The Nineteenth Byte

Ginger Industries

00:09

@RadvylfPrograms ಠ_ಠ

OldSandboxPosts

01:00

Sandbox posts last active a week ago: Will the dominoes topple?, Ragged index, Return shortest integer-is-one-of function

DLosc

Are we learning us a lang for great good?

Looks like Desmos has the highest score at the moment, followed by Haskell

Nitrodon

Looks like we aren't.

Unrelated String

01:41

speaking of haskell i just noticed there's a (<<) on tio that seems to behave like flip (>>) as one might expect... except i looked (<<) up on hoogle and it doesn't seem to exist

user

Old version, probably

Unrelated String

ah, so it's something that was actually removed in a recent version

interesting

context

Bubbler

(>>) == (*>) and there exists (<*) but probably not exactly the same as (<<) you want

Unrelated String

seems to work as desired here

DialFrost

shld i post my simulating bombs?

emanresu A

02:49

Hi!

Razetime

if someone's willing to teach desmos i'm in for learning me a lang

DialFrost

?

emanresu A

I sometimes use desmos but have no idea how to golf it

DialFrost

@emanresuA @Razetime ya guys think i shld post simulating bombs

Razetime

what does that mean

DialFrost

03:03

my sandbox post

Razetime

link pls

always give a link

DialFrost

1

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Simulating bombs More advanced version of this The aim of this puzzle is to simulate the impact of the shock wave of bombs on a square grid. The grid initially contains cells labelled 0 along with several bombs of type A, H, or B. Display the greatest intensity of shockwaves felt at each cell aft...

ye i wanna gna post it anyways

Razetime

i think you were getting feedback on this yesterday?

DialFrost

ye

but only 1 person answered

*which was adam

Razetime

ok what is the precedence of the bombs

what determines the order of bomb explosion

DialFrost

03:07

okey that is a good qns

the answer is: it does not matter

Razetime

left to right top to bottom seems sensible

DialFrost

cuz the highest possible bomb explosion will replace the lower ones

Razetime

basically reading order

what is "highest" in this regard?

DialFrost

so e.g. u have your H-bomb, where it emits a intensity of 5 right

Razetime

oh ok i see

DialFrost

03:09

then u have ur A-bomb right next to it

the H-bomb outshines the A-bomb

Razetime

well, that should be written somewhere

that's fine

DialFrost

ohok

Razetime

just specify that and also the order in which bombs explod

DialFrost

changed accordingly

pls check again @Razetime thx for ur help!

Razetime

yup looks good to me

DialFrost

03:15

thx!

New Posts

0

Q: Simulating Bombs

More advanced version of this The aim of this puzzle is to simulate the impact of the shock wave of bombs on a square grid. The grid initially contains cells labelled 0 along with several bombs of type A, H, or B. Display the greatest intensity of shockwaves felt at each cell after the bombs expl...

DialFrost

@Razetime pls check if i used the right tags

thx

PyGamer0

03:44

what happened to LYAL?

(i almost typed LYXAL out of habit lol)

emanresu A

@AidenChow Are you okay with teaching Desmos LYAL todayish?

(If not, we can do a different lang)

PyGamer0

DMSCMC: Calculate the sin of input.

Unrelated String

...sin(x?

i forget are variables the input method or is there some obscure other feature for that

emanresu A

I think sinx works

PyGamer0

i just need to know how desmos IO works x=0\nsinx

Unrelated String

03:49

oh it does nice

PyGamer0

let me go see how desmos answers work

well i think the input can be taken as variables

and output can be (idk how to describe it) the result of an expression

good link: desmosgraphunofficial.wordpress.com

a=0 becomes a slider but a=0+0 is a constant

emanresu A

An actual line of code found in an example program for school:

# Initialise some variables # this is a comment

@NewPosts Butterify? The bakery's about to freeze :(

Unrelated String

read that as butterfly and was a bit confused

Aiden Chow

@emanresuA OH SHOOT i forgot i even put desmos for that

lyxal

Gg gamer.

Aiden Chow

03:59

uhhhhh

emanresu A

We can do something else if you're not ready

Aiden Chow

totally not prepared

yeah can we do next month?

emanresu A

Sure

Haskell's the LYAL then if someone wants to teach @WheatWizard?

Aiden Chow

@PyGamer0 i usually use functions when i can but i think some people prefer to take input through variables

i will always use variables for input when dealing with actions though

its just easier that way

@emanresuA how long do i have to teach

so that i can plan for next month

emanresu A

As much as you want over 24h

lyxal

04:08

It doesn't have to be full on dedicated teaching for the entire time

There can be little bursts of desmos learning here and there

For planning, I recommend you write down how you want to explain/teach desmos (so that you can have something to reference if someone asks about the basics)

And then I recommend writing a list of CMCs that can be solved in Desmos

Aiden Chow

@lyxal sorry, new to chat, but what is cmc

lyxal

Chat mini challenge

Aiden Chow

so is that like an easy code challenge?

lyxal

Not necessarily

It doesn't have to be trivial

But it's usually not too hard.

Unrelated String

just something not quite main-worthy and/or especially conversation relevant

Aiden Chow

04:12

huh ok, im not good at creating challenges so i will have to think about this

lyxal

The idea is that it's not like a challenge on main where you have to objectively specify details

CMCs are allowed to have a bit of ambiguity/subjectivity

Unrelated String

in this case just whatever the fuck you think works best for teaching the language and challenging learners

lyxal

Exactly

And the IO formats are even more lax than usual IO rules

Aiden Chow

dang ok i didnt realize i was getting myself into all of this when i nominated desmos for this. i will see what i can do

lyxal

@AidenChow I usually get codex (GPT-3) to generate CMCs for me

@AidenChow planning early certainly helps

emanresu A

04:14

@AidenChow Do as much as you want :P

lyxal

Vyxal's LYAL had a month of planning and a meta proposal put into it

but most LYALs are spontaneous

And you just ask questions that you think will make people use different aspects of your language

Aiden Chow

@lyxal hmmmmm...

@lyxal how do you use this?

lyxal

Also, LYAL just means that conversations about learning the language are given more importance than normal conversations

Off topic/general conversation can still happen if there's a break in learning

@AidenChow beta.openai.com

You need to get on the wait list to join the private beta

I think the acceptance time is pretty quick

Once you do that, you just put some existing CMCs into the prompt box, hit enter and it'll spit out more CMCs

Aiden Chow

do i just make an account

lyxal

I think so

It's been a while since I last checked the sign up process

Aiden Chow

04:22

@lyxal :\ they asking for a phone number, i dont have one though (only in eighth grade, my parents wont let me have a phone)

is there an example of how this all looks like in practice?

just like a link of a msg to the start of a LYAL learning session

lyxal

If SE chat search worked I'd get you a link

Jan 19 at 0:00, by caird coinheringaahing

Welcome to the eleventh Learn You A Lang for Great Good! Today, we'll be learning Vyxal, a golfing language that aims to be both short and readable. During the day, Vyxal Bot will be active to assist people learning Vyxal, see the pin below for information about how to use it. During the event, feel free to post CMCs to practice Vyxal, ask questions about the language and so on.

Feb 2 at 0:15, by user

Welcome to the Scala LYAL y'all

Aiden Chow

@lyxal thanks

ok what is vmc?

and what is cms?

lyxal

@AidenChow Vyxal mini challenge

@AidenChow chat mini scala

Aiden Chow

ok so if i were to do a challenge only for desmos i would put dmc?

lyxal

Correct

Dec 22 '21 at 0:00, by pxeger

Welcome to the ninth Learn You A Lang For Great Good! Today, we'll be learning zsh, a Bourne shell derivative that's (sometimes) good for golfing. Feel free to ask questions about Zsh, post CMCs ("ZMC"s) related to the language, and just discuss the language in general. ATO (or TIO, if you're so inclined)

As you can see, LYALs can be as informal or formal as you like

And they can be as planned or as spontaneous as you like

Aiden Chow

04:39

wait im looking through this and it looks like they straight up just start giving out challenges, not really teaching anything

lyxal

That's a pattern that unfortunately seems to happen

We tried to avoid that with the vyxal lyal

And except for a few challenges at the start, I'd say it went well teaching wise

Bubbler

You could start by teaching the I/O format and a short reference to built-ins

lyxal

As well as how to actually make a desmos submission

Aiden Chow

it lasts 24 hours from start right?

lyxal

Yes

But you don't have to actively teach that whole time.

General conversation sneaks into the gaps where content isn't being taught

And that's fine.

28 mins ago, by lyxal

Also, LYAL just means that conversations about learning the language are given more importance than normal conversations

Aiden Chow

04:46

hmm ok is it ok if im not here for like more than half the time

cause i have school and everything

lyxal

@AidenChow that's fine.

I had to sleep during the vyxal lyal, and normal conversation just took precedence. Once I got back, learning started again

Aiden Chow

ok i might start it if i have time after i eat my dinner

Sandbox Posts

05:28

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Is it a fibonacci-like sequence? The Fibonacci Sequence is a sequence of positive integers where the first two elements are 1 and the rest are the sum of the previous two. It begins \$1, 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 13\$ and continues forever. But what if you started with numbers other than \$1, 1\$? You could...

DialFrost

06:14

its a wed y everyone offline

DialFrost

06:25

quick qns

how come tio.run doesnt support :=

in other websites it works

hyper-neutrino

for python?

because it's out of date (python3)

use python38pr

tio.run/#python38pr - yes, python 3.8 isn't pre-release anymore, but TIO is out of date

DialFrost

oh

thx hyper neutrino

i forgot about 3.8

PyGamer0

07:53

@DialFrost or use ato.pxeger.com

it has the latest version

also i hate my school

DialFrost

haha

y?

PyGamer0

should have taken home science instead of computer at my school ......

DialFrost

haha

pxeger

08:11

yeah, IME computer science courses below university level are all rubbish

DialFrost

ye

same

my school right, the computer science class teaches java lang

PyGamer0

java is bad

(imo)

I must change the language my school teaches from Java to APL.

lyxal

@DialFrost mine taught VB.NET

Which was an interesting experience, given that the school used Macbooks and Visual Studio runs on Windows (sure it can run on macos, but iirc it wasn't feasible to install VS on our macs)

PyGamer0

so i dont have to do crap like a>3?a++ + b-- - c:b++ - c++ + ++a

DialFrost

VB NET?

ISNT JAVA BAD ENOUGH

wat sch wr u in @lyxal

lyxal

08:19

@lyxal the workaround? Thumbdrives that had Windows on them and you booted windows using a VM

DialFrost

im suing them

PyGamer0

@DialFrost promotional exams are in a month, and i have 3 projects to submit like what. I have computer due tmrw >:/

DialFrost

lol

lyxal

@DialFrost Don't sue the school, sue the state I live in

DialFrost

i took sciences

:)

PyGamer0

08:20

sue the entire world

DialFrost

lol

honestly what happend to CG

it used to be vry active

lyxal

It was a course designed in 2001 or so when languages like vb.net were still prominent and pseudocode reflected that

DialFrost

tdy is wed, and the main CG is so empty

pxeger

sue-docode

PyGamer0

lmao

DialFrost

08:23

anyone wanna golf my "simulating bombs" code?

python3.8 btw

PyGamer0

@DialFrost no i got non-programming work to do

DialFrost

ic

PyGamer0

which includes writing about rain gauges

and drawing onions

DialFrost

@lyxal congrats on ur recent 20k !

(not very recent lol but congrats)

PyGamer0

> 🔵 ← pipis

DialFrost

08:28

wait u can js use `` instead of ``````?

PyGamer0

wdym

abcd -> `abcd`

DialFrost

like in CG

i always used code

whoops

i always used triple backticks

u can use 1 backtick????????

emanresu A

@pxeger The one I'm in is using Adobe Dreamweaver :(

DialFrost

hi adam!

emanresu A

Anyone want to play tanks?

DialFrost

08:34

tanks???

PyGamer0

@DialFrost yeah if the code is in the same line

DialFrost

oh

ic

but multiline cannot?

PyGamer0

yeah, multine use ```

lyxal

@DialFrost thank you, many appreciates

DialFrost

ic pygamer lol lyxal

pxeger

08:43

If codegolf.stackexchange.com/questions/242873/… then why is codegolf.stackexchange.com/questions/144017/… allowed?

l4m2

Can I, who can edit others' post, suggest an edit but not directly edit?

ophact

Any progress on figuring out @GingerIndustries package contents?

pxeger

@l4m2 Unfortunately no. That's a feature I also often wish existed, but I sometimes just put "feel free to revert" in the edit message

l4m2

Technically I can downvote random users till I can only suggest edit, then undo the downvotes?

3

pxeger

That's not a good idea lol

ophact

08:45

Only if you're quick enough

But if you wanna do that, start with my answers :)

DialFrost

haha

l4m2

That's why I say technically

emanresu A

@pxeger ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Look on meta, there's probably soemthing ther

DialFrost

anyone wanna further golf my code?

pxeger

I'm honestly tempted to vote to undelete

ophact

08:48

@DialFrost which code?

DialFrost

tio.run/…

nobody steal this ans. its for the simulating bombs challenge i posted

:)

ophact

Remove the space between 0 and "or", that's the most obvious one

DialFrost

cant

invalid octal literal

never put a 0 beside a o

ophact

Ok...

DialFrost

i can changed the or to a | and the and to a &

but it will still be same code size

the g[i,j]=v.lower() is annoyingly hard to get rid of tho

i havent figure a way to get rid of it

we shld celebrate when sandbox hits 300k views :)

PyGamer0

09:10

why i hate java: 18 characters for the print function oof

ophact

16 for "print lite"

emanresu A

DialFrost

wats that @emanresuA

Aiden Chow

@DialFrost it looks like a nightmarish trolley problem situation to me

DialFrost

haha

pxeger

09:22

@emanresuA the Travelling Trolley Problem: what's the quickest way to run over everybody without running over anyone more than once?

8

emanresu A

Lol

DialFrost

answer: nuke the shopping mall problem sovled

ophact

@pxeger solve the Königsberg bridge problem first

@DialFrost I think it's frowned upon to answer your own question so soon?

DialFrost

idk

delete ah

ophact

no it's too late now, but next time

DialFrost

09:35

k

im assumign u downvoted?

ophact

not me

PyGamer0

@pxeger sandbox that

emanresu A

o/

DialFrost

shld i js delete lah ophact

ophact

it's not up to me as to whether or not you delete your answer. I was just saying that it's generally frowned upon to answer one's own question without waiting a few days.

If nobody answers for about a week, then you can post your answer.

DialFrost

09:42

A WEEK?

emanresu A

Could someone VTD this?

Actually o/ now

ophact

Sorry, not enough rep :( the requirement is 3000, right?

DialFrost

wats vtd

ophact

vote to delete, I believe.

pxeger

@ophact no, you need 20,000

codegolf.stackexchange.com/help/privileges/trusted-user

> Voting to delete questions with a score of -3 or lower immediately after they are closed

ophact

09:45

wow

long way to go then ;)

Why isn't Nineteenth Byte message searching working for me?

pxeger

Oh actually, if you have 10,000 you can do it as well but you need to wait 2 days after it's closed: codegolf.stackexchange.com/help/privileges/moderator-tools

ophact

looks like the vtd worked.

PyGamer0

10:13

also i am not happy with java at all

System.out.println is super long

⎕← is much better, or : or even echo

ophact

presumably console.log is better, then?

ATaco

When in doubt, Just use a lambda and return a string.

Printing in Java, and many OOPy languages...

Sandbox Posts

10:33

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Disassemble tables code-golf Given a string that represents a bunch of tables stacked on top of each other and/or arranged side-by-side, disassemble all the tables. Tables A table looks like this: ------- | | | | More formally, a table has a tabletop, composed of n dashes, and two visib...

AncientSwordRage

@Adám I'm still thinking about this...

does anybody else have opinions?

DialFrost

? for what @AncientSwordRage

AncientSwordRage

if I should constrain the error output or my latest challenge to return negative numbers or allow any non-positive

like if there's no way to give an answer for how many matchsticks moves are needed, then do they need to respond with -1, -2 etc, or do I allow text output like "Ooops" ?

PyGamer0

@ATaco im doing this for school i cant return strings lmao

lyxal

@ophact the joys of being a 20k user :p

pxeger

10:46

@AncientSwordRage I think just "output anything other than a nonnegative integer" is the best option

DialFrost

@lyxal >:( im still 1.8k

:(

PyGamer0

when you write Scanner sc = new Scanner as Scanner sc = new Scammer £_€

DialFrost

lmaoooooo

AncientSwordRage

@pxeger cool

pxeger

also interesting challenge idea: the same, but supporting multi-digit numbers

like how many matchsticks need to be moved to change 12 into 51?

DialFrost

10:48

@PyGamer0 how come ur not posting anything in CG

PyGamer0

@DialFrost i dont have my brain cells

i lost them somewhere

i must find them

DialFrost

bruhh

PyGamer0

i almost golfed my java lmao

DialFrost

LMAOOOO

anyone wanna validate this post? codegolf.meta.stackexchange.com/questions/2140/…

AncientSwordRage

> You will take two numbers, and return the number of moves needed to convert from the first input number to second input number. If not such operation is possible output an Error Response (any consistent number less than 0 (-1 -> -Infinity) or crash):

DialFrost

10:55

guys singapore got 22k covid cases yesterday

yikes

ophact

@pxeger Sounds like a job for pathfinding libraries

New Posts

0

Q: How many matchstick moves to change a number?

How many matchstick moves to change a number Using the matchstick numbers here: Count the Matchsticks _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ | | | _| _| |_| |_ |_ | |_| |_| |_| | |_ _| | _| |_| | |_| _| How many matchsticks must be moved or removed to chang...

code-golf

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