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21:00
@UzumakiDev run dpkg --get-selections | grep hold
but I'm guessing it more closely matches what @UzumakiDev has installed
nothing happens when I run that
I think for aptitude it's aptitude search '~ahold'
ok, try aptitude search ~ahold
@UzumakiDevt try @deroberts first. but try both of them
we gave the same thing, I just quoted it to protect from shell expansion in case he has a ahold user.
21:03
it looked like it did something but nothing was output
@derobert ok
@UzumakiDev hmm. @derobert ?
the kind of error you get does point to some kind of hold.
VM is done downloading all those packages, installing them... should only be a few more minutes until I can see if this works on the freshly-installed jessie vm
@derobert ok. seems unlikely jessie would be so badly broken.
I agree, seems unlikely.
I think I did something when I was trying to fix my drivers or upgrading
21:05
@UzumakiDev if you use aptitude, and actually go into aptitude and select steam in the UI, it should let you try to interactively fix the dependencies
@UzumakiDev try apt-get install dpkg:i386. it doesn't get more basic than that
@derobert yes, i guess that is an option. but it will probably also try to throw out a lot of stuff
nope, same again.
@FaheemMitha @UzumakiDev no, don't do that that
@UzumakiDev actually, yes, don't do that
sorry, that was bad advice
aptitude gives me this
21:07
I'd try aptitude. If it finds a terrible solution, hit , or . to scroll through them, after rejecting the parts you find terrible
you can always hit control-C to give up
@UzumakiDev what is in obsolete and locally created?
@UzumakiDev press e
@UzumakiDev if you scroll through that, is it entirely suggestions to keep currently-uninstalled packages "at their current version" (i.e., none = uninstalled)?
21:14
yep
go ahead and hit ! to apply that (accept its recommendations)
that should get you back to the main screen
well it says at the bottom leave the following recommendations unresolved
@UzumakiDev which recommendations?
Up to you if you want to try to satisfy those Recommends: lines or not...
If you don't care, pressing ! will leave them unsatisfied. Otherwise, select the one you want satisfied, press R, then press . (period)
BTW: You have some pending actions set in aptitude... we'll see what they are shortly.
21:21
ah, not quite sure what I'm doing
@UzumakiDev Which screen are you on currently?
warning: the package cache is opened in read only mode!...
@derobert do you mostly use aptitude then?
@UzumakiDev Ah. Ok. You have to run aptitude as root, either via sudo or su
@FaheemMitha yeah
.... getting there on the VM....
i pressed shift - 1 and the red message bar is gone but I didn't notice much happening
21:25
@derobert you didn't need all that to test this. and i'm sure you'll find jessie is perfectly fine.
@UzumakiDev ok, press g and see what it lists its about to do...
there's 67 of them
any idea why aptitude was left wanting to install/remove packages?
if debian testing broke dramatically like this, there would be outraged squawking all over the blogosphere.
and, also, if you look through the list, is steam one of them?
21:28
ha, no idea, probably something I did during the upgrade?
67 of what?
installs or removes?
@FaheemMitha would anyone have noticed over the systemd squabbles?
no steams
to be installed
@derobert probably yes
1 to be removed because it's not used
21:29
@UzumakiDev 67 to be installed? and what was the original command?
how do i install them from aptitude?
@FaheemMitha this is just from running aptitude, they were already pending
@UzumakiDev press g again, and it'll do those 67 things its saying its going to do
I like aptitude
never used it before
vm is booted
lol are you purely doing that to test my problem?
21:31
@UzumakiDev he is.
wow, thanks for the effort :)
The VM install is mostly sitting and waiting for it, thankfully!
so what could have caused this hold up?
@UzumakiDev Normally it'd be from using aptitude, and quitting it before actually installing/removing packages... But I think it and apt-get install share an intended action database nowadays, so it could be from apt-get oo
@derobert i don't think that is true. afaik apt-get has no "memory".
21:33
also when I upgraded I had GUI problem because the upgrade activated my neouvau driver which made my nvidia driver freak out so had to uninstall and install the debian way
other than what is in its configuration files. which is one reason i like it
OK, so it appears it's going to install fine on the VM. That's good, we're troubleshooting a problem that's actually on your machine—it's not Debian being broken.
@UzumakiDev is aptitude downloading/installing stuff now?
@derobert Do you have a pretty fast connection over there? What is your downstream speed?
@FaheemMitha 50 megabit here, I believe
@derobert wow, that's fast. so, like 50/8 megabyes per second?
21:35
yes
I have faster at home :-P
@derobert that's pretty nice. what is your home connection called?
@FaheemMitha Home one is Verizon FiOS.
At work its a cable modem with Comcast of all people.
(ok: steam installed)
yea it's done
i just did a apt-get update
@derobert oh, wow. fiber optic.
@UzumakiDev apt-get update and pressing u in aptitude do the same thing, by the way
@UzumakiDev OK, if you're back on the main screen, press / (forward slash), should bring up a search box. Put in ^steam$ to find it. You can stop typing the moment it comes up.
pressing enter should close the search box. Press + on steam to tell aptitude to install it
50-50 you'll get a red bar at the bottom, if so, go ahead and press e
@FaheemMitha I vaguely recall that apt-get tries to use aptitude's memory, at least. I think I ran into that once before. So it's possible clearing those pending actions has fixed it. Possible...
21:40
I get the red box
Ok, press e, and let's see what it says
@derobert yes, that's possible.
i don't think getting apt into that kind of tangle is possible from within apt.
i get the list of packages like before
should I press g?
no, you need to resolve the dependencies here...
screenshot?
what's it saying to do to steam, in particular?
21:44
@derobert at this point he could just try running apt-get again.
@UzumakiDev scroll down to steam, which will be under keep uninstalled, and press R. It should turn red.
then press . for the next solution
('R' tells aptitude you don't consider that an acceptable outcome. 'A' tells it you like that outcome.)
@derobert how much does your home internet cost?
@FaheemMitha I'm on a business account with static IPs for around $130/mo... You can get the same speed with a dynamic IP for less, something like $40 or $50
@derobert wow, that's a pretty good value.
Apparently they'll go up to 500mbps, but that's almost $400/mo
@UzumakiDev ah, yeah, that's aptitude getting in over its head :-(
That's the in theory it will eventually finish... you can give it a little bit and hope. Or kill it (control-C).
Next, you could try apt-get install steam again. Or check what all those local & obsolete packages are, they may be the problem.
think im going to do a fresh install
@derobert wow. i wonder if speeds like that are actually useful for anything.
straight into jessie
@FaheemMitha Well, if you were actually a business with a hundred employees at the location....
21:51
@UzumakiDev did you try running apt-get install steam again?
my nvidia card caused problems the first time i know what to do now
@derobert sure. i guess maybe a big enough group would need the bandwidth collectively. i was thinking of an individual.
@UzumakiDev i've had problems with nvidia too. not sure how it could cause these kinds of issues though
Before reinstalling, look at the local/obsolete packages
@derobert i guess i don't use aptitude because I don't like tools that think they are smarter than I am. :-)
what am I looking out for?
21:55
Those are packages that are installed on your machine, but aren't in the archive... Usually, you'd want to remove them.
Unless you still need the package, or it is actually a local package (something you built yourself).
@derobert What is the fast way of showing locally installed packages? on the command line
well, if I do a fresh install wont it all get wiped anyway? I'm going to reformat the drive
@UzumakiDev yeah, if you do a fresh install, everything will be wiped
if you want to do that, make sure to grab the jessie installer
im going to go straight into jessie, this was my first debian install on a machine with nvidia cards
ah yes
that's the plan
but you really shouldn't need to.
21:57
I went wheezy not knowing steam needed jessie repos
there's a hacky way of installing steam on wheezy
i thought upgrading would be more simple....
@UzumakiDev you can install steam on wheezy, no problem.
i just tried it, it doesn't complain
lame... I swear I read somewhere it needed jessie or sid repos?
it has to get steam itself from jessie, but all the dependencies are satisfied in wheezy
of course, it is possibly it would not work properly, but you could try it
@UzumakiDev i'd recommend staying with stable unless you are fairly experienced
21:59
so if I was on wheezy I'd just change my sources.list to jessie?
sudo apt-get install steam?
@UzumakiDev no, not exactly. if you do that, you will end up upgrading to jessie
you need to add jessie sources and then pin jessie to a lower priority
see man apt_preferences
@UzumakiDev what happened with the apt-get install steam on your current install? Does it still fail?
@UzumakiDev bummer
wonder what the problem is.
yea i know, just found out my dad has lung cancer too, that's why I disappeared earlier, shit times all round
I'd guess one of those local/obsolete packages
@UzumakiDev wow, sorry about that. That sucks
22:03
yea, fixing problems help take my mind off of it
thanks
@UzumakiDev oh, very sorry to hear that. some days are just bad
im going to make a jessie install
@UzumakiDev Ok. Take care. Sorry we couldn't sort out your problem.
ha, thanks for your time guys. Appreciated.
@UzumakiDev at least we know from the VM that the fresh install will work.
22:08
was that a jessie install?
@derobert like I said, testing could not possibly break that badly. unstable, maybe.
@UzumakiDev yes, that was a jessie install, from debian-jessie-DI-a1-amd64-netinst.iso
I used the amd64 netinst, but you may want one of the larger ones
you may want to use jigdo to get the images, if so do that before blowing away your current install...
you'll have a lot of the packages already downloaded in /var/cache/apt/archives
@derobert you use jigdo. I used it once, but not for a long time. now i just do a net install and pull stuff down
@FaheemMitha I've wanted to make bd-r and dvd-r images before to hand to someone with a slow connection.
oh yea, I used a CD install last time
22:12
@derobert oh, right
see ya later guys I'm off. Got some other work to do, thanks for the help.
@UzumakiDev Good night, and my best wishes to your dad.
@derobert you really should write that getting to know you question. are you Clark Kent?
@FaheemMitha Maybe! Or I could just be a mushroom. You never know on the Internet.
i bet you wear glasses and are mild-mannered.
@derobert Nah, I think the mushroom thing is taken.
There is only room for one mushroom on the net.
22:20
Yep. Ask the folks on the cooking site.
Surely they'd recognize a mushroom better than the folks on the Unix site.
@derobert It would be closed as off-topic, probably.
You could try their chat room. Nothing is off-topic there.
@derobert I've never spent time in there. Is it called the Happy Pastry?
@derobert boring
22:22
Boring? Depends on who's around.
hmm, lots of americans by the look of things
@derobert I meant the name
You could always try engaging the hellhound in a discussion about philosophy. Or get the hellhound and the not-quite-crazy-cat-person in an argument about linguistics.
@FaheemMitha Cerberus and rumtscho aren't American.
@derobert no idea who those people are, but they sound intriguing
i think @goldilocks might enjoy that more than I would.
oh, cerberus. the two headed dog guarding the gates of Hades
Well, Cerberus is the three-headed hellhound, currently residing in the Netherlands. SAJ is the not quite crazy cat person. I think he's currently short two cats to be a crazy cat person.
@derobert my bad, three heads.
Well, I guess I'm off. Take care, @derobert. And everyone else.
22:28
Yep. I'm leaving in a second, too.
@derobert good of you to spend so much time walking him through the aptitude thing.
I thought everyone used aptitude...
I guess I switched to it back when it, and only it, remembered auto-installed packages and could uninstall them automatically
@derobert far from it. I think apt-get is much more popular these days. It is more predictable.
Though ironically, as I observed here a few days ago, it was only originally intended as a demo program.
I used apt-get for distro upgrades, when there are a lot of packages being upgraded, and aptitude would surely fail
@derobert why surely?
22:35
because its dependency resolver works way too hard (as we say it start to do on the steam install)... mainly, I think it searches the wrong paths first
I've heard the problem its trying to solve is NP-complete.
And, well, apt-get's simple but not as perfect solution is much faster... and usually works well enough. At least if you are willing to do a few manual hints
Or fix the mess afterwards.
@derobert I find it usually works pretty well. Like I said, it lets you do the thinking, which I prefer. It doesn't try to be smart.
anyway, good night!
good night, @derobert
23:24
well, I got pinged about a question...
0
Q: make grep confirm all matches

mightyuhuI am writing a "unit test" for a bunch of .tex files and want to check for incorrect entity names, e.g. "Data Items" instead of "DataItems". Currently, I use grep to search for the incorrect versions: grep -i "Data items" *.tex however, the list is pretty large, also there are false positives...

I've edited it to make it clearer, based on OP's saying my comment is the correct understanding.
I voted to re-open... should be in the queue now.
(I'm home, and going afk shortly)
slm
slm
@derobert voted to reopen, need 3 more, @graeme @casey @terdon
my guess is that the answer to that question is going to have to be TeX-specific, since its very hard to store metadata about particular words in arbitrary text files...
@FaheemMitha not sure if you're still around, looking for reopen votes unix.stackexchange.com/questions/121074/…
23:41
two more
It's time to go to sleep so have a good night or end of day or morning.
see you in 10 hours
chrome and dpkg experts needed, askubuntu.com/q/438411/169736, what this guy did?
Why am getting only 19 points for an UV + accepted answer?
*2 UV
Aah, it is because of the reputation cap is it? First time I scored more than 200 points in a day :) Yipeee!!!!

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