Language Overflow - 2016-08-17 (page 1 of 2)

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CowperKettle

00:18

> If you put five furniture manuals from IKEA around yourself in a pentagram and pronounce the product codes of five furniture items, you will have summoned the Devil. However, he will appear in disassembled form.

2

Sawasdee khrap. I dunno why I woke up at 5:20 am

StoneyB

00:45

@CowperKettle Not enough to drink last night?

Man_From_India

@DamkerngT. Nice to see you answer in the main site after a long time :-) And what a fine explanation!

Good evening @StoneyB

StoneyB

Hello, @Man_From_India

Man_From_India

how is everything going?

StoneyB

S l o o o o w l y

Howboutchu?

Man_From_India

It's early morning here. 6.21 AM. Planning to read a little bit, preparing for some sort of exam. Don't know how I'll clear it. I get very little time :'(

StoneyB

00:56

I hope you figure out what sort of exam it is -- it would be a pity to study for a chemistry exam and find out it's history!

Man_From_India

@StoneyB it's not chemistry exam. I studied electronics and communication in college, and after my service as a vlsi engineer, I forgot other stuffs whatever I studied in college. So a little bit under stress.

StoneyB

Oh, well, if you're an engineer, you're in like Flynn. Engineers make the world go 'round.

Man_From_India

@StoneyB hehe

StoneyB

Fact. My father-in-law said so, and he should know.

CowperKettle

01:33

@StoneyB I am a teatotalling kettle

The weather is horrible

It's 6:30, and already +21 C

CowperKettle

01:46

@Man_From_India - good luck on your exam, Man ji!

CowperKettle

02:17

> Replace air filter No. 1 (closest to the sterilization zone) of filtration class H14.

I wonder if it's okay.

They wanted to say that this filter has a filtration efficiency rating H14

Jim Reynolds

03:07

@DamkerngT. Your great-grandfather pouched his coal

Man_From_India

03:31

@CowperKettle thank u kettle.

Jim Reynolds

04:12

@CowperKettle It's grammatically ok, but could be more reader-friendly: Replace af No 1, a filtration class H14 unit located closest to the sz.

CowperKettle

05:09

Thank you, @JimReynolds!

1 hour later…

Damkerng T.

06:14

@Man_From_India Thanks!

@JimReynolds Haha!

1 hour later…

Damkerng T.

07:16

@Man_From_India Hope you've done well!

Damkerng T.

07:41

4

A: "To death" vs "to the death"

A very good question! OALD says that both are idioms! to death (without the article) means extremely, very much. But when you add the article... to the death it means until you 'die' That's the reason, when you say starve to death, it means you are famished But defend/fighting to ...

I don't like it much (but I upvoted the answer anyway).

It's not really enlightening, even though OALD defines it that way.

Actually, I don't think OADL did a good job in explaining this, if we focus only on the difference between to death and to the death.

Too many senses, and too many idioms on their page, so I'm not going to quote them. (I don't even know where I should start!)

Anyway, it's here: oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/definition/english/death?q=death

> do something to death
= to do or perform something so often that people become tired of seeing or hearing it
'That joke's been done to death.'

> to death
= extremely; very much to be bored to death
'I'm sick to death of your endless criticism.'

Maybe this is why I like being a lumper than a splitter.

The more you split the senses, the more it's confusing.

DEAD

Hmph.

Arbitrary distinctions make this more bureaucratic and confusing at the same time.

Damkerng T.

nods

DEAD

They make everything more bureaucratic and confusing at the same time.

I just realized I'd do anything not to spell "bureaucratic" again.

The composite vowels are messed up.

Damkerng T.

Maybe by doing so, it helps their sales, because it looks more dense, and hence more creditable to many. -- shrug

Different dictionaries, different styles.

1

A: "To death" vs "to the death"

"To the death" is used as an idiom with verbs and nouns meaning "fight" We shall fight to the death A battle to the death It means "until one party is dead" although it may be used figuratively. The expression can also occur in non idiomatic situations: "protesters reacted to the death of the...

I like the "figuratively" point in this answer.

It's also true that both to death and to the death can be figurative.

Maybe to death is used figuratively more often. Not very sure.

johnchae

08:18

Good afternoon, everyone :)

I just read some of the candidate's posts for the moderator positions. +1 for TIPS for being honest, I was expecting some trolling in your post to be quite honest ^^. Either way, I'd vote for you.

And @DamkerngT. Why won't you take part in the election, I was hoping that I could read your application because I think you'd fit the position well since you spend a lot of time helping/editing... on the site.

Damkerng T.

@johnchae Thanks! I have my personal reasons. Hope you understand.

DEAD

@johnchae \o

@johnchae q_q why?

I'm always a serious person.

Like in the message above.

johnchae

@DamkerngT. I see ^^

Damkerng T.

@DEAD :D

johnchae

@DEAD Hehe

@DEAD I lol'd hard at "I'm younger than most people that read this nomination." tbh.

:p

DEAD

08:31

Well, some people might consider age a factor.

I personally don't, but I'm not sure if I would if it favored me. :P

Cardinal

08:46

Hi guys

This is a test from of my grammar book:

>*Fill the blank space using these words (it-reverse-wall)*

>*The back of car looked as if ....... .*

The answer in the book is: **it had been reversed into a wall**

I cannot imagine how looks back of the car?

Damkerng T.

My grammatron screams "We need a before that wall!"

Cardinal

@DamkerngT. You are right

Damkerng T.

This reverse is something like driving in the reverse gear.

Cardinal

Awo

From that point of view

Damkerng T.

nods -- Make sense?

Cardinal

08:50

I mean they mean they were on the back of the car

Like truck and this kind of thing

They experience deriving in a reverse fashion !

Damkerng T.

The back of (the) car looked as if it (the car) had been reversed into a wall.

@Cardinal Yes!

Oh, hmm... it's a kind of accident that happens often enough.

Sometimes it's really tragic.

DEAD

user image

Cardinal

I had never sit back of the moving car; It was a weird experience; The back of the car looked as if thing getting far from us, ...

Damkerng T.

@DEAD They stopped before they decided to crash the car into another car!

DEAD

@DamkerngT. "Oh, shit. How did I end up here? Oh well, let's get the job done"

Cardinal

08:55

@DamkerngT. What do you refer? You mean my problem with understanding?

Damkerng T.

@DEAD Haha!

@Cardinal I mean those accidents.

Cardinal

:D

DEAD

user image

Damkerng T.

user image

DEAD

@DamkerngT. :o

Damkerng T.

08:57

@DEAD It had happened far too often before that device was invented.

Cardinal

Can we use "would have + PP" when "if clause" contains "simple past"?

DEAD

user image

Damkerng T.

@DEAD Oh, no! That's very scary!

DEAD

@Cardinal If I were you, I would've written examples that contain "would've + pp".

Damkerng T.

@Cardinal I think you can, but I would avoid using it the best I can in essay writing.

(And a lot of it would depend on the real words in those clauses.)

DEAD

09:00

@DamkerngT. Oh? Have you seen this famous GIF?

Damkerng T.

Argh!

Survival chance: 0.01%

DEAD

user image

Cardinal

@DEAD It was just curiosity.

johnchae

I'm not clicking it @DEAD

:(

DEAD

Well, whatever

@Cardinal No, take a second look at the structure of my sentence.

i.imgur.com/FFM2n40.mp4

Cardinal

09:07

Now consider this:
> You would know what you have to do if you hadn't been absent from school on Friday.

It is from my grammar book.

I think 4 conditionals are just a kidding !

johnchae

@DEAD Yay, GTA :D

Damkerng T.

@Cardinal The sooner you quit using them, the better! :D

DEAD

@Cardinal Well, don't try to categorize conditionals.

You'll turn into TCh.

Cardinal

I see

Which actress do you like the most?

Damkerng T.

I had quite a few favorite actresses. Maybe the first Hollywood actress that I've to like is Elizabeth Perkins. I really like her in He said, she said.

(I guess you may not know her! But that's okay! :)

Cardinal

09:18

Yes, I didn't know her

I like Anne Hathaway

Damkerng T.

@Cardinal She's good, too!

Cardinal

^_^ :D

Damkerng T.

*I've come to like

Cardinal

<My connection sucks>

Damkerng T.

Hmm... Googling for "hollywood actresses" returns a one-box of "Top 10 Hottest Actresses in Hollywood"!

I think "hotness" is a very important factor to most people.

Cardinal

09:21

@DamkerngT. yes

@DamkerngT. :D :v :v

Damkerng T.

:D

Oh, yes! Zoe Saldana nails it in most movies she's been in.

I think she's a part of the success of Avatar.

Cardinal

nods

Damkerng T.

Audrey Hepburn is kind of timeless to me.

Cardinal

I watched a documentary about her

but, I didn't watched it completely, skimming the movie ?

Watching partially

Damkerng T.

I think Breakfast at Tiffany is one of the movies I can watch again, and again, and again. :D

Of the list Top 10 Hottest Actresses in Hollywood, if I can pick three, I guess I'll pick Emma Stone, Charlize Theron, and Scarlett Johansson (in the list's order).

DEAD

09:33

imgur.com/gallery/T7xRe

Damkerng T.

Haha! -- Huh? What's with the accusation?!

DEAD

IKR

Cardinal

Breakfast at Tiffany's (film)

Breakfast at Tiffany's is a 1961 American romantic comedy film directed by Blake Edwards and written by George Axelrod, loosely based on Truman Capote's novella of the same name. Starring Audrey Hepburn and George Peppard, and featuring Patricia Neal, Buddy Ebsen, Martin Balsam, and Mickey Rooney, the film was initially released on October 5, 1961 by Paramount Pictures. Hepburn's portrayal of Holly Golightly as the naïve, eccentric socialite is generally considered to be the actress's most memorable and identifiable role. Hepburn regarded it as one of her most challenging roles, since she was an...

:D

DEAD

Usain Bolt stopped the interview to hear the U.S. anthem

Good man, Usain

Damkerng T.

@DEAD Nice!

Cardinal

09:42

Yes, the same meaning, but the second one is ungrammatical because the preposition "about" does not license (permit) a that- clause as complement. Note that you can say "It was more about the fact that I was obsessed with the job". — BillJ 9 mins ago

Damkerng T.

Good point!

DEAD

Pood goint!

How many prepositions allow subordinate clauses as complements?

Cardinal

It shouldn't be a big number

:D

DEAD

Is 0.0000573891 a big number?

Cardinal

big and small are relative notions

:p

Mattew

09:53

Hello

DEAD

Hullo @Mat! Welcome to chat!

Mattew

Thanks!

@DEAD Did you are proposed like mod?

DEAD

Yep, I'm the chat flagship in ELL's mod election.

If only @Dam could fix his "personal reasons"

Mattew

Ok :)

@DEAD How old are you?

Anonymous

@DEAD Depends on what you consider to be a preposition :-)

Mattew

09:58

@DEAD No, It isn't neither 1.

DEAD

@snailplane I consider all prepositions to be prepositions. No further details

Damkerng T.

Hi, @Mattew! Welcome to the chat room!

DEAD

@Mattew Seventeen

Damkerng T.

Hello, @snailplane!

Mattew

@DamkerngT. Thanks

@DEAD Oh ok

I'm 14.

DEAD

09:59

Hullo @Snail. Don't tell me you're not gonna run

Mattew

lol

Anonymous

It would be strange for me to run since I've hardly shown up on the site in months.

Mattew

@DEAD Are you a native english?

DEAD

@Mattew Well, I might look like seventeen, but I have the spirit of a seven-year-old!

Vote for DEAD! Vote for DEAD!

2

Mattew

Why?

@DEAD How to I can vote u?

Anonymous

10:02

I'll have more time for ELL in a few months I hope :-)

Damkerng T.

@snailplane Yay!

DEAD

@snailplane \o/

@Mattew The election will begin in a few days.

But you need more reputation to be able to vote.

Mattew

Ok :)

Cardinal

@DEAD :)

Mattew

Ah ok, I would like vote you but I can't, The next time I will do.

@DEAD Are you a native english?

Cardinal

10:05

@Mattew Why?

DEAD

@Mattew No, I'm not a native English speaker. Just a learner.

Mattew

Just curiosity.

Ok

Cardinal

Why do you mean you cannot vote for?

DEAD

@Cardinal You need 150 reputation to vote in the election.

Mattew

I can't vote @DEAD because I haven't enough reputation.

@DEAD I'm a language learners since 1 year too.

Where are you from guys?

DEAD

10:07

Only a year? Your English is very good considering the time you've spent on it.

Cardinal

You can ask several questions or even answer them

Mattew

@DEAD Thanks, I think my English suck anyway.

Cardinal

what is the election date @DEAD?

DEAD

@Mattew No, that shows you've got some talent. Keep going

Mattew

@DEAD Ok, thanks!

DEAD

10:09

@Cardinal Well, per the election page, nominations close in 5 days and the election ends in Aug 30.

Mattew

@DEAD Where are you from? I'm Iranian, you?

DEAD

I'm Iranian as well.

Mattew

Ok :)

DEAD

Jul 14 at 18:34, by Færd

Heh, this chat room is brimming with Iranians.

CC @Dam

Mattew

lol

Damkerng T.

10:11

@DEAD :D

Cardinal

If I become the Mod., I will ban Irannians from joining ELL, I will make ELL great again

Damkerng T.

LOL

Mattew

@DEAD شما فارسی صحبت می کنند؟

Cardinal

Again, those google translate guys :D

DEAD

@Cardinal I'll build a wall to keep ELUians away

Mattew

10:11

@DEAD Do you use Tor, right?

DEAD

Tor? No

Mattew

Oh ok

DEAD

@Mattew Yep.

Cardinal

@Mattew That proves you're an Iranian person

:D

Mattew

@Cardinal Why?

I use Tor because I need it to use Facebook.

Cardinal

10:14

Because, ما فارسی صحبت می کنیم نه می کنند

Mattew

AHHAAHAH Ok

Cardinal

Where are you from pal?

I haven't been persuaded that you speak Farsi yet

Mattew

I live in Teheran

I'm in the capital

Cardinal

Sorry, that doesn't change anything

Mattew

I didn't understood what you want.

Cardinal

10:18

:D

Mattew

Do you mean I don't speak Farsi?

Cardinal

@Mattew That isn't important

Damkerng T.

Attention! / Achtung! / !خبردار : Please add subtitles when you use languages other than English! Thank you for your cooperation! :D

Mattew

Ok.

Cardinal

I meant your Persian was as wrong as "I speaks English"

@DamkerngT. Sorry

Mattew

10:20

Ok.

DEAD

@DamkerngT. (ﾉ＾◡＾)ﾉ︵ ┻━┻

Damkerng T.

@Cardinal Don't worry. I wasn't serious. But it'd be better if we do that because everyone will understand what's going on in the chat. :D

Mattew

0

Q: A word to refer who doesn't want study anything

I need to know if there is a word to refer who doesn't want study anything, who is a bad student etc. Ex. He was a bad student because he didn't study anything. I would like know if I can replace "didn't study anything" with an adjective.

word-request adjectives

Cardinal

@DamkerngT. شما فارسی صحبت می کنند؟ is wrong; the suffix after the verb is nonsense

Damkerng T.

nods

(Not that I know what it says! :D)

Cardinal

10:25

:D

DEAD

@DamkerngT. Well, it's interesting, really. There are two types of pronouns in Persian.

The first group are like English's.

Mattew

linguisticsociety.org/content/why-major-linguistics I like this article :3

I suggest to everyone read this.

Cardinal

@DamkerngT. the to+infinitive is "فکر کردن"; the wrong suffix is "ند" as in "کنند"; the correct suffix is "ید" as in "کنید"

Damkerng T.

I guess it should've been شما فارسی صحبت می کنید, maybe?

Cardinal

Excellent

Damkerng T.

10:28

A-ha!

DEAD

And that sentence is an echo question.

Cardinal

that "می" part is prefix making progressive tense

DEAD

Formed like a normal statement, but with rising intonation, and a question mark.

@Cardinal Progressive is an aspect, not a tense.

Cardinal

"می کنید" = You are doing

Damkerng T.

@DEAD What would the non-echo version look like?

DEAD

10:30

@DamkerngT. ایا شما فارسی صحبت می کنید

Damkerng T.

@DEAD Thanks!

Cardinal

@DEAD I see, thanks for the correction

Mattew

@DEAD What school are you in?

Cardinal

All Persian aspects and tenses are based on suffixes and prefixes

DEAD

@DamkerngT. "ایا", pronounced /ʌjʌ/, is used to form yes/no interrogatives. It serves part of the auxiliary "is"'s role in "Is your letter done?"

@Cardinal I disagree. Some of them are periphrastic.

@Mattew A normal school

Well, not so normal.

It's a gifted school or whatever

Damkerng T.

10:33

ایا ~ aux., شما = you, فارسی = Farsi, فارسی = speak, می ~ particle, کنید ~ another aux.?

Mattew

@DEAD Ok

Cardinal

@DEAD I meant in the formal context; I agree "all" is always too strong whenit comes to languages

Damkerng T.

Looks like ایا is something like "yes/no".

DEAD

@DamkerngT. صحبت = speak

Cardinal

"آیا" works similar to do-support

It is used for making questions

DEAD

10:36

@DamkerngT. You can call کنید a light verb.

Damkerng T.

@DEAD Eh? (Japanese eh) But there isn't صحبت in the sentence!

DEAD

5 mins ago, by DEAD

@DamkerngT. ایا شما فارسی صحبت می کنید

Damkerng T.

Oh, I missed it!

Thanks!

Cardinal

How do you put phonetics marks here?

Damkerng T.

@Cardinal Like IPA characters?

Cardinal

10:39

Yes, as what already @DEAD mentioned

DEAD

@Cardinal westonruter.github.io/ipa-chart/keyboard

Damkerng T.

This is also useful: westonruter.github.io/ipa-chart/keyboard

Heh! It's the same page!

DEAD

Also this: westonruter.github.io/ipa-chart/keyboard

Here's another one, pretty useful: westonruter.github.io/ipa-chart/keyboard

Cardinal

Crl+c Crl+v ?

DEAD

@Cardinal Ja

Cardinal

10:41

I thought there are special codes

DEAD

There could be something implemented in Windows but I can't remember all that code.

Cardinal

nods

what does "... as if steering a bus through a sharp bend" mean?

Damkerng T.

0

A: What's wrong in the sentence: "I think it best to be well-prepared for the exam"

There is nothing wrong or not understandable with your sentence I think (that) it (is) best to be well-prepared for the exam. Dropping "that" and "is" would be considered to be a stylistic choice rather than a grammatical error.

Cardinal

> His hand made a circular motion as if steering a bus through a sharp bend

Damkerng T.

Hmm... really? (what's written in the answer above)

Cardinal

10:46

yes

wait wait

Damkerng T.

@Cardinal "as if steering a bus through a sharp bend" ~ "as if he were steering a bus through a sharp bend"

Cardinal

I confused "steer" and "stare" for a moment

Damkerng T.

A-ha!

Cardinal

Thanks, and sorry

Damkerng T.

No problem, and don't worry! :D

Heh! It *good then, you say. :P

It makes me think of this guy:

How to Pronounce Chipotle

Or this: youtube.com/watch?v=QYx7caHqo84

How Do You Pronounce 'Tony Okungbowa'?

Cardinal

10:56

A chipotle (/tʃᵻˈpoʊtleɪ/, chi-POHT-lay; Spanish: [tʃiˈpotle]), or chilpotle, which comes from the Nahuatl word chilpoctli (meaning "smoked chili"), is a smoke-dried jalapeño. It is a chili used primarily in Mexican and Mexican-inspired cuisines, such as Mexican-American, Tex-Mex, and southwestern dishes. Varieties of jalapeño vary in size and heat. In Mexico, the jalapeño is also known as the cuaresmeño and gordo. Until recently, chipotles were largely found in the markets of central and southern Mexico. As Mexican food became more popular abroad, especially in the United States and Canada, jalapeño...

dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/olympics-2016/…

Damkerng T.

If you like his pronunciation of Chipotle, you'll like his onomatopoeia!

How to Pronounce Onomatopoeia

Cardinal

@DamkerngT. I didn't say that :D

Damkerng T.

@Cardinal :D

I remember that his channel started out with all good pronunciations. Then one day, the behavior of the channel suddenly changed!

Cardinal

I am waiting for Youtube buffering- Elen ..

Damkerng T.

@Cardinal Aww... I found out about this (mis)pronunciation channel because of that Ellen episode. So, basically, it's the same thing.

Cardinal

11:00

ha ha ha

Damkerng T.

@Cardinal Not really related :P, but it's a fun song! Johnny Can't Read: youtube.com/watch?v=VYEm76840Yo

2 hours later…

Avicenna

12:44

Prediction of the day: Overflow will be soon overflowed by Iranians. And @DamkerngT. will learn to speak fluent Persian.

Damkerng T.

Hehe!

Salam and hello, @Avicenna!

Avicenna

Salam!

This is exactly what I predicted. You speak Persian :D

Damkerng T.

Hehe!

DEAD

@Avicenna Technically, Salam is Arabic

Avicenna

@DEAD alsalmo alayk!

Salam is the Persianized form.

Oh, so he speaks Arabic Persian!

Congrates @DamkerngT.

Damkerng T.

12:50

LOL

Which dialect of Persian should I learn if I want to lean it?

DEAD

@DamkerngT. Persian Persian

Damkerng T.

Oh!

What's "salam" in Persian Persian?

DEAD

Well, perhaps they call the Iranian dialect "Farsi".

picks a fight with @Færd about Persian and Farsi

Damkerng T.

Farsi, I see!

Avicenna

The dialect that is mainly spoken in Iran, doesn't have any special name @DamkerngT.

DEAD

12:54

@DamkerngT. Well, "Salam" is one of Allah's names.

Damkerng T.

nods

DEAD

So what's the Persian for a name? O_o

What's "Damkerng" in Persian?

Damkerng T.

Oh! I thought the word meant something like "peace".

I got the wrong idea all this time!

DEAD

Yeah, it does mean something like that.

Avicenna

@DEAD We have lory, Yazdi, ... but the dialect mainly spoken is just called Farsi=Persian.

DEAD

12:57

@Avicenna Those are accents, hardly dialects.

Avicenna

I believe they are dialects specially Lory, Gilaky, and others in north of Iran.

But what I hear in Esfahan is a beautiful accent, in my idea.

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Language Overflow

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