Language Overflow

M.A.Ramezani

15:00

> I wanna help [to] arrest that man.

Man_From_India

@snailboat Examples of contribute to doing this pattern...

Anonymous

@Man_From_India Oh, I was commenting on the entire sentence, not contribute to V-ing.

Anonymous

@M.A.Ramezani Leave out the to.

M.A.Ramezani

@snailboat I always do, though some people don't.

Anonymous

The bare infinitive is more common in all registers, but in informal conversation it's considerably more common.

M.A.Ramezani

15:02

That's because I use it a lot.

Anonymous

So to sounds a little bit off when you combine it with wanna.

Anonymous

Particularly to an AmE speaker.

Anonymous

The difference is less striking in BrE.

Man_From_India

@snailboat That is what I was expecting :-)

Anonymous

(See the Longman Grammar of Spoken and Written English, p.735)

Man_From_India

15:03

Sorry I don't have that one :-(

Damkerng T.

Eh? A new avatar!@snailboat

Anonymous

It's a grammar that focuses on the frequency of various types of usage.

Anonymous

@DamkerngT. It's a rainbow snail.

Anonymous

Anonymous

Polymita picta

Damkerng T.

15:06

It looks like a nice pebble. :-)

Man_From_India

@snailboat This looks very beautiful...but if I find it on my bed at night when all lights are off...it will scare me for sure :D

Anonymous

I've never had a nighttime snail invasion, fortunately.

Man_From_India

:D

M.A.Ramezani

@snailboat Does it have to be an invasion to be scary?

Anonymous

@M.A.Ramezani Well, not in principle.

Man_From_India

15:15

But your profile pic is same as old one. No change? :O

M.A.Ramezani

@Man_From_India Whose?

Man_From_India

snailboat's

HarryCBurn

@snailboat Also makes me, personally, think that the writer is either unimaginative or generally bad. Swearing always puts me off when I'm reading a book.

Man_From_India

But as far as I can think swearing makes a character live.

HarryCBurn

That's only what it makes me assume, doesn't mean that you can't swear in a book.

@Man_From_India Maybe so, but I've never seen it used in dialogue and not felt clunky.

Gone Girl used it a lot.

M.A.Ramezani

15:20

@HarryCBurn It's a strategy, even a good writer might use it.

That's like seeing a lot of profanity in Alfred Hitchcock movies.

Man_From_India

@HarryCBurn But I have seen some Indian writers, for example Khushwant Singh (because I am currently reading) makes their character use such language.

M.A.Ramezani

@snail @snail look who's here!

Man_From_India

And I believe it depends on what type of character you are going to portrait.

Anonymous

@Man_From_India It can take time for a new picture to show up for everyone.

Man_From_India

Oh i see.

M.A.Ramezani

15:26

@snailboat BTW aren't your snails jealous of the snail whose pic is your profile pic?

Anonymous

My snails do tricks!

Anonymous

Look at this twist:

Anonymous

HarryCBurn

@snailboat Gnarly stunts brah!

Anonymous

@HarryCBurn Inorite?

HarryCBurn

15:28

@snailboat bruh do u even board?

Man_From_India

The white one is so long? Or may be stretched itself so long :O Never seen anything like that!

Anonymous

@Man_From_India It's stretching out! And doing a 180! :-)

M.A.Ramezani

Gymnasnail!

Damkerng T.

Anyone who wants to discuss the define question, say "Aye"!

Anonymous

Meh.

M.A.Ramezani

15:30

Mehaye.

Anonymous

I'm lazy.

Man_From_India

Ahm

Anonymous

I haven't written an answer in forever.

Damkerng T.

Okay. Let's let other rooms handle this one.

Anonymous

I was hoping someone would see the question on ELL and post a good answer :-)

M.A.Ramezani

15:32

Too much expectations. Gosh!

Damkerng T.

@snailboat What a twist!

Anonymous

Woo hoo! I got to 41 votes :-)

Anonymous

I guess something I voted on got deleted.

Anonymous

@Man_From_India If you'd like to see a snail stretched out really far, try this Japanese snail: youtube.com/watch?v=hweHxSWovTI

Man_From_India

@snailboat Thanks :-) Now I can see snailboat in a new dress :D

M.A.Ramezani

15:41

Snails are interesting animals.

I am made to admit.

Man_From_India

@snailboat Oh my god :O this one stretched that long :O anyway it reminded me of a movie -Turbo

Anonymous

Oh, I loved that movie! :-)

Man_From_India

Me too :D

I guess this is the movie @DamkerngT. has not yet watched :-)

Damkerng T.

@Man_From_India I've seen its trailer only last week, I think.

M.A.Ramezani

0

Q: how to discerning between the following?

Excerpted from Practical English Usage: Swan : In many cases, both structures can be used to express the same idea. I'm washing I going to wash my hair this evening. But there are some differences. For example, we prefer going to ... when we are talking not about fixed arrangements, but about in...

Man_From_India

15:45

Not surprising :D I have a general impression, you have watched almost all movies :D

Again "Discern"? :O

Damkerng T.

@user10467 I'm sorry that you deleted all your questions. Here is a comment I wanted to post to your question on ELL:

> A few thoughts. First, avoid using How to ...? as a question. Second, How is <something> defined as being <some quality>? is a bit informal, so I'd expect it appears more often in casual speech or writing. Third, I may answer How is a volcano defined as being active? with something alone the lines It's defined as being active like this. or [It's defined as being active] when it meets these criteria: ...

Anonymous

"NOT Pm rettUy teEling him . ..) .............."? Really?

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Hey, your avatar here's changed to the new one!

Anonymous

Yay!

M.A.Ramezani

Here too.

Anonymous

15:47

@DamkerngT. I feel bad that I'm not being more helpful, but I'm really very tired.

M.A.Ramezani

It looks, more lively.

Damkerng T.

@snailboat I understand. It's perfectly understandable.

@M.A.Ramezani I still like the cartoon one a little better. :-)

Man_From_India

@DamkerngT. Same here

M.A.Ramezani

It's only about getting used to it @Dam.

Anonymous

I'll draw a new one later.

Damkerng T.

15:49

(secretly... Yay!)

M.A.Ramezani

ಠ_ಠ

Man_From_India

@user10467 You could have waited a bit longer. People will answer questions :-) for sure. If you want, you can undelete your question.

Damkerng T.

@Man_From_India I estimated that I've watched about 500 movies before I joined ELL.

M.A.Ramezani

@DamkerngT. Only 500?

Damkerng T.

Since then, I'm not sure, maybe I've watched about 1000-2000 more.

Man_From_India

15:50

@DamkerngT. For improving English? :-/ :D

Damkerng T.

It was for fun at first.

Anonymous

That's a lot of movies!

Damkerng T.

My first Hollywood movie was Back to the Future.

Anonymous

Yay!

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Indeed!

@snailboat I'm not sure how I should count. (BTW, I count an episode of things like House of Cards as one movie, too.)

Anonymous

15:52

@DamkerngT. I used to write down every book I read.

Anonymous

It's fun. I got lazy, though.

Anonymous

These days, there are sites online where you can keep track of stuff like that, I think :-)

Man_From_India

@snailboat Even that is what I do...I post it on facebook wall :-)

Damkerng T.

nods

@Man_From_India Oh!

Man_From_India

@DamkerngT. Yes you can update status now reading etc etc...

Damkerng T.

15:53

nods

@M.A.Ramezani It was just my estimate. I can't be sure if it's accurate, but I think it's a fair estimate. If I count only movies, maybe it's somewhere between 700-1000 movies up to now.

M.A.Ramezani

@DamkerngT. I think you're off at a factor of 10 million.

Damkerng T.

LOL -- Hey, Hollywood didn't exist 4536787543526785432 years ago.

M.A.Ramezani

I bet it was Jollywood back then.

Anonymous

@DamkerngT. It's true. Hollywood was founded only 4536787543526785431 years ago.

Damkerng T.

LOLOTF!

Man_From_India

16:00

Wikipedia should update their site with this data :D

M.A.Ramezani

And before that, it was Jollywood.

These are all geological timeline stuff, you guys wouldn't understand.

Man_From_India

@snailboat you are lucky that Nima replied to your comment :-)

My last sentence use that to mean because, almost. @DamkerngT.

Damkerng T.

nods

M.A.Ramezani

The hollywoodian era began 4536787543526785431 years ago as my assistant researcher Dr. M. J. @snailboat points out.

Before that, the DVD fossils don't seem to be very helpful, but scientists imagine the period to be Jollywood, the ancestors of Steven King And Charlie Chaplin.

Damkerng T.

Ahh... It's PEU 214 future (4): present progressive, 214.2 present progressive and going to ... : differences

@M.A.Ramezani I guess Jollywood made their films with jelly.

> I cannot imagine or get how I am to differentiate in meaning between the following.
A. Who's cooking lunch? (asking what has been arranged)
B. Who's going to cook lunch? (asking for a decision)

It's a common problem for learners, I think.

Before joining ELL, if someone said that saying Who's cooking lunch? in the morning is grammatical, I would feel like What?.

But explaining this kind of thing neatly is hard.

My blunt attempt:

If I say She's cooking lunch (in the morning) it's because I can see that she's cooking lunch as if it's happening now.

If I say She's going to cook lunch it's because I can see (at that moment) that she's going to cook lunch.

Someone may explain it better than I can.

Man_From_India

16:27

I think Nima uses cell phone or something, where he doesn't get options to format the questions. I think he never used desktop to post questions, and so may be he is not aware of some basic formatting options. But this is just my guess.

And now that he got PEU, he will get a better hold of the language.

Damkerng T.

I hope so.

My vote stat: 9999 votes

Man_From_India

And looking one of his recent questions, I strongly believe he needs to learn what you believe about native and non-native speaker, that one which you were telling me the other day. He will gain some confidence from that.

Damkerng T.

Looking for a post to give the 10kth vote. :-)

@Man_From_India nods

Man_From_India

Congratulation :-)

Damkerng T.

@Man_From_India for the site!

Man_From_India

16:33

Oh Nima also replied me once :-)

long back.

2

Q: Is this sentence correct? if not why?

Would you please elaborate your explanations on the reason why the following would be incorrect? I will no longer use these tools any more Thanks in advance

negative

If anyone can explain, please write an answer.

Damkerng T.

I don't really know why.

Man_From_India

One can only say any longer is used with a negative sentence. But what about no longer?

Okay, may be it's used only with positive sentences? :D

So can't be used together?

M.A.Ramezani

Having them both is very redundant, IMO.

Man_From_India

right...

M.A.Ramezani

> ...no longer...any more.

Seriously?

That's like

> I don't wanna eat no lunch.

Man_From_India

16:36

And if you write them together, what will be the sentence? Positive or negative?

Damkerng T.

@Man_From_India That sounds like the crux of the matter!

M.A.Ramezani

Some versions are good in slanguage, but none of them are acceptable in standard English syntax.

Man_From_India

Both no longer and not...any more mean the same thing.

Damkerng T.

Let's see...

> a) I don't use this any more (anymore).

> b) I no longer use this any more (anymore).

Man_From_India

Well that no longer and any more clashes with each other in sentence #b :D

Damkerng T.

16:42

suspecting that we may find some examples of 'no longer' with 'any more' in corpora...

> The bubble is no longer able to heal any more, but it is also no longer able to damage the lens either, which is why the unnatural position was required.

> --Dialogues on Values and Centers of Value: Old Friends, New Thoughts By Thomas M. Dicken, Rem Blanchard Edwards

Man_From_India

I still find them odd :-(

Damkerng T.

It's surely redundant, but maybe it's not ungrammatical.

Man_From_India

May be they used any more to add emphasis on the sentence. But in that case there has to be a comma before any more.

Damkerng T.

> Young reportedly proclaimed, "Why, the stewardess is no longer a hostess any more— she's nothing but an airborne waitress."
-- Femininity in Flight: A History of Flight Attendants - Page 96 (https://books.google.com/books?isbn=0822339463)

Man_From_India

OALD says any more can be used with negative sentences and questions, but most of the time they are over simplified. Their simplified rules are directed at the very beginners to make them equipped in such way that they don't make any mistakes or that they are on safe ground.

Damkerng T.

16:50

nods -- Also, there are many sentences that, though non-negative in form, contains a NPI (negative polarity item).

> But in other ways things have moved on so much that home is no longer familiar any more.
--Against the Grain: An Autobiography of William J. Nicol, ... (https://books.google.com/books?isbn=059540040X)

Man_From_India

Right...In your second example also if anything, any more is just for emphasis. My guess. But unfortunately there is no comma. May be, I am wrong?

Damkerng T.

nods -- It seems like people use it to add emphasis to their sentences, and it seems that no comma is needed.

Man_From_India

Or may be the speakers are so fluent to say familiar any more, that they don't take note that they already included no longer?

@DamkerngT. oh thanks.

Damkerng T.

Welcome!

@Man_From_India Could be so.

M.A.Ramezani

@DamkerngT. I am pretty sure that's why it's supposed to be incorrect.

Damkerng T.

16:55

In any case, this sentence c) is surely possible:

M.A.Ramezani

Heck, in Persian poetry, sometimes redundancy gives birth to beauty.

Damkerng T.

> c) I don't use this any longer.

Man_From_India

Completely agree.

M.A.Ramezani

@DamkerngT. That's a very good replacement.

Man_From_India

Now I am thinking should I still keep this comment?

As far as I know this is because of the use of no longer and any more together in the same sentence. I will no longer use these tools or I will not use these tools any more. — Man_From_India 2 hours ago

@DamkerngT. what to do? Delete?

Damkerng T.

16:58

I'm not sure either. It sounded like a good argument at first.

It still sounds reasonable enough to me at the moment.

Though I think maybe it's not ~~ungrammatical~~ incorrect.

Man_From_India

Or should a comment, that sometimes adding both of them in a sentence for the purpose of emphasis is not uncommon, or incorrect, will be appropriate?

Damkerng T.

Possibly. It's your call. :-)

Man_From_India

Scratching my head :D lol

Whatever I deleted my comment, maybe it might convey a wrong notion that had before you came up with those examples :-)

(old habit die hard - again may be. CORRECTED it)

Damkerng T.

17:21

Sorry about those examples! :P

Man_From_India

No they are good :-)

M.A.Ramezani

19:38

I wanted to write a comment in ELU, but I was scared.

Damkerng T.

@M.A.Ramezani Well, don't. I think if you're sure that it's correct or useful, it should be okay.

M.A.Ramezani

Mom, I'm scared.

Damkerng T.

@DamkerngT. In normal usage? (AmE) I don't think so, but maybe its just me.. — user3169 22 mins ago

@user3169 Here is an example: on PBS Journal, April 20, 2014 5:38pm PDT, Volkswagen cars are already very popular in China. The company's compact Lavida model went down well with consumers. — Damkerng T. 1 min ago

archive.org/details/…

M.A.Ramezani

@DamkerngT. Certainly not an expression I'd expect to hear every day, but I have no problems with it.

(Not that I hear anything English other than in SE)

Damkerng T.

nods -- I think it makes it sound a little different. Not exactly high register, but not very colloquial, I'd say.

M.A.Ramezani

19:48

I wonder if user3169 is a native Englisher.

Damkerng T.

I suspect that he(?) is a bilingual (student?).

M.A.Ramezani

Word of the day: Rapscallion

Damkerng T.

Oh! Thanks for a new word for me!

M.A.Ramezani

I wonder if I'm even gonna be able to remember that myself tomorrow.

Damkerng T.

Here is how I remember it: rap-SCALE-lian

M.A.Ramezani

19:53

Great. Now I have to remember three words. And their sequence.

Damkerng T.

:D

M.A.Ramezani

@M.A.Ramezani I use "the user". Is it acceptable to use "they" in the next sentence? — Ahmad 2 mins ago

I REALLY don't feel like answering that comment.

Laziness took over.

Damkerng T.

That's understandable (about the laziness). It may depend on his(?) style guide. (If he(?) has one.)

M.A.Ramezani

It's a he. Am assuming that from his username.

HarryCBurn

I think Ahmed is a guy's name, yeah.

Damkerng T.

19:57

Well, since "nima", I think I can't be very sure. :P

Argh! My mouse!

M.A.Ramezani

It's not like a girl's gonna use a boy's username.

@DamkerngT. Hagu ate it?

Damkerng T.

I dropped it. I think it survived.

M.A.Ramezani

It fell into the abyss?

Damkerng T.

On the floor!

HarryCBurn

Hm, YouTube thinks my video is shaky. I disagree on the basis that it's perfectly still.

Damkerng T.

20:13

What's the message YouTube gave you? I'm sort of curious. :-)

HarryCBurn

I came off the page now, but to paraphrase:

> Youtube has detected that this video is shaky! Do you want us to stabilize it for you?

Damkerng T.

Hah!

I wonder how they can stabilize a perfectly still video.

HarryCBurn

I even used a tripod thing. The camera never moved :c

Bad Youtube ;p

Damkerng T.

:-)

HarryCBurn

Ah well.

Damkerng T.

20:18

I guess that it concerned only about the center of the video.

Nice "Hello" message, BTW. :-)

HarryCBurn

Thanks ;p

@DamkerngT. Perhaps ;p

It would seem to me to make more sense to look at the edges.

Damkerng T.

@HarryCBurn :-)

Oh, I find this sentence strange.

> It includes the landing gear, the fuel plant, and anything else NASA figured it wouldn't need for the trip back up to orbit.

anything, not everything?

Hmm... It looks less weird in the chat.

I still think I like everything better.

HarryCBurn

20:36

I think that everything implies literally everything. Anything is just a selection.

Anonymous

22:32

I like anything slightly better, though I think everything works fine, too. I can't really explain the difference here

Anonymous

Anymore itself isn't negative, although in Standard English it only appears in negative contexts.

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