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6:03 PM
Stop trolling Jasper. Otherwise I will send evil bunnies and monkeys to feast on your soul! Only I am allowed to do that.
5
 
@JonasTeuwen i am chinese. i will feast on your evil rabbits and monkeys and enjoy them!
3
 
@JasperLoy I had not seen FMA until RajeshD said hi just a while ago.
 
user19161
@robjohn I noticed a mysterious FMA the day SP disappeared. :-)
 
@JasperLoy I guess I have been away from chat at the wrong (right?) times. :-)
 
on a separate note (from monkeys) my advisor is thinking of scheduling a talk for me on my thesis.
 
6:11 PM
@Eugene For you I will send a bear! A scary one.
 
user19161
@Eugene Very good. You may film it and show on youtube.
 
@JasperLoy yes... it will be so wildly popular...
@JonasTeuwen you got me there. i don't eat bears.
 
@Eugene Maybe this is a good moment to reconsider not eating bears.
 
user19161
@Eugene Yeah, I still don't know what you look like. Jonas is very cute though.
 
@Eugene which brings up the question, if an infinite number of monkeys typed for long enough, would one of them type your thesis?
 
6:13 PM
@robjohn i don't know. i know all of them would fling poo and pee on the keyboard though
 
@robjohn Are the monkeys independent?
 
@JasperLoy i look like a pink/purple symmetric pattern
 
@JonasTeuwen would it shoot laser beams from its eyes? That'd be frikkin' awesome!
 
@robjohn Yes, blue lasers. Awesome$^2$.
 
@robjohn if it rode a shark i'd think it was awesome
a landshark would be a +2
 
6:15 PM
@Eugene attack or defense?
 
@robjohn good question. attack i believe... and with the trample effect.
 
Wow! Look at all the fish jump for this lhf!
 
yes i saw that. calculus questions are like chumming shark infested waters here on MSE.
anyway i have to go now
good day to all you sirs!
 
Hi folks
 
Good afternoon, sir.
 
6:26 PM
@BenjaLim I think most people do.
You'll certainly have to go back at some point, since he gives a few constructions in there that will pop up later.
 
@robjohn I only upvoted Didier.
 
But I wouldn't sit down and read it straight through to begin the book. The homotopy extension stuff in particular will seem super boring and you won't need it for a while, if ever.
 
6:48 PM
@robjohn Could mathJAX not load because of a slow internet connection?
 
user19161
@PeterTamaroff I think that is possible.
 
Darn
I can't answer!!!
@Eugene Nothing is more awesome than G$\Omega$W's Chimera.
By the way, today is $\tau$ day.
 
7:26 PM
I don't understand this edit.
 
@PeterTamaroff If you refreshed your browser and the slow connection caused the MathJax site to time out during loading, then yes.
 
@robjohn OK. Thanks.
@DylanMoreland I rolled it back.
 
7:39 PM
@PeterTamaroff Ah, I see. I left a comment explaining everything. If he still wants to roll it back then I guess that's fine.
But all the changes seem demonstrably for the worse.
 
7:53 PM
@DylanMoreland do you know where in silverman and cornell is translation of the proof of faltings' theorem by any chance?
 
8:14 PM
@Eugene Have you seen God Of War's Chimera?
@robjohn Are you around?
 
8:38 PM
@peter nope
 
@Eugene Where did he go?
 
@PeterTamaroff: i'm here. What would you like to know?
 
@Chris Could you explain what solution you're suggesting?
You can use LaTeX here, too.
@Chris About the one of $1/8$, let me double check it, OK? Really sorry about that.
@Chris I'll rewrite that answer, OK?
 
Once you made that split you did in the comment we may go this way: 1 + $\lim \limits_{n \to \infty} \left( \dfrac{n-1}{n} \right)^n$ + $\lim \limits_{n \to \infty} \left( \dfrac{n-2}{n} \right)^n$+ $\lim \limits_{n \to \infty} \left( \dfrac{n-3}{n} \right)^n$ + ...
that is 1 + e^-1 + e^-2 + ... = e/(e-1)
Sorry for my way of writing things.
I hope you understand my point.
@PeterTamaroff: it's OK. Take your time for it.
 
8:57 PM
@Chris I just lost a term around there.
 
(i didn't downvote you)
 
@Chris Hehe I know!!
 
:D
 
@Chris That is not valid, dude.
You cant take infinite limits at once! (Thogh intuitively it is "OK")
 
It depends on the case. Here as you notice all terms are different from 0. It's not the case 0*oo as it happens when you have to calculate 1/(n+1) + 1/(n+2) + ...+1/2n
@PeterTamaroff: for my last example, it would be a mistake to calculate separately each limit and then to add them up and say it's 0.
Of course, the limit is ln2.
 
9:04 PM
@Chris That's what I'm saying
In the above case it works, but not in the general. Thus there is no reason to support that reasoning.
 
Hello there.
 
@PeterTamaroff: my luck here is that i don't fall in any indeterminate case. Since that, i'm safe to correctly calculate that limit.
 
@MattN Ello
 
Hi.
 
@Chris Not really. You're being ad hockish.
The general term goes to zero, so you're doing the same as the other.
 
9:06 PM
What is "ad hockish"?
 
@Chris Nevermind.
@Chris The general term goes to zero, so you're doing the same as the other.
 
@PeterTamaroff I am. I was answering a question and replying to some comments. My sound is not working for pings (browser or site problem)
 
@robjohn Oh! OK.
 
@PeterTamaroff Is there something I can help with?
 
@robjohn I was thinking about naïvely using Stirling's approximation to estimate $$\sum\limits_{k > 0} {{{\left( {\frac{k}{n}} \right)}^n}} $$
 
9:09 PM
@PeterTamaroff: well, if you think this way is not valid, ask other opinions as well.
 
@Chris What is your opininion on Chris's argument? (see above)
 
@PeterTamaroff how would you use Stirling? there are no factorials.
 
@robjohn To get rid of $n^n$. But don't think it'll work. Your solution is the boss, I think.
 
@PeterTamaroff actually I think I saw this solution in another answer by Robert Israel. I should look for that question.
I think it is a duplicate question.
 
@PeterTamaroff: i'm very sleepy now. If you have other questions ...
 
9:14 PM
@Chris No more questions. But try to think about that. It is not correct.
 
@PeterTamaroff: since you don't fall in any indeterminate case i see no problem around.
 
@Chris It falls in the same case than the $\log 2 $ sum, Chris.
 
No, there you have 0 * oo case.
I leave now. See ya all.
 
@PeterTamaroff I can't find the answer that I thought I saw from Robert Israel. Hmm
@PeterTamaroff: did you see the justification I gave for the Concrete Mathematics claim?
It is almost as long as the proof I have.
 
9:32 PM
Code Geass =/
 
@N3buchadnezzar ?
 
Anime
 
@N3buchadnezzar Ah, I should have looked first. :-)
 
10:15 PM
@DylanMoreland Hey I saw your comment
 
10:32 PM
@robjohn For the asymptotics of the cotangent, it is enought to use $\cos x \sim 1+o(x)$ and $\sin x \sim x+o(x)$
That makes the proof really straight forward!
 
leo
10:48 PM
hi all
do the eigenspaces in the spectral theorem have dimension 1?
 
@PeterTamaroff are you talking about this question?
 
@PeterTamaroff So tell me how you control the sum of $2^{n-1}-1$ terms with an error of $\frac{z}{2^{n-1}}$?
 
@robjohn What do you mean by "control"?
 
@PeterTamaroff Each of your sandwiched estimates has an error of up to $\frac{z}{2^{n-1}}$ and you are adding up $2^{n-1}-1$ of them
 
10:58 PM
@robjohn So you're saying the error doesn't go away? I'm squeezing, not estimating, aren't I?
 
@PeterTamaroff Your squeezings give you an error that must be controlled. For each $n$, there are $2^{n-1}-1$ terms that you are adding, with errors of $\frac{z}{2^{n-1}}$. That has to be controlled.
 
@robjohn When you say "controlled" you mean "considered" "looked after", or rather "bounded" "estimated"?
 
@PeterTamaroff The Squeeze theorem works for a single limit, but you are adding a lot of them. The number of terms goes up as your squeezing gets tighter.
 
@robjohn Yes, I know.
 
What I'm saying is that your argument needs work.
 
11:03 PM
@robjohn So what would the "issue" if any, be?
@robjohn I'm willing to work on it.
 
@PeterTamaroff Let me work up an example of something that doesn't work. Hang on.
 
@robjohn OK.
 
11:18 PM
For each $n$, say we know that
$$
\frac{1}{k^2}-\frac1n\le a_{n,k}\le\frac{1}{k^2}
$$
So that $\displaystyle\lim_{n\to\infty}a_{n,k}=\frac{1}{k^2}$. Can we say that
$$
\lim_{n\to\infty}\sum_{k=1}^na_{n,k}=\frac{\pi^2}{6}\text{?}
$$
 
@robjohn No, we can say that $$\frac{\pi^2}{6}-1 <\lim\limits_{n \to \infty} \sum a_{n,k} < \frac{\pi^2}{6}$$
 
@PeterTamaroff Yes, now go back and look at your argument to see why you are making the bad claim.
 
@robjohn He, OK. I'll take a look at it!
According to what I've written I have that $$\left| {\frac{z}{{{2^n}}}\left( {\cot \frac{{z + k\pi }}{{{2^n}}} + \cot \frac{{z - k\pi }}{{{2^n}}}} \right) - \frac{{2{z^2}}}{{{z^2} - {k^2}{\pi ^2}}}} \right| < \frac{{\left| z \right|}}{{{2^{n - 1}}}}$$
That is the error.
 
@PeterTamaroff Yes
 
So given any $z$ I can make the error as small as I want by taking $n$ large enough.
 
11:26 PM
No, you've got to sum first, then take limits. Just as in my example above.
 
@robjohn But wait.
I know what you mean
 
The problem is the limit of a sum, not the sum of limits
 
But In fact, $\cot x < 1/x $in say $(0,\pi /2)$ and $ \cot x > 1/x $ in $(-\pi /2,0)$
Can't I get better results using that?
 
Not with the estimate you've given there.
 
I mean the estimate I gave is for $0<x<\pi$
In fact for $-\pi<x<0$ one should use $1/x$ and $1+1/x$
I'll go eat and I'll return to this, OK?
 
11:31 PM
@PeterTamaroff okay I have to run some errands too.
 
11:59 PM
@robjohn Tell me when you're back.
 

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