Language Overflow

Man_From_India

01:04

@snailplane tjanks. i have seen in articles in websites. But very rare with yes.

Damkerng T.

@Man_From_India Good morning!

I guess the phrase (My money is on 'something') would probably be easier to understand if you'd tried roulette (or know how it plays).

In that game, a player bets by putting their money (or chips) on some number. :D

4

Q: Can Yesterday be used for Tomorrow?

In a recent episode of TV series Suits (which revolves around Lawyers) character Mike says the line: You heard Cahill. He needs an answer yesterday. Isn't it incorrect English? Can yesterday be used for tomorrow? If so what are the rules? I heard a similar use of yesterday in the same TV ...

Sometimes idioms aren't readily understandable!

Nihilist_Frost

01:22

My grandpa uses /ʐ/ for the Vietnamese R and my mom uses /r/!

or something similar

Man_From_India

@DamkerngT. good morning!

I was going through your discussion about tense. Very nice :-)

Damkerng T.

@Nihilist_Frost I have no idea what /ʐ/ sounds like!

@Man_From_India Thanks! :D

Nihilist_Frost

hmmm

Man_From_India

@DamkerngT. but your answer to that question on ELL is really great.

Nihilist_Frost

maybe it might not be /ʐ/

Damkerng T.

01:25

@Man_From_India Thanks, again!

Man_From_India

It's really hard to go through the change from traditional grammar to modern grammar.

I mean for a learner.

Damkerng T.

I think so. I guess it's like going from Windows to Linux or Mac OS X. :P

Nihilist_Frost

0

Q: "Are" at the End of a Statement (a statement that is not an indirect question)

Why is it okay to use "are" at the end of a statement? I found a page here that talks about verbs at the end of indirect questions, but I am specifically looking for an answer about why "are" can be used at the end of a statement that is not an indirect question. For example: I won't do th...

grammar sentence-construction verb sentence-structure

Man_From_India

Hehe

See you later.

Damkerng T.

See you around!

I guess I'll head out as well.

Man_From_India

01:29

Oh btw I don't think that sentence in Java's answer is incorrect without context.

> what would happen if they stop paying you?

0

A: Correct way of using - "Both"

The role of both...and in NP (Noun Phrase) structure is of a Correlative coordinator. Example - ... both interesting and challenging problem. Generally it's ungrammatical to place a pre-head dependent like the, a or other determiner, adjectives etc before both when it's used as a correla...

Nihilist_Frost

about the "are at the end", seems that indirect questions do not trigger inversion

CowperKettle

02:18

Sawasdee khrap!

> Wish you were close to me, but the way is sealed
Over trail and footpath, over barley field
For it snowed all morn, and it snowed all night
Now my soul is black, though the snow is white

Ольга Павловська, Євгенія Крикун. Я знайду доріженьку

►

Translated the first stanza

Very loosely, because it's impossible to translate the words literally

I tried to recreate the song in the English romance song style

CowperKettle

02:47

A draft version of the second stanza

> Where the river flows, where the willow stands
Where we came to kiss and to hold our hands
Snow has fallen thick, snow is shining white
But it's black to me, for you're out of sight

CowperKettle

03:09

And the last one

> Let the branches sway, let the blizzard start
It's a summer's day when you're in my heart
Let it snow all night, let it snow all day
To my darling one I will find the way

Overall, quite close to the original

Anonymous

04:42

Very nice :-)

Anonymous

Yes, someone should talk about subject–auxiliary inversion being a main clause phenomenon. Maybe I will tomorrow :-)

DEAD

07:22

@snailplane Where?

Damkerng T.

08:03

@CowperKettle Sawasdee khrap!

DEAD

@DamkerngT. \o

Damkerng T.

@CowperKettle This poem sounds like a sonnet! :)

@DEAD o/

DEAD

Has Jim's absence begun?

Damkerng T.

o_O

DEAD

Why o_O?

Damkerng T.

08:06

@DEAD Why would you expect his absence?

Did I miss something?

DEAD

'cause he said a while earlier that he'd be gone for some time.

And he wasn't gone.

So I had to make sure.

Whoops

Damkerng T.

Oh! I'm just happy that he's around.

I'm happy that everyone is around!

DEAD

I'm just unhappy that he's around, but at least the feeling is mutual

You said in your last comment that Posts put up by learners need not be of very high quality. Roughly, what is the minimum question quality you accept to be on ELL? — DEAD 7 secs ago

Damkerng T.

Ah, I haven't read his answer yet!

(The picture of Loki and his popcorn scared me! :P)

DEAD

@DamkerngT. Well, his answer is full of irrelevant memes.

That said

Doesn't feel like a right way to end the answer to a question that asks what you'd do if you disagree with a mod.

Damkerng T.

08:20

Argh!

DEAD

How is stuff going on in your end of the world?

Damkerng T.

Fine enough, thanks! :-)

(Hopefully, unlike that photo!)

DEAD

It's only a month until school starts.

I do feel like swinging a sword in the air.

Damkerng T.

I heard that it's more intense over there.

DEAD

A nerd such as me should actually be happy about schools recommencing, but I know too much about the world to feel exceptionally happy now.

@DamkerngT. It is? Who knew

Why would stuff here be intense?

Unless boring has found a new meaning.

Damkerng T.

08:25

@DEAD I heard about something happened in a place near you.

DEAD

Turkey?

Damkerng T.

@DEAD I tried to avoid mentioning the name.

DEAD

Yeah well, I guess that's close enough to Tabriz, but I don't feel stressful.

Damkerng T.

@DEAD Phew!

DEAD

The police is already fighting a lot of terrorists in the borders.

Damkerng T.

08:27

nods

DEAD

They haven't succeeded in doing anything here.

Although, I think IS is now a lost cause for its creators.

They will come up with something even more frightening in a near future.

Damkerng T.

scared!

DEAD

How can robots be scared?

I mean, look at their games.

Damkerng T.

LOL

DEAD

They made Al Qaeda. People were scared at first, but then got used to them.

Damkerng T.

08:30

@DEAD Maybe it's because of the First Rule.

DEAD

@DamkerngT. Of thermodynamics?

Damkerng T.

Of robotics!

Should I quote it or make a presentation for it?

DEAD

Both

Damkerng T.

Hehe!

I'm lazy. :P

Hey, I think I found an odd usage in a law!

3 laws of robotics - iRobot Movie 2004

►

> Law II
A robot must obey orders given it by human beings except where such orders would conflict with the first law.

"given it"? Not "given to it"?

I guess it's okay, but I think it'd sound better with to.

(Maybe I've spotted this oddness before and can't remember it. Not sure.)

DEAD

I can remember you spotting it

What is rule #1 anyway?

My IP switcher is off and so I can't access YouTube.

Damkerng T.

08:40

> Law I
A robot may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.

DEAD

Aww

If I were a human I would've been touched.

Damkerng T.

:D

CowperKettle

09:23

@DamkerngT. Thank you! I'll to translate the song about a girl with cheese pies next

Damkerng T.

:D

CowperKettle

Дмитро Гнатюк - З сиром пироги

►

This one: "And Cheese-Topped Pies"

> A Cossack was a-walking, was just a-walking by,
And saw a girl that went her way and carried a pie
Oh, yes-yes-yes, oh yes-yes-yes, and carried a pie

Something like this. (0:

Damkerng T.

@CowperKettle I heard "chumachu machu machuma, machu machu mapey" :-)

CowperKettle

@DamkerngT. It's a set of meaningless words, I used "yes-yes-yes", but I'm not sure

Damkerng T.

I guess I heard "pie" as "pey" :D

CowperKettle

09:31

These words are just like spacers

Damkerng T.

Ahh

CowperKettle

It's "Oh, chuli chuli chuly, oh, chuli chuli vi" ("vi" means "you" (plural you))

Damkerng T.

A-ha! Thanks!

CowperKettle

Anytime!

> Oh, girl my dear, don't pass me by,
Don't let the Cossack cry,
You know I truly love you – and that delicious pie!
Oh, yes-yes-yes, oh yes-yes-yes, and that delicious pie!

In the next stanza, the girl invites him over for a piece of pie

In the next, they are happy together: she kisses him while he eats a pie.

In the next, enemies come near, and he hides in bushes

In the next, the enemies take the girl and the pie

Damkerng T.

Ah, it's tragedy!

CowperKettle

09:38

In the next, he says: "take the girl, but give me back my pie!"

(0:

Damkerng T.

LOL

CowperKettle

The end.

DEAD

13:22

@CowperKettle What a revealing moment

Jim Reynolds

13:36

Did someone call for a Supreme Authority to this room?

I am here to solve the most insolveable, the most uncomprehensively impossible issues.

And I do it without performing any research.

@DEAD O.O

DEAD

o.o

Jim Reynolds

o.0

DEAD

If that's not enough for you you better double-check your expectations.

Jim Reynolds

Felicitous

Could add a comma

Probably better with one

DEAD

You expect commas on the internet?

3 mins ago, by DEAD

If that's not enough for you you better double-check your expectations.

Jim Reynolds

13:46

The internet is real!

If there's one thing reality needs, it's commas.

DEAD

It needs comas.

Jim Reynolds

O.O

Courtesy notice: You are in need of a psychiatric assessment.

DEAD

@JimReynolds You already assessed me psychiatricistically

I wonder if istically can go on forever.

Jim Reynolds

Only for linguisticists who support the viability of isticims and itsticy-like istinesses.

DEAD

16:01

Woosh

Anonymous

17:40

Woosh?

DEAD

17:55

5

Q: Shall we experiment?

Overview There has been some concerns lately about whether we close too much. So we start giving leniency a chance. Scroll down to What we do to get to the fun part. Read the rest if you're interested. Why we do It's all about answers. Whatever we do here, whether it is commenting, asking, an...

discussion homework experiment vote-to-close

Yes, I actually forgot to link the meta post.

Man_From_India

18:40

In another forum (wordreference.com) I found an interesting discussion. It revolves around the use of preposition. The same sentence were written twice. In one the preposition is used transitivily and in the other the same preposition intransitivily.

> Would you miss having her around?

> Would you miss having her around you?

Interestingly all the commenters, native and non native alike, find both the sentences having two different meaning. They find the first one to be normal. And the other one really odd, one commenter even claimed it might be incorrect. And je is a native speaker.

DEAD

@DEAD, the posts should have a minimum quality, and by minimum, I mean that they should be understandable to atleast some of the other users on ELL. They can, in turn,help out the OP,or even edit the post to make it clearer to other users. On the other hand, some posts are far too difficult to follow. In such cases,the OP should edit the posts seeking some help, or the post must be closed. In no case do we want the OP to be left with a wrong answer: An answer a user has provided, based on his understanding of the question, but is actually not what the OP meant. Such posts ought to be closed. — Varun KN 39 mins ago

What

@Man_From_India They do have different meanings.

Having someone around doesn't mean they're around you.

@Man_From_India The second is certainly not incorrect, but far less common than the first.

I trust natives that don't have any background in English grammar for their intuition on what I shouldn't use, not what's wrong.

Man_From_India

They say that the second sentence seems odd because with the mention of you at the end sounds like she is similar to some sort of shawl or something similar wrapped around you. I find that very strange. If they are right, the concept of transitivity/intransitivily of preposition is going to get hurt badly.

@DEAD right. It might be, might not be. Around what? That to be decided from context. But without any context, with just that sentence, it seems likely that she is near me.

DEAD

That does mean they have different meanings.

At the very least, the second one removes any ambiguity.

However, I don't think it's implied that she would be around me if she's just around.

That would just mean she's accessible. But it may just be my interpretation.

Man_From_India

@DEAD nods. But they think that first one means she is nearby. Very strange!

@DEAD you are actually right. It can mean anything. With no context we can't come to any conclusion.

@DEAD (on a lighter vein) so you don't trust that slow-being on a fast vehicle who visit this place quite often and who is right now competing with you on moderator election and who I voted :P

(I voted for you too)

DEAD

18:59

@Man_From_India She deserves this spot more than me.

Actually, if there was a fair judge watching from afar, he'd easily judge that I'm the 5th, at best.

Man_From_India

I just joked on your comment that you trust only those natives who don't have knowledge in grammar for what you shouldn't use :D

I understand what you mean.

Damkerng T.

19:18

Googling for "always around her" should tell us something about the usage.

Damkerng T.

21:12

Grammatical terminology recommended by the LAGB for use in schools

(via Stoney's meta post: meta.ell.stackexchange.com/a/3193/3281)

Thanks, @StoneyB!

I was sure that they must've had something like this but I didn't know where to look. Now I know!

StoneyB

21:30

@DamkerngT. Glad you liked it; and I was glad to find it. Not that I intend to follow it in every detail!, but it's a useful resource and a judicious account of the problematic areas.

Damkerng T.

I haven't really started reading it yet, but I sure will!

(BTW, I spotted Bas Aarts in the list of the committee! :-)

StoneyB

Yes, he seems to do a little bit of everything. I have his Oxford Grammar, but I know him primarily as a corpus investigator of trends in contemporary syntax.

Damkerng T.

> Tense and aspect: the glossary recognises periphrastic tenses as well as the simple inflected ones, while recognising ‘aspect’ as a possible name for progressive and maybe perfect; but it argues against a periphrastic future tense.

Ah! It sounds like he's really in the committee. :D

Catija

Hey all! Exciting news. I'm no longer two people in one. :D

Damkerng T.

@Catija Congratulations! How is the other you doing? :)

Catija

21:35

7

Damkerng T.

Aww

Catija

He is doing beautifully. :D He arrived August 25th at 9:23 pm. Had the nurse in today to check on him and everything looks great.

Damkerng T.

That's really great news!

Has he gotten his name yet?

(Ah, maybe it's a bit too personal. Feel free to ignore my question!)

Catija

Bennett Alexander is his name. :)

Damkerng T.

Nice name!

Hello, young Bennett!

Damkerng T.

21:52

I can't stay long today. Anyway, it's nice to see you again (and the cute baby, too!) Congratulations, and all the best to both the mother and the baby! @Catija

Catija

22:09

Aww, thanks :D Have a good Sunday!

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