The Nineteenth Byte

Ginger

14:04

heyo

lyxal

berans

Ginger

I am currently talking to yall through my terminal

mathcat

greg

woah really?

Ginger

yup

(for performance reasons)

mathcat

~~aren't bots prohibited?~~

Ginger

14:04

I'm not a bot

Radvylf Programs

...is exactly what a bot would say!

Ginger

(can't figure out how to delete that)

~~well I am a Markov chain but that's besides the point~~

anyways

have any of yall ever heard of Minetest?

lyxal

@Ginger what does formatted text look like ~~on terminal~~?

oh and how do edits show up?

can you see edits happen?

mathcat

and-tags?

lyxal

Ginger

14:14

uh

italics is italics

Radvylf Programs

In a terminal?

Ginger

bold is highlighted in green

strikethrough has <strike> tags on either side

edits do show up

lyxal

dang it

what about the other two questions?

in Sandbox, 9 secs ago, by lyxal

how about this message?

in Sandbox, 6 secs ago, by lyxal

do quoted messages display their contents?

@Ginger ^

Ginger

well it just crashed for some reason

PyGamer0

@Ginger yeah

Ginger

14:19

images just show up in a box with the url inside

lyxal

truly beans.

mathcat

excellent burroe

which program are you using?

Ginger

SE-Chat-Terminal

lyxal

oh hey it's Saturday! Man I love Saturdays

Ginger

Got it from Github

lyxal

14:23

best day of the week

Ginger

I'm playing some Minetest

mathcat

@lyxal nah friday's more epic

Radvylf Programs

Anyone understand this grammar?

lyxal

@mathcat no friday bad because it's the day of my least favourite uni workshop

@RadvylfPrograms what kind of weird BNF/EBNF is this?

PyGamer0

@RadvylfPrograms no, doesnt look like english to me

Radvylf Programs

14:25

@lyxal Whatever the cookie RFC uses

lyxal

also, where's the definitions for DIGIT, OCTET and ALPHA

Radvylf Programs

Another RFC

lyxal

and is there a 4DIGIT and 2DIGIT definition?

Radvylf Programs

Okay I think it's ABNF

*<n> in ABNF is apparently how you say "at most n repetitions"

lyxal

that makes sense

yeah okay the grammar looks reasonable enough

some of the definitions I disagree with though

but it's mostly fine

Man I remember doing BNF/EBNF in high school for the software design and development course

Radvylf Programs

14:31

I hate the cookie RFC so much

lyxal

good times

Radvylf Programs

HTTP in general is pretty badly designed ngl

lyxal

@RadvylfPrograms why so?

Radvylf Programs

It's a huge mess

lyxal

hey stop tracking me like that

I didn't consent to you storing cookies about me

Ginger

14:33

mmm cookies

lyxal

Because the fact you're talking about cookies and the web being a mess just after I watch a Tom Scott video on why the web is a mess because of cookies and pop-ups is uncanny.

Radvylf Programs

More that cookies themselves are awful to deal with because the standards are so all-over-the-place

lyxal

well I suppose that's what happens when something unofficial gets written into the official specs

apparently cookies started with netscape navigator and were later written into standards.

frick how is it half past midnight already?

it was only 20 past a minute ago

I'm going now then

o/ nerds

Ginger

biya

does anyone want to play Minetest w/ me?

Bgil Midol

whats minetest

Ginger

14:37

Minecraft-type game

can run on RPi

(which is why I'm playing it)

Bgil Midol

how do i open it

Ginger

Have you installed it?

Bgil Midol

yes

Ginger

what os?

mathcat

wait is that a free version of Minecraft?

Bgil Midol

14:43

windows

mathcat

lets gooo

Bgil Midol

not exactly

Ginger

well it's kinda like minecraft

same premise

but mods are server-side

and downloaded when you join

Bgil Midol

how do i play

@Ginger windows 10

Ginger

idk man

I'm on RPi

mathcat

14:46

Random Programming Interface

Seggan

so... close...

Bgil Midol

nice

Ginger

I'm on radiator.ddns.net at (183, 3169)

mathcat

@Ginger what's in config.json, I can't seem to figure it out?

Ginger

@mathcat snans

PyGamer0

14:51

@Seggan is Jyxal highly optimized just for speed?

Bgil Midol

@Ginger uh it just opens and closes

Radvylf Programs

wth why are you allowed to set cookies that expire in the 17th century

> Abort these steps and fail to parse the cookie-date if:
...
the year-value is less than 1601

Seggan

@PyGamer0 is there anything else it could be optimized for? 😉

@RadvylfPrograms the internet has existed for half a millennium now

also, ty whoever decided to get me above 2k :)

Ginger

now i'm on daconcepts.com:30008

Radvylf Programs

15:13

There are so many weird TLDs

Not sure if I like the idea of big companies being allowed to buy and own them

Bgil Midol

@Ginger ERROR[Main]: FontEngine: Cannot load '\bin\..\fonts\Arimo-Regular.ttf'. Trying to fall back to another path.

Radvylf Programs

15:29

Well my grades aren't looking as sussy anymore

Today's the last day of the second-to-last six week grading period

I'm almost an 11th grader

Which is crazy

Wait the chrome icon changed

It has a white circle around the blue one now

DLosc

15:52

... Is that new?

Radvylf Programs

Maybe not, actually. Something changed, that's all I know.

Prolly for Chrome 100

Seggan

@PyGamer0 why you ask?

New Posts

16:52

0

Q: Byte counting for BASIC style DATA / READ inputs

Background Many BASIC dialects idiomatically use DATA and READ commands to store and read input data from the source code. We appear to have a consensus that this form of input is valid in these languages, however we have not formed a consensus on how to score solutions that use this approach. ...

Neil

@lyxal infamous example of that is the Referer [sic] header

Radvylf Programs

There must be something that changes when you're using a smaller window size because I have my screen divided into four windows and hyper's pfp like...crash landed into the list instead of gracefully floating down

Double leters are stupid, glad they went with referer instead of referrer.

Unrelated String

referér

DLosc

@RadvylfPrograms I'd say FGITW'ing Python or JS answers gives you more rep than answering in your own language. It's just less consistent because there's more competition.

Neil

bah, SE changed the header again, and then Firefox just crashed on me, so I don't have access to the old CSS any more :-(

Radvylf Programs

17:04

Yeah. You can go back through and answer like 10k questions with your own language though, whereas finding challenges unanswered in Python or JS is near impossible. You might only get an upvote or two on about half of the non-FGITW answers you post, but that's still a good rep income

DLosc

I guess that's fair. I'm just not that prolific.

Seggan

yall have like 20k rep and talking about speedrunning rep 😂

while me with 2k sits in the background

DLosc

@RadvylfPrograms I would have preferred referrer. Otherwise, it looks like it should be pronounced "refearer."

@Seggan In my case, it's been more like slowwalking rep ;)

Seggan

ye me too except for that one time i qualified for the vyxal bounty

DLosc

Our average rep-earning rates are remarkably similar: you're averaging about 340 rep per month, while I'm averaging about 320.

Seggan

17:16

hmm so i guess itll take me 8 years to get to 30k lol

Radvylf Programs

;p.

how...did a french fry type that

I accidentally flung a fry at my keyboard and it typed that

(and I hit enter then apostrophe while grabbing it)

Seggan

how do you "accidentally" fling a french fry at a keyboard

Radvylf Programs

good question

I was using my non-dominabnt hand and klooking the other way

DLosc

> klooking

I don't know what that word means, but I like it ^_^

Radvylf Programs

It's like looking but you use your non-dominabnt hand to type it and are kjlooking the other way

DLosc

17:29

Seems like it ought to mean something like "clumsily hitting something by accident," sort of a cross between "conking" and "klutz."

att

@DLosc huh, that's pretty much exactly my rate

Bgil Midol

how do i calculate mine?

att

rep/months

DLosc

(based on your current rep and the "member for __" on your profile)

Radvylf Programs

Mine's about 350

Surprisingly, since I've been very inactive for much of that time

DLosc

17:42

I've had long stretches of inactivity too

Huh, TIL that I joined the site 2 months after Dennis did.

Unrelated String

wow

Radvylf Programs

I'll have been on the site for four years as of a week from now :o

DLosc

Turns out four of our top five users joined within a year of each other.

Bgil Midol

@DLosc 338

DLosc

17:57

I just got the Fanatic badge, and now I'm wondering if there's anybody with a longer stretch of time between getting their first gold badge and getting Fanatic. :P

Unrelated String

lmaoo
nice

Neil

18:46

worked out what the SE header CSS changes were, so my header is more normal again

.s-topbar .s-topbar--content .s-topbar--item {
  color: hsl(210,8%,65%);
}
.s-topbar .s-topbar--content .s-topbar--item:hover {
  color: hsl(210,8%,85%);
}
.s-topbar .s-topbar--content .s-topbar--item:not(.s-topbar--item__unset) .s-activity-indicator {
    top: 8px;
}
.s-topbar .s-topbar--content .s-topbar--item:not(.s-topbar--item__unset):hover .s-activity-indicator {
    top: 4px;
}
.s-topbar .s-topbar--item .s-activity-indicator,
.s-activity-indicator__success {
    box-shadow: initial;
}
.s-activity-indicator {

mathcat

@DLosc same

well two really long stretches actually

my score is 163-ish

Radvylf Programs

19:52

I've got a bit of a conspiracy theory

Running a speed test causes the ISP to allot more bandwidth to you temporarily

I swear my internet can be 15 KB/s and then I run a speed test and it's all back to normal

allxy

@RadvylfPrograms Kinda weird how Firefox and Chrome have almost the same version numbers...

Radvylf Programs

I think they've been trying to synchronize them

Sorta like what Bedrock did not long ago

allxy

20:10

@RadvylfPrograms Constantly run speed tests on your server lol

Wait nvm I forgot how speed tests work

Radvylf Programs

@allxy lol. luckily internet speed's pretty consistent at my house, but not so much at school

@allxy wait what

allxy

Don't speed tests test internet speed by consuming as much bandwidth as possible?

Or am I getting mixed up with something else

Radvylf Programs

I think they just time how quickly a set amount of data can transfer to and from a destination

Usually like, under 100 MB IIRC

allxy

Oh okay

@RadvylfPrograms The IT people at my school are trying to set up a new wifi network and now both old and new are horribly cursed and randomly break

Radvylf Programs

Schools must pay their internet people a massive amount of money. It takes serious skill and dedication to mess it up as bad as they do.

DLosc

22:17

@RadvylfPrograms I'm not a network person, but I'm sure it doesn't take much skill to mess it up badly. When I took Communications Networks in college, the whole course seemed to consist of "Here's another 27 things that can go wrong."

Radvylf Programs

Yeah yeah :p

emanresu A

22:30

TIL CSS has a min function

Radvylf Programs

Not supported by any major bowsers as of last time I checked

emanresu A

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Supported by firefox afaict

developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/CSS/min

@RadvylfPrograms Compatible with everything except internet explorer

Radvylf Programs

huh

caniuse.com/css-math-functions

emanresu A

caniuse.com/css-math-functions

ninja'd

allxy

23:04

isArrayLike = function (obj) {
    // working around blog-bug with "and" due to ampersands
    return !(typeof(obj) != 'object' || typeof(obj.length) != 'number');
}

Radvylf Programs

That's foka for so many reasons

I don't think they realize functions have a length

allxy

functions have their own type

Radvylf Programs

Ohh wait...

I see what it's doing, so it's not quite as foka but still some wack duck typing

Especially since Map and Set aren't included

Although guessing this is pre-ES6

allxy

Probabyy

Radvylf Programs

And this "blog-bug" has me a lil worried

allxy

23:08

Never seen that one before

Radvylf Programs

huh

I guess a node that's been removed or something?

allxy

TIL you can put a position:absolute element inside another one and it'll work correctly. w3schools lied to me

@RadvylfPrograms Maybe ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Radvylf Programs

@allxy It's relative to the parent instead of the window

Unrelated String

what other lies have you been told by the council

allxy

Yeah lol

@UnrelatedString That "es6 functions are not well supported" lol

Unrelated String

23:12

LMAO

allxy

They seem to have fixed that tho

Radvylf Programs

To be fair

For anything serious, ES6 is still unsupported on important browsers

Many corporations and governments still use Windows XP, MSIE, etc.

allxy

Frick internet explorer.

Radvylf Programs

For hobby projects and learning purposes ES6 has more than enough support but W3S is right that for production purposes it's too modern

allxy

@RadvylfPrograms Google still uses Python 2

@RadvylfPrograms SE using ES2020 be like

@allxy Source: developer program

Radvylf Programs

23:16

Not necessarily true

They could be using Python 2 in FooBar for sandboxing reasons, or because that's what they used at the time they made it, or because that's what whoever made FooBar felt like using, etc.

FooBar's like 6 years old IIRC

Unrelated String

python 2 in a competitive programming context makes sense since other competitions have been slow to move to 3 as well

allxy

I have foobar access but I've stopped trying because I'm not particularly proficient with python in general

And python 2 is annoying in that it's missing a lot of nice features

Radvylf Programs

Wait really? Like what?

They seem basically the same to me

Other than long vs. int name change and parentheses around print

allxy

f-strings, :=, functions instead of statements, and more

I don't remember exactly waht

Tbh I usually use copilot a lot when working on Vyxal

Radvylf Programs

:= is pretty new, I wouldn't expect many companies at all to be using Python versions that recent

allxy

23:21

compatibility = pain

Radvylf Programs

I guess those things missing doesn't bother me much because JS has no (good) formatting strings so I just concat stuff, and I rarely use = in expressions aside from ++ which Python 3 also doesn't have

allxy

@RadvylfPrograms I challenged a friend to create a grid layout that worked in IE. He gave up after an hour or two.

@RadvylfPrograms Yeah, python having ++ would be nice and kinda cursed

Radvylf Programs

Grid layout meaning?

allxy

@pxeger ^^ whython feature request?

Radvylf Programs

Does it have to be responsive? Or just like, a grid of boxes?

allxy

23:23

@RadvylfPrograms 3x3 responsive box grid

Radvylf Programs

So it resizes the boxes to fill the container it's in? or the screen?

I kinda want to try now lol

allxy

@RadvylfPrograms Just fill the screen

Radvylf Programs

"just"

allxy

Oops

Radvylf Programs

Getting the height of the screen is like, impossible without vh lol

allxy

23:24

Does IE support % units?

Radvylf Programs

Yeah, but those only work with the window's width

Since it's % of the body's width and height, and the body's height collapses down

allxy

Oh :| feel free to use JS

Radvylf Programs

That takes away the fun though :p

allxy

I guess, yeah

Radvylf Programs

I'm going to go boot up my windows computer, this'll be fun

The same sort of fun as amputations and kidney stones

Unrelated String

23:31

@allxy the context having string concatenation had me wondering "what would ++ in python do when we already have + for string concatenation" for a minute lmao

allxy

Haskell go brr

Opinions on the new canvas UI?

Unrelated String

...reminded me of curry ++ patterns, which just gave me an awful idea

allxy

@allxy You can place pixels, try clicking - the timer overlays the color bar

Unrelated String

give whython backtracking, with choice points that you can only create by using multiple splats in a destructuring lhs

allxy

Is this prologish?

Unrelated String

23:35

ye

Radvylf Programs

23:47

Did it

3x3 grid layout, MSIE 11, a few things that don't work entirely how I think they should but it didn't even involve any weird hacks from SO

allxy

\o/

You have tamed the beast

Unrelated String

wow

Radvylf Programs

Had to use Edge's built-in IE emulation

But confirmed that it behaves the same

allxy

Woah

Radvylf Programs

Appparently you have to height: 100% the body and even html for it to work

But then I just needed to do a fairly typical rows-of-inline-blocks thing to make a 3x3 layout, and use %s to size it

allxy

23:51

@RadvylfPrograms Noice

Radvylf Programs

Not a very sustainable strategy for more complex layouts though, and even with something this simple there was a weird bug with the margins

So I still have quite a bit of respect for people who bother to support it xXD

> xKD

my new webcomic leaked :o

allxy

00000000: 2020 0a53 6f20 4920 7374 696c 6c20 6861 .So I still ha
00000010: 7665 2071 7569 7465 2061 2062 6974 206f ve quite a bit o
00000020: 6620 7265 7370 6563 7420 666f 7220 7065 f respect for pe
00000030: 6f70 6c65 2077 686f 2062 6f74 6865 7220 ople who bother

You asked for xxd lol

Radvylf Programs

lol

allxy

CMC: Guess which key of my keyboard has started to wear out

Radvylf Programs

d

allxy

23:57

Nope

Bgil Midol

w

allxy

And fyi, I use qwerty and not vim

Radvylf Programs

Oh. Hmm, ,?

I'm guessing it's something slightly unexpected and not like, e or t

Aiden Chow

CTRL?

allxy

Nope

Aiden Chow

23:58

shift?

allxy

Nope

Aiden Chow

lol ok idk then

backspace?

allxy

Nope. Tell me if you give up

Transcript for