott.se-yo' Yes, exactly right: I've tried to make that clear in my meta post
@JosephWright yes!
@StrongBad The point I've tried to make to the Powers is more that if you break the site design you loose the ability to monetize: I totally understand the desire to standardise as they have resource issues, but the issue is that the new default layout is unusable
@JosephWright I struggle to see how they can ever monetize tex.se, which of course might be why they don't care. At least for sites like photo.se, ubuntu.se, and even academia.se, I can envision advertisers or even careers working. If only one could make money being a tex programmer.
As @UlrikeFischer has pointed out, the mobile version is unaffected: I suspect that as much as anything means that the network will survive this!
@StrongBad They don't want to monetize this site, they want/need to monetize the StackOverflow model. The 'Teams' business is all about getting companies to set up their own private mini-sites which are paid for. We and the other network sites are just 'testing/advertising' for that
8:21 PM
@marmot :) not really, it isn't really about TikZ, is it?
@boycott.se-yo' do you know how physicsoverflow.org works? I think they might be a good model if you really wanted to try and split and get TUG to host.
@StrongBad I think Ubuntu is a special case: that is paid for by Canonical I believe
@StrongBad Of, there are lots of possibles in that sense (@StefanKottwitz is the expert)
@StrongBad What about TeX Welt?
@JosephWright yeah so they have a new product which they are not sure is going to work and they are screwing with what does work. That doesn't make sense to me unless you are on the verge of failing.
Does anyone actually know anything about the financials of the company running Stack Exchange? Whatever they are calling themselves now.
8:23 PM
@Skillmon Well, yes, but this actually applies to a large fraction of questions that are tagged tikz-pgf. (I am also wondering if arara could help there, but I have no idea about all these things... ;-)
@StrongBad Possibly true: they have used a lot of cash. I'm probably going to have some discussions with a few 'key' people in the TeX world over the coming days ...
@FaheemMitha The Powers That Be
I like TeX SE. It would be a pity if it went away. And all that content.
@marmot I doubt that's what they officially call themselves.
@FaheemMitha content is all CC licensed so can be ported. Votes might be lost ...
@StrongBad Well, it would be very hard to put it back in a usable form.
8:25 PM
@StrongBad that's been discussed briefly in the room
@marmot neither do I have any clue about arara. I'm used to write Makefiles from my C programming, As far as I understand, you'd have to set up your own rules for the image file types, and I don't know whether it supports multiple processes in parallel.
@StrongBad Votes should be easy enough to be web-crawled.
@FaheemMitha not really, why should it? The authorship (at least user profile links) is part of the post (actually, an obligatory one)
@boycott.se-yo' It would involve creating something very similar to the current SE structure.
Which given that the code is not available/free, would be a significant exercise in reverse engineering.
@FaheemMitha of course, there are open-source QA systems that are ready to install
8:29 PM
@boycott.se-yo' Yes, I know. But are they set up so you can just plug in SE data?
Good evening or good morning to everybody
@StrongBad Thank you.
@FaheemMitha there is also techcrunch.com/2017/11/02/stack-overflow-lays-off-staff where they laid off a ton of CMs and behind the scene people.
Oh dear. They got venture capital in 2015? That's rarely good.
@marmot Can you see my picture, please?
8:31 PM
Oh, and before that too.
@marmot These are just my negative votes in almost two years.
@Sebastiano I also have 5, together we are at two digits ;-)
@FaheemMitha if not, probably they are very close to that. The biggest issue might be if SE's markdown is not the standard markdown (which I suppose is the case). Actually, given how many scrapers there are, it's probably not that much an issue :D
If you want in on the Trogdor board game kickstarter you only have 25 minutes: kickstarter.com/projects/1999933720/trogdor-the-board-game
@boycott.se-yo' You probably know more about this than I do. But any transition will be very painful.
And I wonder if one could easily come up with the same chat functionality.
8:37 PM
@FaheemMitha sure
@FaheemMitha a similar one quite likely. But there are of course issues; especially the instant updates.
8:50 PM
We lost the serif question titles
@egreg no, I didn't :)
@marmot You could make a theme with the marmot jumping along the footline to indicate the progress :)
@samcarter Oh, as opposed to "lahme Ente"? ;-)
@samcarter I was more thinking that the marmot could represent the mood of the audience. Curious at the very beginning, i.e. jumping, then bored during the main part, i.e. snoring, and finally relieved (don't know yet how to implement that) when its over. ;-)
@marmot Don't say this in the presence of @PauloCereda :)
@samcarter Yes, he writes oh with two h, and thinks my oh is a typo ;-)
9:03 PM
@marmot If instead of relieved a celebrating marmot would also do !it could raise the arms
@marmot Of course everybody knows that the correct spelling is ooh :)
Writing a CV is English is not what I do everyday...
@egreg We also have a new background image
@egreg honestly, it looks better now. It was a non-sense
@boycott.se-yo' I agree
9:19 PM
@Milo that new one is better with the new layout (just launched Chromium to check it out).
I really miss the upvote/downvote buttons. The pen nib icons. They almost give me a feeling of nostalgia when I used to go on this site, ask for questions, find answers. I loved clicking that button whenever someone helped me
I'm really sad that it is gone. It's been replaced by those bland triangles... I feel like in a way, the new design gets rid of much of the identity of TeX.SE
@SkeletonBow You can get them back using some custom css - see tex.meta.stackexchange.com/questions/7787/…
Wow, that's a nice thread! Thanks a lot for the link, Milo :)
2 hours later…
11:15 PM
@samcarter I was more thinking of a good glass of honey liquor. BTW, what does "it" refer to? ;-)
@marmot I did not write "it" but "!it"
@samcarter I see. It should be she or he, though. ;-)
@marmot In first order approximation !it should be very close to he+she
user image
@samcarter Very nice! Where is the accompanying duck? ;-)
@marmot The duck is already sleeping - as I'm about to do as well :) Have a nice day!

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