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ssb
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00:02
I'm also unable to propose tags. Could be a rep thing?
What tags are you proposing?
ssb
ssb
Ah, I see. I want to propose a tag for Unity but this process is not immediately clear.
> "Read the Intro Post, contribute to the C#, .NET, Java, or Android docs (or find another tag to help with), and come say HI in chat."
HI
00:18
Hi
00:44
GAH.
It is far too easy to discard drafts.
I just lost two good examples :(
01:20
@MSeifert That was exactly it. Thank you.
@SteveMoser That was what? Are you referring to me saying "Hi"? :-)
 
1 hour later…
Okay. That bug is so annoying ...
 
4 hours later…
06:21
Does anyone have opinions about where to put topics that aren't specifically nor nor nor ? We could perhaps use , but Cocoa technically refers to specific frameworks that are OS X-only. Are there any other tags that would really work well?
I'd love for us to come up with an answer to this question soon, because I think there are a lot of good topics that will need a home
e.g. NSAttributedString, Quartz APIs, possibly things like NSURLSession...
I'm not sure that is a sufficiently unique name that it would make sense to use it
07:00
Hello :)
 
2 hours later…
08:55
Can't delete sections, if accidentally added one. For example wanted to remove "Syntax" section from the draft, but there is no way to do it. It should have a "delete" icon, just like "Example" items.
By the way, Hi everyone :)
09:09
@S.D. hello there
hi guys
is it possible to reorder examples ?
no: all you can do is "pin" one example to the top; apart from that, examples are ordered by votes
oh ok thanks
09:38
Quick question: anyone had situation where you click on a notification and it takes you to the main site rather than the actual proposed change?
@DavidG no, I've only had the one where I click the notification and it takes me to a 404 page
I can't repro right now, it happens very rarely
 
2 hours later…
11:46
There is currently a flood of tag-wiki edits going on. Is this useful? I suspect tag wikis will be deleted after private beta?
@MSeifert and what should we do against it? can't really prohibit the people from editing them, even though it may be useless in the long term
we could reject them if it doesn't make sense to edit them.
but most of these aren't wrong, are they? It's just wasted effort
but they are just plain plagiats of the SO Q&A
(mostly)
the current one about [tag: asp-classic] is stackoverflow.com/tags/asp-classic/info
if it's more effort to reject them I would let them be, if it is the same either way then rejecting maybe isn't that wrong
11:55
@MSeifert o ffs, wasn't aware at the time that they were going to be nuked after beta...does it matter? I just wanted to place something meaningful there so people who might not know what it is had something to refer to!
don't know, I dont have enough rep haven't reviewed tag edits before
@Lankymart there are only the possibilites of merging or deleting the ones here, since documentation will go back to SO when beta closes
and merging won't do any good
@FlorianKoch then reject it, it's fine.
nah, why reject the ones already done? it helps as long as this is in beta
jsut making the effort of extending all tags isn't really worth
@FlorianKoch it's like MSeifert said they are just plagiarised from SO anyway. If docs is being merged into SO then we don't want them merging back in.
I don't think merging will be done, like MSeifert said they will probably just deleted exactly because the contents are most likely the same. I don't think plagiarism is really the right word here, since the tags are essentially the same
it's just the technical situation that they are duplicated
12:03
I think just a link to SO-Tag would suffice - if you really want to fill these tags
so my opionion is: extending the tags or even copying their descriptions from SO ist ok, but wasted effort
@MSeifert best would be to jsut use the descriptions but only show the tags once they were uese here at least once
I suspect it was easier to allow the tags to be recreated, so they build it like that
linking can be a help, but in the tag description popup not really a help
Hi Guys; quick question on "SQL" vs "SQL Server"; is SQL the language and "SQL Server" the product, or does "SQL Server" refer to the MS implementation of T-SQL, and "SQL" refer to the ANSI Compliant (generic) SQL; or something else? Thanks in advance.
Ah, found the answer by looking at versions; it's SQL-92.
@FlorianKoch this
@Lankymart ?
@JohnLBevan maybe ask this as a real question, else it might be lost here
oh forget it, jsut saw you already found it
@FlorianKoch just meant I that was why linking to SO wouldn't be useful
12:11
what? ^^
should "this" be a link?
aren't links possible in excerpt?
@JohnLBevan Might be a good idea to edit the "hello world" topics of those two tags and clarify that / add a note about it, for future visitors
@FlorianKoch does chat not highlight the comment you are replying to? I was just agreeing with you about the linking not being useful
aaahhh
it does, I just didn't understood ^^
sorry
@MSeifert not that i've seen
@FlorianKoch no worries
12:24
Thanks @JonasCz; will do
@FlorianKoch @FlorianKoch Good shout / thank-you
12:46
could someone accept docs-beta.stackexchange.com/documentation/proposed/changes/2842 ... I'm trying to figure out if it's possible to have versions inside lists
Done
Thank you ... now I'll have to write a bug ... :D
13:16
I already noticed that moving an example somehow clutters the edit-history. Anyone knows if the original contributors get rep after the example was moved? Do they receive rep for upvotes on answers on topic-links for BOTH topics?
do you really think moving this is really a good idea?
the exampels are really similar
moving what?
*examples
my exmaple, I just assumed your question was regarding the C# / .NET topic ^^
*example
goddamnit
ah you mean that recently posted-and-deleted question? If they are really similar just reject it.
ah ok ^^
good
I'll recreate a more specific example for collection binding later on
13:19
I was just pondering on the possibilities (bugs) of moving examples in general
@MSeifert Try it out I guess
That's what the sandbox tag is for
seems like really much effort
because rep testing doesn't work alone
approving neither
but we're in chat. In theory there are almost 20 users to help
yeah the need to approve in sandbox is really slowing down ^^
I'd help out ^^
psot the proposal link and we accept, afterwards we can try to test out rep gain
*post
still bit of a hassle, though
13:22
done
so, now someone else needs to move it
Will do
wait
before, create a question suing this
and vote up too, since we need to test "indirect" rep gain too
it must be an answer
13:24
and I think it must be of someone who hasn't contributed
no, it should be also ok for your own
at least you get a badge for this, so I'd assume it givesrep too
It says "moving all examples will delete the topic" - my guess is that topic deletion will affect rep in some way too. maybe we need two examples in that topic ?
but ok I can post it, just create a question and post the link, I'll answer including the example, and a third person needs to vote up this answer
@JonasCz good pijt
*point
ok, it's getting really complicated
yeah that's what I meant ^^
new chatroom?
to coordinate
13:26
Nah, i don't think that's necessary
i've created another example, so the topic will survive
Approved. Let me try moving again..
so we test the rep gain with answers later?
Oh right.. should I wait ?
13:29
yeah, I#m answering right now
don't upvote the answer before moving though :)
anyone else want to add a link to the example before moving?
oh wrong, it should link to the new topic not the old one ... it's about me getting rep for the new topic :(
anyone want's to move the example?
Okay, will do
Do I choose "new topic" when moving, or do we create the destination topic first ?
or move it to an already existing topic ?
I hope that there is no bug so either option should be fine. It just needs to be something I haven't contributed to
neither on topic nor on any specific example
still says it will delete the whole topic?
Nope.
should I approve? Or could you @FlorianKoch approve it? So I don't have any participation.
Oh, wait. it does day "deletes entire topic" ?
It shouldn't though..
Let me edit again and see what I did
13:42
Ok, it's approved now even though I retracted it ? This is wiered..
Why was it saying "deletes entire topic" ? I only moved one of the two examples..
another two bugs?
ok, I get the rep from the link to the new example
I've created an answer linking to the new topic as well
sorry, had somehting to do right now, kinda lost track of how far you are
i approved what you last send me @MSeifert
What happened here ? this looks like a 3rd bug:
it said delete
13:48
well
that doesn't look right ^^
could someone upvote docs-beta.stackexchange.com/questions/902/… and the other un-upvoted answer there?
Then I can at least delete that question (including answers)
i upvoted everything there
ok? or should I exclude one?
no I got rep from everything even the old topic :-D
oh ... no
wrong ...
I just got the rep from being upvoted on my answers
and +5 rep from some topic reference
so the question now is: is this intended?
i totally lost track
could you take your upvote back, one by one?
13:52
sure
so I can see for which reference I got the rep
did it for one answer
next the question?
I kinda totally lost track too.. Ill take my one upvote on your second answer back too ?
ah ... ok I didn't get any rep ... totallly confusing
yeah :/
13:53
I have +40 for answers, +5 for question upvote and NONE for the links therin
but I got the bluebook badge ...
ok, then we should open a question to get to know if this is intended
also someone else should try to get rep with the moved post
correction: not get, but give you rep
I tried to answer, but i wasn't able to link the example with the "post link to documentation" function
@JonasCz - Did you receive reputation from the upvotes on the answers?
maybe this upvote answers with links doesn't work at all (yet)
But I didn't contibute to any of the examples, so I don't think I should get any
13:56
or only if you include it not as link, but with the linkt to documentation feature
ok, how do I do that? ^^
it didn't work for me though, becasue he didn'T find the sandbox
that's why I didn'T post an answer
*didn't
my keyboard hates me today
it looks like we have opened pandoras box ...
I'd love to have a mod here right now to give his thoughts ^^
@DonyorM hey
13:59
is there anyway to remove one of the optional sections in a new topic if you've accidentally added them?
@FlorianKoch You can edit your chat messages btw, in case you don't know
@DonyorM nope there is already a question for this topic
@DonyorM yes, just edit it and remove all text
1. something prevents us from linking to sandbox 2. with a direct link one can approve edits that are retracted 3. moving one example can delete a topic even if there is another example 4. I don't know, anyone found something else?
@JonasCz tried, did work. It said it was misformatted
@FlorianKoch stink, guess I'll go fine some parameters to stick in there
14:00
Did you do "save draft" after ? it worked for me
hmmm, let me try
could anyone upvote docs-beta.stackexchange.com/documentation/… to see if I get the rep there?
you've upvoted it before?
@JonasCz doesn't work. It's empty but it says it needs parameters
14:02
because it's still +3 and I haven't received any rep
this: http://chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/28827460#28827460
as for linking to sandbox: you have to type the entire name of the tag ("sandbox-try-stuff-here") in the tag field, and then it works.. I think there is already a bug report about this
@MSeifert dunno but he let me upvote it
it wasn't an orange up arrow
probably sandbox has rep disabled
@DonyorM Wiered, it works for me by erasing all text
@MSeifert well seems broken too, i can vote up, refreshing sets back
14:05
How do you delete everything? Just with the delete key, or is there some other method?
@DonyorM No, upvotes on examples still give rep. it's a normal tag, i created it
@DonyorM backspace to remove all text in the parameters, then "save draft", then "submit"
@JonasCz i pasted it inside but the ok button was still greyed out for me...
@JonasCz Oh nevermind, apparently some whitespace somehow got left
it worked
Sorry about that
@DonyorM ok sorry I read a question regarding this that's why I thought it was really not possible
@DonyorM Could you upvote docs-beta.stackexchange.com/documentation/… ? You can take the upvote back later :) Just so I can see if I get reputation from it
14:06
@FlorianKoch probably it wasn't possible and they fixed it
@MSeifert done
ok thank you. You can take it back
I've got the rep :)
so what rep was it now? for the example?
yes the upvote on the example gives me the reputation
so ... I think it will also be True for answer upvotes
anyone wants to try it?
if yes, then this time it would be great to have someone else create question+answers because I receive reputation from the upvotes there what makes it a bit confusing
Hello everyone!
14:10
@MarkyPython Hi !
so @MSeifert if you create a question i can try to answer again and someone else upvotes, then you should gain rep for my answer upvote cause i reference your example
right?
I think so :)
ok can i use your old question or do you want to create a new one?
ok
well, how do I link this correctly, now? i pasted "sandbox-try-stuff-here" as tag but i cant find the topic with the search
oh forget it
i searched for "move"
14:15
at least I cannot give myself rep this way :D
^^
@JonasCz are you still there? could you upvote this answer?
According to the announcement, "any visible link" counts, so I guess it doesn't have to be linked through the dialog. I guess that all links which have the little docs icon next to them count, linked through the dialog or not
@JonasCz Did you get reputation from my upvote?
maybe we just need a really unrelated person for the topic
14:17
nope, no reputation
I could imagine everyone who participated in this documentation can't be a rep source
so it needs to be someone else entirely?
dunno, just a guess
someone else should try to upvote the answer and then both of you should get rep
maybe someone else will upvote it
http://docs-beta.stackexchange.com/questions/902/this-is-just-a-test-about-moving-examples-and-getting-reputation-on-topics-examp/908#908
here the link again
14:20
Although the announcement doesn't specify any further rules regarding this
I'd guess "bug", not feature..
well it makes sense that one cannot give yourself rep^^
are you able to somehow sum up evertyhing we tried, and what worked out like we'd expect and what not?
so we can maybe create a question
let's wait until another upvote comes in
because I'm not able to
then let's try active users
we could ping @JAtkin for example :)
14:22
@JAtkin could you upvote the answer here docs-beta.stackexchange.com/questions/902/…
for testing?
@MarkyPython @DonyorM could you upvote docs-beta.stackexchange.com/questions/902/… for testing purposes?
testing purposes? Giv meh theh rep!!!
:D
btw, what happens with rep received while in beta?
especially for questions?
@FlorianKoch We get to keep rep from docs itself, but not from questions
14:25
upvotes on examples should be moved over I guess
rep from question&answers will just disappear
ah ok like I thought
then givez meh theh repz temporarily! :D
I think we won't get another upvote
no upvotes yet...
well...
how do we proceed?
I think it would be best to create a discussion question with all we tried so far, extending it further when we tested more
sadly I don't have that much time left today, I'll have to go in ~30 mins
no problem, I hope someone else upvotes it then I can create a discussion
14:31
ok
You can create a discussion / [bug] anyway, and then add more info later
The developers will be able to debug it, even without all the information
yeah, but it would have been nice if we could have fully tested one case though
better reference material
can someone approve my test topics in the sandbox: docs-beta.stackexchange.com/documentation/proposed/changes/2870
also an upvote would be nice :D
with regard to reputation just upvotes on answers don't give any reputation
14:39
@Anil done
@Anil, FYI, the rep system is fairly well documented, if that's what you want to find out: docs-beta.stackexchange.com/questions/326/…
@MSeifert should i delete my test answer now? since you made the question a real one
great thanks, trying to figure it all out, finding it a little confusing :\
So the third upvote on the answer still doesn't give any reputation and if @JonasCz didn't get any reputation from it -> probably upvotes on answers give rep for linked examples is disabled
@MSeifert btw someone else voted up the answer, any rep changes?
too late ^^
want me to delete the test answer now?
14:42
let it stand I reference to it in the question ^^
ok
well, then this seems to be it for now
at least until someone reacts to the question
or we get the reputation later.
don't think so
@MSeifert "with regard to reputation just upvotes on answers don't give any reputation" - I got 10 rep for the doc answer @FlorianKoch upvoted? Am i misunderstanding something?, so if I contribute to someone else's answer, then someone upvotes it, I would also get 10 rep?
"upvotes on answers"is the important part of the sentence
14:44
we meant no rep for an upvote on an answer that references the example
normally it should give anyone who has contributed to an example linked in an answer rep too, if this answer is upvoted
ok, so I'll be off for now
I'm inetrested how this works out, though
later, guys (:
@KevinMontrose - Is the "earn reputation by upvotes on answers that cite documentation you contributed to"-feature currently disabled?
Finally received my invite o/
@FlorianKoch me too. Have a nice day and thank you for helping
you too, thx
14:54
404
$answer = $foo + $poo; that's weird you never defined $poo.
I cannot approve this even for science reasons :D
ha! - i just noticed that
lol! - I understand!
@TylerH same here 404
Might it be a privileged screen?
I've only got 101 reputation
no he retracted his edit - I guess
14:57
Unfortunately I can't find a "Documentation reputation" sheet
ah
when I review an example change, I can accept or reject it. Is there a way to improve it ? Like in Q&A
yeah, i fixed it, sorry, can i get an upvote here now its approved: docs-beta.stackexchange.com/documentation/…
Nope, not directly, although you can approve, and then make another edit to improve it @nouney
or reject it and improve the draft later
ok thanks guys
14:59
I've answered this question before ... cannot find where
15
Q: Should we have an "Improve" option when reviewing proposed changes?

SamCurrently, we can only reject or approve changes, Meaning if a reviewer sees a typo or something else that needs correction/improvement (s)he would have to either: approve the changes and propose a new change to improve the previous (kinda tedious), reject the changes and propose a new chang...

@Anil maybe I'm missing something, why are you asking for upvotes?
@TylerH testing rep gain from contributions
Oh, will it be wiped out when it goes public or something?
@Lankymart @TylerH just screwing around with the new docs beta, im done
15:03
@Lankymart thank you for the link
It seems the code powering Docs is not working and so this beta is for testing/fixing it?
I thought the closed beta was for early creation of/contribution to Documentation
on docs, how can I delete a topic I created? - can I?
No, rep will be kept
Yes, docs is very new, there's still lots of bugs / issues to be ironed out, that's what the beta is for, in addition to early creation of documentation.
TylerH, I think it is for both
oh dam, I thought it would be reset, ok im done
@JonasCz Can i delete my test topics somehow?
15:06
@JonasCz So since rep will be kept, is it valid to ask for rep since this stage is also for "testing" the functionality?
@Anil Yes, you can, there's a little delete icon on the topic once you're in the editor. deletion needs to be reviewed by someone else
ok done, if someone can approve and delete my 1 topic, thanks: docs-beta.stackexchange.com/documentation/proposed/changes/…
Maybe, probably.. It's such a small amount of rep anyway, and I'm also pretty certain that the "sandbox" and test content won't be kept. but better ask the devs if it's okay to experiment with rep for testing purposes.
awesome, I ready to contribute, I have loads of code samples locally (written in markdown) - i've been meaning to blog them, but I think im going to use so docs, makes perfect sense
@Anil Awesome !
15:12
@TylerH That's what I thought to but apparently not...
@JonasCz Sorry, last question, Should I wait until release or is it okay to start writing them out now? - I think i read somewhere it will be migrated over going live, is this correct?
Yes, correct. it's definitely good to start writing now, imo
Thanks,
Hmm... I can edit a title independently of editing a body (e.g. I can edit just the title in the title edit UI), but if I do that, and submit it for review, then I can't edit the body until the title is approved
Seems inconsistent
You can click "retract and edit" from the pending review page, and then you can change the body and resubmit
15:28
Sure, but I'd rather not have to go backward to go forward :-)
@TylerH it's a bit clumsy imo, the whole thing is versioned regardless of whether you change just a title or not so it seems pointless
yeah, I'm posting a question atm about it
wow they really make it hard to ask a question on docs meta site
@TylerH you do realise that docs-beta.stackexchange is the meta, right? there's no meta.docs-beta
@DanHulme yes
what's wrong with it?
15:37
I was referring to the docs-beta.stackexchange site as the meta site
@DanHulme Let me tell you the ways
(one moment)
1) It takes me to How to Ask, which is I think a little rude, but OK maybe new members will be asking questions... but it takes me there every time, not just the first time
@TylerH what takes you to How to Ask?
2) When I load the screen, even on a 24" monitor at full HD, the link to actually ask the question is below the fold: i.imgur.com/vqBLXdj.png
@DanHulme "Ask a question" button
it doesn't for me
It shouldn't take you there more than once.. I only saw the asking advice once. It's active on all sites for new users
It took me there twice so far
Oh, maybe because I haven't submitted my first question yet, I'm still drawing it up
Though I have definitely clicked the "Okay I get it" checkbox and clicked "Proceed"
so the server should know that I've seen the page
Anyway, 3) the Big Blue Action Button is for searching similar titles, while the actual button people want, the Proceed button, is color: grey; on a light grey background, in all caps, and only underlined. That's poor UX, like you're intentionally trying to hide an Unsubscribe link in a spam e-mail
So @DanHulme I guess these are network-wide issues, not just Docs meta issues
15:44
It should go away after asking one question. And yes, I know it's not really useful to show it to people who don't need to see it, but keep in mind that it was taken from SO, where low-quality questions from new users who don't know how to ask a good question are a real problem.
If one of my change is rejected because of a conflict, do I lust my draft? I can't find it
you lot on about in the blue banner message on the site?
this one "Read the Intro Post, contribute to the C#, .NET, Java, or Android docs (or find another tag to help with), and come say HI in chat."?
it's been there since I joined and don't think it goes away I've asked questions etc and it has stayed there.
No, i'm (and TylerH) is referring to the asking advice page: docs-beta.stackexchange.com/questions/ask/advice
@JonasCz oh yeah, should vanish I guess never even registered that it shows every-time I go to post a question, should be reported.
Yep, I can confirm now that I've asked my first question, I no longer get redirected to How to Ask when I click "Ask a Question"
Which makes me realize, that banner is a little redundant
15:58
@Lankymart no, not that; that's temporary for our beta and it's not supposed to vanish
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