Mathematics - 2015-08-06 (page 4 of 5)

Huy

15:00

@BalarkaSen: I know that's only "true" locally, but I don't really know a better way to think of it globally.

Bob

Oh, look, more flagspam.

I honestly think flag abuse should be bannable (at least from using flags, if not chat as a whole). Shows a rather low level of maturity, and is quite disruptive too.

ToolPurger

I flagged borderline bullying.

GnomeSlice

I understand that, but it's been and gone man.

Like it's one thing if it's happening right now.

But flagging from the transcript doesn't help anything.

ToolPurger

Doesn't matter, 5 people took a clear side over someone trying to help.

Bob

Have you considered talking it out, rather than resorting to a network-wide flag?

ToolPurger

15:04

It can't be nice for that person to see a highly starred post about them in that tone. Hence flagging, get it removed.

It's too late for the posters to delete it themselves.

RegDwigнt

@ToolPurger yeah no shit. Guess that never happened before today.

GnomeSlice

I didn't realize it was starred.

That didn't show up in the popup.

ToolPurger

They've got quite a few stars @GnomeSlice

GnomeSlice

So I see...

ಠ_ಠ

ToolPurger

Hence "borderline bullying"

1v1 is fine, 1v6 isn't (1 person + 5 starrers)

RegDwigнt

15:06

Yeah unless that 1 is me.

Then it's a-okay with Tool.

Huy

How's any of the starred messages borderline bullying? None of it was intended, or received as bullying.

RegDwigнt

Double standard much.

Bob

Ways to unstar: ask a room-owner or mod to unstar. Ways to delete: ask a mod. Chat-flag... alerts a lot of people (not to mention involves an implicit suspension, which may not necessarily be warranted).

GnomeSlice

You could do a mod flag on it.

ToolPurger

@RegDwigнt it was well natured earlier.

GnomeSlice

15:06

For some reason it won't let me do that though, on that message.

RegDwigнt

@ToolPurger yes, yes. I did say "double standards".

ToolPurger

"Amateur bichslapper" isn't really an insult.

Daniel Fischer

@GnomeSlice Which message?

GnomeSlice

2 hours ago, by Huy

@AlecTeal: I wouldn't be laughing. In fact I'm not even laughing right now. It makes me sad that you are so full of yourself and don't realize it.

ToolPurger

chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/23256030#23256030 and chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/23255965#23255965

Daniel Fischer

15:07

@ToolPurger I would say 99,9 times out of 10 it is.

GnomeSlice

That's pretty rude.

ToolPurger

You should really read the context of that.

Huy

@ToolPurger: Dude, this is like your first day here. YOU don't even understand the context of it.

ToolPurger

You going to pick me now @Huy

Context:

chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/23251132#23251132 and onwards

skill patrol

@ToolPurger pal let it go please?

Huy

15:09

@ToolPurger: It had nothing to do with that, but great if you prove to all of us that you don't know what it was about.

ToolPurger

@Huy it did

Read the log from the marked position.

GnomeSlice

Passive-aggressive stars aren't constructive guys.

If you have something to say, say it, don't hide behind a star.

Grace Note

I think as the person who actually said the line, that @Huy probably knows what actually the line had to do with anything.

Huy

I can search what it had to do with, give me a second.

GnomeSlice

On an unrelated note, check out my new avatar

GnomeSlice, Ottawa, Canada

14.5k 16 67 162

RegDwigнt

15:10

I really think we should talk about grant proposals more.

GnomeSlice

Guess what I've been watching

ToolPurger

@Huy read the log

RegDwigнt

In fact I shall read at least seven on my commute home.

Have fun!

ToolPurger

So can we get those comments removed now?

Huy

@ToolPurger: chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/23096565#23096565

skill patrol

15:11

@ToolPurger we can live without this kind of reliving of the past, no?

Huy

@ToolPurger: He was so convinced of himself and stated "I'm rarely wrong" even though here in chat and on main he is OFTEN wrong. Being wrong is nothing to be ashamed of, but not realizing it is a bad thing, especially in mathematics.

ToolPurger

@Huy if this was the first instance you guys find of him being wrong.... that sounds pretty good.

In any case pointing out someone was wrong does not require such zeal.

skill patrol

@ToolPurger I am the one who was the FIRST to warn him not to say it

4 mins ago, by skill patrol

@ToolPurger pal let it go please?

ToolPurger

@skillpatrol when I linked your comment that's because it was the start of the logs in an earlier complaint, it wasn't specifically to your comment

Huy

@ToolPurger: If you insist I can give you a list of more than 20 occurences where he is/has been wrong, but I'd much rather do some maths today instead of waste my time to prove my point to someone who's desperately trying to defend his friend.

Grace Note

15:13

I think more people are interested that we let this go than we continue onwards in something that is drastically sliding away from productive.

4

ToolPurger

@Huy I would side with anyone who was being bullied.

skill patrol

^

Associated with Math.SE; for both general discussion & math questions alike. Just ask; don't ask to ask.

Huy

@ToolPurger: I don't think it is bullying if person A says "I'm rarely wrong" and "show me where I've been wrong" and at some time later, when person A is wrong, person B says "look, you're wrong" and person C points out that person A is too full of himself. That's my last message on the subject. If he was really offended by it, he could have told me, instead he mocked my message " Careful with the stars guys, you might hurt my feelings", so I figured he didn't care for it anyways.

ToolPurger

@Huy if that is your way of telling someone they're wrong, you need to work on your social skills.

Bob

@ToolPurger If your way of dealing with it is by immediately flagging, well, that's hardly ideal either is it?

Fargle

15:17

Maybe what he said was rude, but I don't think anyone in this chat room besides the mods have the job of being the tone police.

ToolPurger

@Huy regarding the second sentence, what if he was hurt and didn't want to admit it because? Would you want to when 6 people pounce so quickly on something so small? Or would you rather try and play it down?

Empathy is useful.

skill patrol

@ToolPurger You've only been a "Member for 21 days" take some time to watch and LEARN.

ToolPurger

@Bob it was too late for the OP to delete it, so only hope was moderator attention. Which is what flags do.

Bob

@ToolPurger Flagging for mod attention does that. Flagging as spam/offensive does far more.

ToolPurger

@skillpatrol if to fit in here I have to jump on that bandwagon, I shall never fit in.

Fargle

15:18

@ToolPurger: "so quickly", you mean over the course of an hour?

Why is this still being discussed? It's done with. Everybody here has the capacity to take lessons from this, and could do with some humility and grace.

ToolPurger

@Bob if you click this link you'll see there's only one flag button:

4 hours ago, by Matt E. Эллен

Please stop flagging things for no reason. If you are feeling angry now, maybe step away from the chat room

There's no reply/star/flag thing like there is here.

Grace Note

Click on the left side, you have the option to flag as a moderator instead of flagging as spam/offensive.

ToolPurger

All I can see is:
reply to this message
star as interesting
flag as spam/offensive

Bob

@ToolPurger Point taken (I've never tried from the transcript).

ToolPurger

(changes will not show until you reload)
permalink | history

*nod of respect in @Bob's direction <---serious

Fargle

15:20

This is what you should see. i.imgur.com/WdlJIBw.png

Bob

Still, keep in mind that spam-flag does more than what you might expect at first. The chat flag system is commonly considered broken.

skill patrol

@ToolPurger you need more rep pal

ToolPurger

@Fargle that's what I see here, I also see some buttons on the right - but not on the transcript page.

evinda

Hello!!! How is it going?

Grace Note

@skillpatrol Actually I can't even flag for mods from the transcript

ToolPurger

15:22

You are one.

Fargle

Well, the chat has been devolving a bit, but other than that, quite fine, @evinda. Yourself?

skill patrol

@GraceNote Orly?

Grace Note

Possibly in part because the whole idea is that if it's ancient you really shouldn't be flagging it unless absolutely necessary (hence why spam/offensive is still available).

Ted Shifrin

@Fargle!

skill patrol

Hi Professor @TedShifrin

Fargle

15:23

@Ted! Ignore my last question, I figured out that problem.

Ted Shifrin

Hi skull!

evinda

Why is it devolving? @Fargle
I am quite fine too, thank you :)

Fargle

I kept trying to use the constancy of $\tau/\kappa$ rather than working from the definition of a generalized helix.

Ted Shifrin

I meant usual helix, Fargle, but I wonder if it holds for generalized. Dud you investigate?

columbus8myhw

Hey guys I want to ask a ton of questions so I can mine upvotes and reputation but I can't think of any questions to post halp

skill patrol

15:24

Do you @ToolPurger have a math question for the good Professor?

ToolPurger

I'm okay thanks.

skill patrol

lol

Ted Shifrin

Guten Tag, @evinda.

Fargle

@TedShifrin Yes, I did--it is true in general. Differentiate $\beta(s) = \alpha(s) - sT(s)$, take the dot product of both sides by $A$. Then all the tangent vectors to $\beta$ must be perpendicular to $A$, meaning it necessarily lies in a plane.

evinda

Guten Tag @TedShifrin
Wie geht es Ihnen?

Ted Shifrin

15:25

Ganz gut, danke, und Ihnen?

Fargle

(Where $A$ is the vector such that $T \cdot A$ is constant, from the definition of a gen. helix.)

Ted Shifrin

Good job, Fargle.

evinda

Mir auch :) @TedShifrin
Sind Sie umgezogen?

Ted Shifrin

Jawohl!

Fargle

@evinda Why? I don't know. How? Lots of passive-aggression and retroactive tone policing. It seems everyone's calmed down for now, though.

Mike Miller

15:27

morning

Huy

@ToolPurger: Just so you get an answer to your questions: There's a difference between being wrong and able to admit and learn from it, and being wrong and yet always thinking to be right. You've missed a lot of context. Don't try suggesting a different "social approach" of mine if you have no idea how people tried to socially interact with Alec before.

@ToolPurger: For instance, there was a 7th grader here yesterday asking questions, and when he didn't understand some of Alec's statements and asked "sorry I don't understand, can you explain further?", Alec would respond "good luck then". It was pointed out to him that he shouldn't be so mean to the kid, but he never cared to apologize or show regret.

columbus8myhw

@MikeMiller What about it

evinda

Und gefällt Ihnen der neue Wohnsitz? @TedShifrin

columbus8myhw

:P

evinda

@Fargle Aha...

ToolPurger

15:28

That doesn't sound too mean @Huy

Good luck and all? Do you have a link to the transcript?

Huy

@ToolPurger: You should work on your social skills then. ;-)

ToolPurger

No seriously.

Ted Shifrin

Goodnight @MikeM

ToolPurger

If not being able to help someone and saying "Good luck in that case" or "good luck then" I've p!ssed off a lot of people.

Huy

@ToolPurger: chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/23229045#23229045

Daniel Fischer

15:30

Happy mid-day @Mike.

Fargle

@ToolPurger Why not? It's not like he was asking about homework. If someone asked you to explain something further, would you explain it further, or simply stop? Whether the manner in which he stopped had a nicely toned phrase in it or not, that sort of refusal to help someone understand what you've told them is rude.

Daniel Fischer

Greetings @Ted.

Ted Shifrin

I can confirm that Alec is often a rude, arrogant twit :)

3

Huy

@ToolPurger: It wasn't "not being able to help". It was "I'm way to smart to help this stupid kid so I'll just stop helping at all".

Mike Miller

@DanielF: Do you have a way to contact you offsite, eg an email, that you're willing to share?

Ted Shifrin

15:31

Sicher, evinda, und danke noch einmal :)

ToolPurger

Going further with this means I'll be playing devils advocate, give me a moment to read.

Ted Shifrin

He threw some homophobic crap at me once, too.

Huy

@TedShifrin: Earlier this day I pointed out that he's too full of himself and (obviously) the message got on the star board. Suddenly his friend comes here and complains how we have been bullying poor Alec and demands the stars to be removed.

evinda

Gut!!! :) @TedShifrin

ccorn

I hate it when the origins of a system of equations are disguised

Mike Miller

15:32

@Ted: There's a question about the Chern class of a blowup on main. You should be able to give him a suitable reference.

here

Daniel Fischer

@MikeMiller Not particularly. What is it about? Moderatory things? Mathematics?

ToolPurger

Nice one @Huy - you still got a dig in there.

Anyway Alec mentions prime numbers there, could be his mistake in thinking of en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermat%27s_little_theorem and assuming it was homework using it? He did do an explicit computation?

I dunno, maybe he didn't want to commit to helping him through it, just give a hint? (Like a lot of comments on this site might I add)

Fargle

I stand corrected asserting for a fact that it wasn't homework. It's possible that it was. But at no point did he give a reason like that for a refusal to help.

ToolPurger

He did say "good luck then [in that case]"

Ted Shifrin

Methinks Tool is Alec.

Huy

15:35

+1.

ToolPurger

I don't know what to say to that.

5 mins ago, by ToolPurger

Going further with this means I'll be playing devils advocate, give me a moment to read.

Fargle

How many more instances of this air of superiority that he projects do you want to semantically argue away? I'm sure @Huy can pick out other examples.

Huy

I'd really rather study maths and then make some dinner, if that's also alright.

ToolPurger

As I said I'm playing Devil's advocate... that means I am deliberately going against you guys to play the other side.

Huy

I think we can all agree this discussion is pointless to continue.

ToolPurger

15:37

Good luck with your dinner @Huy ;-)

Huy

Thanks @ToolPurger ;-)

Ted Shifrin

@MikeM: G&H is a standard reference. Many years ago, Robin Hartshorne left me a note with a reference on the general case, but that, along with most everything in my office, got thrown out. I'll see if I can google-find it.

Fargle

Totally fine, @Huy. I was just noting that anything that can be shot down can be met with another example. As to you, @Tool, why play Devil's advocate about this?

Ted Shifrin

Ah, @MikeM, it's in a paper of Porteous. I should have remembered that, since I've referenced him a lot.

ToolPurger

Don't worry about it @Fargle

skill patrol

15:40

Did you get time to watch the moore vid Professor @TedShifrin

Ted Shifrin

LOL, skull. I've been a little busy.

skill patrol

np

perhaps later

ToolPurger

I'll assume from the smiling face that the new comment is banter among friends. Just keep the bullying talk in mind you lot.

skill patrol

hi @robjohn have you talked chris's in the last 24 hours?

Ted Shifrin

@robjohn !!!

ToolPurger

15:43

I will go and fish for a question I can answer - before someone else answers it.

skill patrol

good luck pal

Ted Shifrin

skull, I don't have the patience to teach Moore method, and I'm always trying to give students an intuition and a feeling for scope, but I do like socratic teaching and in office hours I get as close to Moore as I can.

skill patrol

I see

interesting mix

thanks for replying :-)

Random Variable

@DanielFischer I undeleted that answer I said I deleted the other day. You didn't see much of a connection to Parseval's/Plancherel's theorem, and I couldn't really explain any connection. I'm stupid for deleting it in the first place.

Fargle

@Ted: "Show that the involute of a catenary is a tractrix." I can do it, but this makes me dizzy.

Ted Shifrin

15:52

I think there are more interesting exercises for you, @Fargle. Move on :)

Fargle

Like what?

Ted Shifrin

You should do some computational stuff to get a feel for things, but you're probably more interested in the conceptual problems.

Fargle

Yes, indeed.

Ted Shifrin

#19 is interesting, partly for the logic of part b, which always troubles students. 20, 21, 24 are cool. But 26, 27 I find super interesting.

Fargle

Ooh, 19 does look interesting.

Ted Shifrin

15:55

And this relates interestingly to the Bishop frame, which is an exercise in section 3.

skill patrol

I was kinda surprised to not find Moore's name in the Encyclopedia Britannica? Considering his reputation for PhD students? @TedShifrin

Ted Shifrin

Dunno, skull. He worked mostly in point-set topology and was far from a super star, albeit influential in his own way.

skill patrol

Did you ever meet him?

Ted Shifrin

Nope.

Pedro Tamaroff

16:14

@AlecTeal I am a very irresponsible person.

@TedShifrin I never understood how to work out the bicycle problem.

Fargle

The bicycle problem is hurting my head a bit, too.

Semiclassical

morning @ted

skill patrol

16:30

How are the Computer Science Elections going @GraceNote?

Grace Note

Let's see...

The Q&A is flooded, I can say that much from my inbox already

Only two candidates so far though. That's not too shiny

Huy

Man, I've been too distracted today. Remind me to stay off this chat if I'm not discussing maths tomorrow, @skullpatrol.

skill patrol

@Huy ok pal

robjohn

17:07

@skillpatrol I haven't. Did anything happen yesterday?

@TedShifrin are you hailing from northern or southern California?

skill patrol

@robjohn she got a 3 hour suspension.

robjohn

@skillpatrol Ah, perhaps that is why she is not here today.

skill patrol

@robjohn and the whole room was frozen for about half and hour

Alec Teal

@DanielFischer what?

robjohn

@skillpatrol just this room?

skill patrol

17:09

@robjohn yes

Daniel Fischer

@AlecTeal What what?

skill patrol

Oh, I forgot...another one of the created rooms too. @robjohn

Alec Teal

57 mins ago, by Pedro Tamaroff

@AlecTeal I am a very irresponsible person.

skill patrol

This room @robjohn

Daniel Fischer

@AlecTeal Jesting? skull hasn't been suspended for over a year. At least not as skull, maybe as skill?

Alec Teal

17:14

??

skill patrol

@AlecTeal what part of "by Pedro Tamaroff" don't you understand pal :-)

Mike Miller

@DanielFischer No worries then, nothing important.

Alec Teal

No I mean when he said that (@ me) what was he talking about?

Did I ask?

I'm confused.

Mike Miller

@Ted: Thanks. I see you posted a comment which was all I was looking for.

Daniel Fischer

@AlecTeal There is a link to the message from you he responded to.

Alec Teal

17:15

Yeah .... or you could tell me?

Daniel Fischer

13 hours ago, by Alec Teal

@PedroTamaroff why are you suspending @skullpatrol

skill patrol

1 min ago, by skill patrol

@AlecTeal what part of "by Pedro Tamaroff" don't you understand pal :-)

4 mins ago, by Alec Teal

57 mins ago, by Pedro Tamaroff

@AlecTeal I am a very irresponsible person.

Alec Teal

@skillpatrol you're making it worse!

@DanielFischer ah..... that doesn't help.

Daniel Fischer

@AlecTeal Why not?

Alec Teal

@DanielFischer take it seriously please.

Daniel Fischer

17:19

@AlecTeal I do, but you're not making much sense, not saying what you're talking about.

skill patrol

@AlecTeal he did it again you know

when they suspended chris's sis

Alec Teal

Why?

ccorn

yawns This is so... meta here

skill patrol

being rude

Alec Teal

You can't have too many integrals on a math site!

Daniel Fischer

17:21

Sure you can.

Needs quite a few, but definitely possible.

Alec Teal

kk thanks for your input Daniel

What did he say Skill?

skill patrol

it started out as condescending and got ugly fast

Alec Teal

Was Huy involved?

skill patrol

no

he tried to break it up

Alec Teal

Balakararreasaakala sen?

skill patrol

17:23

nope

not at all

Alec Teal

Oh really, who was involved?

Daniel Fischer

Who cares? Let bygones be bygones.

Jus fuhgeddaboutit

Alec Teal

Given the amount of comments of mine that go missing (thanks, really) @DanielFischer - sure.

skill patrol

The König has spoken.

:X

Daniel Fischer

@AlecTeal ?

Alec Teal

17:26

@DanielFischer a lot of my comments vanish, which I figure is you and it's probably for the best.

skill patrol

You should be thankful pal

Daniel Fischer

@AlecTeal Why and how do you figure it's me? We have a few more moderators. I certainly have deleted some of your comments when they have been flagged, but I'd be very surprised if a lot haven't been deleted by other moderators.

Ted Shifrin

@robjohn: I hail from Berkeley, but I now live in San Diego :)

heya @DanielF

skill patrol

wb

Daniel Fischer

@TedShifrin Bonjour.

Ted Shifrin

17:28

Only here for a moment, @skull.

Fargle

@TedShifrin Berkeley's where I want to go for grad school. Is the town cool?

Mike Miller

@Ted: You should make that reference comment an answer.

ccorn

Now for something completely different: Compute $\binom{2^{32}-1}{2^{31}} \bmod{p}$ where $p = 3\cdot2^{29}+5$, efficiently. Unfortunately, all that I can come up with uses at least $\operatorname{O}(p)$ multiplications and divisions. The shortcuts by Granville et al only help for powers of small $p$.

Ted Shifrin

@MikeM: Not really. I should work it out for him (at least in sketch) if it's going to be an answer.

Alec Teal

@DanielFischer to whomever it concerns, I am grateful

Mike Miller

17:29

@Ted: That's usually my policy, but in practice this means questions never have an answer.

Daniel Fischer

@AlecTeal Okay.

Mike Miller

Pseudodifferential operators are silly.

Ted Shifrin

No they're not, @MikeM.

They're a very elegant idea.

Remember me

Hello @Alec @Ted

skill patrol

@MikeMiller don't let @robjohn see that

Ted Shifrin

17:30

Yes, @Fargle, although it's changed a lot over the years. I'll be up there in a month or so, though.

Mike Miller

@Ted: I know that. :)

Alec Teal

Hey @Rememberme

Done any spuds today?

Ted Shifrin

hi @Remember

Remember me

Spuds? @Alec

Fargle

Neato. If I get my act together, I can hopefully go there. Supposed to be one of the best math graduate programs in the country.

Alec Teal

17:31

They're like small potatoes

Remember me

Wait did I miss something today here ??

Ted Shifrin

@Pedro @Fargle: The bicycle problem is cute. You end up with a differential equation that cannot ordinarily be integrated in closed form. I have a nice Mathematica program that draws it all for any given original $\kappa$ function.

Yes, @Fargle. There are plenty of others, ones which will give you more financial support. You and your adviser (and we) can discuss this in a few years :)

Fargle

Sorta, @Remember. You missed a lot of pointless bickering, and then bickering about bickering.

Ted Shifrin

@Fargle: I'm too old and cranky for all this bickering.

4

Well, I need to get going. I have a futon to go buy.

Fargle

@TedShifrin I'm too young and idealistic for it.

Mike Miller

17:33

I find it funny how hard it is to prove absolutely basic facts.

Ted Shifrin

LOL ... keep it up, @Fargle. And keep me posted on the interesting problems.

Mike Miller

That's all.

Ted Shifrin

Try to prove $1/2$ isn't an integer, @MikeM :P

Fargle

I'll do my best. I want to break into the curve theory section!

Ted Shifrin

Surfaces get even more interesting, @Fargle ...

Fargle

17:34

Oh dear.

Remember me

I haven't been here coz of some nice physics questions and a bit if topology.. So I am have no idea about the so-called bickering

Ted Shifrin

Until later !

Fargle

@Rememberme Probably best.

Remember me

Hey @Fargle what have you been thinking today

Khallil

Later, @Ted! (Good to see you online again!)

Fargle

17:37

Mostly differential geometry, courtesy of @Ted. I think soon I'm going to hit Dummit-Foote and delve further into field/Galois theory.

Remember me

Hey@Khalil

Khallil

Yo! ^_^

How's it going?

skill patrol

Hi pal

Remember me

@Fargle I am huge fan of Galois theory after the analogy between it and covering spaces

Fargle

Yeah, Balarka mentioned that earlier. It seems really clever. Grothendieck was The Man.

GnomeSlice

17:43

Whoops.

Wrong room.

Remember me

True ....
Alexandra the great

skill patrol

Your new avatar is visible @GnomeSlice

GnomeSlice

I probably won't keep it for long.

I'm just obsessed with Robotech at the moment

skill patrol

what's the value of the @RandomVariable today?

Khallil

Is it an old anime, @GnomeSlice?

Hey @skill!

skill patrol

17:49

@Khallil hi

GnomeSlice

@Khallil Fairly, yeah.

I don't even watch anime, this is the first one I've ever watched

Robotech

Robotech is a science fiction franchise. The franchise began with an 85-episode science fiction anime TV series adaptation produced by Harmony Gold USA in association with Tatsunoko Production Co., Ltd. and first released in the United States in 1985. It was adapted from three original Japanese television series. In the series, Robotechnology refers to the scientific advances discovered in an alien starship that crashed on a South Pacific island. With this technology, Earth developed robotic technologies, such as transformable mecha, to fight three successive extraterrestrial invasions. ��2�...

Khallil

I'm a big fan of the old anime style.

Mike Miller

@Fargle: Grothendieck did not invent that analogy. It's as old as covering spaces, which are about as old as topology.

GnomeSlice

Breetai vs. Rick Hunter

►

Green guy is the guy in my avatar.

Fargle

@MikeMiller Yeah, I meant its formalization, but even that is me talking out of my rear about things I don't understand yet.

Khallil

17:51

If you like that, you may like ZOIDS, @GnomeSlice.

It's a mecha with a similar feel. One of my favourites!

GnomeSlice

heh, zoids was on when I was a kid

Khallil

The same for me! I'm guessing you've just entered your 20s, @GnomeSlice?

GnomeSlice

23

robjohn

@TedShifrin did you pass through LA on your way north?

Mike Miller

@Fargle: No, that's still just as old. Grothendieck's invention was going back the other way again, and using the idea of covering spaces to develop a notion of fundamental group for schemes (an algebro-geometric object).

Fargle

17:53

Ahhhh.

Khallil

I'm of a similar age, @GnomeSlice!

skill patrol

@robjohn He's still in San Diego

robjohn

@skillpatrol He just said he was hailing from Berkeley...

skill patrol

@robjohn He's hails from

robjohn

@MikeMiller :-p

@skillpatrol ?

skill patrol

17:57

@robjohn I hail from Berkeley, but I now live in San Diego

robjohn

@skillpatrol Yes, his home is in San Diego, but he is now in Berkeley.

Mike Miller

@robjohn: I can like silly things!

robjohn

@MikeMiller it's not silly!

skill patrol

@robjohn "I hail from Berkeley," to me, doesn't mean "I'm hailing to you from Berkeley."

32 mins ago, by Ted Shifrin

@robjohn: I hail from Berkeley, but I now live in San Diego :)

Mike Miller

@robjohn So you claim...

@robjohn: Is that what you worked on back in the day? I don't think I ever asked what you did thesis work on.

skill patrol

18:03

drum roll...

robjohn

@MikeMiller Yes, I worked on pseudo-differential operators in grad school and gave a talk at UCLA about them.

skill patrol

and I almost got suspended for telling him the prefix "pseudo" doesn't belong in math :P

Mike Miller

@robjohn I think I missed that one :)

robjohn

@skillpatrol I doubt that, unless you were being extremely obnoxious about it.

Mike Miller

I care about them in the context of elliptic PDE. Some stuff, like how the symbol of a PDO changes under a change of coordinates, just seems disproportionately hard compared to the statement :)

@skull: Of course, pseudodifferential operators lie firmly in the realm of pseudomathematics.

skill patrol

18:14

@robjohn I'm exaggerating.

PVAL

@MikeMiller Where do pseudoholomorphic curves lie?

robjohn

May 14 '12 at 13:25, by skullpatrol

@robjohn I object to the use of the prefix pseudo- (from Greek ψευδής "lying, false") in math because it is used to mark something as false, fraudulent, or pretending to be something it is not.

Mike Miller

@PVAL: Pseudomathematics is the study of mathematical objects whose names start with "pseudo".

Semiclassical

eh, basing arguments on the greek roots of words is a bit troublesome to me

PVAL

I hope the pun "lie" was intentional.

Mike Miller

18:19

@PVAL: I wonder if we can popularize the term "analytic topologist". This seems like a reasonable name for some who uses gauge theory or pseudo holomorphic curve theory to do topology.

Also more evocative for someone who doesn't know the term "gauge theory".

skill patrol

@Semiclassical how so?

Semiclassical

it doesn't capture the way meanings drift and change over time. language isn't static, even though its history certainly is.

skill patrol

true

PVAL

@MikeMiller If you want to be inclusive, just call them people who study things named after Witten.

Semiclassical

post-Witten mathematics?

Huy

18:25

Witty.

Mike Miller

@PVAL: You exclude the instantonners.

Richard

@Huy - I assumed he was going to call them half-wittens.

PVAL

@MikeMiller As far as I understand (which is close to nil) SW theory subsumes the invariants related to instatons.

Fargle

@Richard Booooooooooo!

PVAL

At least say for smooth structures in 4 dimensions

Mike Miller

18:35

@PVAL: There are some things that we don't know how to do without instantons. My friend Chris Scaduto just wrote a thesis on them.

skill patrol

Semiclassical

@MikeMiller: what kind've stuff, if the answer is something that can be said with reasonable brevity?

(looking at his paper on arxiv i'm guessing the latter condition isn't satisfied, but just in case...)

PVAL

@MikeMiller I wouldn't be surprised if that is still considered SW theory (at least to some). I don't enough about instatons to say what we can or can't do with them, I just thought that stuff fits under the large umbrella that is SW- theory.

Mike Miller

Maybe. I think Ciprian would just call it gauge theory.

But this is of course not an exciting point. I just like the sound of "analytic topology".

Semiclassical

now you just need some way of turning that into "holomorphic topology" (kidding, of course)

PVAL

18:52

There are also people who do (or did) this kind of stuff that say that they study "geometric PDE's" and there are others who call themselves "differential geometers" and others just call themselves "topologists".

Mike Miller

@Semiclassical: Under very general conditions I don't understand, there should be a spectral sequence from a Floer theory to a version of Khovanov homology. (Just think of this as "there should be a relationship between...") Up until now all results have been done with $\Bbb Z/2$ coefficients. Chris was able to show this with $\Bbb Z$ coefficients in the case of instanton Floer, the first result of this type, as far as I know.

@PVAL: That's why it's up to us to make it hip.

skill patrol

I think Ted calls himself a "differential geometer"

Semiclassical

i definitely don't follow that (I've heard the words floer/khovanov, but never studied that). but i also don't see where the point re: "stuff we can't do without instantons" comes in

Transcript for

$Mathematics$ Mathematics