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00:00
I constantly get emails from people around the globe expecting me to send them solutions just because I should trust them.
I see
Hello
I have often argued with Jasper about this, but one of the main ways I chose textbooks was to look at the exercises. Books with crummy exercises don't impress me.
heya Demonark.
I take great pride in a lot of the exercises I've written (in all my books).
Is there an equation that relates time complexity, space complexity, and entropy of the output of a function? It seems to me that there should be a relatively intuitive relationship between the three, something like $E = f(T + S)$ where $f$ is a linear function or something like that. The main argument being that any function can be written as a hash map that takes its input to its output. This hashmap could be compressed based on its entropy.
I have a hunch that the only way to decrease the space an algorithm uses more than that is to increase the time complexity, as if the hashmap is moved onto a time axis instead of a space one. Is this crazy?
I dunno if we have experts on this sort of thing here, @WilliamOliver.
00:05
I don't know if this is more related to pure mathematics, cs, or physics
Where would I go to find out?
Complexity theory is part of theoretical computer science.
@Dair, who's sometimes here, might have a thought on it.
00:20
@TedShifrin tbh my fav classes have been ones that were majority hw for final grade
unless the probs suck
Of course, @Eric. And that's where you learn a lot struggling with homework. It's not fair to push people that hard on exams.
LOL ... some profs are too lazy to make decent probs. You'll see that more and more in grad school with advanced courses. They don't bother.
i hate exams bc im a sleep deprived man
Well, I needed some exams to test basics ... partly because people cheated/collaborated so much on homework.
@TedShifrin lol my gr class rip
00:23
I took homeworks far more seriously than most faculty I ever had, @Eric. You've seen some of my homeworks, like for the complex geometry course.
yeah i like em
If you don't have problems to chew on you learn nothing IMO. I certainly don't.
A+ from me
I agree, Mike. I tried to explain this to my colleagues but most of them don't care.
That explains why I learn so little.
00:24
@Fargle: It seriously is a big deal. Even the best students don't just learn by magic.
Ugh yeah my functional analysis class had only 5 psets all quarter
So do you agree with us, Demonark?
Yeah I believe in problems
For grad courses, they don't have to be weekly. Every week-and-a-half is fine.
@TedShifrin I don't remember if I told you, but Hempel proved a theorem in his book which includes the s-cobordism theorem, once you know the Poincare conjecture.
00:25
I eventually did fail it due to attendance, but I did like my combinatorics class many years ago. There were a decent number of problems that expanded my thinking quite a lot.
just do all the end book problems in brezis ain’t no thang but a chicken wang
Oh, cool, just for 3-manifolds or in general, @MikeM?
Well, the way it happened. We had weekly psets for the first 4 weeks and then after the midterm we had just one pset
@Fargle: what did you fail?
@Daminark lol good ol charlie
00:26
@TedShifrin The class. Along with every other class that semester.
And then 3 days before the final we got a list of practice problems which our professor meant to assign but forgot about, on spectral measures, Sobolev spaces, and Hille-Yosida
Demonark: One of the most amazing lecturers in the UGA department is terrible about assigning homeworks. When he used my notes for diff geo, he was even too lazy to assign problems enough.
Oh, @Fargle, you mean ages ago.
LOL @ "but forgot about" UGH.
Ream him on evals.
Yeah. I think I was here but new.
And they were so much harder than the problems he had been giving before, could solve maybe one of them
Oh we didn't have evals for that class actually
Generally for grad classes
@Ted He proves that a compact 3-manifold (with no 2-sphere boundary) whose pi_1 contains a surface subgroup of finite index is, in fact, an interval bundle over that surface... Up to possible summands of exotic 3-spheres.
00:28
oh, cool, @MikeM, so you meant for 3-manifolds only./
What happens in dim 4? I assume $\ge 5$ is the usual diff top "easy" case.
Seemed easy to be precise by saying the theorem.
@Erico might do so if only because I wanna revisit Sobolev spaces, though there are other things I wanna do in functional analysis which it doesn't really cover so chances are I'll have a different one as my primary source
Sure. Thanks.
4 is always bad: both for cobordism between 3-manifolds and for cobordism between 4-manifolds.
@Daminark most of the probs in the back of brezis aint sobolev oriented
00:29
Sobolev spaces are so important for geometric analysis.
It's funny how basic a tool they are nowadays.
I also like anisotropic Sobolev spaces.
@Erico rip
im always v enchanted by the idea of sobolev spaces
Reading stuff about the $\bar\partial$-Neumann problem first year of grad school for seminar is where I really started to like analysis.
Ciprian convinced me in a class in my first year.
00:31
I'm trying to remember the authors. Princeton orange.
And yeah the stuff we did with Andre has inspired me to try and give PDEs and diffgeo another shot
@LeakyNun You should !
I loved the bootstrapping arguments.
@KasmirKhaan :P
@LeakyNun but during summer you might enjoy it better, it is snowy and bad weather now ><
00:31
I like snow :P
Demonark: Even the stuff in my notes isn't that horrible, but grad stuff is much fancier.
aha haha
then this is the season for it :D
@MikeMiller Thanks Mike!
The weather is going nuts all over the US. Seattle is having serious snow and ice. My friends there are trying not to get stuck away from home.
Who knew Mike could be nice
@Ted I didn't think the stuff in your notes was too bad, I just felt at the time that I couldn't really figure out how to get a handle on the problems that required geometric intuition
00:32
he removed a mean comment about poor kas
Demonark: They threw way too much at you way too fast without decent presentations/intuition.
poor, poor Kas ...
the bootcamp was a doomed project i agree
So in the psets there were the problems that seemed fun and which I didn't know how to set up, and then there were problems which were "Compute the Christoffel symbol" which I could do but wasn't especially inspired by
Hehe @TedShifrin
Oh, those are definitely not inspiring to anyone, Demonark. But I think I have a lot of interesting problems in there.
But it takes time and a good lecturer too :P
00:34
Sure. I don't think the technical tools of this site should be used to be nasty.
We can do that all by ourselves!
I would have tried to help if you'd asked.
And some of us excel ... @MikeM @Ted.
Oh, interesting, I can't ping myself :P
christoffel symbols are just an important tool that u need to know but thinking in coordinates is generally not the way to go
theyre not for thinking so much as getting into the mud like a pig
well, sometimes you really have to, @Eric. OR in moving frames :D
ya computations are v important
I mean I definitely did ask you guys for certain things, I just felt at some point that I was overdoing things. But in any event I've been a bit reinspired by Neves' brief schtick about Yamabe problem the other day, so at some point I'll try it again, perhaps at a more leisurely pace
00:35
You need Christoffel symbols to do connections, one way or another.
@Ted personally I like being a diff geo pig rolling in the mud
Demonark, as I said, I thought those summer bootcamps should have done 2 topics for the summer, not 4.
@TedShifrin I suggested this multiple times and no one listened lol
LOL ... as you know, Eric, I like computations. And I did tell Rafe some of the stuff you and I worked on.
No one listens to me, either ... sigh
Yeah, tbh I didn't see the point in doing complex analysis there for sure
00:36
@Daminark i said rthis literally so many times to the others
like most of the ppl in the bootcamp literally took two CA classes
It's possible that if we had a smaller group it would've worked out a bit better
meanwhile we literally dont have classes in probability or diff geo offered
But we got slowed down so much, sometimes by lectures that got interrupted to hell, other times by lectures where the lecturer didn't seem to learn the stuff as well as they should have/didn't take it too seriously
More the latter
I wish I had taught probability through my entire career.
lol ur schlag lecture
00:38
Sometimes, it's better to have someone who understands things lecture and give intuition.
Lol I got hijacked hard but tbh that wasn't as bad, I was thinking more the complex analysis lectures
i didnt see any of those ur year
The interruptions on average were more frequent, and sometimes a bit overdone, but again the real problem was that a few people clearly just didn't actually try to prepare
To do it right, preparing should mean giving the lecture ahead to someone like Eric or the prof who understand things and help you put intuition into the lectures.
i think my year functioned the bst of the three bc we had a smaller group and a prof in the room at all times but still i wouldve cut the content in half
00:40
Yeah, most of the courses I taught in my career students complained I went way too fast.
Personally, I don't agree, but I'm just saying ...
Most classes go way too slow.
@TedShifrin I told the students i personally supervised to do this last time through and the ones who listened and gave me their lectures beforehand were the best ones imo
Complex analysis is a damn mess usually.
not to toot my own horn but
00:40
LOL, @Eric, of course IMO. :P
The lecture that Schlag hijacked was one I didn't wanna give since I was hoping to do a diffgeo lecture soon afterwards, only did it because people weren't comfortable with lecturing on manifoldsy content, so I signed up on Wednesday afternoon for the Friday lecture and probably spent nearly 20 hours going through and making sure I had things down
Demonark: That one lecture you did for me on Skype (where I was certainly no expert), it just seemed too technical to me.
I will never understand how the Residue theorem gets weeks upon weeks of discussion.
Maybe weeks of different applications?
So I got mildly annoyed when I saw certain lectures which seemed like people just glanced through the chapter half-assedly
00:42
One of my colleagues taught G&P once and had the students present the lectures. They got through 1/4 of what I covered and the students only learned the stuff they lectured on, nothing else. I think this is a disaster.
@Ted yeah I felt afterwards that people hadn't absorbed much. Now, I think I was going way too fast that time because I was sorta determined to get to the proof of Van der Waeerden within the hour
@TedShifrin I basically think that a lot of the integral discussion could fit into two weeks. Once you have Green's theorem and do a calculation you get the residue theorem and Cauchy's various theorems.
Yeah my complex analysis course was basically "here's what complex numbers are", "here are the C-R equations", and then just RT for the rest of the course.
But most classes seem to cap on residue.
@Daminark he called me a diff geo expert during that lecture and i never felt more like an imposter
00:43
Note: I have experience with quarters.
@MikeM: But the undergrad complex analysis at UGA had mostly weak students in it who knew almost no analysis and minimal vector calc. The grad course is a different story.
I'm thinking undergrad. I think it's pretty sad that people can't do basic vector calculus at that level.
Yeah, when I taught undergrad complex under quarters, I finished with residue theorem and a week of different applications.
The students did not know uniform convergence at all. That's changed since, because we now have a sequences and series course that is a prereq.
@Daminark What you'll see over time is that it's easy to tell when someone has prepared well, but this does not necessarily correlate to either how much material they get to or how many proofs are presented.
Poor @Fargle. I need to brainwash you more and teach you more math :P
00:45
@TedShifrin we have a prereq for complex that includes uniform convergence and in my class first year we STILL didnt use it till 7th week and went through the basics of uniform convergence
it was bad
It correlates to having good intuition for the thing you're talking about, and knowing how to tell a clear story.
And everything is in italics.
@TedShifrin But I need to maintain my veneer of plausible deniability, in case I'm ever expected to know any math!
Of course a big part of good teaching is anticipating where students will have trouble and struggle and trying to head that off.
Oh, true, @Fargle. I withdraw my offer.
But while you had asked maybe one or two notation questions throughout my Skype lecture, I was getting a question every 30 seconds in mine since folk were less familiar with stuff, and as a result I kinda just tripled the speed. I do think I got a bit better at pacing during my probability lecture though
00:46
Demonark: I interrupted more than that :P
Far better to get through less, but make sure your audience understands more.
@Daminark dynamics was also a disaster that year
I often write talks with multiple reasonable stopping points.
@MikeMiller this is a galaxy brain strat
00:46
Teaching and giving seminar talks are almost antipodal skills, I realized in grad school.
So many math faculty don't know the difference.
True.
I'll learn about actual teaching in half a year I guess
a teacher was not born a teacher , he was born a student
Yeah that was quite something. I feel like the book we used just assumed more stuff, also doing hyperbolic dynamics was a bit of a mistake since people weren't too familiar with Riemannian Geo
so if you gonna teach, remember how it were when you were a student
@TedShifrin Comments? notes?
I was at the Notre Dame conference for the last two lectures so I didn't see what happened but I heard the one on Wednesday that week was a disaster, the guy apparently didn't know what he was talking about and he was making jokes more than teaching, and nobody signed up for Friday
00:50
If that did not impress Ted, I donno what will
Ciao
@Mike I'm gonna steal that re stopping points
@Daminark i think the student lecturing thing worked a lot better for the TA cohort for our individual topics bc we were more consistently serious about learning material and had real ass grown ups in the room
Also, have you tried practicing your talks in front of other students (who heckle you with questions)? It's very very difficult to estimate ahead of time how long you'll take, and more importantly how slow you should go. Hint: usually, a lot slower than you think.
By now I have a good feel for timing issues. But only with much much practice and a good dose of failure.
@Jacksoja: I was away from the computer when you uttered your deep words of wisdom. It's sort of interesting — I think I started teaching rather early in life.
@TedShifrin Mike turned me on to a paper of Rafe's w a proof of uniformization through analysis of a curvature PDE that ive been reading for a few days and it is v v v v cool
01:02
@TedShifrin old generation profs and teachers are way better than nowdays imo, I saw your lectures and you make this simpler for the audience, not trying to show them that you know better. also you explain pretty well at the right level so anyone can keep up .
oh, I think Rafe and I might have discussed that stuff at one point.
@TedShifrin am flattered you called those wisdom words :'D
I hope to meet him come March when im whizzing around
Oh, you'd better, Eric. I have a vested interest! FOOD!!
well, and math too.
Food keeps you alive to do math
01:04
math pays bills to let me get food tbh
Me too, Eric. But you may be more talented at math than I was ...
only time will tell if im any good really lol
OK, fair enough. Start by believing in yourself.
i will put in my best effort to do that lol :P
That applies (in some cases vacuously :)) to most people in here.
01:11
why is (0,1) not compact ?
why should it be?
can't we cover it by (-1,5 )
Every cover must have a finite subcover.
So if I give you a particularly mean and pathological cover, and it doesn't have a finite subcover, compactness fails.
Every cover ?
gives the pedagogical gavel to @Fargle
every open covering
01:13
can we do small example ?
In this case, the cover without a finite subcover isn't even that mean.
Agreed.
it might even be, dare i say, nice
jumps in to be the meanie
why would we want to cover (0,1) in a different way ?
01:14
Unlike us
and what would that way be
Sure---$\Bbb R$ is not compact, because I can cover it by $(n - 1, n + 1)$ where $n$ ranges over the integers, and there's no finite subcover---excluding any interval would exclude the integer $n$.
@Jacksoja: The quantifiers in definitions are super important.
I see
Observe that if X is a space, X is an open cover of itself.
01:15
no in practical use, how would one using this defintion of cover
to show something is compact or not ?
Just because that cover has a finite subcover (itself) doesn't mean X is compact.
Too abstract probably.
okay good example Mike
but if we stick to (0,1)
@Jacksoja: Did you go back and look? It says "EVERY open covering ..."
I need to show that there is an open cover ,that does not have a finite subcover?
Correct.
01:17
YES.
I see thanks
Mike's going to kick me out for yelling.
Think about Fargle's example with the real line.
nah just show that it ain't closed and bounded
No, @Ted, I was just going to say you were excited.
01:18
smacks Leaky again
(which one is more pedagogical?)
@TedShifrin hey I thought you're the pedagogical guy
The one the person is using.
LOL, @MikeM, you mean excitable?
leaky that is not the generality i need
for some metric spaces that is enough but not all
He's trying to come to terms with the abstract definition, @Leaky. You're unhelpful, as usual.
01:18
@Jacksoja As usual he knows.
actually I haven't been following the conversation lol
the counter part of this defintion, i cannot show that a set is compact in this way
i'll go on browsing youtube then
because that would mean , i need to prove evry open cover for my set has finite subcover
@Jacksoja: It's worth understanding the logic here. How do you show that the statement "Every person in this room is wearing a red shirt" is false?
01:20
That is a fair bit harder if you're not used to the arguments.
@MikeMiller who knows?
Therein lies the value of Heine-Borel, for example.
The Shadow knows, of course.
@TedShifrin Ah. I should have thought of this avenue.
@MikeM: I do my bit to make everyone a better teacher :P
01:21
okay but at least I understood what it means to be compact
those quantifiers
@TedShifrin 7 billion IQ analogy for understanding the quantifiers o boy
01:35
@TedShifrin Haha, I actually think Daminark is more qualified than I am to make claims about complexity theory (since he is taking a class about it). I'm this awkward blend of software engineering and math. However, cs.stackexchange chat room is probably the best place for a question like that.
@Dair: I figured as much. Maybe ping the guy.
@WilliamOliver Hey, so probably the best place to ask about this is in the cs.stackexchange chat room.
Ok, done.
Thanks, @Dair.
although, I'm not sure there is a single definition for entropy...
@Dair thanks. Specifically shannon entropy
@Dair where is that chat room? I can never find the chat rooms I am looking for
LOL, well done, guys
Looks like it is empty.
Ugh
I'll ask it anyways
@TedShifrin Says the person who couldn't find my github page.
:P
is that about me?
01:41
yes.
:P
chat.stackexchange.com defaults to the math chats, I thought it was the only one.
hell no
you must have been here before for it to default here
I have been here before haha
01:43
lol it doesn't even default to here for me.
I've never tried, so ...
maybe his cookies are more messed up
idt ive ever even been to the list of chats
Ah well, the rest of them are under the "all" tab
honestly, I would look at a comparison between shannon entropy and non-shannon entropy, and try seeing if there is a way to abuse it so there is no relation at all.
but that is a far out there guess.
cya.
What do you mean "abuse it so there is no relation at all"?
02:30
please someone confirm this: derivative of function $f:\Bbb R\to\Bbb R$ can't have jump or removable discontinuities, but partial, or directional derivative of $g:\Bbb R^n\to \Bbb R$ can have jump or removable discontinuities, right?
 
8 hours later…
10:17
@Silent the partial derivative of a function is the derivative of a function $\Bbb R\to \Bbb R$
That is ${\partial g\over\partial x}(a) = \lim_{h\to 0}{g(a+xh)-g(a)\over h}$
10:43
ok, thanks @Astyx, i got my answer, by googling some stuff: which is, if $g:\Bbb R^n\to \Bbb R$ is differentiable everywhere, that is total derivative exists, then no directional derivative of $g$ can have jump discontinuity.
@Astyx That $x$ looks strange. How about ${\partial g\over\partial x}(a) = \lim_{h\to 0}{g(a+h)-g(a)\over h}$
That doesn't mean anything
h is a real number and a a vector
in $\Bbb R \to \Bbb R$?
(WP)
I suggest you are wrong and I am right.
Astyx's is the directional derivative
and when the direction is just along the axis it's the partial derivative
I believe
@Astyx, If you help me with this change of basis question, i will be obliged: Let $B_1=\{(1,2),(2,-1)\}$ and $B_2=\{(1,0),(0,1)\}$ be ordered bases of $R^2$. If $T:R^2\to R^2$ is a linear transformation such that $[T]_{B_1,B_2}$, the matrix of $T$ with respect to $B_1$ and $B_2$ is $\begin{pmatrix}4&3\\ 2&-4\end{pmatrix}$ then , $T(5,5)$ is equal to ....
10:53
OK, so is it supposed to mean something like ${\partial g\over\partial \vec{x}}(a) but what does he then mean by $\Bbb R\to \Bbb R$?
Hi @ÍgjøgnumMeg and all btw.!
I mean $t\mapsto g(a+tx)$ is an $\Bbb R\to \Bbb R$ function when $g:\Bbb R^n\to \Bbb R$
And I also suggest I know what I'm talking about btw
Hi
@Astyx that would make sense, (maybe I should have read how started out).
@Astyx Is it a general statement? ("That doesn't mean anything" was a bit hard to believe).
you can't add a vector and a scalar
10:57
^
I think he means that:
yes
directional derivative
in direction of $v$
using a proper notation to destinguish between vector and scalars seems to help
@Silent You mean that $B_1$ is the basis of the preimage space and $B_2$ the image space ?
If so, you need to write the coordinates of $(5,5)$ on the basis $B_1$
The take the matrix product with the collum you get
And you get the coordinates of the image on the basis $B_2$
@Astyx hmm! I don't know! I thought in terms of both $B_1$ image and preimage. Answer is $(15,2)$, by the way.
@Astyx So, coordinates are $(6,2)$ wrt B_1
oh!
thanks!!!
@Astyx, is it convention to think $[T]_{XY}$ that $X$ is preimage basis and $Y$ is image basis, right?
11:10
Yes
thank you!
11:24
I've been writing too many proofs. I've begun using "thus" in regular conversation.
12:10
@Silent It depends on the author though
It's either one or the other though
yeah :) I saw that in linear algebra done wrong, it is other way around.
 
2 hours later…
13:58
@Rithaniel Things will be much worse in due time. Your language will undergo highly nontrivial deformations with probability measure 1.
 
2 hours later…
16:26
Let mu and nu be sigma finite measures on (X,sigma) such that mu >> nu. from Radon-Nikodym theorem we know that there exists extended integrable function f such that d nu = int f dmu. my question is: assuming mu and nu are both positive measure does the function f have to be also non-negative function?
It has to be nonnegative $\mu$-almost everywhere I'd say
why?
If it is negative on $A\subseteq X$ with $\mu(A)>0$ then $\nu(A)=\int_Af\mathrm{d}\mu$ is problematic
but f can be negative with int f dmu > 0 no?
even though mu is positive measure
Not if $f$ is negative everywhere on $A$
16:32
true but what if it's positive more than it's negative , for example the function f(x) = x on [-0.5,1]
it's integral is positive with respect to lebesgue measure but it's not a non-negative function
Sure but you're not taking integrals on $X$ only, you're taking integrals on every measurable subset of $X$
It's enough for $\nu(A)=\int_Af\mathrm{d}\mu$ to fail on some set $A$
So what you're saying it that if it's not completely non-negative then there is a set where it's integral is negative
makes sense, thanks
It can be negative, but on a measure zero set
If it is negative on a positive measure set then it will also have negative integral on that set
cool cool
16:58
Could someone help me with the following definition: A bipartite graph G with vertex partition L, R where |L| <= |R|
is degree-constrained if deg(l) >= deg(r) for every "l" belongs to L and "r" to R.

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