@Johannes_B Surely you can turn that off? Or make a dedicated twitter email for the junk.
@Jun-GooKwak Hi, I don't use LaTeX for math, but what specifically are you having problems with? One good source of advice is Herb Voss's mathmode documentation (should be part of your distribution). Or if you're in a hurry texdoc.net/pkg/mathmode
@AlanMunn Hi Alan, thanks for the advice. I'm using the amsmath package, and using it's align environment for equations. I'm working on a partial differential equation that has rather large partial derivatives.
@AlanMunn I think it will be easier if I just link you to the original document so you can see the mess that I made. :3
@Jun-GooKwak Well I might not be too much help, though since I don't typeset any math regularly. Are you worried mainly about the huge fraction on page 6?
@AlanMunn Yep, exactly. I've seen some documentation on how to split equations on multiple lines, but I'm not so sure how that will look with the fraction. Additionally, I would just like everything to be a bit bigger so it is easier to read.
I've got a few lines of calculation that involve large fractions and it is looking horrible on Latex. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to make the fractions bigger with more space so that they are more readable?
Here is my code
This function is well defined as the definitions agree on...
@Jun-GooKwak Good. Sorry I can't be of more help, but this is the kind of thing that is more about best practices than TeX itself, and since I'm not a mathematician I think I'm better off just pointing you towards answers by people who are. :)
@Johannes_B It's all the secret TeX.sx twitterers.
@SeanAllred Looks fine to me. (I use actual letterhead and I don't use the letter class for letters), so I'm not so clear on where the return address is expected to be. But I also know from reading lots of letters (at least in academia) that nobody cares that much about what they look like.
@AlanMunn Yep, that's how it is after the fix I just pushed :) (Well, the return address is still left-aligned, but I'm actually not sure I'd like right-aligned – never seen it that way)
@Johannes_B @clemens @(anyone else I'm not remembering): a place to discuss the 'template' situation (not in the l3 sense:)
@SeanAllred So I'm not going to say "Sh*t this guy doesn't know how to format a letter." but I might say "Sh*t, this guy doesn't know that 'than' and 'then' are spelled differently. Etc.
@PauloCereda arara-based automation question for you: I have the following makefile at the root of github.com/vermiculus/texample. Unfortunately, I'm have absolutely no luck getting everything to compile like I think it should be. Pretty sure this is a unix question though, so it's OT on the site :/
Yes, the TeX engines are very stable. It's a core goal of the project to maintain its famous archivability – as we've been talking about recently in this room, that's something that should never change. However,
LaTeX packages don't have to follow this idea. The majority of them are not developed by the LaTeX team and while I'd say a good portion of the package authors and maintainers out there appreciate archivability, it stands to reason that not all do
If you have all of the same input files as you did back in the day (there are a few tools for this, which I'll find and link in a moment), then yes, it's very unlikely that a newer version of an engine will have any impact on the output of your document
Hmm, but is that necessary a bad thing? I mean, while new packages are cool and fanc, outdated but maintained packages seems to fit better "LaTeX" stable philosophy, right?
For instance, I feel like caption has been superseded (or simply assumed by the core LaTeX 'kernel', i.e.no package required), but I can't remember by what.
@MarcosRorizJunior That's the thing: when I say 'outdated', I almost always mean 'abandoned'.
There are certainly venerable and time-tested LaTeX packages out there that I would still recommend today.
I'm an on and off user of LaTeX so I'm not familiar with every package out there. Having said that, whenever I use LaTeX and need to accomplish a certain goal (i.e. generate a list of appendices), I search around and find some kind of solution that involves a package that I didn't know about. I t...
@JosephWright decided to go for lua only for whatsits? Also for attributes on declaration would it be better to test that the value is -7fff* and error if not, rather than setting it (in tex or lua)?
@DavidCarlisle If you look at the whatsit stuff I'm really not sure it's sensible to have a TeX interface: there's still a question of reverse lookup though so I might reconsider
@DavidCarlisle Don't follow on the attributes stuff
@JosephWright initex sets them all (otherwise all attributes would be set on ever node all the time try lualatex \\showthe\\luatexattribute2000\\stop so if it isn't that, something is already using that attribute
@JosephWright did you get notification of my edit? It seems like I only get edit notifications if you edit in github rather than push via git, or at least that's how I understood the help page.
@JosephWright think it must have been (or you had to use \attrbutedef from tex) as from lua you can't really tell that its been initialised or not if it started at 0, but anyway it's that way now;-)
@DavidCarlisle Don't worry; any changes I make to unicode-math in this regard will be for compatibility with breqn. Having said that, I don't find breqn fundamentally broken for day-to-day use; a summary of complaints would be useful if someone starts working on it again in earnest.
@WillRobertson Been a while since I looked (Michael was writing it at same time I was writing bm and we bounced a few prototypes back and forth:-) but I know @egreg has a long list of issues, we should get him to write them down.
@DavidCarlisle Definitely—algorithms can be improved, but if there's a fundamental problem with the way that breqn hooks into math mode, that's a different story...
@JosephWright I'm actually surprised that no-one has complained that breqn and unicode-math simply don't work together.
I suppose that people don't like eqnarray, but if I have a & = & b in eqnarray (I have much much bigger formula, this is just example), how can I made "a" and "b" closser to "=", like in align where I would have a& = b (but here a& = b doesn't look nice)... Sorry for bad English.
@DavidCarlisle Because I don't know how to solve my problem. Basically, I have four rows of equations and I want left, centered, centered (but in align with previous equation), and RIGHT. I know that I can use multline, but then I have problem with that centered equation because they I are not aligned.
@DavidCarlisle I tried to put align into multline (for that centered part), but I suppose that is not possible.
@SeanAllred The rules in general use getBasename which only gives the file name, so an absolute path is lost. A possible way of fixing this (at least in 4.0) is to use the file reference with some extension handling, or I could implement a getFullBasename. :)
@Cortizol multline and align are both "top level" display environments, you should never need to nest them (and as you see it doesn't work) just change eqnarray to array and delete the second & on each row
@DavidCarlisle Yes, I see, but that is not what I wanted. I want left, centered, next in align with previous and right. Ohhh, I will see on net for some solution, I suppose someone asked similar question. Thank you David
@TorbjørnT. Now remind me which one of the subcaption/subfig/subfigure packages is best :) (My recollection is that the order above is newest/best to oldest.)
I want to add one horizontal line above and one below the chapter-entry as well.
Before using the scrbook-class, I used this simple solution made by titlesec-package:
\newpagestyle{headrules}{
\headrule
% for twosided layout, use:
\sethead[\thepage][\chaptertitle][] ...
Hello chat. Why does \textcolor{red}{<whatever>} expand to {\color{red}<whatever>}? Wouldn't it be much better, partly because of the fact that also works in math mode, \begingroup\color{red}<whatever>\endgroup? Any benefit of using {..} there?
@Manuel well I'd hope that we never have to put a color whatsit in vertical mode, so colour support will be completely different, perhaps. If my memory is correct, there were some early latex2e releases where we used \begingoup for \textxx font changes, but it broke too much so we put them back, but maybe I dreamt the whole thing:-)
@DavidCarlisle You talk a little bit and now I'm lost :) Okey, okey, I know you had reasons. The thing about this “complete compatibility” (which is not entirely true due to packages doing many kind of things) is that it stops many things. I think, if one want to live by some rules, that a clever move is to put a rule that opens to change anything. May be if from the start the “rule” was if you want complete compatibility just save a copy of all the files used by that document...
I know I just arrived to TeX less than three years ago. But that's what it looks like to some outsider. You would definitely have had reasons; I don't discuss that. It's just a little suggestion for the incoming LaTeX3, that may be those rules have to be rewritten a little bit.
1994-03-10 Rainer Schoepf <latex-bugs@latex-project.org>
* newlfont.dtx: Changed \math@bgroup/\math@egroup to use
\bgroup/\egroup, to follow the change in fam.dtx.
* fam.dtx: Changed \math@bgroup/\math@egroup to use
\bgroup/\egroup rather than \begingroup/\endgroup to avoid
leaking out of style changes. Side effect: now always produce
mathord atoms.
@SeanAllred It was incidental, I guess. I think I've never had users who used arara without being the working directory. My last commit incorporates getFullBasename which considers the whole path. We could discuss if rules should use this method instead the usual getBasename.
@PauloCereda I was actually thinking of asking if arara could have something like make's -C option, but I decided I've caused you enough trouble already ;-)
@PauloCereda It changes to the given directory before running. So, for example, make -C duck will cd to the duck directory look for a Makefile, do its stuff, and once it's exited it's back in its original directory.
@SeanAllred: A possible way of solving your problem would be something along the lines of David's suggestion: bash -c "cd /path/with/file && arara file.tex"
@NicolaTalbot Oh my! :) We should try having Quackfile as the Makefile for arara. :)
@SeanAllred Yes, certainly. It wouldn't be anywhere without that, or, of course, Paulo, and ducks :-)
@SeanAllred I'm sure it's this new gui prompt that's appeared since I upgraded something or other. I never used to have a problem when the prompt was in the console.
@SeanAllred No, Linux. I think it happened with I upgraded to Fedora 21. If I type git push in the bash prompt, up pops a gui prompt when it used to show the prompt in the terminal I was using.
@barbarabeeton The discusion that should have went off in Darmstadt somehow went live already. The discussion is split to different locations, a bit twitter, @clemens' forum and gitter. It is chaotic already and i wish to hear your input on how we can keep the discussion tight. Reference: gitter.im/vermiculus/texample?at=55a1383f8223831f0990537a
@Johannes_B In my defense, all the rooms I went into on Clemens' forum were completely empty at the time I created the gitter room :O maybe it was some sort of bug
@Johannes_B -- yes, i did get the ping, and was investigating whether there was anything relevant in the list of mailing lists at tug.org. (there isn't.) but i live on a push-down stack, and it got pushed. i think a list will probably be a good approach, but i would like to have some discussion first in darmstadt. (oh, i do have to make a list of who to corner there.) if you have a good idea for a list name, please feel free. (i thought of "templates", but that may be too incendiary.)
@barbarabeeton I have to say I disagree with you there (at least in the context of implementing a real solution). GitHub issues are near-perfect approximation of mailing list topics; GitHub-linked chat (I use gitter, but I'm not sure if other implementations exist) is good for quickly sorting out small issues. Proper GitHub issues of course allow interaction via email for those that prefer it.
@SeanAllred The current state of discussion is to find a consense about what to do. It isn't about changing templates, improving templates or doing dev work. The discussion in it's current state is (or rather should be) Can we do something to change the current situation? and Are there ways to get template providers on the boat? Somehow, the big three were pinged and happy to work with us.
But there is no us, no community, no consense. I think Darmstadt was meant to answer the above question and define this us.
@SeanAllred Yes but issues are really (to me) for specific things: that's no good for an open discussion with no clear code to complain about or likely outcome
@JosephWright Interestingly, that's the biggest thing I dislike about actually using mailing lists
Parsing out a single topic of conversation throughout that mess takes a lot of effort. If I were king, I would have a new email sent for every tangent that summarized the thoughts preceding.
@SeanAllred topic of conversation = thread so the system has done that for you (so long as people don't just reply to unrelated mails when starting a new topic)
@JosephWright the sources I have do have the diffs adding xetex to the sections dealing with md5sum, but it hasn't made it to the executable, but I'll probably just leave it a bit see if there are further chnages
@SeanAllred yes I was just trying to understand your comment above (which I find baffling) as for mail reader I use thunderbird at present but best email program I ever used was emacs
@SeanAllred for most of the time i used it, It was just using emacs own movemail program to copy files straight off the mail spool, pop was a newfangled alternative that came in later, I did use that though. I suppose you want imap or something:-)
@DavidCarlisle All I remember from my POP days is wondering why it wouldn't let me push my mail up and how I could convince it to just override whatever it was trying to protect on the server. IMAP makes the process much easier, in my experience.
@SeanAllred I use imap now but typically there wasn't really any remote server where it would make sense to push anything to, the mail would arrive site wide and appear in /var/spool/mail and email clients would just copy the files off there to your local directory, no need for pop or imap or anything..
@SeanAllred only problem (and reason I originally switched to pop) was that movemail's idea of file locking didn't really work on NFS mounted drives, so once the mail spool was nfs mounted it wasn't totally safe.
@SeanAllred I can't remember the details but I think basically yes, but if it and the smtp demon bringing the mail in tried to lock at the same time locking could fail, it's a long time ago:-)
@SeanAllred Frank likes one thread per topic, but even if you do that it can get complex as there are sub-topics. Plus of course if you have more than one thing to talk about there are parallel threads: in a chat room they are interspersed.
@SeanAllred I also wonder about timescales. Chat is good for some things precisely because it's quick, but conceptual discussion can take weeks, months or even years (e.g. the LDB stuff)
@DavidCarlisle Contracts now specify number of days holiday. Our place is insisting we all have to log days off 'for legal reasons', which is I suspect being honoured as much as you'd expect
@SeanAllred Can't say I actually know what they entail
@JosephWright giving up for now with xetex, unless @ArthurReutenauer can confirm it's supposed to work:-) It looks like I have pdfmdfivesum changes in the c and web sources but they are not hanging together somewhere, make builds but the command isn't definined in xetex -ini.
i had the xmpp-facebook chat running via pidgin, and it stopped working yesterday. Haven'thad time to investigate, but it is annoying (the not working and the facebook part).
@Johannes_B @SeanAllred -- i have taken a look at the gitter reference; i don't have a github login (and honestly, i don't think i can possibly remember yet another password! i've already had too much trouble changing ones that have been challenged, although i know i used the correct one -- i keep an up-to-date cribsheet with suggestive keys). i do have a list of the people i want to round up in darmstadt to discuss just the "outline" topics i posted here earlier. then i'll report. okay?
@barbarabeeton Sounds good. Out of interest, who are these guys? Have you taken any of the points made today (and yesterday) to your list? How do you see the current state of the discussion/project, not the template situation?
@Johannes_B -- the people on my list are all participants in this chat, and have either put in their "two cents" on the matter directly, or have shown interest in this or related topics. very short list -- 4 names so far plus me. if you really want to know who they are, i'll send the list in email.
@Johannes_B Mmmm house music :) listen to a lot of that too – recently been getting into trance-ish stuff though: youtu.be/ybzSWlpgJOA (takes a full minute or two to really kick into gear, but it's really awesome how everything starts to blend together into something coherent)
I heard about the above on public radio actually – the artist who produced it was doing research into how people are physically moved by music
I've got a few lines of calculation that involve large fractions and it is looking horrible on Latex. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how to make the fractions bigger with more space so that they are more readable?
Here is my code
This function is well defined as the definitions agree on...
I want to add one horizontal line above and one below the chapter-entry as well.
Before using the scrbook-class, I used this simple solution made by titlesec-package:
\newpagestyle{headrules}{
\headrule
% for twosided layout, use:
\sethead[\thepage][\chaptertitle][] ...
