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00:17
@RedwolfProgrammed Literally every single one of my assignments has a deadline of midday on whatever day its due. Working on this premise, I finished the last question on my Intro to Proofs problem sheet at around 10am on the day it was due, only to go and submit it and see "Deadline: 9am Thu 11th Oct" ಠ_ಠ
Of literally every piece of deadline-d work, that's the only one that wasn't at 12pm
You know what they say: Life is a bed of roses
@cairdcoinheringaahing F
were you able to submit it?
in Vyxal, 52 secs ago, by lyxal
Behead sounds good
@user mfer quoting it out of context just as I expected
No, but it wasn't an assessed bit of work, so it just meant that I didn't get feedback on where I went wrong
Like, I know it was "all of it", but I'd've liked some specifics :P
00:52
> integration by fear
5
every new student's first way of integrating stuff
you get so scared of the process that it just magically integrates itself
Sandbox posts last active a week ago: Loading Circle Animation
@lyxal Integration by substitution: Let u be the derivative of the antiderivative of xsin x. Thus, the integral is trivially solved. :P
01:08
dah frick why does my apple pencil keep deciding it's a good idea to lose connection with my iPad while I'm trying to take notes
smh
02:05
0
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

tshInput two positive integers m, n; Output a grid looks like below: ┌──────────────┐ ├──┬──┬──┬──┬──┤ │ │ │ │ │ │ ├──┴──┴──┴──┴──┤ ├──┬──┬──┬──┬──┤ │ │ │ │ │ │ ├──┴──┴──┴──┴──┤ ├──┬──┬──┬──┬──┤ │ │ │ │ │ │ ├──┴──┴──┴──┴──┤ ├──┬──┬──┬──┬──┤ │ │ │ │ │ │ ├──┴──┴──┴──┴──┤ └─────────...

02:50
Ello
Yes
Question: For constants that are arrays (like [1, 0]), should they be wrapped in a LazyList?
I don't think so. I don't see much benefit to that
Just push a list and be done with it
Does it get auto-coerced to a LazyList at some point?
Not necessarily
02:54
Then... weird bugs could occur
For example zipping with lazylist
Or not...
Ok :P
@emanresuA zipping accounts for that
The system is designed so that lists and lazylists can play nice together
I'm just going to leave it like that just in case
@emanresuA it doesn't matter if it's a list or a lazylist
03:04
Ok :P
I made it a lazylist because I wasn't sure what'd happen
It'd be better to make it a normal list
LazyLists are more for wrapping all the different generator types that python has
Well time to start on that 1000 word report
in how many hours is it due
fun fact: if you type at just 100wpm, you can finish a 1000 word report in only 10 minutes /j
My parents decided this would be a great night to go to a restaurant with a two hour wait (outside. in a line. in the cold.)
So I lost a lot of time I could be report-writing
@hyper-neutrino -46 or so
do you mean 4-6
03:11
No, I mean -46
I didn't actually realize we were supposed to be writing the report already in class, I thought we were still working on the bibliography
i thought you said it was due tomorrow
Yeah a lot of people forgot
they forgor 💀
oh ok so the deadline got extended? pog
It wasn't very clear what we were supposed to do when
Plus this is a team project, and a practice for when we do this for real for the AP test
@RedwolfProgrammed what's it on?
03:16
Mine's on solutions to agricultural impacts on the environment
It's a group project, four of us are writing reports on different aspects of a topic, and ours is the impacts of agriculture on the environment.
Oh man that reminds me of the time I did a group project on Quinoa in the middle east somewhere
So I'm writing about solutions, someone else is writing about the politics of it, another person is writing about the economics, and a fourth person is just writing about what the issues are in the first place
@RedwolfProgrammed on a Google doc?
No, four separate reports lol
Dang, so no group trolling
03:19
Idea: Government based around a collaborative google doc with the constitution. By default regional representatives get suggested edit access.
Lol
@RedwolfProgrammed gee that's way different to how we were made to do group projects
it's better
Back in my day, we had to make group contracts, share google documents, complete checkpoints and other stuff
It was horrible
We write several separate reports and git merge them /hj
"Project Based Learning" is what is was called
03:21
contracts??
@UnrelatedString yep
Group contracts
why, and how
@lyxal I do in most classes, this is for an AP class though so it's rather fancy and official
Basically, we'd agree that we'd do the work, be responsible, and have consequences if we didn't perform/contribute
We had to actually sign it and have the teacher check it
ಠ_ಠ
03:22
Those were the days when we used NTN's Echo
That implies sus is a substance you can take
Meaning I need to get into selling sus on the black market
poll: do your teachers at least mark group projects individually or does your group just get one mark for everyone
@hyper-neutrino group mark iirc
cringe
my gr10 history teacher marked group projects separately and I distinctly remember there being a 35% mark disparity in my group lmao
03:25
@hyper-neutrino idk but I really hope my chemistry teacher does the former because I ended up in a group with multiple people who decided it'd be smart to snort the baking soda we were supposed to mix with something
My social studies teacher just puts all the people who do nothing in one group then has them present in front of the class
Not as bad as the guy in my 8th grade science class who went to the nurse for snorting cheese-it dust, which they then learned is mostly salt
@RedwolfProgrammed what the fuck
@RedwolfProgrammed I see the stupidity of your classmates and raise you the stupidity of the year group 2 years below mine from when I was back at school
@RedwolfProgrammed what the fuck x2
03:26
@RedwolfProgrammed that's not as bad as the year 10 students who decided it'd be a good idea to get high on deodorant
On a school camp too
@lyxal You can do that?
Man I've been using it wrong
@RedwolfProgrammed apparently so
"Chromies" or smth
@lyxal how the hell lmao
@Niko idfk I wasn't there
Apparently they needed the ambulance to come iirc
brilliant
03:28
"what drug did you take"
"deodorant"
@RedwolfProgrammed This is the same guy who told a very NSFW joke in class, which was both funny enough to make our 80 year old teacher laugh, and NSFW enough to get him suspended.
It had to do with priests IIRC
And I'm not gonna retell it in TNB lol
I don't think he really cared about school
I see you that and raise you the kids who put a bottle of hand sanitiser over a lit Bunsen Burner.
@Niko well if kids can figure out how to get high from a whipped cream canister, they can figure out how to get high from deodorant
We had someone "unintentionally" plug something in halfway and drop pencil lead over the two exposed prongs
Somebody else was rumored to have jammed a paperclip into one of the 240v vending machine outlets and nearly caused a fire
That was at my middle school. Good memories.
Does property damage of a swimming centre count as peak stupidity or is it just commonly stupid?
Because that happened last year
03:34
I wasn't here for this but I heard of a guy who managed to bring down the computer system of both my middle school and another middle school in the school board
via generating directories via applescript and somehow that just broke everything xD
I used to break into classrooms if that counts
speaking of swimming
someone in my class ran into a car on our way to a school swimming trip once
Never got in trouble for it and I admitted to doing so to the whole year group and in front of several teachers
I managed to get a list of every username and password for every student in the school district, in second grade, by accident while messing around in the computer lab.
wow in second grade
how bad is your district's security lmao
03:35
I've got two good funny computer related stories that'll trump all of y'all's
They had some sort of external drive sort of thing for all of the students, with the name being their username. Our passwords were based off our birthdays, which were in some property of the folder.
My father created a fake student and no one noticed for several months
I got in trouble though 'cause I was showing it off
Number 1: I was screwing around with developer tools in the 8th grade to make the text of our schools LMS different (because that's funny right?). A teacher saw this and thought I was hacking the site. The principle called me to go to the IT guys office, only to have them laugh at my little prank.
@emanresuA You can make what looks like a fake student in my school district using a google group
cheezit.boy69@[school] redirects to my email
03:37
...
Along with all five of the kids who went to the chocolate factory
I don't think they do this anymore but your password used to be reset to your student number every year (maybe they still do this for younger students)
Including but not limited to augustus gloop
fun fact: your student number is on your report card and people looking at each other's report cards is fairly common
@RedwolfProgrammed I still get occasional emails from people who randomly stumble across Cheezit Boy
03:39
Created a fake student as in him and a bunch of friends did all his assignments, called out 'Here' in class, etc
a lot of classes in my high school also posted marks publicly using your student number to "hide your identity". except our email usernames are four chars of last name + first initial + last four digits of student number and in a class it's very unlikely you'll get duplicates in the last four digits
Apparently it was worth it for the report cards
Number 2: our school was mac based, so every 2 years, we'd get a new mac. Something I found funny was to turn the screen upside down by going to display preferences after pressing all sorts of hidden key sequences (google it). Now I did this on a new Mac one year (9th grade) on the first day, something usually fine. However, there was a little bug with mac os at the time which left the screen rotated upside down with no way to rotate it back
So here's me with my screen fricked up on the first day
And the it guys had to do some stuff to it to fix it
But that's not the funny part.
The funny part is that later that year, I managed to convince (using accidental reverse psychology) two of my friends to do the screen rotation during maths
sounds pretty funny to me
oh lmao
I told them "no actually don't do it because it's broken"
But they did it anyway
And then of course, they couldn't change it back
So they went to the IT support, only to find that they couldn't fix it
03:41
ಠ_ಠ
At this point, they've had to leave class early to try and get it fixed
My school district blocked their own website once. And google classroom. And google.
I'm pretty sure that they left school with the screens still upside down
Anyhow, they fixed it by downloading an app from the App store
I managed to create several bookmarklets which allowed you to embed various games in google docs
@RedwolfProgrammed o.O
03:44
@RedwolfProgrammed yeah well my school blocked github and TNB once
That wasn't a good day
We still don't have github :(
Or redwolfprograms.com
They found my site because I ran a chat room on it lol
If you think moderating chat here can be tough, try moderating a room full of 7th graders
@RedwolfProgrammed see now that's where you went wrong
Highlights include 1.2 GiB of lenny faces in one message
Took like an hour to paste if I heard the story right
I set up a message app thing but pretty much no one ever used it
@RedwolfProgrammed moderating chat here isn't tough lol
it's the rest of the network :P
03:46
@RedwolfProgrammed You ran your chat room online, meaning they could trace it without lifting a finger
See real gamers run the chat room fully on paper by starting a note passing frenzy
That's how I made a 3rd/4th grade paper version of DMs
We were passing notes from one end of the classroom to the other
Admittedly, it wasn't very direct
But it was still cool
We eventually got caught tho
Imagine hosting char
We just used the comments on a Google Doc from year 3
Luckily the school never blocked Lyxal.pythonanywhere.com
Mostly because I only made it after I graduated lol
I made a google docs based chat system once
Google docs with me were a place where you got epicly trolled
Your message would be "encrypted" and put into a collaborative google doc by an apps script, which would be picked up and added to your inbox document by another script.
It was actually really cool, and one of the first projects that got me into programming big things.
I distinctly remember jumping up in the middle of class in 5th grade and shouting when I finally got it all working
03:50
Wow y'all actually getting into real code at a young age while I spent my time being a scratch animator in 5th and 6th grade
4
"but Lyxal you suck at drawing"
Yes
i think i started coding in like around grade 5 or 6 and the first language i was actually serious with is JS and I live with those scars to this day
i think technically i touched python first but ended up using JS more until I started using Java
TI-BASIC, JS, Google Apps Script, HTML/CSS, JS, PHP were the first ones I learned
@lyxal but that didn't stop me from trying to draw terrible lip syncing :p
03:52
JS is in there twice since I learned it a little, but didn't get back into it until I started HTML/CSS
@emanresuA I came up with all sorts of horribly cringe scripts for mine. How about you?
I've repressed any memories of PHP I had
If you think JS is bad, PHP takes everything awful about it and inputs it into a very fast growing function
CMQ (for those who have made esolangs/programming languages): how old were you when you made your first esolang?
I was 11
@RedwolfProgrammed It's like perl and JS had a child, while adjacent to the core of a nuclear power plant
@lyxal 13 IIRC
It was called pipe
You can find it on esolangs if you dare
@lyxal heres how mine went: 1st nothing, 2nd grade: nothing, 3rd nothing, 4th nothing, 5th QBASIC (the most used language of 2020 :p), 5-6th summer holidays i learnt visualbasic, 6th HTML programming language and scratch, 6-7th learnt python, 7th more HTML, 8th C++, 9th (currently) java
03:55
I learnt HTML in year 7, and not as part of the class
@lyxal if you count dumb assemmbly clones then 12
It was for a project of some sort, a friend taught me
I'm sure I made something esolangy before pipe, but that was the first thing I made with knowledge of what an esolang is
@lyxal I made this thing where you could enter commands like TURN LEFT (in scratch) and was immensely proud of it at age 11
I wrote the interpreter in an airport IIRC
03:57
._.
@RedwolfProgrammed o?
Don't remember where I was going. Most likely san diego.
Maybe south carolina
I don't remember when I went on what trips but those were my first two times on a plane.
i went on a plane when i was 1 year (pretty sure)
Imagine coding in 3rd/4th/5th grade
Made by redstone engineer gang
7
Does redstone count as coding?
04:03
@emanresuA it counts as electronics
not coding lol
@emanresuA I'd say no
i started doing electronics when i was 4th grade
Redstone engineering definitely counts as coding in CGCC terms
A rather hardcore one (or, obsidian?)
@Bubbler bedrock?
Also frick moment when it takes a full day to set up a working environment locally, only because I lost access to gitpod
Bedrock is reserved for Malbolge or Seed
04:12
@Bubbler Does redstone exist IRL?
Just curious
Redstone is an unincorporated town and a census-designated place (CDP) located in and governed by Pitkin County, Colorado, United States. The CDP is a part of the Glenwood Springs, CO Micropolitan Statistical Area. The population of the Redstone CDP was 130 at the United States Census 2010. The Carbondale post office (Zip Code 81623) serves Redstone postal addresses.The village is listed on the National Register of Historic Places as a historic district and includes several properties that are also separately listed on the National Register. == History == Redstone was established in the late 19th...
The Redstone family of rockets consisted of a number of American ballistic missiles, sounding rockets and expendable launch vehicles operational during the 1950s and 1960s. The first member of the Redstone family was the PGM-11 Redstone missile, from which all subsequent variations of the Redstone were derived. The Juno 1 version of the Redstone launched Explorer 1, the first U.S. orbital satellite in 1958 and the Mercury-Redstone variation carried the first two U.S. astronauts into space in 1961. The rocket was named for the Redstone Arsenal in Huntsville, Alabama where it was developed. ��2...
Named after Redstone Arsenal
I'm now 33% of the way done with my report!
And I think I'll hit 1k words without having to resort to redundancy
04:31
More than halfway done. Just have to do fertilizer runoff, soil erosion, and waste production, then a conclusion.
that sounds very environmentally harmful, redwolf I can't believe you'd do things like that
Don't worry, I've already finished with harmful greenhouse gas emissions and reduction of biodiversity
I actually did both at once with a really big diesel truck with chainsaws on the front
04:58
for some reason i have a private github repository from 4 years ago that is composed of one file, "fizz.py"
def fizz(num):
	print(", ".join(list(map(lambda i: (str(i) if i%5 else "Buzz") if i%3 else ("Fizz" if i%5 else "Fizz Buzz"), range(1,num+1)))))

def fizzHundred():
	print(", ".join(list(map(lambda i: (str(i) if i%5 else "Buzz") if i%3 else ("Fizz" if i%5 else "Fizz Buzz"), range(1,101)))))

fizz-hundred()
> def fizzHundred():
> fizz-hundred()
the last commit is "fixed syntax error". i'm sorry to say past-me, you didn't
4
A language that supposed kebab case and also subtraction would be rather cool
raku does, so i guess i was ahead of my time
05:00
var x = 4; var y = 1; var x-y = 8; x-y;
kebabcase + subtraction is easy: <space>-<space> is subtraction and nothing else
raku has sigils too, so that identifies variables easily
I guess the commit message meant that it doesn't throw SyntaxError per se
It's valid Python, just with unknown identifier hundred
and then if you define hundred you'll get TypeError
the repository is called "UniLabs". I hope i didn't submit this somewhere
05:04
Lol
Looks like it's a company that does some sort of medical diagnostic thing
Maybe you were applying for a job there and they wanted you to code fizzbuzz?
alternatively, it could be short for "University Labs"
Yeah that probably makes more sense
oh no, it has branches
05:09
dev branch   -> "initial commit" (fizz function + fizz(30))
hundred-fizz -> "added 100 fizz" (added function fizz-hundred)
master       -> "fixed syntax error" (only fixed the function name, not the call)
how do i have four different ways of referring to the same function
Typical branch fiddling by first-time git user
See I avoid these issues by being too lazy to use git
Any time I make a significant change I just copy the relevant part into another file
Sometimes I make an entirely new copy of the project with the same name but in a different folder
this isn't even my first repository! i even had an earlier github account, along with Python code
@RedwolfProgrammed This is definitely less work than just using git :P
ahem, anyway, the reason i was trawling through my old code was because someone mentioned visual basic and i basically had a flashback to my year 12 project
windows now detects it as a virus, thanks windows
05:27
I have a malware.exe file that's a renamed png
what's the smallest file to get detected as malware?
05:40
Oh uh
Only the outline of the report was due
Oops
Big brain
Writes the whole essay when only the plan is due
Bet you wish you had gpt3 right now
Because it'd be able to write an outline of your essay from your essay
I can try get copilot to write you an essay
Inb4 it generates // TODO: Write essay
def writeRedwolfAnEssay(length: int, seed: int, file: str) -> None:
    """
    Write a random essay of length `length` to `file`.
    """
    import random
    random.seed(seed)
    with open(file, "w") as f:
        for _ in range(length):
            f.write(random.choice(["a", "b", "c"]))
05:47
I suspect this code will annoy everyone.
I love how it just keeps adding _config to the import and then properly abbriating it later on
> import markovbot.markovbot_logger_utils_config_config_config_config_config_config_config_config_config as mbluccccccccc
Anyway, since I stayed up until 1 AM writing a paper I didn't need to write, I'll see y'all tomorrow o/
Oh no I don't like that emoticon
05:59
@/
≤/
%/
We should probably stop this soon lol
Or we'll end up with the function arrow thing again
I was about to say that this ain't helping you sleep lol

Y'all just giving me more limbs to steal

5 mins ago, 4 minutes total – 8 messages, 4 users, 0 stars

Bookmarked 16 secs ago by lyxal

06:04
\ q/
06:15
CMC: Given a list of values compute average (sum ÷ length)
Vyxal:
₌∑L/ w/out that
jelly has Æm; S÷L without that
The sad thing is, not using is the same count as using it
@emanresuA yeah, ∑?L/
dinoux quadgraph: IJΣ÷L or alternatively ÞΣL÷
06:20
@PyGamer0 also, ₍∑Lƒ in vyxal if you're feeling special
actually, that should be ₍∑Lɖ
because we have a reduce by division element lol
because it's the inverse of ƒ which converts a decimal to [numerator, denominator]
so it's supposed to act as a way of turning [numerator, denominator] back into a fraction
I feel like that should be a digraph
well it's not like it matters now
everything's rationals anyway
Wait in v2.6?
06:24
yep
haven't you seen all the refences to sympy.Rational?
How do you do square root and stuff?
sympy.sqrt
if you mean the element
Doesn't it just give a symbolic expression for sqrt?
I assumed that just returned a Rational
turns out it doesn't
<class 'sympy.core.mul.Mul'>
Because it isn't necessarily rational by definition
06:33
welp time to put that into the vyxalify function
And trigonometry, exp, log, and the values of pi and e
CMQ: Is outputting things like sqrt(3)/4 as a fraction okay for code golf?
I recall lots of Mathematica solutions had to add N@ (evaluate expression to a number) in code golf
I'd say it's ok only if the challenge author says so
Simple fractions (as in integer/integer) is often OK
actually, meta says just outputting sqrt should be fine
18
A: Which number formats are acceptable in output?

user62131The language's default format for numeric output is always acceptable if it's consistent and unambiguous We accept function submissions that return numbers directly. As such, passing those to the language's "print a number" command (if it has one) should also be accepted; jumping through hoops t...

I'd say sympy's output is consistence and unambiguous enough
Idk then
06:48
actually, better question: is 6369051672525773/4503599627370496 acceptable for sqrt(2)
because it's just 1.4142135623730951 as a fraction
is there a meta consensus about floating-point accuracy?
No default for FP accuracy
That... I don't think many challenge authors will accept it
But you can always evaluate to float only when printing
and keep everything rational internally
but if they accept 1.4142135623730951, why not the fraction?
ok so I noticed I still have arknights installed, or at least, the shortcut is on my desktop
so i was like, "hey I wonder if it's actually still on my system", so I double click it, and it opens
and then it immediately blue-screens my computer
@lyxal because 1.4142135623730951 is imprecisely correct, the fraction is precisely incorrect
(at least, that'd be my argument for it - I haven't decided what my actual opinion on it is)
@lyxal On second thought, it could work if you add a line saying "my language represents every number as rational, so the output fraction is the nearest-rational approximation of the true answer"
Because this is a thing:
in The APL Orchard, Mar 29 at 8:09, by Bubbler
Time to give attention to limited-precision rats again
I might go ask a meta question for clear consensus
07:06
Meanwhile there's this among the I/O defaults: FP numbers can be represented as fractions
although i might post it later when I have time to write it
The only challenge which might be trivialized by that I/O is 1/x, which is actually not because it mandates decimal output
If you aim for a truly general purpose language, you'd need to eventually have a way to print numbers in decimal (as in, float-like)
CMQ problem: given two string S and T, count the number of substrings of S that are also substrings of T. Is there a fast way to do this?
Is there a specific relationship between the lengths of S and T? e.g. T is much longer than S or vice versa?
I can think of a DP that runs in O(|S|*|T|)
Actually not sure, might be O(|S|^2*|T|)
m90
m90
07:30
Make a [suffix tree](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suffix_tree) of each of S and T: [Ukkonen's algorithm](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukkonen%27s_algorithm) is O(length) if the number of distinct characters is small, O(length*log(length)) in general.
Then (within the same time complexity):
* Combine the suffix trees into one tree, keeping track of which nodes are in T's tree.
* Determine, for each node, the length-depth of its first ancestor that is in T's tree (possibly itself).
* Take the sum of those values for the S-terminal nodes. (For each node, this value is the maximum N such that
Markdown fails in multiline messages
@Bubbler let’s say the same thing
Then m90's method would surely work the best
@m90 thanks. That looks unimplementable though
m90
m90
@Anush Wait, are the "number of substrings of S" supposed to be distinct or not? For example, S="aa", T="a", is the answer 1 or 2?
07:40
Well yeah, it's surely an advanced algorithm
I guess the naive method is to make a hash table of counts of the substrings of S in S^2 time and then go through the substrings of T adding up in another T^2 time
@m90 if one can be done more quickly/easily let’s choose that option
@Anush You can iterate over each possible length of substrings and then it easily becomes O(S*T*min(S,T))
m90
m90
(My earlier answer was for the non-distinct version.)
Ah ok
Uh wait, the time complexity is not that easy
Set intersection of length-1 strings in S and T would be S+T, but length-k strings would cost something like k((S-k+1)+(T-k-1)) because equality testing takes k
m90
m90
07:44
@Anush The hash table can be replaced with a trie to not have to worry about collisions.
There are (n^2 + n)/2 substrings
@m90 good idea
I mean there are n substrings of length 1, n-1 substrings of length 2, ..., 1 substring of length n
Oh I see
and you don't need to compare different length substrings
True
If we want an easy to implement solution can you even do it in S * T time?
07:50
Direct evaluation gives S(S+1)(3T-S+4)/6 which is roughly O(S^2*T), but it could be close to O(S*T) in practice if your strings are pretty random (because string comparison tests will end early most of the time)
m90
m90
Yes? (assuming small number of distinct characters)
The trie method does not have the length problem because the longer substrings follow from the shorter ones.
For example, S="abc": create the nodes for "a", "ab", "abc" in a single pass; create "b", "bc" in a single pass; and finally create "c".
Then, say T="abac": traverse 'a' -> 'b' -> no 'a'; 'b' -> no 'a'; 'a' -> no 'c'; 'c' -> end.
For each starting point of T, the traversal length is upper-bounded by the length of S.
Very nice
so I guess the next question is how easily could a sub quadratic time algorithm be implemented
I am tempted to pose this as a challenge with quadratic time as the upper limit
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