/dev/chat

Adam L

3:00 AM

what would be the best back up and recovery package to install for Debian?

Adam L

6:46 AM

:-|

Faheem Mitha

7:04 AM

@AdamL Backing up filesystems from a hard drive?

If so, I use Borg Backup. That's a deduplicating backup. There's also restic. And many other options, of course.

If you want a one time thing to save your data, I've used fsarchiver before.

Though it doesn't support all Linux filesystems.

Adam L

8:42 AM

@FaheemMitha originally I wanted to rig things so that periodically created an iso of the machines present "state" and the contents of the drives, but it got put in the "I don't know wtf im doing now basket" pretty quick. basically I have a virtual machine on this computer that I try to keep identical to the OS on my laptop, and want to take a back up when everything is working well

Faheem Mitha

@AdamL For regular incremental backups of unencrypted filesystems, borg works well.

Adam L

how annoying must it be for javascript developers when you use tor and disable it in the config I mean it really seems like a lot of work to learn it

Faheem Mitha

Did you want to make a filesystem backup, or something else?

Adam L

ok thanks ill give that a crack in my VM

what do you mean by something else

Faheem Mitha

@AdamL What exactly do you want to back up?

Do you want to back up a filesystem? Or do you want to back up something else?

Adam L

8:48 AM

like what else is there lol :-|

im seriously asking

Faheem Mitha

@AdamL Dunno. You might want to back up some kind of image.

That would in general be different from a filesystem.

Stephen Kitt

or keep files in sync on different systems, rather than backups (with a separate backup system)

Adam L

so mozilla and tor are basically a couple right? like the browsers are like conjoined twins like me and maple

Faheem Mitha

@StephenKitt Or that. But I don't think Borg is designed for that. Though I could be wrong.

Stephen Kitt

@FaheemMitha hence the separate backup system

Faheem Mitha

8:58 AM

@AdamL What?

Stephen Kitt

backups are one thing, syncing is another

Faheem Mitha

@StephenKitt Yes, they are.

Andras Deak

1:51 PM

scratch that, that's not my exact error message

still, ubuntu install dying trying to install grub...

Faheem Mitha

@AndrasDeak What's going on?

Andras Deak

Ubuntu install. "grub-install: error: failed to register EFI boot entry: Operation not permitted". I might be doing something wrong: I created an efi partition (and tried installing grub both there and on /dev/sda root as well; both lead to this error).

there are similar issues from 8 years ago... they suggest trying the install through a live CD, but no luck there

Faheem Mitha

@AndrasDeak Ok, so a permission issue.

For something like this, it would not hurt to post to the site. Or even try some suitable mailing list.

Andras Deak

an earlier iteration of the error complained about a wrong user ID...

@FaheemMitha yeah, although I'd probably sooner try installing debian :)

Faheem Mitha

Presumably your BIOS is suitably enabled? I seem to remember that EFI needs to be allowed in BIOS.

@AndrasDeak You could try that too. It would help to rule out hardware issues.

Andras Deak

2:00 PM

hmm, good point, let me check that next

it's a laptop that came with freedos so settings might be non-trivial

Stephen Kitt

yeah you need to boot in EFI mode to be able to install grub in EFI

jesse_b

electronic fuel injection mode

Andras Deak

so when I keep saying that I'm a noob, this is what I mean :P

And I need something called secureboot if I want 3rd party drivers? What the heck

hmm, secureboot needs to be configured so that ubuntu can disable it...

I really didn't want to spend this much time on this install :D

Andras Deak

3:35 PM

and it's so difficult to get reasonable and practical information about secure boot :( Everyone seems to think I'm interested in windows

Stephen Kitt

@AndrasDeak wiki.ubuntu.com/UEFI/SecureBoot maybe?

Faheem Mitha

3:50 PM

@AndrasDeak Not being a "noob" isn't the same thing as knowing the technicalities of every little random thing.

For better or worse, modern operating systems are complex. In part because they increasingly try to be all things to all people.

Telephone, fax machine, priting press, typesetter/typewriter, mail service, broadcaster, music player, TV, etc. etc.

Kuravi H

Is this a good place to get help about forwarding a printer over ssh?

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH Probably, but are you talking about connecting to a printer via ssh?

I.e. CUPS?

Kuravi H

yes I believe so

I'm trying to do this

6

Q: How to print from remote over SSH to local LAN printer?

OK, so it is fairly straight forward to to run apps from a remote server on my local X screen as though they were local apps. The question is, when trying to print, the remote app only sees printers on the remote side. Is it possible (surely it is) to port forward the local CUPS server to the r...

but I dont understand that very well

jesse_b

seems like your question has already been answered by the link you provided

Kuravi H

my apologies but its not very clear what the remote is

should I be doing this on the remote machine or the local?

jesse_b

4:01 PM

remote is the remote machine (the one with the printer)

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH This would be covered by basic CUPS documentation, specifically the Software Adminstrators Manual, if I recall correctly. I suggest you look at that.

How familiar are you with CUPS?

All you would be doing is issuing a print command from your computer, which would be sent by CUPs to the printer, via ssh.

The usual client-server model.

You just have to configure the printer appropriately, and CUPs will take care of the rest.

You can do it via the web interface, or using the command line.

To be clear, in this case both the client and the server live on the local machine.

Kuravi H

4:26 PM

@FaheemMitha can you please give a link that shows how to do it with the web interface? thanks

Andras Deak

@StephenKitt sorry, I was away. That looks perfect, and I have no idea why duckduckgo doesn't point me to it... At least in the meantime I realized that the problem was that enabling UEFI enabled secure boot as well, so now I'm trying to install with just secure boot disabled. Fingers crossed :)

@KuraviH probably localhost:631

@AndrasDeak aaaand UEFI didn't help... *sigh*

@KuraviH oh nevermind, I didn't realize this was part of the Q&A you linked, sorry

Kuravi H

4:45 PM

@AndrasDeak you may want to check the bios, on my laptop (acer) bios there is a uefi (or efi i forget) option and a legacy option. if I have it on efi the ubuntu install will try to install the grub and fail and go to this mokmanager business on boot, such a pain in the butt! but when I use legacy its much simpler

Andras Deak

@KuraviH it was on legacy when I first ran into the same problem :) But thanks for the tip!

Kuravi H

@AndrasDeak in my case If I reset my bios (by removing the battery) it defaults back to efi, and refuse to boot to linux, Occasionally it switches on its own

Andras Deak

sounds fun :)

OK, finally got an ethernet cable

Sep 17 00:28:17 ubuntu grub-installer: info: Installing grub on '/dev/sda'
Sep 17 00:28:17 ubuntu grub-installer: info: grub-install does not support --no-floppy
Sep 17 00:28:17 ubuntu grub-installer: info: Running chroot /target grub-install  --force "/dev/sda"
Sep 17 00:28:17 ubuntu grub-installer: Installing for x86_64-efi platform.
Sep 17 00:28:33 ubuntu grub-installer: grub-install: warning: Internal error.
Sep 17 00:28:33 ubuntu grub-installer: grub-install: error: failed to register the EFI boot entry: Operation not permitted.

I'll go google one more round

Faheem Mitha

@AndrasDeak Assuming CUPs is installed and running, yes.

Kuravi H

@AndrasDeak is your requirement to install Ubuntu somehow or to install Ubuntu in efi mode?

@FaheemMitha I do have CUPS working on both the remote machine and the local machine, i can reach it at localhost:63 on both

Andras Deak

4:58 PM

Install ubuntu somehow :) But the permission error suggested that switching to uefi might help

at this point I'll probably just ditch ubuntu and try to install debian (and hope for the best)

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH I'm pretty sure you don't want CUPS working in multiple places. You just want it in one place.

Well, unless you want to have one server per machine. Which I suppose is a possible configuration.

Kuravi H

@AndrasDeak I'm 90% sure your have booted your installer in efi mode so its trying to install grub in the same mode

Faheem Mitha

But I'm unclear on your overall setup.

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha I'm sorry so i have a desktop at the office wired on to the network where it can print to the office printer which is also wired to the office network

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH Ok. So you just concerned with one computer?

Kuravi H

5:02 PM

@FaheemMitha and from my laptop (on wifi) i cant reach the printer

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH Let's deal with one computer at a time.

Which one are we talking about?

Andras Deak

@KuraviH and should that be an issue if UEFI rather than legacy is chosen in bios?

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha let me call the 2 computers 'the desktop' and 'the laptop'

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH Oh, you're a TeX user too? Where are you located?

@KuraviH Ok. So which one are you currently looking at?

Andras Deak

trying legacy with legacy priority next...

Kuravi H

5:08 PM

@AndrasDeak i believe so, id you choose efi you will boot to the installer (USB) in efi and install in efi, if you choose legacy it will boot to the installer in legacy and install in mbr

Andras Deak

I'm OK with either :)

Faheem Mitha

@AndrasDeak I don't think legacy will work for EFI.

Was EFI failing with the EFI boot mode?

Kuravi H

@AndrasDeak id suggest legacy, usb 1st boot priority in bios

Andras Deak

Yes, but perhaps I should've aimed grub at the efi partition rather than /dev/sda root. 100% cargo culting :(

If legacy fails I'll try that...

Kuravi H

@AndrasDeak in legacy mode you should not have to bother with secure boot

Andras Deak

5:12 PM

Yeah, that I've seen, thanks

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha sorry, so my desktop is wired in to the same network as the printer and they find each other and prints fine

Faheem Mitha

@AndrasDeak Sometimes reading documentation is a good idea. Or so I hear.

@KuraviH So your issue is solely with the laptop?

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha I get RTFMs all the time, but I try not to give them

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH It's OK. Andreas can take it; he's a big boy.

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha that is correct, my laptop is on wifi

Faheem Mitha

5:16 PM

@KuraviH And you want your laptop to print to the same printer?

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha the laptop can ssh in to the desktop fine

Faheem Mitha

If so, what is your printer configuration?

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha that is correct

Andras Deak

@FaheemMitha indeed

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha I dont know, how may I find the printer config

Faheem Mitha

5:17 PM

Note: this is normally stored in /etc/cups/printers.conf.

Specifically, you're looking for the DeviceURI.

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha it says socket://xx.xx.xx.xx

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH Oh dear. Well, what is the corresponding printer? Post the complete stanze.

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha the ip of course not xxs

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH Ok. Well, I think the format should look like:

DeviceURI ipp://192.168.0.20

Try changing it to ipp, if you are sure you have the right IP address. And restart CUPS.

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha Wait, wait, the desktop can print fine,

Faheem Mitha

5:25 PM

@KuraviH With that socket thing?

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha yes

Faheem Mitha

Are you sure it doesn't have multiple configs?

socket won't work for ssh.

I forget what socket is for.

> The AppSocket protocol (sometimes also called the JetDirect protocol, owing to its origins with the HP JetDirect network interfaces) is the simplest and fastest network protocol used for printers. AppSocket printing normally happens over port 9100 and uses the socket backend. Device URIs for the socket backend look like this:

I don't think I've ever used this one.

What OS is your desktop?

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha both ubuntu

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH Look at the logs.

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha holy shit dude, I just looked at your profile 'top 0.51% overall'

Faheem Mitha

5:34 PM

@KuraviH On U&L? You're easily impressed.

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha thanks for your time

Faheem Mitha

I haven't been active here in years. Still hang out in chat, though.

The logs should give some indication of what is going on.

Inside /var/log/cups.

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha I'm confused, I can ping the printer

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH From where? And pinging isn't the same thing as printing.

Anyway, did you try IPP on your laptop?

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha I can ping it from my laptop

@FaheemMitha over the wifi

Faheem Mitha

5:38 PM

Just to be clear, the IPP address to be your printer's IP address. You might want to check you have configured that.

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha this what /etc/cups/printers.conf has

<DefaultPrinter MFC9970CDW>
UUID urn:uuid:d1f9b8cd-9630-3421-6654-04ce36fa4262
Info MFC9970CDW
Location Cubicle area
MakeModel Brother MFC-9970CDW CUPS
DeviceURI socket://10.7.3.13
State Idle
StateTime 1600173024
ConfigTime 1549989872
Type 8392780
Accepting Yes
Shared Yes
JobSheets none none
QuotaPeriod 0
PageLimit 0
KLimit 0
OpPolicy default
ErrorPolicy retry-job
Attribute marker-colors \#000000,#00FFFF,#FFFF00,#FF00FF,none,none,none
Attribute marker-levels -1,-1,-1,-1,-1,94,69
Attribute marker-names Black Toner Cartridge,Cyan Toner Cartridge,Magenta Toner Cartridge,Yellow Toner Cartridge,…

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH Specify machine, please.

Kuravi H

thats on desktop

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH Ok. Who set that up? And is laptop the same?

Kuravi H

i can not get the printer on the laptop

I can ping it but when I try to add the printer it does not work

Faheem Mitha

5:42 PM

10.7.3.13 may not be a fully qualified IP.

@KuraviH I don't know what you mean. It's a local configuration. You can add it with a command line tool, or via the web interface.

What do you mean by: does not work?

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha I add the printer using the gui on kubuntu

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH So what happens?

That's localhost, correct?

Kuravi H

@FaheemMitha localhost:631/printers I type the ip on the search and then click search

Faheem Mitha

@KuraviH Why do you click search? So confirm that CUPS can locate the printer?

Kuravi H

yes

Faheem Mitha

5:51 PM

I don't recall ever doing that.

So what happens then?

Kuravi H

I just had to install their drivers

I gave their prop drivers a go for giggles, and it worked

I shouldve tried that first, thank for your time anyway

Adam L

do notifs on facebook like this one frighten anyone else?

I just don't understand why everyone is ok with such a bogus website high jacking words like science for a broad cast to millions of differently able people on their smart phones

any way netcat and crontab between machines is what I am gonna try as a back up solution

jesse_b

6:18 PM

The fact that anyone trusts information from literally any source other than their own two eyes (and even that can't be trusted in most cases) completely blows my mind

Faheem Mitha

6:48 PM

@jesse_b The options are not great. Any particular area in mind?

jesse_b

@FaheemMitha huh?

Faheem Mitha

@jesse_b What part of that was unclear?

jesse_b

@FaheemMitha What options are not great and what areas of what are particularly in mind?

Faheem Mitha

@jesse_b Options other than trusting information from other sources.

jesse_b

@FaheemMitha be skeptical of everything

Faheem Mitha

6:51 PM

And presumably you had something in mind when you said that.

@jesse_b I am. For one thing, I live in India.

jesse_b

I was replying to Adam L's comment about the facebook post from "Science"

Faheem Mitha

@jesse_b Oh, I see.

Well, with Facebook, it's easy. Just assume it's all nonsense. Saves time.

Adam L

7:06 PM

@jesse_b but it's when they can actually affect people's lives, the way they can execute a character assassination of someone, and sure, the people believing the text are totally worthless, but emotionally its pretty crazy to be hated by an angry mob. for most. I have an issue with seeking negative attention but for most its a pretty bad feeling

how come when I direct a comm command to a text file I get this error saying one of the files is out of order, but is perfectly ok just displaying it in the shell?

tomorrow is Adrien-Marie Legendre's 268th birthday if anyone is interested to know that

Well see most of the things I see on fb I didn't click follow for, like matthew machoney or what ever I hate that douche but he was in my face this morning, like why cant they set up social media like stack exchange so you can select your communities and choose to be exposed to the spastic pit or not

i mean differently abled communites

it's all nonsense until they decide an election

anyone i don't want to ruin anyones day

but we all know we can buy a positive reputation on facebook on dark web markets,and I know its their own fault but simple folk are really starting to see likes as a measure of significance

Andras Deak

7:30 PM

OK, gave up on ubuntu, tried debian. Managed to convert my problem into unix.stackexchange.com/questions/552050/… :'(

(except it's not dpkg, but rather the installer installing grub)

Adam L

Debian has worked out really well for me so far considering I don't know what im doing in comparison to you guys

see wtf did I do today to deserve this twice

ffs the suit is matching the seats where is a sniper when the public need one

jesse_b

why do you want matthew mcconaughey dead? And how will the sniper see him in his camouflage suit?

Faheem Mitha

7:46 PM

@AdamL If you know that, then you probably do math. Probably applied math. Or possibly physics.

@AndrasDeak What Debian release/version?

@AdamL Glad to hear it.

Andras Deak

@FaheemMitha newest stable

10.5.0, apparently

Faheem Mitha

@AndrasDeak Hmm. And the error is coming from where? Can you paste it?

Give unstable a try. They might have fixed it. And if they haven't, file a bug report.

Andras Deak

@FaheemMitha Not at the moment. And since both ubuntu and debian die with a very similar issue it might not be their fault...

I'll try a non-uefi debian install as well...

Faheem Mitha

Note that (I seem to remember), that you can convert a standard install to an UEFI install, though it's not particularly fun, or smooth sailing.

Documentation tends to be sketchy, for example.

But you can sometimes get help on IRC. Sometimes the developers hang out there.

Adam L

8:04 PM

@jesse_b well naturally thermal visors to spot douche bags blending their clothing with environment. And no not dead just not appearing in front of me in an unsolicited fashion so I can go back pretending he is dead

Andras Deak

OK, now I see that I think all my attempts with ubuntu were actually UEFI. Trying proper debian BIOS now. If it works I might go back to ubuntu as planned...

jesse_b

@AdamL I've never even thought about him prior to this conversation. What did he do to you and don't you think that you stressing about it this much is more of a you problem than a him problem?

Adam L

8:19 PM

I just have a pet hate for people that have a career that is based entirely on a schedule of self promotion

anyway I have a question about interpreting tcpdump output should I ask it here or post it as a question?

it's just I am getting incorrect check sums from the same source ip, always with the placeholder flag, and I just want hints as to what I should investigate next

sorry the flag is either the placeholder or .P

jesse_b

8:35 PM

@AdamL You seem well adjusted

2

Adam L

8:47 PM

thanks so do you, I yeah ill run a search about all the other fields in tcpdump output and what they mean before I bother people, but I just find it weird,I like watching the traffic in different networks, and sometimes you get a cluster of packets that are just odd and out of the ordinary its good fun tcpdump has slowed my learning curve in that way because I just end up gazing at the screen instead of reading man pages

lol

Adam L

9:22 PM

@AndrasDeak is it a physical installation or a virtual?

Adam L

9:39 PM

I can't find a Windump on my CygWin64 package list

Transcript for