The Quill and Tankard

In Westeros Knighthood is closely bound to the Faith of the Seven and as the majority of the North still follows the Old Gods they don't appear to have knights. There appears to be at least one exception to the rule with maybe a second. Ser Bartimus: He's a follower of the Old Gods but has been...

Edlothiad

Hmm no canonical mention of "Northern Cavalry", I'll refrain from answering.

TheLethalCarrot

No it's just a term for the page I think

TheLethalCarrot

1:57 PM

Ser Bartimus is a Northern knight who follows the Old Gods, he was Knighted by Wyman Manderly for saving his life during the Battle of the Trident and was given the Wolf's Den. Knighthood is exclusive to those who follow the Seven so how is Bartimus a knight?

(It's unclear whether Jorah follows the Old Gods or the Seven and I believe Rodrick Cassel may follow the Seven so I won't use them as examples)

Edlothiad

@TheLethalCarrot Banter

TheLethalCarrot

Muchos helpful

Edlothiad

*bows*

Kepotx

2:26 PM

Do we know all the member of Daenerys Queensguard ?

Edlothiad

Yes, it just doesn't have 7 members.

Kepotx

All I remember is Barristan Selmy, Jorah Mormont, Aggo, Jhogo, Rakharo and Belwas

but i miss the seven. also, did he replaced Jorah once she banished him ?

Edlothiad

Ye there is no seventh

She never names seven

Aegon

She doesn't have any seven KGs

She has just one...Well one if you exclude Jorah, former Lord Commander

Edlothiad

awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/…

Aegon

2:29 PM

The Dothraki are her Kos and Bloodriders

Edlothiad

And in her QG

Kepotx

That's odd. Are there any other example of King/Queen'sguard with less than seven members ?

Aegon

@Edlothiad Now that is odd

Edlothiad

Yes Daenerys

So is Belwas

Aegon

How are Aggo etc and Strong Belwas members of QG?

Edlothiad

2:30 PM

Dunno

Bael the Bard

1

Q: The curious case of Ser Bartimus

Ser Bartimus is a Northern knight who follows the Old Gods. Davos could not argue with the truth of that. From what he had seen at Eastwatch-by-the-Sea, he did not care to know winter either. "What gods do you keep?" he asked the one-legged knight. "The old ones." When Ser Bartimus grinned,...

a-song-of-ice-and-fire

Edlothiad

ASOS Appendix

Kepotx

appendix

Edlothiad

archive.org/stream/3.AStormOfSwords/…

Aegon

@BaeltheBard Related? scifi.stackexchange.com/q/144512/54887

Edlothiad

2:33 PM

No, Bartimus explicitly states he follows the Old Gods

Aegon

@Edlothiad Jorah's family keeps the old gods so presumably he does as well.

But eh, I suppose we never got an explicit "Yes I keep the Ol' Gods" from Jorah

Kepotx

do we know who controlled dragonstone before Targaryen's colonization ? somme petty king, or jus no-one ?

Aegon

@Kepotx Not mentioned. Just that Valyrian took the Island

There is a native population so presumably there must have been native Petty Kings

Kepotx

did they bring lot of servants with them, or only close-family ?

I mean, are there any non targ (and non velaryon) valyrians ?

Aegon

@Kepotx Celtigars

@Kepotx And of course, the Progeny of "Seeds".

Kepotx

2:42 PM

still a noble family

are there any valyrian commoners ?

Aegon

@Kepotx The Seeds

And their kids

Edlothiad

Left? Probably not, but there were

Kepotx

the seeds are the bastards of targ, no?

Edlothiad

@Aegon qua

Aegon

@Edlothiad Velaryons are still fathering bastards. Aurane Waters

Edlothiad

2:43 PM

That's not commoners....

Aegon

Celtigars must be partaking in the occasional tumble with peasant girls as well

@Edlothiad Aurane is an acknowledged bastard

Edlothiad

I was talking pre-doom commoners

Aegon

If there is an acknowledged one, it is likely there are unacknowledged i.e. commoners as well.

Edlothiad

@Aegon Jon's an acknowledged bastard, what's your point?

Aegon

@Kepotx Any Valyrian

Edlothiad

2:44 PM

I was excluding bastards.

Aegon

@Edlothiad An acknowledged bastard still has a link to nobility

@Edlothiad Oh okay.

Edlothiad

I meant like dirty dirty commoners back in the freehold

Working the mines and ting

Aegon

Those were slaves from other nations

Kepotx

yup, i was asking if they bring any commoners before the dooms

to help building dragonston and stuff like this

Aegon

@Kepotx Doesn't seem like it, given the current demographics

Kepotx

2:45 PM

or did they only use local manpower ?

Aegon

@Kepotx They used magic, not labor

Edlothiad

@Aegon I'm saying there were probably still dirty commoners in the freehold

Aegon

There have to be

There were only 40 families which had dragons

Edlothiad

I mean the non-dragon lords would already be a big 'ol step down

Aegon

There must have been hundreds of thousands who were of no import

Edlothiad

2:47 PM

Hence "Probably not anymore, but pre-doom"

Whereas Vela, Tag and Celti bastards are mudbloods.

I was only accepting pure blood Valys

Aegon

@Edlothiad Wasn't there a meta post arguing to ban the use of this offensive word?

I need to find it

Edlothiad

In questions when used as an insult, yes

Who said I was using the term in the context of Harry Potter

27

Q: Why can't I use the word "mudblood"?

In the question How does reporting to muggle Prime Minister not violate International Statute of Wizarding Secrecy? I used the word mudblood. This was later changed to muggle-born (with edit Summary: changed an objectionable word). What was wrong with me using "mudblood", which is only offens...

discussion specific-question suggested-edit

Aegon

@Edlothiad Thanks. I was actually waiting for your link instead of searching for it myself

Hang on, is Bat that dude who is known to be a troll?

Edlothiad

Because you knew I'd be quick or?

Aegon

Changed his name I see

Edlothiad

2:51 PM

That's how you keep trolling

For 6 month it was a monthly change, he's kept bat for a while now.

Aegon

@Edlothiad Nah because I knew you will never give up on a chance to link a meta post

Edlothiad

What does that mean?

I'm an angel

Aegon

That you are our resident Meta search engine

Edlothiad

Ah, c'est vrai

Knew guy answered the religion ting

TheLethalCarrot

Not entirely sure how it answers the Q though passed the first point

Edlothiad

3:05 PM

/shrug

TheLethalCarrot

To be fair I'm on the fence as to whether the marriage point really answers the question but oh well

amflare

I like how every day when I get in to work, Ed's quote in the sidebar has yet another star

TheLethalCarrot

Haha, we will keep it there

Edlothiad

@amflare I don't, trying to kill it with memes...

amflare

4:48 PM

@Edl, are you just gonna beastmode FP until the end of time or are you looking for a specific number?

Edlothiad

@amflare Yes

amflare

That was an either/or question :/

Edlothiad

(3407 or 10k Total reviews, whichever comes last)

10k is a lot of reviews... damn

amflare

3407?

that's an oddly specific number

Edlothiad

HIghest reviews of one type on the site

So technically 3408

TheLethalCarrot

5:07 PM

Eddard Stark himself was not a knight, because he proudly continued to worship the Old Gods of his ancestors, yet still a great warrior.

Reason #5032 why the GoT wikia is terrible

Edlothiad

I'm not seeing it

TheLethalCarrot

He's not a knight because he worshipped the Old Gods? That's not the reason, it may have been a very small part of it but it isn't the reason

Möoz

8:53 PM

@TheLethalCarrot Like, do you even need reasons?

Kepotx

9:50 PM

are there any languages other than common tongue speech in westeros ?

Edlothiad

@Kepotx awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Languages#Languages_of_Westeros

The Old Tongue, Common Tonue, and I'm pretty sure there's some other ones spoken in the far north and amongst the mountain tribes

Kepotx

i read the wiki, but that's what i wanted, are there local languages speaken only in some parts of westeros

Edlothiad

Not necessarily languages, I'd say bastardisations of the common tongue

> Tolkien was a philologist, and an Oxford don, and could spend decades laboriously inventing Elvish in all its detail. I, alas, am only a hardworking SF and fantasy novel, and I don't have his gift for languages. That is to say, I have not actually created a Valyrian language. The best I could do was try to sketch in each of the chief tongues of my imaginary world in broad strokes, and give them each their characteristic sounds and spellings.

Kepotx

still, i find odd that the dornishmen and northmen can communicate without problems

Edlothiad

Americans and Australians can communicate without problems.

Kepotx

9:55 PM

I mean, even today english and old english change a lot, and it's just few centuries ago

if it would be bring by the targ, 3 centuries ago, no problem, but the common tongue was bring by the Andhals and/or the Rhoynar, so long time ago

Edlothiad

It's fantasy, you can't simply draw parallels to the real world

RobertF

The simplest explanation for multiple characters named Aegon in GoT is plausibility. In our world millions of people share the same first name, why wouldn't it be the same in Westeros?

Edlothiad

It astounds me how many people won't let little things like that go in Fantasy, but allow things like Dragons, or revivals etc.

@RobertF That's not the question that's being asked. Also hello, and welcome, bit of a strange way to start a conversation but ok.

Kepotx

dragons are coherent in the world, but medieval statsis is quite dumb for me

Edlothiad

The question is asking why the two children of Rhaegar, only a couple of years apart were named the same name, when for all Rhaegar, Lyanna and the KG knew was that the other Aegon was still alive.

RobertF

10:00 PM

@Edlothiad Isn't this the discussion forum Randalthor set up for the question?

Edlothiad

@RobertF Not here. This is the general discussion

That's why we're talking about languages, dragons, and Kepotx inability to accept medieval stasis.

RobertF

Ah got it

Edlothiad

@Kepotx It's fantasy, it's how it is and probably how it always will be. Especially when it comes to languages, as GRRM said, he's neither a philologist nor a linguist.

@RobertF Oh he did move them here, like 6 months ago so there way up above.

You're still welcome to ask here, and someone might read it.

Kepotx

I don't ask him to create whole new languages like Tolkien did, but i still find odd that soo many people, from different countries, religion and culture, and after that much time speak the same language

Edlothiad

There all from the same religion technically

Except the north. and there not different countries as opposed to different regions.

Kepotx

10:06 PM

and the drowned god

Edlothiad

I mean you're welcome to find it odd, but evolution on Planetos is different to that on Earth, and it is in the fantasy author's power to create what they want to in their world

There's some language development in Essos, Old Ghiscari has become Volantese or whatever it's called

But nothing significant.

The First Men didn't really speak as opposed to make noises, and the Andals have only been around 2000 years.

Populations are also smaller than Earth, Latin has been quite the same language for a very long period of time.

Chinese is mostly the same for centuries

Yes and the Drowned God.

Kepotx

well, there was common latin that create languages such as french or spanish, and high latin, speak in the court that remained unchanged

Edlothiad

Sure, but again, it's a fictional world, it doesn't have to adhere to our rules

I still don't understand how you'll accept dragons but not medieval stasis...

Kepotx

i don't really have the words to express it, but for me, adding magic don't mean you can throw all coherency in your world

Edlothiad

I don't think you're quite getting the concept. He's not throwing away coherency. He starts with nothing and builds from there.

Kepotx

10:20 PM

also, i wonder if the whole 8000 year thing is real or just a myth. I know you will say that we can not compare reality to fiction, but there is lot of exagerations in national narrative, like some mythologicals kings that ruled for thousands years, or the origin of people that has no archeological evidence, such as the exodus

Edlothiad

There i will agree, we don't know because the Maesters don't know and the FM didn't write books or anything

I'm inclined to real, but the people are mythical, but I don't know

Kepotx

lot of things we know about the age of heroes or other things are history according to westerosi, not GRR martin, so not to take for granted

Kepotx

10:43 PM

awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/House_Falwell

gosh, i love this house CoA

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