TeX, LaTeX and Friends

12:12 AM

@DavidCarlisle dammit

@yo' It used to be work, in fact it's how I came to be here (at Nag and Oxford) but now it's "fun" for some definition of fun:-)

Anonymous

@DavidCarlisle Strange? Compiling with what? I just updated my Tex a week ago

David Carlisle

@VincentMiaEdieVerheyen texlive pdflatex

Anonymous

1:44 AM

@DavidCarlisle I can't figure out why you do and I do not get clickable links ... posted a small question about it now: tex.stackexchange.com/questions/395097/… called "Why is this code outputting clickable URLs for some users, yet not for others?"

Anonymous

2:11 AM

@DavidCarlisle I found a solution, and answered the question tex.stackexchange.com/a/395098/67761 but I am not satisfied with it ... I prefer having empty lines to paste stuff into

BAYMAX

4:07 AM

hi i wanted to write

numbers with spaces in latex

$$10 4- 50 60$$

10 4 -50 60

well \quad !

Chetna Shah

7:32 AM

Hi friends, I am using \cases to write function with conditions, it works fine except the whole thing is right aligned, any ideas?

ok its center aligned, and i'm using \begin{equation}

mickep

7:47 AM

@ChetnaShah Try the mathtools package, it has several cases variants.

Anonymous

9:04 AM

I am working in this latex3 environment, e.g.

\NewDocumentEnvironment {mainentry} { m m m } {%

Anonymous

Now I need to define other commands which take information from an argument of that environment above.

Anonymous

I am fine with the commands being defined inside the environment.

Anonymous

But my question is: how can I do that, i.e. define a new command within the environment in a latex3 way?

Anonymous

the commands which I want to insert certainly look e.g. like

\def\subentryone{\def\subentryoneS{\def\subentryoneS{ \endgraf }}\futurelet\next\subentryoneA}
\def\subentryoneA{\ifx\bgroup\next\expandafter\subentryoneB\fi}
\def\subentryoneB#1#2{\subentryoneS { ................ } \futurelet\next\subentryoneA}

Anonymous

but it seems like I can't just insert them within

\NewDocumentEnvironment {mainentry} { m m m } {%

it doesn't compmile.

Anonymous

9:07 AM

within the ............... I will need to re-use the info from

mainentry#1

Anonymous

For a clearer example of what I mean. See my comment to this solved question (Including MWE): tex.stackexchange.com/questions/394981/…

David Carlisle

9:33 AM

@BAYMAX $$ isn't latex syntax

@BAYMAX \quad's rather a lot \, or \: are more usual math spaces

@VincentMiaEdieVerheyen "doesn't compile" isn't a useful description. it would work if you put the code in the right place, if you said what error you got or showed the code you used, it woul dbe possible to say how to correct what you did.

egreg

@VincentMiaEdieVerheyen Mixing different programming styles is a sure recipe for head scratching; wipet's code is quite good, but doesn't mix.

BAYMAX

10:35 AM

Thanks @DavidCarlisle !

Anonymous

11:40 AM

@egreg So who's code do you suggest instead?

David Carlisle

@VincentMiaEdieVerheyen you shouldn't ever (or hardly ever) need \expandafter and futurelet if using expl3 code it gives high level interfaces to iterating over lists. (that said it should work, you haven't said what you did when it didn't work)

David Carlisle

12:25 PM

@PauloCereda facebook.com/atouchofglassyorkshire/videos/884909058230698

Anonymous

1:51 PM

Any latex3 handbook in Chinese yet?

David Carlisle

@VincentMiaEdieVerheyen the one in English is still very sketchy so no translations yet.

Anonymous

@DavidCarlisle What's the best place for me to look for documentation about basic commands such as environments, commands and arguments please?

David Carlisle

@VincentMiaEdieVerheyen the xparse definitions are documented in the xparse manual but for the basic concepts any latex tutorial, (or the the latex book and the latex companion book for the official but not free documentation) it depends what you want to know. How to use them, or how to write them.

Anonymous

@DavidCarlisle Does this make any sense: -->

Anonymous

\def\percentifier#1{\directlua{
tex.print(url_encode('\detokenize{#1}'))
}}
%
%
%
\ExplSyntaxOn
\cs_set_eq:NN
\IfEmptyTF
\tl_if_blank:nTF
\ExplSyntaxOff
%
\NewDocumentEnvironment {Mainentry} { m m m } {%
  \IfEmptyTF{#3}{%
\tooltips[height=17cm]{#1} \footnotesize #2
  }{%
\tooltips[height=17cm]{#1} \footnotesize #2 \endgraf #3
  }
  }{%
% ??? If I put what's below here, I can't compile. \percentifier{#1} should actually take {Mainentry} 's first argument, not SubentryOne 's first argument.
}
%
%

Anonymous

1:59 PM

Let me just look up the compilation error ...

Anonymous

It says:

Anonymous

              : Undefined control sequence.
l ... \subentryone
                       {
?

David Carlisle

have you defined \subentryone anywhere?

Anonymous

Yes, it starts after

Anonymous

 \def\SubentryOneB#1#2{\SubentryOneS {

Anonymous

2:02 PM

and ends at

Anonymous

 } \futurelet\next\SubentryOneA}

David Carlisle

@VincentMiaEdieVerheyen that does not define \subentryone

@VincentMiaEdieVerheyen s is not S

Anonymous

@DavidCarlisle I don't have any instance of \subentryone with s-minuscule right?

David Carlisle

@VincentMiaEdieVerheyen the error message you quote says \subentryone is not defined, and you have not defined it....

Anonymous

@DavidCarlisle OK> I understand what you mean. I will check my full code.

Anonymous

2:12 PM

@DavidCarlisle Now it says:

Anonymous

         : Undefined control sequence.
\SubentryOneB #1#2->\SubentryOneS
                  { \scriptsize {\Chinese #1} \space
\normal ...

l. ... }
      {
?

Anonymous

OK. I guess I better just come up with a MWE.

Anonymous

My apologies.

David Carlisle

so you haven't defined \SubentryOneS

Anonymous

This is my full code ...

Anonymous

2:16 PM

% !TEX TS-program = lualatexmk

\documentclass[a4paper,landscape, fontsize=24pt]{scrreprt}

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
% Surpress errors
\usepackage{silence}
\ErrorFilter{latex}{File}
\WarningFilter{latex}{ignoring duplicate destination}
%
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
% Various
\usepackage{hyperref}
\usepackage{xparse}

\usepackage{fontspec}

\usepackage[right=1cm, left=4cm, top=0.5cm, bottom=0.5cm]{geometry}

Anonymous

It works fine, but as soon as want to move

Anonymous

\def\subentryone{\def\subentryoneS{\def\subentryoneS{ \endgraf }}\futurelet\next\subentryoneA}
\def\subentryoneA{\ifx\bgroup\next\expandafter\subentryoneB\fi}
\def\subentryoneB#1#2{\subentryoneS { \scriptsize {\Chinese#1} \space \normalsize \\  {\Chinese#2} \href{moedict.tw\percentifier{#1}}{\includegraphics[scale=0.75]{files/favicons/萌典}} }  \futurelet\next\subentryoneA}

Anonymous

to the place of

% ???

Anonymous

I get compilation errors

Anonymous

Undefined control sequence.
l ... \subentryone
                     {
?

Anonymous

2:18 PM

Now, you will say I didn't define it then, but as long as the whole

\def\subentryone{ ..................

stuff is outside of the Environment (as in "This is my full code ..." https://chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/40425578#40425578) it works fine, with the only thing still needed to be improved is that

\href{https://www.moedict.tw/\percentifier{#1}}

should actually be modified so that it takes Environment's \NewDocumentEnvironment {mainentry} first argument, not the Command's \subentryone{ first argument.

David Carlisle

you don't need to put any of the definitions for the subEntry... inside your environment but if you do \def\subentryoneB#1#2 needs to be \def\subentryoneB##1##2 and you need ##1 and ##2 to refer to its arguments

Joseph Wright

2:40 PM

@DavidCarlisle I guess I better finish the l3color additions and l3image so I can talk about them :)

David Carlisle

@JosephWright see the datatool answer that died basically just because utf8 handling isn't edef protected.... I must try to write up my notes on that

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle :(

@DavidCarlisle As we now require e-TeX, should we just add \protected to this code? No one should be relying on the 2e robust mech here, should they?

David Carlisle

3:14 PM

@JosephWright for the "character not set up for latex error" I think using \protected is a clear win. for defined characters it's what I think we should do but means essentially making the utf8 string the LICR for those characters and means that you have to use utf8 everywhere if you use it at all, inputenc is built around expanding everything to ascii markup so that you can have latin1 in one chapter and latin2 in another and it all works in the combined aux. but if...

@JosephWright you use utf8 and it gets written as is to the aux the chance that the frontmatter is using some 8bit encoding and it fails is... small.

Alan Munn

@DavidCarlisle But surely you'll have one done in no time.

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle Team meeting point?

David Carlisle

@JosephWright yes I started to write something up but haven't had much time (not today either) will try to pass round some thoughts before the call. It's sort of related to the unicode-chars in filehandling, but the filehandling code could be a lot simpler if the underlying character handling wasn't so fragile.

@AlanMunn 簡單

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle Similar story here with the str module: unexpectedly busy ATM

Paulo Cereda

4:09 PM

@DavidCarlisle ooh

@JosephWright: is a short talk acceptable?

Joseph Wright

@PauloCereda Of course: we don't have a fixed format

Paulo Cereda

@JosephWright Thanks. I don't think I will be able to provide a huge talk.

David Carlisle

4:24 PM

@PauloCereda you could read your thesis. That would fill the 5 minutes before dinner.

egreg

@DavidCarlisle So long time?

TeXnician

4:54 PM

@egreg He included the time for the applause for the brevity ;)

A question: Should the utf8 questions be remapped to unicode (it has a synonym utf-8 anyway)?

yo'

@TeXnician certainly. @Joseph

David Carlisle

@TeXnician there are only three questions? why not just retag them rather than making utf8 an alias?

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle Good plan

TeXnician

@DavidCarlisle To avoid that other users do recreate that tag (may happen, if you just type it in and ignore the suggestions).

David Carlisle

@TeXnician can't make an alias every time a user mistypes a tag

TeXnician

5:05 PM

@DavidCarlisle Well, do you know the linux command line tool sl? Just a typo converted into a very useful tool ;)

@DavidCarlisle I've retagged it.

David Carlisle

@TeXnician :-)

mickep

5:23 PM

Do you understand what the person is after in this question?

Ulrike Fischer

@mickep Sure. He/she want a semantic command. As an example: not something like \textit, which give the correct look, but \emph. While \text works in the example, it doesn't sound semantically correct, if you want to print a "mathematical phrase". (In LaTeX I would simply define a semantic command).

mickep

@UlrikeFischer Hm, but to me \text is a semantic command in math for shorter text snippets? But clearly, I misunderstand something.

@UlrikeFischer Also, the "spacing around it as an operator" sounds strange to me (for that we have \definemathcommand and \mfunction, but that will not be the same as \text.

Ulrike Fischer

@mickep Well \text{is prime} has a different feeling than \text{henceforth} or \text{and}.

mickep

@UlrikeFischer Thanks for your explanation. I feel I'm simply not able to give a good answer to the question, so I'll leave it.

yo'

@mickep the question makes no sense. In LaTeX, \text is the correct choice, so if it works the same in ConTeXt, he wants to use it.

mickep

5:38 PM

@yo' \text certainly exists. This is also what I thought about it... But probably I missed some nuance.

yo'

@mickep Well, the point is, do you want this is prime in italics in a theorem, or not? But that's completely a stylistic choice, I believe either is correct as long as you're consistent.

Ulrike Fischer

@yo' @mickep Don't think to complicated. Simply assume that you want to print the text with mathematical meaning say in blue. So you would input something like this: x \mathphrase{is prime} \text{ and } y \mathphrase{is odd}. And define \mathphrase in a suitable way (perhaps bases on \text{\normalfont ...}).

mickep

@yo' I'd say what is in \text{} should have the same style as the surrounding text, so yes, it should (if the theorem style is like that) be in italic. What is your opinion?

@UlrikeFischer Indeed, and then one can just define new commands, which are invoking \text if one wants. Maybe that is the correct (i.e. what OP wants) answer. I'm still confused, though.

yo'

@UlrikeFischer I would argue that I would use \text in the display formula, but \textnormal inside a set description or in a sum subscript, for instance

There's no difference in is prime (i.e., \in\mathbb{P} or what) and and (i.e., \wedge)

Ulrike Fischer

6:01 PM

@yo' You are discussing details of the implementation. I only wanted to explain that it could make sense to define a semantic wrapper.

yo'

@UlrikeFischer and I argue that the semantics here are not at all semantics :-/

Joseph Wright

8:54 PM

@egreg String functions coming up

egreg

@JosephWright :)

Paulo Cereda

9:53 PM

@DavidCarlisle oi

@DavidCarlisle: in other news, my talk seems to display ~ 6 min. :)

Fabby

Hi, are questions on installing texlive on-topic here?

(Asking whether I should help an AskUbuntu to ask his question here or not)

Paulo Cereda

@Fabby Hi! We talk about virtually everything, even TeX. :) It's worth asking here, but if the question looks intricate, the best option is to ask in the main site.

Fabby

:)

Here's the AU question:

0

Q: texlive and /usr/local vs /usr/share

I installed a full texlive today. As usual, this produced two directories: /usr/local/texlive/2017/texmf-dist/tex/latex, and /usr/share/texlive/texmf-dist/tex/latex Why there's so much duplication I have no idea. But that's another issue. The poemscol.sty file I planned to use appears in 1) ...

texlive

Ask the user to come here?

Paulo Cereda

@Fabby The OP seems to have installed TeX Live from CTAN. It looks like a PATH problem to me.

Fabby

(Y)

You're going to answer over on AU or should I have a mod have it migrate it here?

:)

Paulo Cereda

10:07 PM

@Fabby I think we could hear from @JosephWright and the others here. I fear the answer could be closed quickly due to being previously covered here.

Fabby

Good! I'll refer the user to look here on the site then!

Christian Hupfer

@Fabby Yes, lure him to the Dark Side/Site @PauloCereda ;-)

Paulo Cereda

@Fabby We have a couple of users here who are too trigger happy, so the OP could feel more lost than at AU...

@ChristianHupfer you are mean. :)

Christian Hupfer

@PauloCereda You're repeating yourself ... constantly ... :D

Fabby

I'll leave a nice comment and tell him to search for an answer here as it's already answered here...

(And thanks for responding: I know nothing about tex except it's a kind of ps...)

Christian Hupfer

10:13 PM

@Fabby I've heard that some people even use TeX etc. to write their thesis with it. Ask @PauloCereda, he will tell you more on this mysterious topic ;-)

Fabby

I like courier and plain text...

My favourite word processor is VIM.

:D

Christian Hupfer

@Fabby Evil words in your post you have: VIM and courier and plain text ;-) Blasphemy

Fabby

No, really: if I would have pursued a career in my education, I would be using tex now, but I went into IT and I'm on AU now...

>:-)

field of education...

Dunno what happened there

David Carlisle