The Nineteenth Byte

Neil

00:33

done that before, might want a border to appear on e.g. hover, but to reserve the space for it

Bbrk24

Yep, that's the exact use case. I change border-color but leave border-width alone

ATaco

@Neil Protip, outline probably works better for that.

Outline + padding

Bbrk24

Can outline replicate border-style: inset;? /genq

lyxal

One thing I appreciate about deterministic finite-state machines is that they come with an auto-golfer algorithm. You have redundant states? The algorithm has you covered!

Neil

@ATaco maybe, but this was before round outlines were a thing

ATaco

00:39

@Bbrk24 Yesn't*

Bbrk24

The full set of relevant rules now is

button {
    border: 2px inset transparent;
    border-radius: 0.38em;
    padding: 0.15em 0.33em 0.13em;
}

button:active {
    border-color: #d2d2d2;
}

@media (prefers-color-scheme: dark) {
    button:active {
        border-color: #3e3e3e;
    }
}

ATaco

...Why do I have access to the Chat Flags list? Did I always have this..?

lyxal

10k+ network rep users can handle chat flags

ATaco

Oh bless

I now have a direct stream of "The worst of StackExchange users"

OldSandboxPosts

01:00

Sandbox posts last active a week ago: Generate a Random Integer, Paint you a Picture for Piet Perfection

emanresu A

I've userscripted away the chat flags list

Bbrk24

01:23

Wait a second. @lyxal You're part of George! I discovered George a year or two ago in a completely unrelated way

lyxal

The GEORGE is a nobel animal

Seggan

@Neil the windows key?

Bbrk24

I discovered it via ultlang's page -- ultlang contributed years ago to a repo that I am now the sole maintainer of, but I've never spoken to them directly.

Seggan

@Bbrk24 why

Bbrk24

4 hours ago, by Bbrk24

Kotlin doesn't consider Foo::class.java to be compile-time constant, and some of the annotations have a Class-typed argument

l4m2

01:26

https://i.sstatic.net/sV9sw.png
Which Unary is it?

Seggan

@Bbrk24 it needs to be constant?

Bbrk24

All arguments to annotations must be compile-time constants

Bubbler

@l4m2 It just made up a language that uses unary number literals and brainfuck-like looping

Seggan

@ATaco curseforge.com/minecraft/mc-mods/kotlin-for-forge i knew i saw mods written in kotlin cc: @Bbrk24

Bbrk24

Yeah, Fabric has some tutorials on Kotlin integration too iirc

Ginger

01:33

@Seggan such kotlin

much code

Bbrk24

The branch where I transitioned from pure Java to mostly Kotlin is called frickin-java iirc

Seggan

@Bbrk24 lol

you do know you can use kotlin and java in the same project right?

i do that for paper/slimefun plugin dev

Bbrk24

I did that in that project

Java when I needed a class in an annotation, and Kotlin elsewise

Seggan

mm

ATaco

Having used both Forge and Fabric

Fabric is so much nicer to write for

Bbrk24

01:40

> JSON 52.7%

Seggan

@ATaco i heard thats because forge has a bunch of clutter from ages gone by

ATaco

Deffo, Forge is from when Mojang didn't even try to support mods

Fabric is built from the ground up to support Mixins, which wasn't even a glimmer in the Forge team's eyes back then

Seggan

hrm apparently forge does a lot of work for the modder, so heavier mods prefer forge

@ATaco they still dont, they push datapacks

ATaco

They released official symbols atleast

Seggan

yeah and for plugin devs they unmangled net.minecraft.server so u dont have to write version specific code anymore (not that using NMS is recommended)

Tsumiki Miniwa

02:12

@ATaco Just noticed this

Weren't they called "reeds"?

ATaco

That sounds right

Tsumiki Miniwa

And, more annoyingly, everyone called it "smooth stone"

ATaco

Bamboo might've just been what my local mates called it

@TsumikiMiniwa It's still Smoothstone to me

Tsumiki Miniwa

the annoying part there is when mojang added a proper thing called smooth stone

and you need "Smooth Stone" for a blast furnace, so if your friend doesn't remember the recipe and you ask for 3 smooth stone they'll give you 3... smooth stone ("Stone")

Never heard of the gunpowder/sulfur or chicken/duck thing, though I 100% believe the reeds thing because I watched a ton of direwolf20 videos where he sometimes called it "reeds"

or talks about how he would almost accidentally call it reeds

ATaco

See: The MInecraft TNT Music VIdeo

"♫T-bag his ghost and now his Sulfur's mine♫"

Tsumiki Miniwa

02:16

huh

caird coinheringaahin g

@ATaco Not quite the worst

I think the hierarchy goes something like this (least to most worst):

ATaco

TNB is best, ofc.

caird coinheringaahin g

site spam flags, non-math chat flags, math chat flags, mod chat flags, site R/A flags, and then the posts that we need to ask SE to contact imgur about to remove the images from their database

ATaco

I don't care to know about the last category.

Bbrk24

@ATaco That was the first song I went out of my way to memorize. I've forgotten half of it by now

caird coinheringaahin g

02:19

@ATaco It's whenever WW accidentally posts a picture of a blurry cat :P

ATaco

Pretty sure I could sing all but the Rap

Seggan

@TsumikiMiniwa i heard of gunpowder/sulfur

Unrelated String

02:41

i had no idea there was a time that the names of blocks/items/entities weren't right there for you but i still call them reeds sometimes :P

ATaco

I think it was the infamous Adventure Update which added thing names? Might've been earlier.

Tsumiki Miniwa

I guess the reason I never heard of it being called "sulfur" is because the only Minecraft content I received at the time was from direwolf20

Plays exclusively modded minecraft, and some mods add something called "sulfur" so he had to adapt, but no mods add something called "reeds" so he didn't have to adapt around that

ATaco

I wonder how modern mods are doing now that Copper is vanilla.

I can never forget having 6+ kinds of copper in a modpack

Unrelated String

07:53

@Bbrk24 lmao nice

i lowkey grew up on minecraft parody music too but that one actually doesn't ring any bells at all

emanresu A

08:28

I heard several minecraft parodies of songs before the originals, and later recognised the originals from the minecraft parodies

Unrelated String

same

Neil

@Seggan no, it's on the right, between the windows key and the ctrl key

Unrelated String

at some point this got added to my friend group's collective playlist and so far nobody's actually felt like removing it

emanresu A

There are others like that

I think someone did that but with fallen kingdom?

Unrelated String

lmaoooo

nice

Sandbox Posts

10:22

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Substring Co-quine Given a string, decide whether it is a consecutive substring of your submitted code. Of course, the empty string is always truthy. The encoding of the given string is assumed to match how your code is encoded. For example, if your code is encoded in UTF-8, the input is also ass...

Ginger

12:02

@ATaco FORGE FOREVER

Unrelated String

have you tried working with both

i don't have much experience in either but fabric feels so much better

Ginger

no ~~BECAUSE ALL I NEED IS FORGE~~

lyxal

@UnrelatedString couldn't help but accidentally read fabric as arabic and get really confused

Unrelated String

LMAO

Ginger

Arabic Modloader

ngl that'd not be a bad name

Bbrk24

12:09

@UnrelatedString What is this cursed thing

Unrelated String

good question

Bbrk24

Also have you seen Rising Kingdom? A prequel to Fallen Kingdom released just this past December

lyxal

@Bbrk24 it's what's getting us out of the grass block house

Ginger

I can't see that video rn, what is it?

Bbrk24

Every beat it switches between DJ Got Us Falling In Love and Revenge

lyxal

12:12

as I said, we getting out the grass block house with it

Ginger

one second, lemme do a little trolling

lyxal

permission denied

Ginger

@UnrelatedString that's glorious

it's almost as good as the f*cked up All I Want For Christmas video

lyxal

is that the one with the metal pipe?

Ginger

no, it's this one

relevant conversation starts here

lyxal

12:16

ah the other one

Bbrk24

@Ginger I follow someone on tumblr who makes lots of these out of various songs

lyxal

@Ginger youtube.com/watch?v=_vDOmmwJF7E when you have the time

I think you'll appreciate it

Unrelated String

whoa

lyxal

it really gives 1997 vibes

Unrelated String

thank you andrew morris

lyxal

12:24

in The Edge of Propinquity, 2 mins ago, by Unrelated String

> Vyxal was created by a team of developers who go by the name "The Vyxal Team". The team includes Andrew Morris, who goes by the username "Lyxal", and Kevin Matthews, who goes by the username "ais523". Other contributors include Chris Brown, who goes by the username "Mr-Xcoder", and Jonathan Allan, who goes by the username "Bubbler".

This has some concerning implications

Bbrk24

It's called you by what, three different names now? (Kevin, Chris, and now Andrew)

lyxal

in The Edge of Propinquity, 4 mins ago, by lyxal

It also thinks I'm Dennis

Bbrk24

It's also given a few different dates spread across a couple years for the release date

Anyways, do you think it will ever guess your actual name by sheer chance? Or are its guesses not even close

lyxal

not even close

mousetail

Wonder if you could use chatGPT to sketch out a web of usernames often collaborating on things because it confused them for eachother

Unrelated String

12:33

it seems like it's kevin at least a third of the time for some reason

YES

Bbrk24

12:45

My legal name is on my github in a few places, mostly license files, but that's not the name I go by

lyxal

I love bugs with hexadecimal built-ins that result from missing a digit in the hexadecimal alphabet

mousetail

How often does that happen?

Bbrk24

Related: github.com/feresum/tmp-lang/commit/…

lyxal

@mousetail approximately once

Seggan

13:40

@Neil fn? never used it

(also its on the left, not the right)

@lyxal Well, it has ur first name

Bbrk24

To the right of spacebar, my keyboard has, in order: alt, menu, control, arrow keys, numpad

Not all keyboards have a right Winkey

Seggan

mine is ctrl, fn, windows, alt, spacebar, alt, ctrl, and the arrow keys (going left to right)

lyxal

@Seggan by chance. I asked it for my full name and it said it doesn't have it at all

Seggan

also, looking though that post, bubblers name is very unusual (no offense bubbler)

lyxal

Wait if you mean in the post from the transcript, then no, it doesn't have my first namr

*name

Seggan

13:48

wait what then is the meta post wrong

lyxal

Oh you mean meta

I thought you meant

1 hour ago, by lyxal

in The Edge of Propinquity, 2 mins ago, by Unrelated String

> Vyxal was created by a team of developers who go by the name "The Vyxal Team". The team includes Andrew Morris, who goes by the username "Lyxal", and Kevin Matthews, who goes by the username "ais523". Other contributors include Chris Brown, who goes by the username "Mr-Xcoder", and Jonathan Allan, who goes by the username "Bubbler".

That

Anyhow yeah by random chance

Seggan

@lyxal i did

the meta post has ur full name, and the transcript has ur first name by extension

lyxal

By extension?

Seggan

ya mind me saying ur first name here?

lyxal

Jonathan Allan, London, United Kingdom

97.6k 7 61 257

That's who it's referring to

Not me

Seggan

13:51

yeah ik

but is that not ur first name as well

lyxal

It is, but chatgpt doesn't know to make the association

Besides, if we're going on that metric, then it has the name of a lot of other golfers with names that appear a non-trivial amount of times in literature

It would only make the connection by either being trained in that meta post or by obtaining it from an obscure oeis sequence I added back in 2020

which just further proves it's not smart at all and just spitting out tokens based on what's already been written by humans

mousetail

Can you ask chatGPT what my real name is?

Seggan

@lyxal i know

i was just pointing out

i wanna write a CGCC blog post

i had a draft on fast code but eh

im thinking of one on praclangs

mousetail

14:07

Both seem they would be interresting

Neil

14:34

@Seggan ah, you're on a laptop? I guess their keyboards are different

Seggan

ive never seen a context menu key on any keyboard

Bbrk24

I have one, I can send a picture if you want to see it

mousetail

Most keyboards used to have them I used them all the time

Bbrk24

This particular keyboard is strange though -- it has a numpad, but the numpad has no enter key

mousetail

But not so much anymore

Seggan

14:42

@Bbrk24 sure

Ginger

time to do more Rabbit development!

Seggan

when do you have time for anything else?

Ginger

~~I can sleep when I'm dead~~

Bbrk24

Ginger

gonna be tricky today tho because I just went to the optometrist and my vision's all weird

mousetail

14:44

You'll die a lot later if you sleep now

Bbrk24

@Seggan context menu is the key between right alt and right control there

Seggan

ah i have that thingy as an fn enabled key on my right control

interesting

mousetail

I have a second windows key there for some reason, completely useless

Bbrk24

A lot of keyboards have a right winkey, but laptops tend to not

Ginger

@mousetail doesn't matter, user'll probably get to me first

mousetail

14:46

If you play dead he'll ignore you

AKA sleep

Ginger

doubtful

mousetail

Their vision is based on motion

Sandbox Posts

15:06

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Implement the <=> three-way comparison operator on numbers Tags: code-golfnumbercomparison In C++, there exists a a <=> b three-way comparison operator that, for numerical types, does the following: If a < b, then return -1. If a = b, then return 0. If a > b, then return 1. The Challenge Implem...

Ginger

@Seggan should things like primitive types and global functions be members of some magic ultimate GlobalContext or should each module's GlobalContext have its own reference to them?

(I need this info to figure out what visibility modifier they should have; they'd be public with option A but internal with option B)

Seggan

@Ginger they should be part of a module that is automatically star imported everywhere

thats what java/kotlin/rol do

Ginger

hm

I guess I could do that, but it'd be easier to just make it so that each module's Context has a singleton GlobalContext as a parent containing all that stuff

I'd rather do that tbh

mousetail

I'd suggest avoiding using context for anything other than functions and closures

Ginger

what?

why?

mousetail

15:17

Because there is no "stack" with everything having a single "parent" outside of functions

Ginger

...there is tho

the current system works perfectly

mousetail

Not really, you seem to be trying to force them into that format with quite a lot of squishing as far as I've seen

Ginger

as the developer I can tell you that it's working fine

mousetail

your choice

user

@Ginger Huh, I didn't realize I'd said that on two specific occasions, and to you both times. I'm sorry if I frightened you, I didn't mean to, especially since you're going to die (sooner than you might expect)

Ginger

15:27

I have doubts about the sincerity of your apology :p

user

Would it help if I wrote it like this?

Dear Ginger,

Huh, I didn't realize I'd said that on two specific occasions, and to you both times. I'm sorry if I frightened you, I didn't mean to, especially since you're going to die (sooner than you might expect).

Sincerely,
Original Original Original VI

Ginger

who's this "Original Original Original VI" character?

user

@mousetail I second this. You might, however, need something kinda like a Context at the module level, though

@Ginger It's my real name

Ginger

huh

definitely one of the names of all time

@mousetail what's the alternative?

mousetail

Something that doesn't have the restriction of a single parent, perhaps a abstract class so you can have different context for functions, classes, modules, and builtins

Ginger

15:32

why would having a single parent be a bad thing? I can't think of any cases in which I'd need more than one parent

(don't take that out of context)

user

Virgin haploid

Ginger

huh?

user

Never mind

Ginger

16:16

LDQ: How should I do module introspection? Due to the way I'm implementing imports, I can pretty easily set properties of imported module objects to whatever I want, but of course modules can declare a name function or whatever

@Seggan why does locateType return a Pair<ResolvedType, FileUnit?>?

Seggan

16:37

because packages may be split across multiple files, and i need to know which ones to include in the generated lua

caird coinheringaahin g

Any further feedback? Thinking about finally posting it

And totally not because it's been almost 5 months since my last challenge

Sandbox Posts

17:37

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Idea: Given a polyomino shape figure out the minimum number of cuts required to fill it with a herring-bone pattern of 2×1 tiles. Gylda is a contractor who installs decks. She receives the deck plan from an architect who always chooses it to be shaped as a polyomino, that is a single connected ...

Sandbox Posts

18:36

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Number of free polyominoes A polyomino with \$n\$ cells is a shape consisting of \$n\$ equal squares connected edge to edge. Two free polyominoes are distinct if one is not a rigid transformation of the other. The sequence of polyominoes with \$n\$ cells is as follows: 1, 1, 1, 2, 5, 12, 35, 108,...

math scat

@SandboxPosts oops I was implicitly inspired by this onebox

I thought I got the idea from a book I was reading :/

emanresu A

23:44

@cairdcoinheringaahing I haven't posted a challenge for almost 8 months. I do have a backlog of challenge ideas though

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