TeX, LaTeX and Friends

GuM

03:10

Hi everybody! Look at this question:

0

Q: braces/parentheses don't display as expected

I have the following code \documentclass{article} \begin{document} \Bigg\{ \big( \big( i,j \big) \big (i+1,j \big) \big) \\ \big(i,j\big)\big(i,j+1\big)\big) \Bigg\} \end{document} after the opening brace the output goes to the next line and I don't understand why especially since this site...

parentheses

Shouldn’t the lack of \mathord in the definition of \Bigg and siblings being regarded as a bug?

barbara beeton

@GuM -- what should really be used is \Biggl, etc.

GuM

(Indeed, what happens here is that the \hbox command is executed in vertical mode, thereby appending the boxes to the main vertical list. Had the expansion of \Bigg begun with \mathord, a “missing $” error would have ensued.

@barbarabeeton Yes, I know, but I’m saying: the absence of \mathord (a “premature optimization”? :-) yields to an uexpected result, instead of what would be really useful to the user, that is, an error message.

Of course I meant “Shouldn’t the lack of \mathord in the definition of \Bigg and siblings be regarded as a bug?”

barbara beeton

@GuM -- they're defined without \mathord in plain tex. i haven't got the ability at the moment to check the texbook or the web code to see if there's an explanation of why not. if you really feel it's a bug, the procedure for reporting same is shown on knuth's tex home page at stanford. when reporting, you should make a very careful and thorough , but compact, argument.

Johannes_B

05:48

-3

Q: i want to change margin in my thesis templates 1.5inch left 1.25 inch right 1 inch up and 1 inch down

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% %% %% %% Class ``PhD Thesis PSnPDF'' %% %% ...

templates thesis

Does anyone see a good way to improve the question? Package geometry is working fine with this template. The accepted answer uses old school margin setting.

Christian Hupfer

@Johannes_B Well, editing the question will push it on the reopen queue...

Johannes_B

06:11

@ChristianHupfer Editing to provide a minimal example will yield to: There is no problem. geometry works just fine. -> Unclear/Off-topic. This is rather a candidate for deletion, since it is absolutely not helpful to anybody,

@ChristianHupfer Or mention the weird \ifCustomMargin stuff as explained here: github.com/kks32/phd-thesis-template

The template really acts not-clever with those strange options.

egreg

07:23

@GuM The definition of \big has outer braces: \def\big#1{{\hbox{$\left#1\vbox to8.5\p@{}\right.\n@space$}}}, so it behaves as an Ord; moreover \bigl can be defined as \mathopen\big. I agree that first defining \@big like above and then doing \def\big{\mathord\@big} and so on would be better for catching errors.

yo'

08:38

@egreg @GuM but it would consume an extra cs -- precious at those times!

egreg

@yo' Yes, that might be the reason. And the simple \big (or friends) should appear only rarely.

@yo' But I'm seeing it quite often. :-(

GuM

09:25

@egreg Yes, exactly: it behaves as an Ord in math mode, but having \mathord in front of it would catch an error like that in the cited question. I agree with @yo' that, in the early ‘80s, an extra cs could be deemed too costly, but what about making this change in today’s LaTeX kernel?

David Carlisle

\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{amsmath}
\begin{document}

\big(\big)
\end{document}

@GuM ^^

although adding $x$ before that changes things a bit:-)

David Carlisle

10:00

@GuM I suspect it's just a feature now, \big shouldn't really be used in documents and it's defined in the format, and in (at least) amsmath, libertinust1math, stix so changing it might be disruptive with little benefit

Paulo Cereda

10:18

Quack from the shaky bus

(mobile is terrible)

The best part of being a duck is being a duck

😬

@DavidCarlisle you lost a good opportunity to blame @JosephWright... :)

David Carlisle

I blame @PauloCereda

Joseph Wright

11:10

@DavidCarlisle Chris is on form

David Carlisle

@JosephWright :-)

Ulrike Fischer

@DavidCarlisle I have a game for you:

\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{xparse}

\ExplSyntaxOn
\seq_new:N\l_dc_blame_seq
\seq_set_split:Nnn\l_dc_blame_seq{,}{@egreg,@paulocereda,@josephwright,@frank,NOT~MY~FAULT}

\NewDocumentCommand\blame {}
{
 \seq_item:Nn \l_dc_blame_seq {\fp_eval:n { randint( 1, \seq_count:N\l_dc_blame_seq ) }}
}

\newcommand\showblame{\fbox{\makebox[3cm]{\strut\blame}}}
\ExplSyntaxOff
\begin{document}
\section*{Blame Slot machine}
\showblame\quad\showblame\quad\showblame
\end{document}

3

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle I think the problem is the idea of 'we can pre-filter issues' simply doesn't work: the GitHub model is you triage them as they come in ...

@UlrikeFischer \seq_rand_item:N perhaps?

Ulrike Fischer

11:26

@JosephWright didn't know that this exists ...

Joseph Wright

@UlrikeFischer l3candidates

Wasabi

I saw an answer to a question once which described how to add an "[Online]" tag to a bibliography item for websites using biblatex, but I can't find it now. Anyone know how to find it (or do it) off the top of their head?

David Carlisle

@UlrikeFischer after a simulation of 1000000 iterations, it suggests that it's never my fault. Seems reasonable to me.

2

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle you are mean (from mobile)

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda you are a duck

Paulo Cereda

11:38

@DavidCarlisle why thank you

I feel good today

@JosephWright Bruno? :)

Joseph Wright

@PauloCereda Yup

Paulo Cereda

@JosephWright Bruno: I will implement this feature because of REASONS.

2

@DavidCarlisle I saw a girl in the cafe using emacs

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda don't they all?

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle I saw one using vim as well...

Not today.

I will talk to her

David Carlisle

11:53

@PauloCereda it's hard to find really reputable establishments these days, these things happen.

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle it can't be helped, it's an engineering department

Ulrike Fischer

12:53

@DavidCarlisle Well naturally. It was a game for you.

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@UlrikeFischer Well, there's the problem, then.

Ulrike Fischer

@HaraldHanche-Olsen A problem for who?

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@UlrikeFischer For whom. I mean, the obvious bug in the program pointed out by @DavidCarlisle. Though he seems to think it's a feature.

Nothing that can't be fixed with an update to the lookup table.

Ulrike Fischer

@HaraldHanche-Olsen I should add "it's a feature".

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@UlrikeFischer As a simulation of @DavidCarlisle, it is of course perfect.

Christian Hupfer

13:03

@HaraldHanche-Olsen @DavidCarlisle is mapping anything to be a feature ;-) \let\bug\feature ... \let\colordesign\feature ;-)

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@ChristianHupfer Even picture mode!

TeXnician

13:29

@ChristianHupfer xsim is very mighty. I'm also a "new user". But for one of my projects I needed such a tcolorbox setup, which was quite easy. And it also supports verbatim inside etc. Regarding the counter thing it's probably just my feeling that it looks awkward.

Christian Hupfer

@TeXnician: I can't say about xsim, at the 'moment' I am still working on a package that is applicable for ordinary schools, not for university education exercises etc.

TeXnician

@ChristianHupfer I'm pretty sure xsim can do this. But populating CTAN is never a bad idea ;)

Christian Hupfer

@TeXnician Yes, if there is space for xii.tex, there's space for YetAnotherSophisticatedQuestionAndAnswerPackage.sty ;-)

TeXnician

@ChristianHupfer YasQaAP? Sounds like a reasonable package name ;)

@ChristianHupfer But maybe something not as sophisticated as xsim, but something easy to use would not be bad.

Christian Hupfer

@TeXnician Easy to remember, isn't it? :D

@TeXnician ximproved, how about that? :-P Let us say, what @clemens will say about that ;-)

TeXnician

13:37

@ChristianHupfer Sounds like either a bad fork of X11 or some official l3 package (although improved is rather boring compared with coffins)...

@ChristianHupfer I'm sure @clemens won't hear us (at least pinging him that way) :)

Christian Hupfer

@TeXnician That's why I mentioned @clemens explicitly :-P

barbara beeton

2

TeXnician

@ChristianHupfer Btw: Just found out that xsim can do random exercise as well as grading tables. Pretty handy. Are that also YasQaAP features?

barbara beeton

yippee! another palindrome! (even if the comma is interfering.)

Christian Hupfer

@TeXnician Yes. But my focus lies also on reusability on education levels, grouping of exercises to form a class test, randomizing the order how they appear in the test, so student A will get version B, and student C will get version D...

TeXnician

13:41

@ChristianHupfer It will probably be fun to compare both packages ;) Except one of you has gutenbergt.

Christian Hupfer

@TeXnician No, it's coincidence, I think. I've been working on it and it is unpublished for years now (like @PauloCereda's thesis :-P)) and I have heard of xsim only recently.

TeXnician

@ChristianHupfer Sounds like xsim's tagging and randomization abilities. Seems that we will soon have two competing teachers on the exercise market. At least no student will suffer ;)

David Carlisle

@TeXnician @barbarabeeton which reminds me, it's probably about time for ctan isn't it?

TeXnician

@DavidCarlisle For what on CTAN? You xii.tex l3 implementation?

David Carlisle

@TeXnician it's a secret

TeXnician

13:45

@DavidCarlisle Ah, packaged in a coffin?

CarLaTeX

@barbarabeeton Don't worry, only @DavidCarlisle cares about that!

barbara beeton

@DavidCarlisle -- yes, it's time! and i have a couple of things to post as well. i think the "short math guide" is in good enough shape to set loose. i still have a file of notes, but the basics are now solid.

David Carlisle

@CarLaTeX No, I know Barbara she cares deeply about punctuation, now it's pointed out to her she can't ignore it (even if she tries to cover herself by blaming me)

@barbarabeeton actually I've got a couple of questions, I'll mail

barbara beeton

@DavidCarlisle -- oh, conspiring to spoil my monday, are you?

David Carlisle

@barbarabeeton no these are easy questions:-)

mickep

13:58

@barbarabeeton Did the new version of "short math guide" end up more or less the same, or did you do a lot of changes?

Christian Hupfer

@TeXnician I don't try to compete with other packages. Perhaps my package is suitable only for me and no other one. And it is not finished by far.

barbara beeton

@mickep -- rather a lot of changes. added references to quite a few new packages and updated bibliography; added a full alphabet showing of a few more scripts (since there are lots of questions here about "what font is this" and the "comprehensive symbol list" has only a few letters of each); added table of contents and full hyperlinking; fixed all reported errors. it's now 21 pages. less short, but easier to use, i think.

David Carlisle

@barbarabeeton you've got secret mail:-)

Joseph Wright

14:25

@DavidCarlisle OOOH!

@barbarabeeton Cool: hope UK-TUG 'publicity' was useful

barbara beeton

@DavidCarlisle -- attended to. onward!

@JosephWright -- no comments yet, but one thing i haven't yet added is an index, so it's really not final yet. (index was suggested earlier, but i think it's better to get the file out now rather than wait; index can be added later. "short" has been essentially unavailable for years, and a lot of things have changed in the interim.)

mickep

14:44

@barbarabeeton That sounds great! I'm looking forward to browse.

David Carlisle

15:52

@barbarabeeton the deed is done

Harald Hanche-Olsen

Is there a ready made command in some package like \smash, except it smashes only the height, and not the depth, of its argument? My own implementation below, but why reinvent the wheel?

\def\finhtsm@sh{\ht\z@\z@ \box\z@}
\def\htsmash#1{{\let\finsm@sh\finhtsm@sh \smash{#1}}}

Uh, forget that, it's in amsmath! Duh.

barbara beeton

16:33

@HaraldHanche-Olsen -- at times, it's useful to read documentation.

David Carlisle

@barbarabeeton that's a bit far fetched, even for this chat

barbara beeton

@AlanMunn -- any ideas about How to put quotation marks above and below letters d and p? (they're definitely not quotation marks.)

@DavidCarlisle -- hey, i write some of the stuff, and authors really like to be read!

David Carlisle

@barbarabeeton don't ask what I do as a day job:-)

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@barbarabeeton Actually, I have read it, more than once I think. The problem is with remembering what I read.

@DavidCarlisle I think you leaked this information right here not too long ago.

barbara beeton

@HaraldHanche-Olsen -- well, you did actually remember it before you gave up.

Paulo Cereda

16:37

@DavidCarlisle ooh secret email

David Carlisle

@CarLaTeX you tricked me, I started reading the answer and when I got to the end it wasn't Steven Segletes

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@barbarabeeton No, I gave up and asked here; then I remembered it.

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda how would you know about it, if it's secret?

barbara beeton

@DavidCarlisle -- you said it was secret, just not what was in it.

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@DavidCarlisle We are really good at keeping secrets on this chat, aren't we?

Paulo Cereda

16:38

@DavidCarlisle we ducks are good at keeping secrets

David Carlisle

@barbarabeeton don't confuse the ducks with details

CarLaTeX

@DavidCarlisle LOL! Is it correct? I did it but I didn't know what I was doing :):):)

Paulo Cereda

@barbarabeeton ooh more secrets

David Carlisle

@CarLaTeX no idea, never actually used the package:-)

Paulo Cereda

We have a conundrum

CarLaTeX

16:41

@DavidCarlisle I was referring to the \vrule :)

David Carlisle

@CarLaTeX probably I'd have used vrule rather than vline (using vline you are relying on the odd feature that \vrule width 1pt width 2pt isn't an error, it just discards the first width.) (but that is what it does so it's not wrong to rely on it:-)

Paulo Cereda

17:05

Quack from inside the shaky bus

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda stupid system git, have to do everything twice:-)

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle :)

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle and @JosephWright wants the team to use it! Preposterous.

And don't make me start about pull requests...

🇬🇧

David Carlisle

17:21

error in \maketitle question not really answerable but the log has Paragraph ended before \zz was complete I wonder who's to blame? I suspect @UlrikeFischer

Paulo Cereda

WHERE'S THE DUCK IN THIS ANDROID KEYBOARD

Ulrike Fischer

@DavidCarlisle That's not possible. I'm not in the blame list.

David Carlisle

@UlrikeFischer nor me, so we're both safe.

Paulo Cereda

$ alias git blame='echo "Joseph"'

3

David Carlisle

7 hours ago, by David Carlisle

I blame @PauloCereda

Paulo Cereda

17:29

@DavidCarlisle oh no

Alan Munn

@barbarabeeton I think in everyday language, 'quotation marks' is perfectly reasonable. I have no idea what they really would be called, but as a description, it seems very clear to me. (I assume you were contemplating changing the question title?)

barbara beeton

18:21

@AlanMunn -- yes, question could be phrased more precisely, but wasn't thinking about that (yet). meanings in unicode chart are: 030D: combining vertical line above (marshallese), 030E: combining double ... (marshallese); 0329: combining vertical line below (ipa: syllabic; yoruba; german dialectology); 0348: combining double ... (ipa: strong articulation). the example shown may or may not be related to linguistics, but that's where the symbols come from.

Alan Munn

@barbarabeeton It didn't look very linguisticky to me. (e.g. stops can't be syllabic...)

CarLaTeX

@DavidCarlisle Thank you!

barbara beeton

@AlanMunn -- that's true. but the important thing (missed by a couple of the people who tried to answer) is that the embellishments should be at the same height. also, granted it hasn't been asked about, nobody seems to have noticed that the cancellations can be either forward or backward. it's missing things like that that can bring down one's test scored. and in this racket, one gets used to seeing symbols stolen from other fields.

Alan Munn

@barbarabeeton I hadn't looked at the answers very closely, but yes, only @CarLaTeX 's answer actually gets the heights right.

Waiting

18:45

Hi people

I'm trying to use \footnote within \text command. It doesn't work in the sense that the footnote doesn't appear on the page.

So, I have something like that \text{bla bla bla \footnote{bla bla bla}}. It doesn't work. Why? How could I fix that?

I'd highly appreciate any answer.

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@Waiting I think you need to use \footnotemark inside the \text command, then \footnotetext{your footnote text here} outside the math.

Waiting

@HaraldHanche-Olsen The problem is that I also have some math there. Thanks for the idea.

CarLaTeX

2 hours ago, by CarLaTeX

@DavidCarlisle LOL! Is it correct? I did it but I didn't know what I was doing :):):)

mickep

Book tip of today: "Sacred Mathematics" by Fukagawa and Rothman. It is a beautiful book about old Japanese geometry problems. Nicely typeset, with nice figures. (Also, the problems are very nice.)

Alan Munn

19:04

@CarLaTeX I looked at that question and thought "This is a job for Steven Segletes", but like @DavidCarlisle I scrolled down and it turned out to be you.

CarLaTeX

@AlanMunn I like stackengine, it's very convenient :):):)

Alan Munn

@CarLaTeX Yes it seems very versatile.

barbara beeton

@AlanMunn -- yes, it is versatile -- for the visual appearance of something. but what does it do to the meaning? what if someone who can't see has to figure that out by deciphering the audio rendition?

GuM

@DavidCarlisle (Reply to the \big issue) Fair enough. It was very naive of me not to consider the implications on existing code.

Alan Munn

@barbarabeeton Well there is that. I guess that's why we need even more unicode characters.

barbara beeton

19:16

@AlanMunn -- more unicode characters might help, but a lot of the time the meaning is hidden in the relative positioning of characters. unicode is never going to introduce full alphabets of second-order scripts, or complicated fractions -- their answer to that is "markup", and they're right.

Alan Munn

@barbarabeeton Yes, that's true. Essentially we need something like 'alt-text' for composed characters like that.

@barbarabeeton Ross Moore has been working on that issue for a long time I think.

GuM

Hello, @barbarabeeton! I’ve noticed that you didn’t reply to my comment about \textup in

2

A: Hyperref and clickable link-boxes produced using \ref, \cite in \xLeftrightarrow

instead of using \textup, use the combination \text{\upshape ...}. in a comment, you said that your output is dvi, which is then converted to pdf. this example was produced with dvi output, converted to pdf with acrobat, not the ps2pdf route you took. however, i've reproduced the experiment wi...

Would you mind if I write an answer myself explaining what I meant?

barbara beeton

@AlanMunn -- all true. there's still a problem -- either the author has to (1) be aware of the problems, and (2) care, or the copyeditor has to be as knowledgeable about the subject as the author. probability of either is not promising.

Alan Munn

@barbarabeeton Yes, this is definitely a problem. Accessibility is rarely on the minds of those unaffected, and copyeditors can only know so much. But if a framework exists for making something accessible, then instructing authors would be possible.

David Carlisle

@barbarabeeton you got me in to trouble with Petra:-)

barbara beeton

19:28

@AlanMunn -- a framework would be really good. and writing instructions for authors can surely be done. but how to persuade authors to read (and follow) the instructions?

@DavidCarlisle -- oh, you'll have to explain how i did that. you can do it offline ...

Alan Munn

@barbarabeeton Well that's a universal problem. But "you don't do, we don't publish" seems pretty plain. :)

barbara beeton

@AlanMunn -- i like that, but management says we have to be accommodating to authors.

barbara beeton

21:40

@GuM -- sorry to have ignored that. (i was otherwise occupied at the time, and don't have a tex system available from home.) i've updated the answer to incorporate your suggestion -- after testing to make sure it really works, which it does.

Paulo Cereda

@barbarabeeton I have earthshaking news. :)

barbara beeton

@PauloCereda -- oh? shakier than the shaky bus? (i still haven't answered your email. i'm thinking.)

Paulo Cereda

@barbarabeeton Way shakier! It almost makes instant butter!

barbara beeton

@PauloCereda -- unless you want it to be public, you'd better send it in mail.

Paulo Cereda

@barbarabeeton ooh a secret :)

David Carlisle

21:48

@PauloCereda should we ask @egreg about football? (anyone from Sweden around?)

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle ooh

@barbarabeeton secret mail sent. :)

CarLaTeX

22:03

@DavidCarlisle National tragedy today!

David Carlisle

@CarLaTeX time to take up cricket (@PauloCereda can give training)

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle People who are out try to make people who are in to be out too so they can be in. This goes on during some iterations and suddenly it stops.

baxx

this table looks weird doesn't it?

the way that it's right aligned like that

CarLaTeX

@DavidCarlisle We'll talk about cricket for the next 4 years :)

Alan Munn

@baxx Yes, it would be nicer centred, I think.

David Carlisle

22:12

@CarLaTeX @PauloCereda might have the rules right by then

baxx

@AlanMunn yeah... i just wrapped it in begin centering, seems better

Alan Munn

@PauloCereda Ah, but sometimes someone who's out can be not out.

David Carlisle

@baxx \begin{center} or \centering not \begin{centering}

Paulo Cereda

@AlanMunn ooh that's true

baxx

what's wrong with \begin{centering} , ?

Alan Munn

22:13

@baxx \centering is a switch, not an environment. (As @DavidCarlisle has just told you too.)

Paulo Cereda

@AlanMunn: see Skype :)

baxx

it just worked like that though :S

David Carlisle

@baxx compare \begin{center}hello\end{center} with \begin{centering}hello\end{centering}

Alan Munn

@baxx If the table is inside a {table} environment it's better just to use \centering.

baxx

it's a minipage

David Carlisle

22:14

@baxx you can edit previous comments (for two minutes)

egreg

@DavidCarlisle Brazil qualified several weeks ago.

bertieb

How is an \itemize list anchored differently to regular text for the purposes of a tikzpicture \node ?

(I am 'filling in' a PDF form and tried a grid of 3x3 nodes to fill in some information to compare to a table (\tabular), but if I use \begin{itemize} the anchor location of the text seems to jump around based on the number of \items)

This is ~~probably~~ definitely a case of 'bertieb doesn't understand the basics', so I thought I would try some different ways of lining up the entries to the underlying PDF pages to see how they all worked out

David Carlisle

@bertieb can't guess what you mean

@egreg and how about Italy?

Alan Munn

@DavidCarlisle @bertieb I'm with David. It's not clear what you mean.

bertieb

@DavidCarlisle I can provide images (with freehand circles!) and MWE but it was more of a curiosity

egreg

22:28

@DavidCarlisle Your message should be flagged as offensive. :-P

David Carlisle

@bertieb most likely you are just seeing vertical centering (which is the default minipage alignment and a fixed width tikz node is a minipage, more or less) but a tikz node doesn't "know" what is in its content and the itemize doesn't "know" it is in a tkiz node, so hard to understand your question.

bertieb

@DavidCarlisle That makes sense (to my limited understanding); I just wondered why it changed the visible alignment; 2 ticks

(only difference is use of itemize)

David Carlisle

@bertieb I can't guess your input, but it looks like the first line of your itemize is vertically centred in the first image

bertieb

I have output I am happy with as above (via doublespace, but there are other ways to do it no doubt); but I thought asking might improve my understanding of what's going on so I'm not 'cargo cult debugging' so much :)

David Carlisle

@bertieb what are you using to make the outer table?

bertieb

22:37

@DavidCarlisle Fair enough! (is there a way to draw a box around nodes (etc) for the purposes of visualising placement of these things?)

@DavidCarlisle The 9 bits of text in the 3x3 grid are just plain nodes in this case (the table looking stuff is a 'background' page from the PDF)

David Carlisle

@bertieb probably:-) (I know nothing about tikz, don't be fooled by the gold badge:-)

Paulo Cereda

> The German city of Munich, which received much popularity back in the day when it first ditched Microsoft's services in favor of open-source software, has now agreed to stop using Linux and switch back to Windows. If the decision is ratified by the full council in two weeks, Windows 10 will start rolling out across the city in 2020.

@DavidCarlisle ^^

David Carlisle

@bertieb as I say if you take a minipage or parbox with its default vertical alignment of center, and place it on the same vertical coordinater as a line of text then the first image is what you expect, you want to top align that node

bertieb

Oh, hey... that's a lotta gold badges!

David Carlisle

@bertieb not as many as @egreg, but mine are more deserved!

@PauloCereda that's probably so they can run emacs in the ubuntu subsyetm

bertieb

22:42

@DavidCarlisle That's a whole ton of combined experience

Alan Munn

@DavidCarlisle Still haven't got the tabularx badge I see. :)

bertieb

@DavidCarlisle I think (in my case) figuring out how to top-align that would take longer than I have budgeted for this exercise :D

David Carlisle

@bertieb probably adding something like valign=t to whatever node has the itemize

bertieb

@DavidCarlisle Probably, but it's escaping for the moment! (and really not critical)

A time-sensitive ish assignment based on a 12-page paper form probably wasn't the best choice of environment for experimentation ;-)

egreg

23:20

@DavidCarlisle All animals are equal, but…

David Carlisle

@egreg ... Swedish Animals play better football

yo'

23:53

Oh no! @PauloCereda vv

"...just got back and didn't see your message until just now. Sorry! -- TIME THIS MESSAGE SAT HALF-FINISHED IN DRAFTS FOLDER: 3 days, 2 hours, 45 minutes."

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