The Nineteenth Byte

DialFrost

04:00

?

Radvylf Programs

@Bubbler How's that a reason?

DialFrost

@Bubbler wut does tat mean

Bubbler

Boring, repetitive, basically the same task to many other ascii-art challenges already on the site but just with a different picture

emanresu A

What I mean is that "draw pattern scaled to certain size" is just not particularly interesting

DialFrost

wats interesting now then

Radvylf Programs

04:02

That's what's hard about writing challenges

Bubbler

^

Aiden Chow

^^

emanresu A

^^^

DialFrost

uhh

so ur saying its hard to make a challenge inetersting

Aiden Chow

ye

exactly

DialFrost

04:04

hmmm

looks like im going to answering then

Aiden Chow

creativity is key to making interesting challenges

DialFrost

lol

im not creative - big problem

cant answer simple coding questions - another problem

Aiden Chow

@DialFrost lmaooo me too

PyGamer0

@AidenChow LockPickingLawyer: Throws away the key and picks the lock.

Aiden Chow

not creative in the slightest, i only have like 2 challenges

Bubbler

04:05

@DialFrost This is easier to fix: practice more

DialFrost

@Bubbler i've been coding for 2 years

and i dont even know what recursive functions are

Aiden Chow

@DialFrost i mean u do seem to be able to answer more complicated questions, i think u r just doubting urself too much

emanresu A

Mar 14 at 1:10, by lyxal

and to understand recursion, you must first understand recursion

DialFrost

@AidenChow nope

Aiden Chow

@DialFrost . . . I swear ive seen u use recursion in at least one of ur python answers lol

DialFrost

04:06

uh

rly?

lol

its like in chess

i dont even know what opening im playing i just play it

@AidenChow where?

PyGamer0

@emanresuA but recusion can only be understood if you understand recursion

DialFrost

@Bubbler i've ran out of fuel

PyGamer0

@DialFrost go to the nearest gas station near you to get some fuel

DialFrost

lol

Aiden Chow

@DialFrost codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/242583/96039, function p is a recursive function

DialFrost

04:11

it is?

Aiden Chow

and also that seems like a pretty sophisticated answer for a complicated problem

so it would seem like u, in fact, can solve more complicated challenges

DialFrost

uh

prob not

i made my solutionwayyyy to complicated

look at the firts answre

Aiden Chow

why not?

DialFrost

only 300 bytes!

me: 2000

Aiden Chow

well at least u can solve those problems, i cant even understand them :P

Jo King

04:13

you could probably save ~200 bytes shortening self

Bubbler

@DLosc 66 codels

tlrnftleuiiasskbbrnnnfttttleeeeui
     teeiisssbbbbnnnntttteeeee ii

DialFrost

@JoKing i dont know how tho

Bubbler

push 1, neg, print, push 1, print, push 2, print, ..., push 9, print

Jo King

self is a long variable name. try using a single character one instead

DialFrost

u cant do s=self

PyGamer0

04:14

@DialFrost uh no

Aiden Chow

instead of def __init__(self,...) im pretty sure u can do def __init__(s,...) instead, and s would be the same as self

DialFrost

theres no way that works

pppery

it does

PyGamer0

^

DLosc

2 hours ago, by DLosc

From an encoding perspective, it's "nice" because the low bit of each character corresponds to the blue channel of the associated color, the next bit to the green channel, and the next bit to the red channel. But I guess that's not super important for this application, and I should have made it less "clever" and more Piet-specific.

Aiden Chow

04:15

then u can replace all instances of self with s

Jo King

why not? it's just a variable name

Bubbler

self is just a variable name

PyGamer0

^^ and ^

Jo King

sometimes i use this instead just to fuck with people

PyGamer0

you can also use this

ninja'd

Unrelated String

04:16

the whole point of explicit self is it gets to be just a variable name

lmao

DialFrost

@AidenChow IT WORKS

HOW

Unrelated String

it is literally just a variable name

PyGamer0

^

allxy

^^

PyGamer0

self is not a keyword

Bubbler

04:16

we already explained how

Aiden Chow

@DialFrost yeah, as other ppl have already mentioned, self is just a variable name, nothing special about it

allxy

Took me a while to get used to it coming from JS

DialFrost

see i dont even understand self

lol

Unrelated String

note that the self parameter isn't even magical or hidden or anything from the outside, you can literally call the method from the class and pass an object in as that parameter

PyGamer0

if self was a keyword then you will not need to pass self as a parameter to the methods

allxy

04:17

I would tell you that it's similar to JS's .call but you don't do JS

PyGamer0

@UnrelatedString so? int.__init__(1)?

ok o/

Unrelated String

exactly

allxy

Unrelated, but does anyone feel like don't do sounds wrong?

Unrelated String

...i'm not sure that works since it's __init__

but yeah

PyGamer0

> Unrelated

Unrelated String

04:18

heh

Bubbler

@allxy you don't do do do do this

PyGamer0

lol

o/

Jo King

heh, doo doo

allxy

@Bubbler I'm not even sure how to parse that

PARSING ERROR: THIS LOOKS LIKE INTERCAL

3

DLosc

@allxy PLEASE DO GIVE UP

The Fifth Marshal

04:20

@UnrelatedString It does work with __init__, and in fact int.__init__(1) is valid (albeit pointless) Python code that does nothing.

Unrelated String

PLEASE(1002)NEXT

allxy

@DLosc No. I won't give this up or let it down.

The Fifth Marshal

int.__init__(1,"extra","irrelevant","arguments") is even valid.

DialFrost

got it down to 1843 from 2040!

jo king was right!

he guessed it 3 bytes off

is this rly neccserray for a question?

Your program needs to take input from STDIN, or the nearest equivalent if not possible.
Your program needs to output using STDOUT, or the nearest equivalent if not possible.

emanresu A

NO.

just use the defaults like a normal person

Radvylf Programs

04:26

Today's xkcd seems super rushed

DialFrost

@RadvylfPrograms ?

The Fifth Marshal

41

A: Things to avoid when writing challenges

Arbitrarily overriding the defaults The default code formats, input/output methods, and other defaults are a product of community thought and discussion. Don't change them just because you feel like it or disagree with them. They have good reasons for being as they are, some of which are only app...

emanresu A

@RadvylfPrograms Which one?

Radvylf Programs

1. It doesn't fit on my screen correctly
2. The math is wrong in the title text (200% - 30% != 280%)
3. Misspelling of "increase"

Unless the last two are intentional but it seems unlikely to me

Unrelated String

@DialFrost 1825 by folding the return after that try...except into it?

like

try:s.y=K[s.y][c];1/s.e()
except:return 0

DialFrost

04:32

where?

Unrelated String

lines 35-37 if i counted right

DialFrost

oh

it works

thx

Unrelated String

yw

The Fifth Marshal

Some more suggestions: you can change return 0 to just return everywhere, and I think you can change if not S.t("FU"):raise Exception to just S.t("FU") since input validation isn't normally necessary

DLosc

@RadvylfPrograms Hm... well, even if the subtraction were correct, it would be completely meaningless to subtract those two percentages, so it's possible that the mistakes are intentional since the hypothetical person saying the title text clearly doesn't know what they're talking about.

The not fitting on the screen bit is weird, tho.

DialFrost

04:35

@TheFifthMarshal it works thx thefith

marshal*

Unrelated String

I solved Semantle #60 in 26 guesses. My first guess had a similarity of 0.90. My first word in the top 1000 was at guess #15. My penultimate guess had a similarity of 75.15 (999/1000). semantle.novalis.org

Aiden Chow

@UnrelatedString niiice

Unrelated String

i played it kinda inefficiently but also got kinda lucky so yeah

Aiden Chow

it seems like todays word is relatively ez for everyone

allxy

WTF NO

today's is stupid

Unrelated String

04:38

i worked up very slowly from my first 20-something being spoiler lmao

Aiden Chow

lmaooo nvm

my first top 1000 word was spoiler at guess #7, if i played it smarter i most likely couldve gotten it with less guesses than what i got (23 guesses), but wutever

Unrelated String

and it kinda bit me in the ass that i probed spoiler so early; got hung up a bit on that on my second to last guess lmao

Aiden Chow

@UnrelatedString yeah, i was looking for those too

my penultimate guess was #999 smh

Unrelated String

i tried multiple earlyish and the conclusion i drew was... wrong

same lmao

The Fifth Marshal

@DialFrost You can get 1768 bytes by making e throw an exception for invalid output instead of returning: tinyurl.com/57j9vjx7

DialFrost

04:42

why is everyone here so smart

thx marshal

Unrelated String

for some reason i guessed 919 before 917 after my first top 1000 was 549

DialFrost

i need a friking calculator to check how many bytes marshal saved

lol

Aiden Chow

@UnrelatedString lol it seems like we had a pretty similar route, i did 917 -> 919 -> 549 instead

Unrelated String

lol

all of my guesses since they actually fit in one screenshot for once

The Fifth Marshal

And -1 more byte by removing the space before "and" in if s.b>=1 and s.E[l]:g (oops, my mistake, I should have caught that earlier)

DialFrost

04:48

wat line

The Fifth Marshal

Oh, and you can delete the input() at the beginning for 1760 bytes (relevant meta post: codegolf.meta.stackexchange.com/a/12442/46076)

DialFrost

wait wat

how to get input then

Aiden Chow

wait oops i did 917 -> 549 -> 919 but wutever, doesnt really matter, still had a similar route

The Fifth Marshal

I mean delete the code that inputs the cube size and ignores it, since you can ignore input by default per the link I posted

Bubbler

@DLosc 48 codels. This is revolution

tlrtmedaskijfv b
crjkndtvuijbcrjb
ltrvfjiksademt b

DialFrost

04:50

ye but i dont know how

Aiden Chow

@Bubbler wtf, how does that even work :|

The Fifth Marshal

tinyurl.com/5av5x4ta

Bubbler

>>>>>>>>>>>>>v X
>>>>>>>>>>>>>+>X
^<<<<<<<<<<<<< X

DialFrost

thx marshal

wait marshal

ru a moderator?

Bubbler

Used explicit turn-right at the start of the 2nd row

The Fifth Marshal

04:53

No, I'm not a moderator, although I do a lot more moderation activity than actual code golfing (and, if anyone cares, I was responsible for the close vote review queue spike that occurred earlier today)

DialFrost

@TheFifthMarshal ah ok

spike?

rly wat happen

The Fifth Marshal

2 hours ago, by emanresu A

The close vote review queue has been really active recently

DialFrost

ah ok

u only have 6k rep

strange

i swear u had like 50k or something

Aiden Chow

@DialFrost lol maybe u mistaken for someone else?

DialFrost

maybe

The Fifth Marshal

04:59

I do everything but gain rep

DialFrost

lol

allxy

@TheFifthMarshal So does ais

The Fifth Marshal

For very different reasons

I do it because I just enjoy moderating more than posting (across the entire network)

DialFrost

wow okey

im more active on chess now tho

cuz its easier to answer

coding is exrtremley tricky

especially for a noob

allxy

Javascript object references have come back to bite me

Aiden Chow

05:09

Daily Crosswordle 69: 4m 16s https://crosswordle.vercel.app/?daily=1

⬜⬜⬜🟨⬜
⬜🟨⬜🟨⬜
🟨⬜🟩🟨🟩
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

Bubbler

@DLosc 40 codels with my first proper loop

dddddtqdjeqkbvleqkbv
dddd e??sc        vv

push 9, while top is nonzero { dup; subtract 1 }, print 10 times

allxy

@AidenChow That is hard

Done, 6m 57s

@AidenChow Was your solution spoiler

DialFrost

wats the yellow thing

allxy

Because I feel like there's more than one correct answer

DialFrost

for wordle

Aiden Chow

05:19

@allxy huh are u doing 70 or 69

cuz my final word was "tease" not "utter"

allxy

oh it must be daily

sorry for tomorrows spoiler

I assumed it was like semantle

Unrelated String

@allxy i tried this and managed to get to that third line without managing to come up with anything valid for before it lmao

attempted first two lines were spoiler lmaoooo

lyxal

@allxy wow it is

Aiden Chow

yall doing 70??

lyxal

I am

Because I'm future.

Aiden Chow

05:28

im sitting here thinking that the game wasnt too bad, and yall are saying that it was hella hard :\

lyxal

Try my Crosswordle https://crosswordle.vercel.app/?puzzle=v1-9,39,40,242-lyxal
⬛⬛🟨⬛⬛
⬛🟨🟨🟨⬛
⬛🟨🟨🟨🟨
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

@AidenChow it's a good kind of challenging

Aiden Chow

@lyxal lmaoooo, nice one

lyxal

@lyxal Edited so that you nerds don't take that out of context

Try my Crosswordle https://crosswordle.vercel.app/?puzzle=v1-18,18,18,78,242-frick
⬛⬛🟩⬛⬛
⬛⬛🟩⬛⬛
⬛⬛🟩⬛⬛
⬛🟩🟩🟩⬛
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

Pattern 100% intentional

Aiden Chow

@lyxal dude why tf is this so hard

lyxal

This is a great meme format

PyGamer0

05:32

@lyxal what is that? effiel tower?

huh CGCC doesnt have a fennel answer yet.

time to do one

lyxal

Try my Crosswordle https://crosswordle.vercel.app/?puzzle=v1-30,30,164,164,242-smile
⬛🟨⬛🟨⬛
⬛🟨⬛🟨⬛
🟩⬛⬛⬛🟩
🟩⬛⬛⬛🟩
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

allxy

@lyxal Got it

spoiler

PyGamer0

@PyGamer0 vvvvv

pxeger

@flawr Thank you!

lyxal

Last one I swear

allxy

05:41

@lyxal TIL weest

Aiden Chow

@lyxal ayy finally got this one, it was really challenging for some reason spoiler

lyxal

:60768716 Try my Crosswordle https://crosswordle.vercel.app/?puzzle=v1-27,23,242-beans
⬛🟨⬛⬛⬛
⬛⬛🟩🟨🟩
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

allxy

@AidenChow Your words were very different to mine

lyxal

I made sure not to include my solution this time

PyGamer0

i swear where is the hello world

allxy

05:44

@lyxal spoiler

PyGamer0

0

A: "Hello, World!"

Fennel, 23 bytes (print "Hello, World!") From the fennel website: Fennel is a programming language that brings together the speed, simplicity, and reach of Lua with the flexibility of a lisp syntax and macro system.

there

Aiden Chow

@lyxal spoiler

lyxal

@AidenChow my intended solution was spoiler

att

I solved Semantle #60 in 96 guesses. My first guess had a similarity of 7.43. My first word in the top 1000 was at guess #38. My penultimate guess had a similarity of 40.69 (919/1000). semantle.novalis.org

@lyxal spoiler

DialFrost

wait mathlab is MATL?

Hello, World!

05:57

1

A: "Hello, World!"

Fennel, 23 bytes (print "Hello, World!") From the fennel website: Fennel is a programming language that brings together the speed, simplicity, and reach of Lua with the flexibility of a lisp syntax and macro system.

Aiden Chow

@DialFrost uh based on this: esolangs.org/wiki/MATL they are different i think

DialFrost

matlab*

oh

PyGamer0

@DialFrost no MATL is a golfier version of MATLAB

DialFrost

oh

mathcat

@lyxal woah did you create it? I got spoiler

lyxal

06:00

@mathcat I made the specific instance of the puzzle, and my original solution was spoiler

DialFrost

guys

how do i make this output

mathcat

nice

DialFrost

in clojure

#(let[n(max 1(int((re-find #"C(.*)H"%)1)))m(* 2 n)](str "2"%" + "(inc(* 3 n))"O2 > "(+ 2 m)"H2O + "m"CO2"))

nvrm

mathcat

@DialFrost now it'll take you forever to overtake me in rep

DialFrost

>:(

i will get there eventually

hopefully

Aiden Chow

06:43

how do i make this piet code halt? llllldaaaqelU

i tried
```
U
llllldaaaqelU
U
```
which is one of the shapes bubbler suggested but it doesnt output anything after it halts

Bubbler

triple backticks don't work in chat

Aiden Chow

^ there should be spaces so that the U's are aligned vertically

@Bubbler oh, rip

PyGamer0

"hey is windows OS gud?"..."Windows ... Oh Shit"

Bubbler

use ctrl+K after pasting the code

PyGamer0

@AidenChow no multiline markdown in chat :(

Aiden Chow

06:45

               U
llllldaaaqelU
               U

what, i tried ctrl k it still looks weird

Bubbler

@AidenChow If the top left cell is black, it halts immediately

Aiden Chow

@Bubbler oh ye oops

Bubbler

Since you have a 5-cell block at the start, you can do

Aiden Chow

its supposed to print out K once (it prints out K forever atm), cant figure out how to make it halt

Bubbler

l        u
lldaaaqelu
ll       u

Aiden Chow

06:47

what, that actually works!

thx

DialFrost

i wish i was better at coding :(

then i wld have more answers then qns

Aiden Chow

personally, i usually just go for easier challenges

AviFS

Hi hi!

pxeger

I have a new favourite xkcd

DialFrost

@AidenChow arent any

AviFS

06:51

So much people is here

Aiden Chow

@AviFS ye, learning piet for lyal rn :)

AviFS

@AidenChow Oh?

DialFrost

@AviFS ye, me doin nothing

Aiden Chow

@DialFrost lol u should try learning new lang instead of complaining about code golf, its supposed to be fun

DialFrost

@AidenChow i cant learnnn

AviFS

06:52

@AidenChow I was so confused... I just got it.

I thought you were learning piet for lyxal

DialFrost

LMAO

AviFS

Was trying to understand the connection

Aiden Chow

@AviFS hehe lmaoooo

AviFS

Kinda sad since I made the initial LYAL post...

Aiden Chow

lyal and lyxal, they too similar :P

DialFrost

06:54

@AidenChow not rly

when u cant even solve it in the first place theres no point golfing

Aiden Chow

um ok, code golfing is supposed to be fun @DialFrost

DialFrost

@AidenChow supposed to

Aiden Chow

the process of solving a challenge is one of the main joys of code golf

at least to me

@DialFrost ok then why do you code golf, if not for fun?

DialFrost

@AidenChow uh

uhhhh

Aiden Chow

its not like someone is forcing u to code golf in the first place

DialFrost

06:56

ye

but..

i like golfing, but the process of solving the challenge is the most annoying and chalelnging, its prob fun if u eventually solved it

PyGamer0

@DialFrost but thats like the core of this site

problem solving..

DialFrost

ye

i cant

thats the problem

Aiden Chow

uh so u like golfing code, but not creating code???

DialFrost

to an extent yes

my brain cant translate verbal to code

PyGamer0

then golf existing ones...

DialFrost

06:59

existing meaning wat

Aiden Chow

ye, u can still golf other ppls code

theres a plethora of answers for u to choose from

DialFrost

@AidenChow i mean i dont rly benefit but ok

plus im no expert at golfing, i can hardly golf well

marshal cut off 65 bytes with ease ealier

PyGamer0

> Existence is the ability of an entity to interact with physical or mental reality. In philosophy, it refers to the ontological property[1] of being.[2]

Aiden Chow

@DialFrost . . . u benefit by enjoying it and having fun?!?!?!

PyGamer0

^

Aiden Chow

07:00

rep is not everything uk

DialFrost

@AidenChow i dont benefit when i cant golf the code

PyGamer0

or do you want internet points

DialFrost

@PyGamer0 sussy

AviFS

@PyGamer0 me

DialFrost

@AidenChow thats not my point

PyGamer0

07:01

CMM: Do tips questions need to be sandboxed?

Aiden Chow

@DialFrost well thats the thing, when u finally do manage to golf the code, it feels like an accomplishment. thats the benefit right there. and anyways, if u cant find any golfs for a particular answer, just move onto another answer

DialFrost

if i can golf the code, then great! i benefit by practicing, when ppl alr golf them to such extent that i dont understand it and cant golf it even if i understand it, i dont benefit

@AidenChow never happens to me

Aiden Chow

as i said, there are literally tons of answers on CGCC, just choose one that looks interesting and start golfing!

there has to be at least some that u can golf

PyGamer0

why dont you workout your brain and start answering?

DialFrost

nope

@PyGamer0 i rarely answer

@AidenChow i've been looking through over at least 15 qns

Aiden Chow

07:03

@DialFrost and why not?

AviFS

@PyGamer0 In principle, requiring everything to be sandboxed is just easier, and safer, than having different classes of problems require different protocols. In practice, those of us familiar with CGCC, aka cocky, bypass sandboxing at our own discretion anyway.

DialFrost

no luck

@AidenChow cant solve them

or dont understand them

AviFS

So just because we don't necessarily sandbox our own tip questions when they're pretty straightforward, doesn't mean we shouldn't state it as a general rule for newer folks.

Aiden Chow

@DialFrost yeah, that is a problem, but there should be challenges out there that u could solve, CGCC has about 13k questions asked as of right now

PyGamer0

@AviFS ok ill sandbox a tips question then...

AviFS

07:06

@PyGamer0 Only after reading the second half :p

Aiden Chow

@PyGamer0 uhhhh idk about sandboxing a tips question, i dont usually see those type of questions being in the sandbox

DialFrost

@AidenChow its extremely rare for me to come across a easy qns

PyGamer0

@AviFS i guess i'm bad at english so i'll sandbox it :)

Aiden Chow

@DialFrost eh, how simple do you want the challenges??! i feel like some of the most recent challenges were pretty simple, like the interstice of two binary numbers or convert from twos complement to integer

AviFS

@PyGamer0 I hate that I'm the reason for increased human suffering on this Earth.

DialFrost

07:08

@AidenChow dont understand that qns

plus if i did, someone prob has the same answer but posted alr

Aiden Chow

ok what about the ascii envelope one, that one is really simple to understand

plus its not that complicated as to be impossible, yet challenging enough to be fun to solve

DialFrost

dont know also

i understand but cant solve

Aiden Chow

did u even try???

DialFrost

uh sorta

i dont know how to make the lines and spaces according to input

PyGamer0

@AviFS im posting to main v

New Posts

07:16

0

Q: Tips for golfing in Fennel

Fennel is a lispy language which compiles to Lua. From its page: Fennel is a programming language that brings together the speed, simplicity, and reach of Lua with the flexibility of a lisp syntax and macro system. I am looking for general tips for golfing in this language. Tips should be somew...

lyxal

@AviFS no, no, I decided to demand everyone learn piet today :p

PyGamer0

@NewPosts fennel-lang.org/see

lyxal

@AidenChow the worst part is that I had nothing to do with the similarities or any name comparison jokes

AviFS

@PyGamer0 Note they should be specific to Fennel vs being generally applicable lisp tips.

We already have that here: codegolf.stackexchange.com/questions/79719/…

So in addition to the rule against general-lang stuff like whitespace+comments, you should add a rule against general-lisp stuff and link to that main one.

PyGamer0

ok so i changed it

SegFaultPlus4

07:55

Try my Crosswordle https://crosswordle.vercel.app/?puzzle=v1-0,31,40,236,242-stove

⬜⬜⬜⬜⬜
⬜🟨⬜🟨🟨
⬜🟨🟨🟨🟨
🟩🟩🟩⬜🟩
🟩🟩🟩🟩🟩

Aiden Chow

@SegFaultPlus4 spoiler

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