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12:43 AM
I wonder if the post office would manage to deliver a letter addreses thus:
जोसेफ राईट
२, डॉथोर्पे एन्ड
अर्ल्स बार्टन
नॉर्थॅंप्टन
एनएन६ ०एनएएच
युनायटेड किंगडम
 
@PhelypeOleinik Ah, ok. So is the right way around this to explicitly load expl3.sty in my package?
 
@DavidPurton Yes. But do you need to check the output format in the preamble?
 
@PhelypeOleinik This code is from pdfoverlay.sty. There's a function that counts the pages in a PDF and the PDF can be specified in the preamble. I didn't bother supporting DVI mode for counting pages because it's not so simple. There are of course other ways I could do the check. But from an API point of view, using \sys_if_output_pdf:TF is neat and (I thought) an obvious way to do this. Are there good reasons to avoid putting \RequirePackage{expl3} in my package?
 
1:01 AM
@DavidPurton Ah, got it. Loading expl3 should be no issue, especially nowadays that it's basically a stub. The only problem would be if someone loads expl3 later with some option, then the option clash error would kick in.
@DavidPurton You can avoid loading expl3 by doing \sys_load_backend:n { } (with an empty argument it guesses the backend from the engine being used). That's basically what it does at \begin{document} if a backend wasn't explicitly loaded before
 
@PhelypeOleinik Using \sys_load_backend:n { } seems like it might be a good compromise. Thanks.
 
 
7 hours later…
7:38 AM
@DavidCarlisle I suspect that would depend on your luck (given that each place of employment is a grab bag of competent versus incompetent). If anyone would have the bright idea of using translation software I assume the "proper" address would simply be written on it and then sent off. But I also suspect that most people would do the decent thing and assume foreigners don't understand their script and use the Latin one (speaking as a postal service veteran).
 
7:57 AM
quack
@Plergux kotaku.com/…
 
8:15 AM
Hi, Is it possible to link JabRef to MS Word? or possible there is a software to change hell to heaven for me?
 
8:35 AM
 
@enthu JabRef can export XML for Word - there used to be an add-in that would link BibTeX directly, but I'm not sure it still works
 
@JosephWright thanks, will check it.
 
9:25 AM
@PauloCereda lol, silly peeps. :p
 
@Plergux :)
 
9:48 AM
@barbarabeeton What would be the correct way to typeset, when writing in Spanish, $x_\mathrm{máx}$ (not working) --- I use $x_\textrm{máx}$ now and it's ok (but I am using standard fonts mostly)
The \mathrm one do not work in lualatex too, but gives no error.
 
10:34 AM
Joseph Wright checking PR's today
 
 
5 hours later…
3:36 PM
@Rmano -- You need to wrap the subscript in braces: $x_{\mathrm{max}}$. This is generally true if more than one character is present in the subscript input. In some cases, it will work without braces, but never guaranteed. Even if a subscript (or superscript) is just one character, e.g., $x_2$, it's not wrong to use braces, and in fact that is recommended.
 
@barbarabeeton I think he meant the accent...
 
@PauloCereda -- Oh. Thanks. I'll try again.
 
@barbarabeeton <3
@barbarabeeton These pesky languages with accents. :)
 
@Rmano -- Apologies. @PauloCereda pointed out that I missed the accent. \mathrm, as far as I am aware, doesn't support any accented letters, so \textrm (or \textup) would be what you need. The advice about braces still applies. (The text on my screen is very small, and I haven't figured out how to improve the contrast. That accent is really tiny.)
 
@barbarabeeton Thank you <3
@barbarabeeton õóḧ
 
4:04 PM
@barbarabeeton Thanks! Yes, I always forgot the braces ;-), apologies (I remember a Q&A where it was explained that without them it works by accident).
The problem is the accent --- I use \textrm but that follows text font, not math font, right?
 
yo'
This made me laugh: wikidiff.com/aforementioned/beforementioned As adjectives the difference between aforementioned and beforementioned is that aforementioned is previously mentioned while beforementioned is previously mentioned.
 
@Rmano -- Right. If it says \text, it says what it means.
 
@barbarabeeton Yes, I suspected it. Well, not too bad. I do not know if adding á í to the set of \mathrm chars is easy or difficult... Anyway, using the non-accented max-min is not too bad, I doubt that my student will even notice the thing... ;-)
 
4:33 PM
@JosephWright should I have closed github.com/latex3/latex3/issues/833? If so, sorry for not doing so and thanks you :)
 
4:45 PM
@Skillmon Just doing a bit of cleanup
 
@JosephWright yeah, my inbox realized... :)
Btw. googling for ltcmd turns out that we now have a Lieutenant Commander to give commands to LaTeX!
 
Mmmhhh... using [spanish]{babel} the math operator \max changes to output "máx" but the \sin one still outputs "sin"...
...although there is a \sen one. A bit asymmetric...
 
5:01 PM
@Rmano I don't know much about Spanish math conventions, but could it be that sin is often not translated, whereas things like max always are?
@Rmano It wouldn't be surprising to me if that were the case.
 
@AlanMunn Normally in Spanish (and Italian) text you find "sen(α)", not "sin(α)" (especially in high school texts). Everybody understands both of course.
 
@Rmano That makes a lot of sense for high school. Does the usage become more mixed in university?
 
@AlanMunn Yes, probably. "Mixed" is the correct word (my students are able to use both in the same document independently on the language). I tended to use "sin" always, but a colleague noticed that in a document and pointed it to me.
 
@Rmano Yes, so that probably accounts for the asymmetry in babel I would guess.
 
@AlanMunn Still, it would be nice to have a global switch, so that I can write \sin everywhere. I will prepare some macro later (no time now). Thanks for the comments
 
5:31 PM
@Rmano ooh I have a Switch
Oh wait, it's the other switch
Oh :(
 
@PauloCereda my daughter too ;-)
 
@Rmano OH MY REALLY
@Rmano Which games does she like? :)
 
@PauloCereda I'm not exactly an expert but the last one was a Pokemon, plus Marios and... ¿Zelda (that was old)?
 
@Rmano ooh cool
@Rmano Zelda still lives up to this day. :) I have two Zelda games: Link's awakening and Breath of the Wild
 
@PauloCereda (no idea...)
;-)
 
5:34 PM
@Rmano Do you play any games with her?
 
@PauloCereda unfortunately no --- not the Nintendo one, she plays with friends online. I played a bit with her with games of my generation (lemmings, or things like that)
...and this summer I adapted a version of the Lunar Lander and we played quite a bit together.
 
@Rmano ooh
@Rmano does she like Animal Crossing?
 
...and we play togheter a bit on the Xbox 360,
I think she never tried it, she seems not really interested a lot.
 
@Rmano ooh I have a XONE :)
@Rmano I see :)
@Rmano secret duck mail
 
5:50 PM
@AlanMunn In more careful texts, sen, lím, máx, and mín are used. As @Rmano says, both English and Spanish forms appear in university texts. I don't use babel, but I remember some support was lacking.
Interestingly ConTeXt displays Spanish abbreviations when the language is set
\mainlanguage[es]
\startTEXpage
$\sin\max\min\lim$
\stopTEXpage
 
@JairoA.delRio Yes --- ideally it should have an option switch to change them all or none. It has a command to "fine tune" some names, like "senh" or "tg", but it is a bit... well... no-uniform. When I have a bit of time I'll try to propose something in the github of babel-spanish
 
ooh las llamas son más grandes que las funciones sinusoidales
 
@JairoA.delRio yes, that is ok.
 
@Rmano Nice
@PauloCereda lol. I'd think of camels instead.
 
@JairoA.delRio ooh
 
5:57 PM
user image
2
 
@JairoA.delRio ooh
 
May 14 '12 at 18:15, by Alan Munn
@egreg It reminds me of a story that my advisor told, which I now tell my students as a lesson on how a good theory can be explanatory rather than merely descriptive.

Q: Why are there 1-humped camels and 2-humped camels, but no n-humped camels for n>2?

A: There are only two types of camels: concave and convex.
4
 
@AlanMunn LOL
 
@Rmano the logically correct markup would be \mathrm{máx} the fact that it doesn't actually work is a "techincal detail"
9
 
 
3 hours later…
9:02 PM
 
@CarLaTeX ;-)
 
9:46 PM
@yo' Can I ask you an Overleaf question?
 
yo'
@AlanMunn sure, but I have to rush off in 5 minutes
 
@yo' I have a package that contains files in a graphics folder plus a style file. How do I upload it in a way that it can be used?
 
yo'
@AlanMunn we have a help page on that. You shall use latexmkrc if you don't want all the file exposed in the top folder of the project
gimme a sec
it works well, as long as the project's main file is in the top folder itself. When it's not, these things tend to break
 
@yo' Yes, that should help I think. Do I need to upload all the files individually? I tried uploading a zip of the folder structure but that did nothing
 
yo'
@AlanMunn yeah, this sucks. You can do a multiupload by selecting multiple files in the browser, but they'll come into the same folder, so you'd have to spread them afterwards.
 
9:50 PM
@yo' Ok thanks. A bit clunky, but it will work
 
yo'
It's also possible to upload a ZIP file and unpack it using latexmkrc into the project's cache, but it's tricky as the files are never visible in the project tree.
 
@yo' Got it.
 
yo'
@AlanMunn I have an example of this somewhere that I could dig up if needed.
 
@yo' For this use case, it might be helpful to me, if you don't mind
 
yo'
@AlanMunn Ah! I didn't do it using latexmkrc, it's using bashful: overleaf.com/read/fwmyrmsxnpvb
(this means that shellesc will work equally well)
 
9:54 PM
@yo' Ok thanks! That's all I need to get things working.
 
yo'
@AlanMunn ok great :-) I'm sorry especially for the missing ZIP uploads into the projects, that sucks intensively. (At the same time, it's also not easy as it's difficult to undo; imagine someone accidentally uploading a ZIP file with 1000 files)
Oh there's Dropbox!
Do you have Dropbox?
 
@yo' I do, but I don't know if the person who needs this does
@yo' So if I can get it done without that would probably be simpler.
 
yo'
@AlanMunn ah right! They'd also need a free trial or a subscription for this to work. It's a drity hack basically
 
@yo' Yeah, so I'll use the unzip method. That seems the simplest overall.
 
yo'
@AlanMunn the ZIP file method is reliable, just beware that ZIP takes some of the compile timeout limit
 
9:57 PM
@yo' There's no need for the package to be visible to the user, and I can instruct them to comment out the \write18 command after the first compile.
@yo' But the amount of zipping is minimal anyway, and the documents will be small.
 
yo'
@AlanMunn it can be done in more clever ways that safe for project copies and project cache clearing, like using these if [ -f ] bash thingies
@AlanMunn yeah right, it's usually fast, make a second or two, but if the project gets compiled 3 times etc. it can build up
 
@AlanMunn you can also do multi-file uploads via the form submission API (that's how learnlatex sends mult-file examples to overleaf
 
yo'
@DavidCarlisle well, if it's a new project, you can upload a ZIP, that's fine :)
 
@yo' ah I see (I thought you could upload zips, but I didn't check the full context of the discussion above:-)
 
yo'
@DavidCarlisle only as new projects, not into a project :) (well, you can upload it, but it won't be unpacked)
 
10:02 PM
@yo' Ah, that might work too. I'll see what seems simplest. I need lowest common denominator.
@yo' Because I could make a zip that includes a main.tex and the latexmkrc and have people upload the whole zip as a new project
 
yo'
@AlanMunn yeah, if it's an existing project, you can download the ZIP of it, combine it with the new files and upload into a new proejct. Then simply archive or delete the old one. You'll only lose coments, track changes and history
 
@yo' This might be the simplest solution.
 
yo'
@AlanMunn or you can create an example project and share the read-only link to it :) People can then make copies
anyway, gotta go now, sorry
 
@yo' No worries, this has been super helpful. Thanks!
 
yo'
@AlanMunn oh you're welcome :)
 
11:00 PM
@yo' I implemented the last solution, i.e. send the person a zip with a main.tex, latexmkrc file and the package folder structure with instructions to upload it as a new project. It's definitely the simplest solution, and works very nicely.
 
11:33 PM
@CarLaTeX -- What a super photo album! So many great pictures and creatures! I want to visit! I love the otters -- they just have too much fun. (Admission: some years ago, on the island on the Georgia coast that we try to visit every year, an orphaned baby otter was adopted by the resident manager couple. It was great fun to watch it try to take over their residence. Sleek little critter, and amazingly flexible.)
 
11:53 PM
@DavidCarlisle After updating today, I ran texdoc tagpdf, I think this is the best documentation I've seen and read, what do you think? :D (@UlrikeFischer ^^)
 

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