The Nineteenth Byte - 2022-08-29

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12:36 AM

@emanresuA Honestly screw Safari users

Web developers, let us unite and force everyone to use Firefox!

On ios it's the only broser

Everything else is a safari wrapper

You can download Chrome and Firefox right

Oh wait do the iOS versions of other browsers use WebKit?

@RadvylfPrograms So apparently they switched (or are letting you switch) from Rhino, which tied you to ES5, to V8, which lets you use "modern ECMAScript syntax," whatever that means

Do they consider ES2015 modern?

Unrelated String

isn't v8 one of the engines tio has? so i guess you could test it empirically lmao

v8 is the one behind chrome and nodejs afaik

Well apparently Google Apps Script decides to not support the latest syntax even if V8 does (SO question)

12:48 AM

> The underlying V8 engine is good and supports the latest features, but the parser won't allow you to save or execute the project with those features, as it considers them as syntax errors.

bruh

Unrelated String

phenomenal

OldSandboxPosts

Sandbox posts last active a week ago: Find "Millionaire" score, Fibonacci word fractal

Radvylf Programs

1:11 AM

@user Firefox isn't immune to jank either

IME Chrome is the best when it comes to properly (and un-bug-ily) supporting stuff, though FF is a close second

can someone tell me why this say sys is referenced before assignment, python:

Firefox is (at least partially) rustified so it must be less janky than others by definition :P

1 hour later…

2:35 AM

FACTORIAL!!!

3:13 AM

0

A: "Hello, World!"

SunSip -w -n (just means suppress warnings and no newlines) set to "Hello, World out A big fat 24 bytes. Syntax highlighted:

@lyxal what are "unique characters"

because i see a reading of this where the answer is x=>x

CMP: is the empty string a valid answer if you say its a js function? you can "call" it by putting parenthesis "after" it and your argument in the parenthesis

so instead of cat(args) youd do (args)

🤔

no, because js doesn't think it's a function (or function call)

how do we know what js knows :P

by looking at its grammar

3:26 AM

that seems like an unobservable requirement to me /j

I mean... would it be valid if you defined a function as the empty string?

"defined"

user image

heres my "reasoning"

window[""]=x=>x

(obviously this fails because it would crash the program)

but still (x) is syntactically not a function call

and my reasoning is that f=x=>x;f(a,b,c) !== (a,b,c)

3:32 AM

fair

well you could maybe define a function which has the same effects as (a,b,c) but idk how you handle the fact that just () is a syntax error and not a regular error :P

4:22 AM

@thejonymyster characters that only appear once

5:02 AM

Hi all

hi

How things in ccgc land?

geed

where e = o

starring frequency seems to be lower than before

Does anyone recognise this probability distribution?

start with a positive integer x. Repeatedly choose a uniform random integer l from 1..x and let x = x-l . The output is the collection of l values

5:43 AM

→ 85 messages moved to Sunsip

← 1 message moved from Sunsip

→ 2 messages moved to The Nineteenth Bakery

I cant delete this but I can edit and flag lol

for context, I requested those messages moved back

they were accidentally moved in the mass move

oh ok

5:52 AM

@emanresuA the two messages from graffe

not the two you sent to the bakery

is it possible to move to the bakery tho

no

6:08 AM

me: can we have emanresu?
mom: no, we have emanresu at home.
emanresu at home:

chat.stackexchange.com/users/286657/eman-resu

lol

lmao

TODO: Make a tacit language called ZOK or CRN

@lyxal stackoverflow.com/…

That's a lot of socks

must be a big drawer

6:35 AM

even Emanresu a exists lol

joke cmc: transform emanresu A to Emanresu a

@Bubbler That's me. For some reason SO fricks up usernames

3 hours later…

9:18 AM

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Does there exist a synchronizing word? code-golf decision-problem string A complete deterministic finite automaton is a machine, with some states. Each state in the automaton has, for each character in the alphabet, a pointer to a state (not necessarily a different one). The automaton starts at s...

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Contrasting Colors code-golf When designing a website or poster or book it's important to make the graphical elements be distinct. A common mistake is to choose colors to similar to eachother. We must prevent this! The goal of this challenge is simple: Given a initial color and a number of colors...

4 hours later…

Radvylf Programs

12:51 PM

@emanresuA Function("") works, but in that case Function() is the function syntax not ""

3 hours later…

4:13 PM

@Bubbler Python 3, 14 bytes: str.capitalize

4:33 PM

@DLosc thats a funny builtin, is there one that doesnt lowercase the rest of the string?

cause that seems destructive :P

I mean, it kinda makes sense to turn ABCD into Abcd if you want title casing but yeah, leaving the rest alone would be more expected

@thejonymyster There's str.title, which capitalizes the first letter of each word. If you just want to uppercase the first letter of the string, I think you have to do it separately--something like lambda s:s[0].upper()+s[1:]

i guess its a matter of splitting on punctuation and spaces and then capitalizing appropriately ?

@Bubbler Pip, 9 bytes: UC:@LC:aa

@DLosc It feels really weird that s[0] gives you another string

You can keep doing s[0][0][0]...

4:41 PM

It's ~~turtles~~ strings all the way down

strings are arrays of strings. i wonder what language started that

In QBasic, there's technically not a way to get a specific character from a string, just several builtin functions for substrings (which you can of course use to get a 1-character substring).

So I suppose that's different from Python, but when I learned Python it didn't surprise me at all.

@user i had a (terrible) idea for a lang where that was true of all types, everything was just a list of lists of (lists of...) ints

Everything is an array in APL, right?

@thejonymyster Even numbers?

4:46 PM

im like 50% sure that numbers arent arrays in apl but they might just be dimension 0 arrays

@user yes :P the idea was theyd behave like numbers unless you tried to inspect them like arrays

@thejonymyster In BQN, there's a difference between numbers and dimension-0 arrays, and I think the docs say this is one of the differences between BQN and APL.

and every array contained its index of where it was located in the global array

@thejonymyster rho <number> gives an empty array

a fool would have been 99% sure, but i knew to only be 50% sure

What I dislike about APL's stranding is that sometimes you want distinct strings but if you write 'a' 'b' 'c' they get automatically merged into 'abc'

4:48 PM

wait question, this might be true of bqn but just to be sure; are there any languages where indexes are lists instead of numbers

because i always find myself wishing i could [x,y] instead of [x][y]ing

      ⍴0

      ⍴'ur mom'
6
      ⍴'u'

      ⍴0 1
2

@user This is also true in BQN, but only because numbers get promoted to arrays before being passed to certain functions.

@thejonymyster You could kinda sorta consider Python's slice objects to be lists maybe?

nah it has to be a list so i can modify it like a list :P

so i can pop from and push to it etc

@user the problem is the inconsistency IMO. 'a' is a character but 'ab' is a string. they should have different syntax even if its longer for characters

4:50 PM

Yupyup

I'm kinda torn because languages with ' for characters and " for strings make more sense but strings are used more often so I prefer the less noisy ' when using JS and Python

what do you think of `

@thejonymyster Yes, as long as you're indexing into an array rather than a nested list.

Backticks are cool

@DLosc dang it

i respect that but doh

having list indexing would have helped a lot when i was making my lang where the pointer traversed and modified a binary tree :P

Related

4:55 PM

literally that yeah

though on a cursory search, I don't think the inverse challenge has been asked yet (given a ragged list and a ragged index, find the element at that index)

CMC: ^ (CMC since it's probably much easier than the linked challenge)

yeah lol too ez

but it was really annoying in js with the whole objects are lists of references shit

Actually wait maybe they're about the same level of difficulty?

Unrelated String

nah definitely easier lmao

4:56 PM

Is it "do whatever you want" if the index is invalid?

@user what do you think of lisp's weird #\c syntax? Or something similar that doesn't need to be closed because if you think about it, characters aren't going to extend for more than one .... character (barring escapes) so they don't need to be closed

@DLosc I guess, yeah

@Wezl' That made sense to me

To be honest \c (without the #) would be great

I think (some version of) Ruby has ?c

and of course CJam and Pip and probably some other languages use 'c

@Wezl' Only problem is that \n might be ambiguous or something?

Or is that #\\n?

@DLosc yeah but im pretty sure its deprecated. It doesn't fit because Ruby doesn't distinguish characters and strings

Unrelated String

4:59 PM

@user there's probably a builtin but Jelly, 3 bytes: ị@ƒ

@user lisp uses #\newline which I don't really like but it could be worse

of course you could have a different syntax or no syntax, something like Char(10)

Unrelated String

yeah the builtin is `œị

œị

i hate accidentally turning intl layout on lmao

same. I use EXTD

XCompose ftw

@user Pip -xp, 9 bytes: Wab@:POab

Ooh, actually, 7 bytes: $@:aPEb

which is "prepend the ragged list to the index list and fold on indexing"

5:05 PM

Ooh

Does Pip have a scan builtin?

Not yet, but it's been requested.

Ah ok

caird coinheringaahing

In GoL, assuming an infinite board, if two board states \$B_i\$ and \$B_j\$ are identical, with \$j > i\$ (i.e. occurs strictly later), is it true that no more "meaningful" change can occur? That is, the board is entirely still lifes, and oscillators?

yeah, since gol states are only determined by previous state

Radvylf Programs

Yeah, if that happens it'd have to be periodic

5:10 PM

and so i suppose the burden of proving periodicity is on the solver :P

very well, i retract my question on your sandbox :-)

caird coinheringaahing

Ah good. Thought so, but wasn't sure if there's some weird exception

@thejonymyster Nah, it was a good question. I'm going to redefine "fixed state" based on the periodic definition thing

true that would be good

its just the thing i was wroried about was completely ridiculous

but i imagine youre in the "fixed state" the moment you reach a state that is to be reached again at any point in the future, right?

@thejonymyster numpy supports that: Try it online!

@Neil Probably just for rectangular arrays, though, right?

5:25 PM

what would it matter?

rectangular or not i mean, why would it make a difference

6:29 PM

I'm not sure if ndarrays can be jagged

(if "rectangular" means not jagged)

ah

Radvylf Programs

I have an idea for a new esolang

Run.

You are no longer safe.

please share

i desire to appreciate the pain

Radvylf Programs

Well, I don't want to spoil anything. But depending on how you count, there are one or two data types.

And it's likely not the one(s) you think.

too late I thought of all of them

6:44 PM

@RadvylfPrograms my awesome awesome guess: date objects and fibonacci heaps

(how could you count that as one data type :P)

wait yeah i cant even plausibly meme that into working

i have faith in you

every time you add a second its a new node on the heap :P

1 hour later…

7:52 PM

@user You can do that with JS - a=[0],a[0]=a

Hm, that's almost a palindrome

@user Vyxal go brrr

@Wezl' Crystal go brr

@emanresuA Oh hey I didn't even realize

@emanresuA But you kinda have to make it be cursed, it's not builtin (which is good of course)

CMC: Do the thing emanresu did (make a list whose only element is itself)

Or make a list a whose only element is b, where b = [a] (basically the same thing as above but with two lists)

8:12 PM

0

Q: Is it a properly tiered list?

A ragged list is a (finite depth) list where each element is either a positive integer or a ragged list. A ragged list is properly tiered if it contains either all positive integers or all properly tiered ragged lists. For example [1,2,3,6] is properly tiered because it is a list of all positive ...

code-golf decision-problem ragged-list

Radvylf Programs

8:22 PM

@user CMC: Take a number N, and return a cycle of this with N single-element arrays

E.g., 3 -> a[0] == b, b[0] == c, c[0] == a

Radvylf Programs

8:34 PM

I feel like there's a really elegant recursive JS solution but I can't find it

I've gotten close

9:22 PM

that kind of owns

its like im playing patrick's parabox again :P

caird coinheringaahing

@user Python: a=[];a.append(a)

Try it online!

9:56 PM

@RadvylfPrograms JS, 38 bytes: n=>(a=[g=i=>i>1?[g(i-1)]:a],a[0]=g(n))

10:10 PM

Or another 38 byter, also not very elegant: (n,a=[0],e=a)=>n>1?f(n-1,a,[e]):a[0]=e

1 hour later…

11:20 PM

@DLosc I guess so, I don't really know numpy

@DLosc yes, numpy is an APLoid and all ndarrays are rectangular

I imagine ndarrays can be nested by using ndarray itself as element type, but then the "indexing without multiple brackets" breaks down

K does have ragged arrays and multidimensional indexing

11:56 PM

Does K have infinite-depth arrays?

Radvylf Programs

@RadvylfPrograms I am really proud of how unreadable this is turning out

STDIO:(
    :n STDIO:(
        :p {p:}:|n
        {n}:STDIO
    )
)

That adds two numbers

(well, representations thereof)

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Aug '2229

The Nineteenth Byte

The Nineteenth Byte: General discussion for codegolf.stackexc...

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