The Bridge

C. Ross

20:00

boo, who requested it go away?

Downvoter

ejem, what happened to "i hate list of x questions" mr @IvoFlipse

Downvoter

15

A: Good typing games

The typing of the dead From Wikipedia: The Typing of the Dead has been described variously as a remake or mod of the original House of the Dead 2. Like the original, Typing of the Dead is styled as a first-person rail shooter game, but substitutes shooting zombies and other ene...

C. Ross

Ivo, I am ashamed ;-)

Ivo Flipse

I voted to close it

and if your memory serves you right @JuanManuel, you can see I requested my own closed list question deleted

and that answer was given on launch day :P

Downvoter

:)

antony.trupe

20:03

off-topic

Ivo Flipse

oh and you should blame Juan for the close votes :P

while were starting a flame war here

Downvoter

lol

Ivo Flipse

move that new question to Meta

and then it's probably a dupe of the discussion there

the only (bad) argument I could give for leaving the typing question open

is that it gives me 170 rep, which I probably need to vote to close

Arda Xi

noo

why'd you have to close that question

I had a great answer typed out

Ivo Flipse

so either I need to step up on voting, rather than chatting

Downvoter

20:05

which one?

Arda Xi

the law one

Ivo Flipse

lol was that pun intented @ArdaXi? typed out an answer to the typing question?

Arda Xi

answered it at meta

Ivo Flipse

ah the law one, that one belongs on Meta

Arda Xi

no, the law question

Ivo Flipse

20:06

but the feed just showed a new spawn on the parent

Arda Xi

I answered it on meta now

I thought it was just closed

Ivo Flipse

(Y)

Arda Xi

didn't see it was migrated

Ivo Flipse

hehe

Arda Xi

if you're answering a question and it's closed you see a bar 'this question will no longer accept answers'

Noctrine

20:07

Don't understand why emulators are that big a deal to people

on meta

Arda Xi

well, ROMs are illegal, hence unwanted

Noctrine

I mean, the people who keep arguing that they should be included

Arda Xi

ah

Ivo Flipse

it's simple @Noctrine: we shouldn't be allowing grey area questions, because they lead to darker shades of grey and eventually lead us into darkness

Arda Xi

Shouldn't this answer be deleted? @JuanManuel ?

gaming.stackexchange.com/questions/458/…

alexanderpas

20:12

I love living in a country where downloading copyrighted content is legal ;)

Arda Xi

which is which?

in the netherlands it actually isn't legal to download software

Downvoter

should I delete the whole question @ArdaXi?

antony.trupe

flagged the answer

Arda Xi

might be a good idea

Noctrine

May be good to have something that people can see is closed

Arda Xi

20:13

@antonytrupe flagging doesn't really have much use if a mod is already looking at it lol

Noctrine

when they start typing

Where can I download X

antony.trupe

oh, I didn't see Juan

Arda Xi

it actually doesn't show up for that title

Downvoter

"Where can I download Alien Swarm" is a valid question :)

Arda Xi

that too

Downvoter

20:14

question deleted

Ivo Flipse

yeah delete it @JuanManuel, we just need the FAQ saying it

Arda Xi

might get gietzen some rep back if it's ever resynced too

hmm, suddenly a lot of questions with 3 close votes

alexanderpas

the question seemed valid, only the answer was bad in my opinion.

Ivo Flipse

and @alexanderpas it's not legal to use software where you have no license to, which excludes nearly all games or paid software (where you need to buy the license)

Arda Xi

@IvoFlipse but you can't download software you have a licence to either

you can only make a backup copy yourself for personal use only

alexanderpas

20:18

@Arda actually you can, if the licence allows you to make an archival copy ;)

Arda Xi

iusmentis.com/auteursrecht/nl/thuiskopie (Dutch)

No, @alexanderpas that's the difference between download and make

you can't download, you can only make

"De kopie moet door de rechtmatige verkrijger gemaakt worden."

Ivo Flipse

well I'm sure Adobe won't blame your for torrenting Photoshop when you've got a legit license though ;)

Arda Xi

and technically an EULA can remove that right if they wish

alexanderpas

Torrenting = uploading too, so bad!

Arda Xi

@alexanderpas in the case of software downloading has the same implications as uploading

but the law only states that it isn't a violation of copyright, not that it cannot be forbidden by an EULA

alexanderpas

20:21

that's why i said if it allows you to make an archival copy.

Arda Xi

yes, but then you're still not allowed to download an archival copy

only to make one

alexanderpas

btw: if you do not agree with the EULA (yet) you can do things in violation of the EULA if they're not in violation of the law ;)

Arda Xi

actually, an EULA is a binding contract

an EULA cannot override the law, but it can amend the law

within reason, this is up to a judge to decide

alexanderpas

i concur!

still EULA is customer unfriendly!

GNU licenses are customer friendly.

Arda Xi

GNU isn't customer friendly, it's user-friendly

assuming you mean GPL :P

Noctrine

20:24

I hate GPL

Arda Xi

besides, a GPL is an EULA still

C. Ross

I like LGPL

Arda Xi

LGPL is alright

alexanderpas

GNU is not an EULA

Arda Xi

I prefer permissivel icenses

sure is alex

C. Ross

20:25

me too, otherwise I can't use it at work

MPL is actually good

alexanderpas

you're not required to accept the GNU licenses, you can use the program without.

Arda Xi

it's a **l**icence **a**reegment **e**nd **u**sers MUST accept to use software

damn

that didn't work like I wanted it to

but you are

GPL doesn't apply to just source code

Ivo Flipse

ok, enough discussion about downloading now :P

Noctrine

lol

Arda Xi

nah

:D

Ivo Flipse

20:27

you discussed for so long, that I have browsed all my 90 Google Reader feeds

Arda Xi

only 90?

I just browse interesting items when I get bored

Ivo Flipse

I've cut down on feeds, dropped all the feeds that felt spammy, like ZDnet

rom your 30 subscriptions, over the last 30 days you read 8,592 items, starred 49 items, shared 33 items, and emailed 2 items.

alexanderpas

you don't have to accept the (L)GPL, it is in the license itself, however, if you do not accept the (L)GPL, you're only restricted by copyright law. (and thus cannot spread the program as the permission for that is in the (L)GPL)

Arda Xi

that's not how it works

wait

Ivo Flipse

Subscription # Read % Read
Gizmodo 1,355 100%
Engadget 959 100%
TechCrunch 798 100%
SlashGear 757 100%
Ars Technica 367 100%
Mobile Android News 344 100%
Download Squad 256 100%
[Geeks Are Sexy] Technology News - We make technology sexy 164 99%
Tested Site Mashup 163 100%
the How-To Geek 155 100%

Arda Xi

20:29

that's included in the GPL? really?

alexanderpas

yup!

Arda Xi

where?

Ivo Flipse

time of day for the feeds is really bad :P

Arda Xi

ah, I see

section 9

that was added in v2

meh, (L)GPL is way too complicated anyway

I prefer licences I can stick on regular source files and not have them make up 75% of the file

like the MIT licence

alexanderpas

GPL is easy, do what you want, as long as you allow anyone that recieves a copy of your adaption to do the same.

Arda Xi

20:32

err no, it's much more complicated

tzenes

Yeah, GPL is super complicated

Arda Xi

"if you want to distribute it you have to fully credit them, distribute the source code with it fully and this licence"

tzenes

the standford licience is much easier

Arda Xi

MIT is 3 lines or something

tzenes

I just realized I can't spell

Arda Xi

20:33

well, a bit more

alexanderpas

GPL is 11 lines in your files + 2 additional files (CREDITS, LICENSE)

Arda Xi

yes, those two files I don't like

MIT is about 16 lines in your files

the only restriction is "The above copyright notice and this permission notice shall be included in all copies or substantial portions of the Software."

period

antony.trupe

3

Q: Need a good controller for PC flight sim

Any recommendations?

is this on-topic?

Arda Xi

hmm, unsure

antony.trupe

2

Q: Showcase 3D games

What games would be good for showcasing 3D technology? I've seen some games where the 3D seems tacked on, but I've never seen one with well-implemented 3D.

3d

show me the lists

Arda Xi

20:36

the ISC license is even simpler, it's basically MIT License with language "made unnecessary by the Berne convention" removed.

"Note: 3d goggles are bad for depth perception (your eyes lose their "sea legs"), and can be really damaging to children under 7."

[citation-needed]

alexanderpas

at least GPLv3 protects against tivolisation. (Hello open source software you are not allowed to change because that would damage your hardware - Motorola Droid X with android )

Arda Xi

but at least simpler licenses allow commercial use of the code

which is good because it improves software all-round

alexanderpas

GPL does allow commercial usage!

Arda Xi

of course not

alexanderpas

it states so in the license.

Arda Xi

20:39

commercial usage in this case is closed-source

because it's pretty hard to make money of GPL'ed software

alexanderpas

You can make money by providing service, and you only give service to those who bought the software from you.

Arda Xi

alright, let me revice

but at least simpler licenses allow closed-source use of the code, which is good because it improves software all-round

alexanderpas

uhm... no! which is more secure windows Vista/7 or Ubuntu Linux 10.04

Arda Xi

7

definitely

but that wasn't even the point I was making

I meant, without open-source projects with permissive licenses a lot of software people use daily wouldn't have been possible

like Adobe's software

tzenes

BSD licenses

BSD licenses are a family of permissive free software licenses. The original license was used for the Berkeley Software Distribution (BSD), a Unix-like operating system after which it is named. The original owners of BSD were the Regents of the University of California because BSD was first written at the University of California, Berkeley. The first version of the license was revised, and the resulting licenses are more properly called modified BSD licenses. Two variants of the license, the New BSD License/Modified BSD License, and the Simplified BSD License/FreeBSD License have been ...

alexanderpas

20:43

like the linux kernel? (GPLv2)

Arda Xi

the linux kernel isn't licensed under a permissive license?

I meant more like X

alexanderpas

it was a counter argument!

Arda Xi

I know, and I countered it

no, not like the linux kernel

I'm talking about closed-source software people use to make money

like Windows

alexanderpas

let's see... Microsoft office?

Arda Xi

for example

alexanderpas

20:46

I counter that with OpenOffice.org under the LGPLv2

Arda Xi

so?

I'm just saying Microsoft Office wouldn't have been possible without the software it was based on

there's a pretty good chance OO.org wouldn't have existed like it does if MSO wasn't there

alexanderpas

Possibly, Wordperfect would've ruled the market.

Arda Xi

by the way, LGPL doesn't count here, since it is permissive

I can release code based on LGPL'd software closed-source

as long as I don't edit the library itself

a good example would be Google Chrome

that would never have been there without the L GPL

alexanderpas

exactly, as long as you don't edit the libary itself, (and allow the possibility of drop in replacement updates.)

Arda Xi

I'm only arguing against the GPL

if not the LGPL but the GPL was used, Google Chrome would never have existed, at least not in this format

antony.trupe

20:51

vote to close this discussion as off-topic

Arda Xi

oh wow, yeah

sorry about that

alexanderpas

closed (3/3)

tzenes

haha

Arda Xi

Closed as off-topic by antony.trupe, alexanderpas and Arda Xi ♦ 1 minute ago

@alexanderpas I prefer my version

tzenes

how do you get the diamond?

Arda Xi

20:54

you have to be chosen by the community I think

alexanderpas

copypasta?

tzenes

I ment in the chat

Arda Xi

Juan, Grace and Oak were exceptions

oh

tzenes

is it just an ascii character?

Arda Xi

unicode I think

alexanderpas

20:55

unicode position 0x2666

tzenes

sure

Arda Xi

really!

tzenes

no I believe you, I just meant it didn't matter to me the difference between ascii and unicode

Arda Xi

well yeah, but you asked it so explicitly

tzenes

...

alexanderpas

20:58

I ♥ unicode

Arda Xi

you &fail; at html entities though

:)

don't know why it doesn't work though

alexanderpas

at least we can edit messages here...

tzenes

♦

3

Arda Xi

how did you do that

tzenes

magic

Arda Xi

21:00

oh

it's red right after posting

me = dumb

antony.trupe

this ♦ is now ♦'s.

Arda Xi

don't star that plox

alexanderpas

text is red after posting

Arda Xi

yeah

hey, I didn't even know that reply feature

:57645 this chat gets more awesome every day

Noctrine

alexanderpas

21:03

♠7

Arda Xi

http://➡.ws/땛횢

it doesn't even work :/

that's a working link

alexanderpas

http://☃.net

Arda Xi

doesn't work either

http://➡.ws/mw4

why doesn't it work :(

http://➡.ws/mw4

yay

http://➡.ws/땛횢

shortest shortlink ever

http://☃.net

alexanderpas

BTW: did we find a bug in the url handling of markdown regarding IDN

Arda Xi

I think so

but you can always do it manually

alexanderpas

21:12

YAY! Package!

Arda Xi

at 11 pm?

alexanderpas

delivered at the neighbours

Arda Xi

ah

what'd you get :P

alexanderpas

DMG2 + 4k penny sleeves

Arda Xi

neat

consolas snowman is much more awesome

alexanderpas

21:18

now (not right now) i can finally continue sorting that big-bag-o'magic-cards.

last retweet @Jeff did... LOL

Arda Xi

I've decided I don't like the Stack Exchange sites. They're going to destroy the value of my Google-fu.

Tweeted by kevindente on August 6, 2010 at 9:17 PM

3

alexanderpas

I would say that means that... part one of the mission is accomplished

Arda Xi

pff, I hate providing something online for other users on my site and then getting emails about 404 errors after the utility is deprecated

alexanderpas

lol

Arda Xi

that's a bit late :P

tzenes

21:29

are twitter links magic links?

Ivo Flipse

ah didn't see it

Arda Xi

yep

alexanderpas

and twitter links get expanded so

I've decided I don't like the Stack Exchange sites. They're going to destroy the value of my Google-fu.

Tweeted by kevindente on August 6, 2010 at 9:17 PM

tzenes

twitter links are magic links!

Tweeted by tzenes on August 6, 2010 at 9:30 PM

Ivo Flipse

Eating a bunch of bacon nachos and watching sports championship games from the 70's. Ah, Fridays.

Tweeted by OldSpice on August 6, 2010 at 8:43 PM

C. Ross

21:31

oh %^&* Twitter

3

Arda Xi

@tzenes What about replies?

Tweeted by ArdaXi on August 6, 2010 at 9:31 PM

aww, no link to the tweet it replied to

oh, thanks

tzenes

tweet threading is hard

alexanderpas

[status-feature-request]

tzenes

I've seen a couple decent implementations, but mostly it doesn't work

He could probably drop in code to have it produce the icon of the person you're using @ to

Arda Xi

I meant just like Twitter does it

Marc Gravell

21:35

Fine, we could probably improve that twitter support.

Go suggest it in chat-feedback ;p

C. Ross

no, don't encourage them

tzenes

toolate

also Twitter++

Arda Xi

what's wrong with twitter‽

alexanderpas

Tweeted by ArdaXi on August 6, 2010 at 9:31 PM in reply to tzenes

Arda Xi

exactly

now mcckay is starting to annoy me a bit, he's over-zealously editing question based on his interpretation of the law :/

tzenes

21:38

yeah

he annoys me frequently

Arda Xi

and.. he disagrees with me, I don't like people disagreeing with me

tzenes

I know he means well, but a lot of his answers have about 5 seconds of thought put into them

Its like he's rushing to answer

I tried disagreeing with Grace a couple times

it did not work out well for me

Arda Xi

but it's especially the fact he's editing questions everywhere without concern for the original author

alexanderpas

downvote on bad answers?

tzenes

we can revert them

Arda Xi

21:40

like this one

1

Q: Steam version of Fallout / Fallout 2 in a window

I've been looking to run Fallout / Fallout 2 in windowed mode; I have the steam version. Has anyone had any experience getting this to work? I'm running Windows 7 64bit.

steam fallout fallout-2 fallout-series windowed-mode

you don't edit a question's scope based on a guess

tzenes

yeah

thats a bad one

I realize there is a lot of poorly tagged questions, but that could be better

Like I said, I think he means well, but I don't think he spends a ton of time thinking about something before he does it

alexanderpas

my comment: @McKay When unsure, verify!

tzenes

I think a lot of that is just the magpie response

Arda Xi

true, I haven't spoken out on it before since my history on wikipedia engrained 'assume good faith'

tzenes

I'm sure when gaming.se hits pro it'll be fine

Arda Xi

21:43

hm?

tzenes

well right now its "new and shiny" so we all kind of obsess

once there are dozens of new questions every 10 minutes we'll probably back off

only answer a few

and write better answers

Arda Xi

we need our equivalent of a Jon Skeet though

alexanderpas

I already write good answers!

Arda Xi

the one who answers every question before it's asked

tzenes

we need to lure the Jon Skeet of gaming

and we do that through good questions

Arda Xi

21:45

but who?

tzenes

there are not enough good questions

Arda Xi

also, another example of what I mean

gaming.stackexchange.com/posts/4576/revisions

tzenes

Jerry Holkins

yeah, and it was already tagged spy

like I said, just seems overeager

Arda Xi

but even if it wasn't, an engineer couldn't use an ambassador

alexanderpas

+145 rep today already.

tzenes

21:47

right

McKay?

Arda Xi

I'm on +30

but there's not enough questions I can answer

too much starcraft

tzenes

Hey, what seems wrong with this answer:

1

A: What are “grid hotkeys”?

Grid Hotkeys are a hold over from Starcraft 1. Default Hotkeys use letters in the building/action command for which reference. For example, to build a Bunker you can use the U key. Grid is an alternative style that mimics the layout style of commands on the keyboard. For example the Stop comma...

I realize it wasn't as good as others, but -3? seems out of place

Arda Xi

I agree

offset for you

alexanderpas

It only gives an example, it does not explain.

tzenes

Grid is an alternative style that mimics the layout style of commands on the keyboard

granted, not the greatest explination

and I realize why someone elses answer was selected

I would have picked it

I just don't get the heavy downvoting there

well, to each their own I guess

alexanderpas

21:52

1 downvote from someone + 2 tactical downvote from other answerers

tzenes

I don't think Raven is that petty

though he did surpass me in rep today

so grats to him

Arda Xi

I hardly ever downvote

I'm still surprised by my rep

Ivo Flipse

go finish this one off :P

15

A: Good typing games

The typing of the dead From Wikipedia: The Typing of the Dead has been described variously as a remake or mod of the original House of the Dead 2. Like the original, Typing of the Dead is styled as a first-person rail shooter game, but substitutes shooting zombies and other ene...

Arda Xi

the fact I stayed on top after a week of no activity

tzenes

Same

Ivo Flipse

21:54

check how many new users we got @ArdaXi, they may have gotten rep, just not as much as you have

Arda Xi

but how did it take so long for for example @tzenes to surpass me in that week

and how did they do it within a few days of my return :P

tzenes

Well I didn't hit top till SC2 released

most of my rep is from about 4 Starcraft 2 questions

which is vaguely rediculous

alexanderpas

game releases might be related indeed.

tzenes

I really think more rep should be given to questions

Arda Xi

I still cite 'Hello Kitty' as most ridiculous

Ivo Flipse

21:56

I disagree @tzenes, just look at what it did at Super User

I know users who ask A LOT of questions

alexanderpas

Hello kitty might become meme.

tzenes

I didn't mean for it to be linear

Ivo Flipse

and gained significant amounts of rep, because of 1 or 2 upvotes per question

tzenes

I think that after 10 it should double for each vote

Oak

Indeed @Arda, SC2 is responsible for removing you from the top :)

Oak

21:57

And me and Juan

tzenes

I really don't think I deserve to be near the top

Oak

And it's great, quality SC2 answers can do wonders to our traffic

alexanderpas

if we become a resource where gamers can ask and find answers right after the release of a game: MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!

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