My corresponding author sent our article to nano letters but i havent recieved any confirmation emails yet. Is it normal or thats due to a probable problem during submission?
I have problems with the plants on my balcony. I know it's off-topic here but think there might be others with the same issue... See the point? — Uwe Ziegenhagen1 min ago
@JosephWright I am quite shocked how Brazil is ignoring the whole situation with UK and EU. I've not seen any reports on national TV, not even a single mention. I saw a couple of highlights when watching CNN, but I don't like it. Thankfully @cfr gave me some links to UK online newspapers.
@JosephWright Possibly, but in fact there's a huge political/institutional crisis going on: the Federal Police is arresting high cast politicians involved in corruption schemes, which is basically everybody out there.
@JosephWright Has there been much discussion about the not-so-large winning margin for the exit-side? I mean, there was about 72% turnout, and the result was 52-48. There was certainly massive support for exit, but it's not that big a difference, and leaving is a huge step. (Also referring to petition.parliament.uk/petitions/131215)
@touhami depends a bit if you want the includeonly features of preserving counts, if that isn't needed, I'd just stick \iffalse \fi around the omitted text. if you want the \include features, it's possble but using \include is simpler, so why bother?
@JosephWright @DavidCarlisle I am not a very political person, sorry. I thought Brexit was about leaving the EU and now i am reading some shocking twitter and facebook things where people tell "stangers" to leave britain? what the fuck is going on there?
Wouldn't the easiest solution be that all who voted against Brexit move out and to the continent? On the other hand, all non-european continental inhabitants would move to the island to be finally non-europe. Would remove quite some tension.
@PauloCereda Well, Brazil has multiple crises of its own to deal with right now and while Brexit will presumably have some impact on Brazil at some point, it really isn't clear what or to what degree, I guess. But it does seem odd it doesn't get mentioned at all. I would have thought it would at least get a mention in business news, for example, just to explain the cause of changes in the stock markets, currencies etc.
@Johannes_B Yes. It is is shocking. It is not surprising. But it is shocking. And it is going to get worse.
@TorbjørnT. Well, you have to take people's votes at face value. That's pretty basic. However, it is notable that, if this were a trade union vote for a strike, the (proposed?) rules would not consider the vote sufficient to authorise it. (I say 'proposed' because I can't remember if they've actually instituted this rule or not. But that would require 40% of the membership to vote to strike.)
@Johannes_B It is to be hoped that all they do is shout abuse, awful though that is. But I would not count on it.
Though I suppose the Scottish government could relocate along with the majority of their population.
@Johannes_B It is the governance issue, more. The parliament will have to go with them. Also, this wouldn't address the issue of the other island which is even more problematic.
@egreg -- but that's true (driving on the other side of the road) everywhere in those islands. (also bermuda. and japan. never mind the drivers who insist on going the wrong way on the one way street in front of my office. it always pays to look both ways.)
@AlanMunn -- maybe something good can come of it ... maybe it will make folks think twice when they go to the polls here in november to elect the next president. you, at least, have a canadian passport to fall back on.
@TorbjørnT. Not really: remeber for a start this technically non-binding, and that as we use first-past-the-post our MP numbers don't follow vote share anyway
@Johannes_B A lot of the focus has been on immigration, particularly from UKIP but also increasingly from the main leave group toward the end of the campaign. Concern about jobs, house prices, etc. has been strongly linked to immigration, and that then leads to the idea that a leave vote means that EU nationals will 'go home'.
@Johannes_B At the present, there has been no suggestion from anyone campaigning to leave that anyone will have to leave: it looks likely that EU nationals already in the UK will get indefinite leave to remain
@MathWanderer But Nicola's online book that Paulo linked to is very good too (and free). Also for math, specifically George Grätzer's More Math Into LaTeX amazon.com/More-Math-Into-LaTeX-4th/dp/0387322892. And hidden gem, there's a free (older but still good) version included in the TeXShop Help menu!
@PauloCereda Cunning plan of the English: now that they're essentially as big as they were at Elizabeth I times, they'll start conquering an empire again and Brazil is the first step. They'll attack you from the Falkland/Malvinas.
@MathWanderer Yes, then check out the version that is in the Help menu of TeXShop. Also, you can access all of the MacTeX documentation from within TeXShop by choosing "Get Help for Package" in the Help menu. From there you can try mathmode which pulls up a really good overview by Herb Voss how how to typeset lots of math.
@MathWanderer Actually looking more carefully, only part of the Grätzer book is included in TeXShop. So I would recommend buying a copy.
@JosephWright @Johannes_B Although this is likely to get complicated in various ways. There are also issues in terms of the anger people have whipped up. Some on the leave side don't really want to stop free movement of people anyway, but they played the immigration card. They told desperate people that it was the fault of 'uncontrolled borders' and that this was the fault of the EU. It is the usual scapegoat move. If they don't now act against the scapegoats, people will get mad. ...
If they do, people will also get mad because they are only scapegoats, so even if we throw all immigrants out, the problems will still remain. Plus lots of the 'immigrants' are (1) not immigrants at all or (2) immigrants but not EU nationals.
@JosephWright Yes. And the fact that people are going up to people in streets and supermarkets and telling them 'we voted leave, get packing!' is not only horrible but very confused. Especially confused when the victims are e.g. South Asian or Tunisian or British or British Asian or fifth generation Polish or ... (I don't mean it is not equally bad if they are Romanian and arrived last week, but it doesn't reflect the same level of confusion.)
@cfr @JosephWright I assume we're all seeing some of the same social media stuff, but have you seen this? indy100.independent.co.uk/article/… Wishful thinking only?
@AlanMunn Boris downbeat as his strategy was to loose referendum by a narrow margin, claim moral victory and use that the go for PM role without the issue of leaving EU
@JosephWright Right, but does he have now the guts to go through with leave? Surely the longer the truth sets in without Article 50 being invoked, the more regrets some of the leave side will have.
@AlanMunn I'm thinking of writing to my (rabidly) pro-Leave MP to say that I expect us to leave 'properly', even though I voted for Remain, as that's what the outcome of the referendum is
@AlanMunn I am worried that a long wait puts us into the 'how long does this mandate last' territory
@AlanMunn The problem with this is that a lot of people voted leave out of distaste for the way politics tends to work: trying to 'game' the people by avoiding leaving the EU is not exactly going to help
I can't see any possibility of starting article 50 procedures before we have a functioning government (and opposition) at Westminster, and that doesn't look like it will be any time soon.
@PauloCereda It depends what you mean. The forces which have been unleashed are unleashed. If you mean, is it possible that the UK not leave the EU? Yes, it is possible. The vote is not binding. But whatever happens now, there is no going back. Those who voted to leave voted for change and many voted because desperate. If we don't leave, that tells people clearly that no peaceful protest will be heeded. So what is left?
@MathWanderer Apparently, yes. Individual incidents. It isn't clear whether there is an increase in the number of instances of racism. That is, it is getting reported because what's said is invoking the vote, but it might just be that people who would otherwise shot some other racist thing are using the vote because they can.
@JosephWright But we have a representative democracy. An MP who sincerely believes that leaving will be substantially worse for the UK than remaining ought not endorse a motion to trigger Article 50 if s/he sincerely believes that the negative effects are great enough to justify ignoring the referendum result. There must be some degree of damage which would justify opposing a motion to implement a referendum result. The question for any MP has to be where that cut-off is and whether it applies here.
@wilx I recently had some errors with unicode conversion with Pandoc which I solved with making sure I had the most recent version installed (of pandoc).
@JosephWright @DavidCarlisle @AlanMunn And any MP deciding whether to approve exit must surely consider the fact that the Leave campaign have no essentially taken back all of the promises they made during the campaign. Since Friday, we have been told that the 350 million figure was a mistake, that the money will not necessarily go to the NHS anyway, that there will not necessarily be fewer people coming into the UK, and that Article 50 need not be triggered immediately or necessarily at all.
@AlanMunn no I think leaving the EU would require changes in UK law that would require parliamentary vote, but I may be wrong, it's hard to keep up with details...
@DavidCarlisle UK: United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland = Wales + Scotland + England + Northern Ireland
@AlanMunn @DavidCarlisle They are saying that they expect Cameron to officially trigger exit at Tuesday's summit. Apparently, it does not even need to be in writing. However, it does need to be intended and clear. If so, then I guess parliament need not approve. Nonetheless, Cameron has said he won't do it. If MPs passede a motion to the effect that the will of the house was not to trigger it, would a PM really do so?
@DavidCarlisle But isn't the vast majority of the parliament in favour of remain? So if it went to a vote there surely it would fail. That's why I think it's in the PM's hands. Something to do with the Crown Perogative.
@cfr Now there's a scenario. Direct vs. representative (such as it is) democracy in a head-to-head battle...
It seems to me quite tricky to say it is up to the PM. The PM does not have the powers of a presidential head of state. It all seems rather unclear. If the PM can trigger it with a referendum then the PM could do so without one or despite a vote for remain.
@DavidCarlisle An awful lot would have to switch to get a leave. But the point is that they might still be convinced remain is best, but also convinced they should vote leave in parliament. That is perfectly consistent. The will of the people is, at the very least, a serious factor to consider.
@cfr yes that's what I meant above, MPs may vote to leave now if they think they should follow the public vote (or if they have a three line whip telling them to vote)
@wilx what does your source look like, how come it's got NEL in it anyway?
@wilx but how is NEL used, it is an odd character just in Uniocde as part of the original ASCII/EBCDIC merger denoting an d EBCDIC new line but not actually treated as a newline (in the way characters 10 and 13 are) by most software
@wilx you could make it catcode 10 so it acts like a space but you can't really make it act like end of line with the behaviour that two consecutive ones are a paragraph, it would be much more reliable just to change them all to character 10 using a replace in an editor or sed or perl or whatever you want.
@DavidCarlisle @cfr @JosephWright This is an interesting (though sobering) read. It's from March of 2015, but talks about all of the constitutional issues now facing the UK with a leave vote in place.
@wilx the problem is tex's end of line behaviour is only partially controlled by catcodes, the input stream is split into "lines" before catcode tokenisation and white space is stripped from the ends of the lines. the filesystem line markers are system dependant and not visible from the tex macro layer, so there used to be texs for record-based filesystems that had no end of line character at all, and for NEL separated streams and all sorts of things, but current systems use 10 and 13
@PauloCereda Well it depends on the application, but it's sometimes handy but you have to pay attention. It's awful if you're writing in a mixture of languages (as I often do) however.
@AlanMunn Interesting article though. I noticed the number of countries increased by page 3. Perhaps the abstract was written a bit too soon - before the creation of the UK?
@cfr I think the '3' in the abstract refers to Scotland, N. Ireland and Wales ("the three smaller constituent nations") in contrast to England. Or were you objecting to some other counting problem?
@AlanMunn Hmm... I was going to say that I didn't say it was stupid enough to believe Boris. However, I don't think the people who voted to leave are stupid. I'm not even sure that voting leave was not the best choice they had.
@AlanMunn I took 'smaller constituent nations' to mean smaller than the combination of the nations. But maybe you are right. Probably didn't pay enough attention to the details ;).
@cfr No, I agree, and I've been very careful not to jump onto the "everyone who voted leave is a racist idiot" bandwagon that I've seen among some of my UK friends.
@PauloCereda Don't worry. You're not one of the people trying to figure out how to escape from something which it is metaphysically impossible for anything to be contained it.
@BBM Unfortunately this is more of a style question than a TeX question, and I suspect it will likely be closed as off topic. Asking here in chat would be fine, but unless @cfr has an answer, there's nobody else here at the moment who might be able to. @barbarabeeton would be a good person to answer though (not here at the moment).
@BBM Sorry. I would have no idea. You don't have to figure out how to organise stuff at BA level. However, I think it is off-topic anyway and belongs on Maths SE.
@BBM As a philosopher/logician, I would say that if they are not part of the definition, they cannot be included in the definition on pain of contradiction. So if 'based on' means 'derived from via obvious inferences' then they need to be distinct from the definition.
@BBM Bachelor of Arts - undergraduate, as @AlanMunn said.
@BBM It is just that I didn't write any mathematics. So what went in a definition or a lemma or whatever was whatever other people had organised into the definition or the lemma. I didn't have to decide whether this went in a lemma or something else, because I wasn't inventing new stuff.
@BBM It isn't really different from mathematical logic. Philosophers use the same logical systems. At least, certainly some of the same ones. I don't know if mathematicians ever talk about things like deontic logic, but I'd guess maybe not. But, still, that's really an interpretation of a formal system which is just a formal system of equal mathematical and philosophical interest.
My corresponding author sent our article to nano letters but i havent recieved any confirmation emails yet. Is it normal or thats due to a probable problem during submission?
Should obvious properties based on definition be written as a lemma or should they be included in the definition?
Thank you
