TeX, LaTeX and Friends

CarLaTeX

10:13

egreg joined the Duck Side of the Force: tex.stackexchange.com/a/415419/101651!!!

yo'

@egreg Czech Catholics (and not just Catholics; I signed the online petition as well) just sent an open letter to brother Francis regarding the Czech arch-bishop, asking Francis not to prolong his status. Funny things going on in the church :-)

Paulo Cereda

@yo': poking time, if you have a few minutes. :)

egreg

@yo' Quite likely there's some more than just congratulating Mr. Zeman for reelection. ;-)

@CarLaTeX The Duck side of the Schwartz.

Paulo Cereda

10:29

@egreg Quack! :)

yo'

@egreg yeah, you can consider congratulations to the winner as a matter of good manners. But you can't consider congratulations to Tomio Okamura, who's a nationalist radical, a good manner. And that's just one thing of many.

Anyway, the letter is available in English and Italian, if you wanted to see the background: odduka2018.cz/?page_id=63

CarLaTeX

@egreg Schwartz in the meaning of black? I didn't get it...

yo'

@egreg are you sure that \hline is proper in the "good" table? It seems a tad bit too tight to me

egreg

@yo' Ah! Forgot to change it!

yo'

@egreg you see, I have a sharp vision for tables! :D

egreg

10:39

@yo' Fixed, thanks

yo'

@egreg no problem!

egreg

Spaceballs

Spaceballs is a 1987 American comic science fiction film co-written, produced and directed by Mel Brooks. Starring Brooks, Bill Pullman, John Candy, and Rick Moranis, the film also features Daphne Zuniga, Dick Van Patten, and the voice of Joan Rivers. In addition to Brooks in a supporting role, the film also features Brooks regulars Dom DeLuise and Rudy De Luca in cameo appearances. The film's setting and characters parody the original Star Wars trilogy, as well as other sci-fi franchises including Star Trek, Alien, and the Planet of the Apes films. It was released by Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer on June...

yo'

Is there a short word for "polynom over K can be factored into polynoms of degree 1"? I'm especially interested in a shorthand for "polynom of degree 1"?

egreg

@yo' “K is a splitting field for the polynomial”

yo'

@egreg ah ok, that's too high-level terminology :D

egreg

10:44

@yo' It's “polynomial”, in any case.

You can use “completely factored”

yo'

@egreg yeah, right. That's s relict of the Czech--English schizophrenia

egreg

Or “has all its roots in K”

yo'

@egreg that's a good one! I would probably use P factors completely in K. (We will actually need that $P$ factors completely in $\mathcal{O}_K$, but that's no difference.)

I tell you, diagonalizability of matrices in O_K is something quite strange it seems.

egreg

@yo' I'm sure it is!

yo'

@egreg so far the only thing that seems to be sure is that a diagonalizable matrix over OK has its charpoly's roots in OK, which seems to be checkable by computer. (SageMath can factor polynomials over K, and that's enough for us of course.)

CarLaTeX

10:58

@egreg I watched that movie (and liked very much), but I didn't remember The Schwartz, LOL

Steven B. Segletes

General question: While my home system recognizes decodearray option of \includegraphics, my work system does not. Do I need to update graphicx? If so, how, since it is not a distributed package, per se, but comes with the distribution.

System at work identifies as This is pdfTeX, Version 3.14159265-2.6-1.40.18 (MiKTeX 2.9.6350)

egreg

@StevenB.Segletes I see decodearray only defined within TeX Live 2017

Steven B. Segletes

Hmmm. I use MikTeX both at home and at work. Maybe my home system is sooo old that it still had it?

egreg

@StevenB.Segletes Looking at the sources, the key has been introduced in version 2017/06/01 v1.1a

Steven B. Segletes

@egreg By the way, @DavidCarlisle assured me the other month that decodearray was part of the graphicx code.

egreg

11:09

@StevenB.Segletes It isn't defined in older versions

Steven B. Segletes

@egreg Something crazy happened about a year or so ago, when what used to work no longer worked. I complained to David about it, and he originally defended its removal (?) saying it was undocumented. Months later, he said it was now part of the documented package.

@egreg If you search questions on the site, you will see that its use far pre-dates 2017/06/01

daleif

11:25

@StevenB.Segletes did you update miktex twice? admin and user? User may have an older version covering the newer

Steven B. Segletes

@daleif I don't think I have ever updated it at work, and when I try just now, it produces an error and won't let me (as a user) do it. Perhaps I can get the sys admin to try to update it for me.

daleif

What does that option do? It's not in the manual (I looked in grfguide)

Hmm, remember the -l option to texdoc. Something to do with bitmap images.

Steven B. Segletes

@daleif It allows the definitions of "r", "g", and "b" colors to be redefined, which will thus render the included image in a redefined false color.

daleif

@StevenB.Segletes ok, why would one want to do that on the tex side, and not in a proper image editing program?

Paulo Cereda

Dear Dr. Cereda,

Your peer reviews protect and enhance quality research in your field, COMPUTER SCIENCE, INFORMATION SYSTEMS.

You deserve recognition for that. Join 290,000+ scholars and 1,700+ partnered journals using Publons to track and showcase your review contributions.

Seems legit.

@DavidCarlisle ^^ :D

I like how the field is not totally automated.

Steven B. Segletes

11:31

@daleif If you search it, you will find a few questions/answers on it. Here is one example as to why one might want it on the TeX side: tex.stackexchange.com/questions/194378/…

@daleif Another is false transparancy: tex.stackexchange.com/questions/332722/…

David Carlisle

@StevenB.Segletes it was added to the graphics package last year. (previously it was half added, undocumented via a patch that was in pdftex.def) so it wasn't really removed, not that that distinction makes so much difference if you were using the option then it stopped working for half a year then (should) start working again. Note it should now work for any drivers that support it not just pdftex

Steven B. Segletes

@DavidCarlisle Well my graphics package is 2017-06-15, but the feature does not seem operational.

daleif

@StevenB.Segletes did you check the versions and locations using \filelist? again to be completely sure as to which file your miktex is using.

Steven B. Segletes

@daleif Package: graphics 2017/06/13 v1.2b Standard LaTeX Graphics (DPC,SPQR)

Package: graphicx 2017/06/01 v1.1a Enhanced LaTeX Graphics (DPC,SPQR)

daleif

11:47

graphicx, 2017/06/01 v1.1a, graphics.cfg, 2016/06/04 v1.11, pdftex.def, 2018/01/08 v1.0l

Will Robertson

11:59

@HaraldHanche-Olsen A unicode-math problem? Sorry, will be fixed in the next update

daleif

@HaraldHanche-Olsen Sigh, yeah proceedings seems to bring in the worst code ....

Steven B. Segletes

12:17

@daleif graphics.cfg 2016/06/04 v1.11, same as yours, but pdftex.def 2017/06/15 v1.0dis older. How would one update that?

David Carlisle

@StevenB.Segletes update graphics-def via miktex/texlive

Ulrike Fischer

@StevenB.Segletes I have pdftex.def 2018/01/08 v1.0l in my miktex. Check for updates as admin and user, and also synchronize both package managers and check for uninstalled packages.

Steven B. Segletes

12:52

@UlrikeFischer Would it be in the MikTeX package manager, that I would update pdftex.def? If so, would the "package" name be pdftex or miktex-pdftex or miktex-pdftex-bin-2.9?

Ulrike Fischer

@StevenB.Segletes pdftex.def is in graphics-def.

Steven B. Segletes

@UlrikeFischer I already did that one (2018-01-12), but I still get, upon compilation, ! Package keyval Error: decodearray undefined.

Ulrike Fischer

@StevenB.Segletes I didn't follow the discussion. Do you have a minimal example?

Steven B. Segletes

\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{graphicx}
\begin{document}
\includegraphics[decodearray={.5 .7}]{example-image-A}
\end{document}

David Carlisle

@StevenB.Segletes works for me (once I fix the filename to example-image-a)

Steven B. Segletes

13:01

@DavidCarlisle So what needs updating?

David Carlisle

@StevenB.Segletes my log:

This is pdfTeX, Version 3.14159265-2.6-1.40.18 (TeX Live 2017) (preloaded format=pdflatex 2018.1.26)  15 FEB 2018 13:01
entering extended mode
 restricted \write18 enabled.
 %&-line parsing enabled.
**aa138
(./aa138.tex
LaTeX2e <2017-04-15>
Babel <3.17> and hyphenation patterns for 84 language(s) loaded.
(/usr/local/texlive/2017/texmf-dist/tex/latex/base/article.cls
Document Class: article 2014/09/29 v1.4h Standard LaTeX document class
(/usr/local/texlive/2017/texmf-dist/tex/latex/base/size10.clo

Steven B. Segletes

@DavidCarlisle and mine:

Ulrike Fischer

@StevenB.Segletes Your babel is older, and pdftexcmds too (and then it stopped ...)

Steven B. Segletes

This is pdfTeX, Version 3.14159265-2.6-1.40.18 (MiKTeX 2.9.6350) (preloaded format=pdflatex 2017.6.19) 15 FEB 2018 08:02
entering extended mode
**C:/steven.segletes/TeX/Working/junk.tex
(C:/steven.segletes/TeX/Working/junk.tex
LaTeX2e <2017-04-15>
Babel <3.10> and hyphenation patterns for 72 language(s) loaded.
(C:\MikTeX\tex\latex\base\article.cls
Document Class: article 2014/09/29 v1.4h Standard LaTeX document class
(C:\MikTeX\tex\latex\base\size10.clo
File: size10.clo 2014/09/29 v1.4h Standard LaTeX file (size option)

Ulrike Fischer

@StevenB.Segletes graphics is older too (I have 1.2c).

Steven B. Segletes

13:10

@UlrikeFischer Progress...now it compiles, but the decodearray setting seems to have no effect.

Paulo Cereda

@StevenB.Segletes yay progress

Steven B. Segletes

@UlrikeFischer Clarification: No effect on B/W images, but it works on color images. MWE:

\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{graphicx}
\begin{document}
\includegraphics[width=1in]{example-image-A}
\includegraphics[width=1in,decodearray={1 0 }]{example-image-A}

\includegraphics[width=1in]{example-grid-100x100bp.jpg}
\includegraphics[width=1in,decodearray={1 0 1 0 1 0}]{example-grid-100x100bp.jpg}
\end{document}

Compare to result at tex.stackexchange.com/questions/300334/…

Ulrike Fischer

Work ok if I force the use of a bitmap: `\includegraphics[width=1in,decodearray={1 0 }]{example-image-A.png}
`. Should it work for pdf?

Steven B. Segletes

@UlrikeFischer Yes! It works if I explicitly cite the png! Why the change, do you think?

Is example-image-A.pdf the default, whereas in the past maybe not?

Ulrike Fischer

@StevenB.Segletes The order of the graphics extensions have changed. texlive 2016 loads a png, texlive 2017 prefers a pdf.

Steven B. Segletes

13:19

@UlrikeFischer That would explain it, thank you for the help! I will need to edit my answer at the cited question. Thanks again.

David Carlisle

@StevenB.Segletes note you need to use -a not -A on case sensitive filesystems as the filename is all lowercase

Paulo Cereda

@UlrikeFischer: I poked you in the IM.

Ulrike Fischer

@PauloCereda replied.

Paulo Cereda

13:36

@UlrikeFischer Danke!

CTAN is paying a nice tribute to Staszek Wawrykiewicz.

yo'

14:09

@PauloCereda indeed! (I'd not known him, but many people seem to be touched by this!)

naphaneal

14:35

who was he?

yo'

@naphaneal See these two links (that's actually all I know about him, but others here had known him in person):

preining.info/blog/2018/02/in-memoriam-staszek-wawrykiewicz

gust.org.pl/news/r-i-p-staszek-wawrykiewicz-1

David Carlisle

14:53

Welcome to TeX.SX! Missing end-of-line protection is a common error. — egreg 27 mins ago

@egreg you forgot to add "fortunately for my reputation count"

egreg

@DavidCarlisle By the way, @Werner is fastly reaching 400K: be prepared.

Steven B. Segletes

@DavidCarlisle Thanks for the correction. I would have found that out...once I got it past the prior keyval error.

barbara beeton

@Werner -- you had an answer for this question that you linked from a comment, now deleted. was it any more scrutable than what i posted? the op is asking for something more "latexy".

Ulrike Fischer

@DavidCarlisle Do you know of any difference between luatex 1.04 und 1.07 regarding spaces when writing to a file? I have been looking at this question tex.stackexchange.com/questions/415384/… and could reproduce it with miktex and texlive + luatex 1.07. And when checking the .sta-file with an hex editor one can see an additional space

The first is from a compilation with luatex 1.04 and the second from 1.07.

David Carlisle

15:14

@UlrikeFischer there was some discussion about \endlinechar at one point (interpretation of values outside the range 0-255) that's all I can think of

David Carlisle

16:08

@UlrikeFischer do you have any tabs at end of line?

Ulrike Fischer

@DavidCarlisle Good guess. That seems to be the problem (I now have an example without standalone).

Werner

@barbarabeeton I wouldn't say your approach is less LaTeXy. I was struggling to get around the idea of the labels being right-aligned. It is probably possible to figure something out from within an \item when you align = left.

Ulrike Fischer

@DavidCarlisle and here a more or less minimal example (there is a tab behind the abc).

\documentclass{article}
\makeatletter

\def\sa@gobbleeol#1^^J{%
  \@ifnextchar^^J%
    {\sa@gobbleeol{#1}}{#1}%
}
\newwrite\testwrite
\immediate\openout\testwrite=testout.txt
\long\def\writetooutput #1\XXXX{%
\immediate\write\testwrite{#1}}
\endlinechar=\m@ne
\sa@gobbleeol\writetooutput^^J
abc

\XXXX

\begin{document}


\end{document}

Werner

@egreg Perhaps "somewhat steadily", but definitely not fastly. :)

David Carlisle

@UlrikeFischer well that would be it then tabs are no longer stripped from end of line (affecting all tex engines)

egreg

16:24

@Werner Better put a little scare on @DavidCarlisle

Ulrike Fischer

@DavidCarlisle What do you mean by "affecting all tex engines"? Does pdflatex change behaviour here too?

David Carlisle

@UlrikeFischer yes (I put a note in the other chat)

Werner

@egreg Right... yes... I'm... chasing him down! Be prepared...!

By the way, the closing in the typewriter package documentation is hilarious.

4

egreg

@Werner As I have already said, my lawyers are at work. ;-)

Ulrike Fischer

@DavidCarlisle Hm. The output is not consistent over the systems. In miktex (luatex 1.07 and pdflatex I get 20 0D A0), in texlive with luatex 1.07 I get only 20 A0.

David Carlisle

16:33

@UlrikeFischer will try some tests later, can't now

yo'

17:16

@Werner the name of the package should have been properly letterspaced in the title :-) @David

David Carlisle

@yo' blame my typesetting consultant

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle ooh

@Werner Even the GuIT guys enjoy it!

Font Open Type variabili, il nuovo pacchetto typewriter... $ texdoc typewriter "typeset by egreg design services"

Tweeted by guitexorg on February 14, 2018 at 10:43 AM

yo'

@PauloCereda finally this so far unrecognized John @egreg Doe becomes famous!

Paulo Cereda

@yo' :D

egreg

17:50

@yo' I'll sue also the GuIT!

Paulo Cereda

@egreg oh no

yo'

@egreg suing someone for that they acknowledge your credit, wow :D

David Carlisle

21:42

@marmot asking to understand tikz is like asking to understand @PauloCereda's thesis

marmot

@DavidCarlisle Well, the difference is that only one of the two exists. ;-)

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle I direct you to pgfcorepathconstruct.code.tex, lines 275 onward ;)

David Carlisle

@JosephWright I'll read it later when it's in expl3:-)

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle Sounds like a plan: it will have some comments on the algorithm at that stage :)

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle oi

@marmot oi

@marmot somewhere in the multiverse, my thesis is already written. :)

marmot

21:56

@PauloCereda In the same patch of the multiverse, TikZ can read the thoughts of ducks and marmots....

Paulo Cereda

@marmot ooh \usetikzlibrary{mindreading}

2

yo'

@marmot speaking of patches, did you know that patch-glueing is a basic way of space travel?

Paulo Cereda

@marmot: if you tell me you will come to TUG 2018, I will try to make my marmot tool ready for a keynote just to honour your presence. :D

@yo' ooh glue power

yo'

@PauloCereda speaking of which, do not remind me that I have a package to finish yet!

David Carlisle

@JosephWright googling for magic constants like 0.55228475 turns up more doc on what's happening:-)

Paulo Cereda

21:59

I heard that if you stay inside a certain room for one hour, you can travel to the future in one hour and you will be in the same place one hour after.

@yo' as long as you do not remind me I have a thesis to write. :)

marmot

@yo' Of course I know that. I'm using this all time. (unlike the poor cats, who have to jump from the roofs of some houses to the dark side of the moon ;-)

yo'

@PauloCereda :)

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle Almost certainly :)

marmot

@PauloCereda At this time I will be on yet another continent....

yo'

@marmot well, remember that as a red square, I can serve as such a patch myself :-)

Joseph Wright

22:00

@DavidCarlisle Tracing the code at present to make sure I get the first part: you can't draw a curve of greater than 90 degrees in one go. That will be a lot clearer with an fp loop than with the pgf code :)

Paulo Cereda

@marmot ooh traveling marmots

marmot

@yo' Why did you ask about the around-the-world ticket then?

yo'

@marmot it's a curiosity

Paulo Cereda

All around me are familiar faces

yo'

good news EU citizens don't need visa for Brazil (I did not know that). I wonder why US/Canada ones do, though.

Alan Munn

22:08

@yo' Because diplomatic relations is like fights between 8yr olds.

yo'

@AlanMunn well, that makes its own sense.

Stefan Kottwitz

@yo' Sometimes it's symmetric. EU lets Brazilians in, and Brazilians EU. But the US doesn't let Brazilians easily in, so guess what Brazil does.

Alan Munn

@StefanKottwitz Exactly what I said. :)

Ulrike Fischer

@DavidCarlisle @JosephWright as a coincidence I cam across the number when I looked up a few days ago how pgf draws an ellipse as I wanted to know how much more code is needed to make a duck in l3draw ;-)

4

yo'

@StefanKottwitz yeah, well, it's mostly symmetric of course. But I wonder what exactly makes the US deny Brazilians free entrance.

Alan Munn

22:12

@yo' Almost all visa restrictions in the US are driven by propensity of economic immigration from those countries. Apart from the purely racist ones.

Joseph Wright

@UlrikeFischer Current plan is that I'll have all of the core of pgf done in l3draw by TUG2018

@UlrikeFischer I think that might be doable in a week or so, but it does depend on what happens with the path post-manipulation stuff

yo'

@AlanMunn well, yeah. Does it mean that US is so impotent in detecting unreported employment?

Alan Munn

@yo' To a large extent, yes, although I think mainly because there is no political will to impose sanctions on employers (since they fund the politicians). But there are various barriers compared to most European countries, since much of government is severely decentralized here.

@yo' So there is no national ID at all, for example, and unlikely ever to be one.

Paulo Cereda

@yo' They call it "reciprocity law" (not in the mathematical sense). Since USA requires a visa for Brazilians, they take revenge and require the same things. :)

Ulrike Fischer

@JosephWright There is not much post-manipulation needed, most pathes of the ducks are simple filled ellipses and a few bezier pathes.

Joseph Wright

22:18

@UlrikeFischer :)

yo'

@AlanMunn ah yeah, it's this thing. Well, you don't have to carry your ID with you here (if you're a Czech citizen), but they can detain you in order to verify your identity.

Joseph Wright

@UlrikeFischer I mean that I've got to sort \pgfusepath

Stefan Kottwitz

@PauloCereda The limitation comes primarily from US. The only way of a bit counter pressure is limiting US on entry to Brazil, to let at least something happen. Guess who should relax the rules first - the stronger bully or the normal guy?

yo'

but for instance, every employment contract has to have a written form now. And there are similar restrictions.

Paulo Cereda

@StefanKottwitz :)

Alan Munn

22:19

@yo' Yeah, but this isn't about carrying it, just that there is no piece of ID that shows your citizenship status. (Permanent residents like me, of course, do have an ID, our green cards).

yo'

@AlanMunn you're not a citizen?

Alan Munn

@yo' No. I'm dual British/Canadian. I only live in the US.

yo'

and yeah, I know. It's a bizarre thing. But not as bizarre as voting without presenting any piece of identification.

Paulo Cereda

I shouldn't mention this, but some Americans are mad at us because they should have free access everywhere in the world. "Who is this poor, third world country dictating that I cannot enter its boundaries?". :)

@AlanMunn Hockey and Marmite! :)

@AlanMunn We can make you Brazilian too. :)

egreg

@PauloCereda Somebody would use a different word than “poor”, talking about third world countries.

yo'

22:22

@PauloCereda that's an attitude I will never understand. But again, you've Americans who comply and wonder: "Nobody told us there'll be so many foreigners in Barcelona."

Paulo Cereda

@egreg Indeed!

egreg

@yo' And they don't use feet and gallons like everybody does

StrongBad

@yo' when I moved to the UK I found I had to re-evaluate what I meant when I said an city was very international.

Paulo Cereda

@egreg and barleycorns!

Stefan Kottwitz

@egreg And miles and ounce and Fahrenheit and inches and whatever

yo'

22:26

@StrongBad I think I lost you

StrongBad

but we feel cheated when we find out 500 ml of beer is the standard size

Paulo Cereda

@StrongBad oh I went to Barcelona and was in shock when I saw a beverage in deciliters!

Stefan Kottwitz

@StrongBad per sip or per gulp :-)

StrongBad

@yo' the UK considers a city "international" if there are people from many nations even if they all look the same. In the US a city is "international" if the people look different

marmot

@yo' But you know that the M in M-theory stands for marmot? That's why it's so complicated;-)

yo'

22:28

@StrongBad ah

Paulo Cereda

Note to self: offer good beer to Germans in Rio

marmot

@PauloCereda I guess that's too broad. Restrict the good beer to Bavarians.

Stefan Kottwitz

@PauloCereda Note to self: verify.

StrongBad

@PauloCereda shouldn't you be offering them good cachaca?

Alan Munn

@PauloCereda But there are only two.

Paulo Cereda

22:38

@AlanMunn two Germans? :)

@StrongBad I am planning eviler things. :)

@StefanKottwitz uh-oh. But for you it's easy: I know you like Antarctica. :)

Stefan Kottwitz

@PauloCereda Because it was available. ;-)

Paulo Cereda

@StefanKottwitz ah. :D

@marmot We have a beer called Bavária here. :)

The real issue is, I do not drink alcohol. :) I can tolerate beer just to not be an outcast in a group of friends. To me, all beers taste the same.

Stefan Kottwitz

@PauloCereda Once I'm in good company I'm not picky about the kind of beer as long as it's tasty. (And the other way round)

Paulo Cereda

@StefanKottwitz ooh

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda just get all the Czech visitors this one and everyone will be happy.

Stefan Kottwitz

22:47

@PauloCereda The stuff in parentheses was a joke ;-) of cause I'm picky about company, so beware >:-)

@PauloCereda Don't introduce Brazilian girls to us if they cannot chat the whole evening about TeX.

marmot

23:00

@PauloCereda Notice that in most places people think beer is made by writing beer on the bottle. These "beers" I also don't drink.

egreg

23:18

@marmot Are you perhaps referring to Anheuser-Busch?

Loop Space

Just got a down-vote on one of the original \tikzmark answers (tex.stackexchange.com/a/1570/86). Clearly, someone's been reading my tweets on it (@PauloCereda, j'accuse).

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