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01:00
Sandbox posts last active a week ago: Construct this point
 
3 hours later…
04:08
0
Q: Relations between interval and semitones

l4m2Output this table: -2* -1* - 0 - 1 2 -1* 0 1 - 2 3 4 1 2 3 - 4 5 6 3 4 - 5 - 6 7 5 6 - 7 - 8 9 6 7 8 - 9 10 11 8 9 10 - 11 12 13 10 11 - 12 - 13 14 You can output one string with two types of split, 1D string array with one type of split, or 2D string array If yo...

04:26
CMC: Given a Float, Calculate the best fit fraction where the Numerator and Denominator fit within signed shorts. Eg. 3.14159265359 => 335/113.
Why would it not be 3.14159265359 => 3/1?
or 22/7?
those are closer to 3.14159265359 than 335/113
04:45
@lyxal 355/113* Typo
ohh
Side note: will take a very long time
because it's checking the cartesian product of the range [-32768, 32768] with itself
 
2 hours later…
06:51
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A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Dannyu NDosChinese color mixing Objective Given two Chinese ideographs meaning basic colors, output the ideograph that means the color resulting from mixing them. Basic colors The basic colors are: 靑(U+9751; blue) 赤(U+8D64; red) 黃(U+9EC3; yellow) 白(U+767D; white) 黑(U+9ED1; black) Mixed colors Mixing 靑(bl...

@SandboxPosts If that's not cumbersome.
oooh, i could see that getting some very interesting answers
So it's basically just encoding the 12 different combinations?
hypothetically some answers might be able to exploit something in some of the input codepoints
@mousetail 10, actually.
06:55
Yea so it's mostly just a compression challenge
Linguistic notes: Historically 靑 could refer to blue or green. Now 靑 refers only to blue, and the results of Berlin & Kay are violated.
I don't really understand why we need 2 different colors for blue and green in any language.

In my ideal language there will be one red/green/cyan color, one red/yellow/pink/orange color, white, and black and that's it. Using any other words will lead to immediate execution
@mousetail Are you colourblind by any chance‽
No I just hate colors
Right. Your avatar is red/yellow/pink/orange, black, white and some strange thing kind of inbetween black and white.
07:16
You got it
@mousetail tyrannic prescriptivism
@mousetail your avatar is black, pink, dark gray, light gray and white
No, it's rellinkge, black, and white
@mousetail ?
It's rellinkge, black, and white
Saying "darker white" is valid in my language
But only when relative to another color
07:21
what
are you trying to test sapir-whorf
So you can't say "this cup is dark white" but you can say "the outside of the cup is white but the inside is darker white"
darker white as compared to rellinkge
or are you just color's greatest enemy
Yes I hate colors
07:22
can white be darker than rellinkge or is it just light black at that point
@mousetail ok this is actually really cool
but can I say "this cup is white in a way that is darker than what is usually called white"
@UnrelatedString It can be yes. Colors can also be described as more or less saturated
The issue is "what is normally called white" is a huge range of colors ranging all the way to medium grey
so hue is a binary but you can still describe everything else
that's actually kinda based
Only relative to other things
@mousetail that's not how linguistic Evolution works
give it a couple generations and "standard white" will come to indicate a specific shade
07:24
What is considered "brown" for a tree is a very different color as "brown" for a dog. The meanings of colors in real language are also extremly context dependant
the same way most grue languages quickly evolved "plant grue" or whatever
Yea describing something as "a similar color as this well known object" is entirely valid in my language
@mousetail that's just context messing language up as usual
@mousetail right so I can say that my table is ivory white
You can say "my table is a similar color to ivory" yes
Ivory white seems to much like it's refering to a specific color
sapir-whorf here would have so much fun
would ivory white ever appear as a concept? will people stop after finding common wats to say "#fff white" vs "#ccc white"?
07:30
Probably if allowed to evolve naturally, but I'm enforcing this policy with murder
right forgot about the tyrannic prescriptivism part
07:52
@RubenVerg what about "#ggg white"?
@lyxal why not use a lazy list?
@PlaceReporter99 it doesn't change anything
Well you see it's because it is a lazylist it's that I'm doing an operation on it that forces evaluation
@PlaceReporter99 ^
In order to get the minimum of a list, you need to check every item
Regardless of whether it's lazy or not
Besides, is lazy anyway
@TheThonnu no!
 
2 hours later…
10:10
I have reached 100 nice
user image
3
11:00
Haha nice
 
1 hour later…
12:01
@PlaceReporter99 yes, it is invalid. your browser doesn't run an infinite loop while you have an HTML page open
it waits for events but it doesn't do anything while it's waiting
That's not really the issue, just because there is a sleep call doesn't make a loop non-infinite
yes that's what i meant
it's not a loop though
@noodleman how is it supposed to wait for an event without running?
it's just waiting
Your browser is looping
12:03
@PlaceReporter99 when an event happens, it wakes up
@noodleman how will it know to wake up?
the only way is if it's running in the background.
You don't nececairly need an event loop to listen to events, you can do it with interrupts instead
Or other OS systems that allow a wake up to be triggered in specific situations
@mousetail don't the interrupts need to interrupt an executing program?
Program can be sleeping
@mousetail but the program is still running
12:06
It's sleeping
@PlaceReporter99 "program is running" != "infinite loop"
The browser also != your HTML
for example:
import time
while 1:
    time.sleep(1)
That program will always resume
You could set it up so your program never resumes without an event
@noodleman "programme is always running" == "infinite loop"
12:07
import time
time.sleep(Infinity)
idk if there's infinity in python but that is not an infinite loop
@PlaceReporter99 nope. that's not how it works
I'm not sure operating systems will support that via a normal sleep call
@noodleman there is float('inf') and i believe time.sleep allows floats
okay
so would you consider what i posted to be an infinite loop?
The underlying sys call only supports ints though
you need a different syscall
@noodleman yes
12:09
well it isn't sorry bud
but it throws an overflow error
OverflowError: timestamp too large to convert to C _PyTime_t
there is no loop
it's just waiting
Like I said it will try to convert to an integer
i don't really know Python but ok
This will wait forever:
12:11
@mousetail then how come timeit.timeit("time.sleep(0.5)","import time",number=1) returns something within 1/500 of 0.5?
import threading
resumed = threading.Event()
while not resumed.wait(): # wait until resumed
     "continue waiting"
@PlaceReporter99 OS call is in milliseconds
This code creates a signal then waits for it, but the signal will never fire so it will never resume the program
You don't need the loop actually, since there are no other events that could possibly fire
that one isn't an infinite loop because resumed.wait() never returns, right?
Yep
The OS will never wake up the thread
@mousetail this is code golf, so you must do:
from threading import*
while Event().wait()-1:0
You don't need the while
__import__("theading").Event().wait() works
12:17
what would the challenge be called, "sleep forever without an infinite loop?"
I'm gonna write up a sandbox post. Have a program can exist in the process table forever while using exactly 0.000 CPU time
also: if you think about it, any answer to the "shortest infinite loop without output" could be answered in 0 bytes since your computer runs a timer that's always ticking :P
@mousetail race you to it!
Till your CMOS battery runs out
@PlaceReporter99 no
that's not how that works
it's their idea
12:19
i actually thought of writing it as well
Feel free to edit my sandbox post when it's ready
I think PlaceReporter can claim co-ideaship, and noodle man too
I was just gonna add this bookmark.
@mousetail ping me when you've written it.
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A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

mousetailSleep Forever Write a program that never exits completely, but also after startup consumes exactly 0.0 CPU time. This means you must sleep in a way that the operation system never wakes up the process. px aux | grep [your program] should show %CPU 0.0 at any time after startup. Note a long sleep ...

@PlaceReporter99 Ideas how I can make the signal exception more objective but also loophole free andnot super tedious?
12:50
@mousetail no ideas.
 
1 hour later…
13:59
@noodleman In Swift, await Task.sleep(nanoseconds: UInt64(Int64.max)) suspends the thread effectively forever, but await Task.sleep(nanoseconds: UInt64(Int64.max) + 1) returns immediately
That's just integer overflow right?
No, it's something much more interesting. Any number >= 2^63 is translated to FOREVER internally, and the function that tries to schedule the next job to run at "now() + FOREVER" doesn't handle that correctly
Since it's using a runtime method that does exactly that when you hand it FOREVER
Is it really called forever and not infinity?
I don't remember the exact name, it probably starts with kNS knowing Apple
> ...returns DISPATCH_TIME_FOREVER. However, dispatch_after(), which is used to actually enqueue the job, has undefined behavior for this time; the result in practice is that the job is immediately run.
14:56
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

FhuviPrint this pulsar (or "Print this diamond" gone beautifully wrong) Write a function (or a whole program) that outputs (or prints) the following ASCII art: Output: 1 1 2 1 1 2 3 2 1 1 2 3 4 3 2 1 1 2...

15:29
@mousetail am I allowed egg white?
@Neil "Colored white in a similar shade as egg shells" would be ok
15:46
0
Q: Output / Convert to unary number

12431234123412341234123Your task is it to output a number as a unary string. You get the number of a non-negative integer input in the range of 0 - 2'000'000'000. Rules You can choose any character for the digit you like. Output a unary string by outputting this character N times. N is the input. Input range is 0 - 2...

@NewPosts This has to be a duplicate right?
That's what I was thinking
But I can't find it
16:24
@mousetail since your new ><> explanation doesn't format properly for a lot of people, I would suggest just a normal codeblock at the top, and then the images thing under a heading of "explanation" or something like that.
It's only bad on chrome mobile right?
Oh that browser the plurality of all web users use? :p
I don't care at all about mobile users
Which answer is this so I can go downvote it
The last few ><> answers that mousetail posted :p
16:26
You can always click the link to see the code
Ik but it's just easier to have the code in the answer
I'm experimenting with different techniques
(I'm mostly joking about the downvoting thing but seriously, "I don't care about this group of people so I'm going to inconvenience them without any care" is a really shitty attitude toward literally anything)
I have 0 respect for mobile users
16:28
@mousetail It's a good idea, just have a normal codeblock before so everyone can see the code
Who hurt you
And then non-mobile users can see the explanation as well
^^
This is just childish
Mobile doesn't even display normal code blocks properly
...
Mine does
16:29
I can only deal with things that follow reasonable standards
What's wrong with that?
It's too short to get fucked line wrapping, and even if it did it's python where that doesn't really matter
@mousetail Okay there's a huge difference between "I don't want to spend my time trying to get things to work right on a platform with unreasonable behavior" and "I have zero respect for the people using that platform [who likely don't have a choice]"
You can just enable desktop mode
@mousetail it looks exactly the same in desktop mode
And what's the problem with having another codeblock?
It doesn't hurt anyone in any way
It works on chrome desktop right though? So I've been told?
And it helps mobile users
I feel like you're just trying to pick a fight and/or condescend toward people you feel like you're better than with this whole "0 respect for mobile users" thing
@mousetail Chrome desktop != Chrome mobile with "request desktop site" by any means...
I know
I'm trying to more effectively triage the issue
16:33
That's not how you presented your "use desktop mode" statement
1 min ago, by The Thonnu
And what's the problem with having another codeblock?
I assumed it would emulate this specific bug
I know it's different software though
I never said that
3 mins ago, by mousetail
You can just enable desktop mode
I'm kindly asking anyone on chrome desktop to check for me if it works
@RydwolfPrograms I just admitted that was a wrong assumption
In most golflang answers (including all my Thunno 2 answers) there are two codeblocks - one for the real code, and one for the explanation. What's the problem with doing that in your ><> answers?
16:35
Oh wait hang on I misinterpreted which statement you were saying was for triage purposes mb
Nothing, I'm working on a better way to do things
Note that would mean 3 different blocks since I also have the image version most of the time
But anyway, saying you have "0 respect" for anyone on this platform or otherwise is just rude and unnecessary
@mousetail ._.
@mousetail That's fine - I don't mind scrolling a bit more if I can actually see the code
^^^
16:36
If it doesn't work on chrome desktop either though it may not be worth having the feature at all
Like if you'd just said "it'd be extra work to make it look good on mobile and I don't think it's really that big of a deal" we'd probably be cool with that
it's not our fault that SE's site works weird on mobile; you could at least make an effort to compensate for it instead of abandoning mobile users
or ^^
I don't know any way to make it work on mobile since it's just a bug specific to chome mobile
@Ginger Nah, IMO it's not even necessary to do that, and I wouldn't expect someone to
sorry, I've just been turned cynical and dour by years of poorly-designed mobile sites :p
4
16:38
But I would expect them to be reasonable enough to say that's why they're doing it instead of making something up about having "no respect" for them (which is just like, victim blaming people for having to put up with bad technology)
agreed
Best idea is host a server that specifically checks for the user agent of chrome mobile, if so send a image of the letter otherwise just close the connection so the browser errors and renders it normally
Seems a bit OTT
But yeah that would be nice
The image idea is very cool btw
It's just that it doesn't work on mobile :(
@mousetail that seems like so much work just for users on specific devices.
16:44
I don't think anyone on mobile is going to be able to understand ><> on their tiny screens even if formatted properly
17:13
0
Q: Numbers that can be negated by reading backwards

bsoelchBalanced ternary is a modified version of ternary (base 3), using the three digits 1,0 and -1 (written as T) to represent numbers. The balanced ternary representation of -n can be obtained by replacing 1 with T and T with 1 in the balanced ternary representation of n. Examples: 1 // decimal: ...

17:23
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

I am kind of a language devThat is disproportionate! You want to overwhelm your nasty boss with an error message so large that they quit their job. But your boss will fire you instead if it's too long. Challenge In this challenge, you have to write code that is more than 0 bytes long that produces the longest error messag...

@NewPosts It would be fun to write an answer to this in BitCycle (converting binary to unary), but I doubt it would run fast enough to satisfy the rules of the challenge.
18:02
@SandboxPosts This is a duplicate right? I can't find the original though, just the C++ version
 
2 hours later…
c--
c--
20:34
@mousetail I think the method of explanation looks cool, but it's a pain to hover over each symbol, I'd rather just read it
It's not intended as an alternative for a more high level explanation, it literally just explains what the builtins used are. Thanks though, I'm trying to make it more useful
c--
c--
then it serves it's purpose just fine
21:19
(note: upcoming release, this is the rc changelog)
builtin min and max functions will be helpful
stdlib maps and slices packages will also save bytes
though i'm probably the only person on this site using go currently lol

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