The Nineteenth Byte

Redwolf Programs

07:04

Okay, just as a quick sanity test before I post this to SO, here the most minimal example I could make of the bug. Run this in the console, and look at circuit.lights. If the second one has on equal to true, the bug didn't occur. If both are false, it did. You can try again with circuit.run(), then check again. It usually takes three or so tries for me.

The code's not very readable, I also hard coded as much as possible

lyxal

@wasif one day when it's mostly ready

Redwolf Programs

This is the most bizarre thing I've ever seen, and I've now 100% confirmed it's not my fault

There is nothing there that could cause nondeterminism to my knowledge

Wait a second

It's not nondeterministic, it's always the third run that fails

wasif

@lyxal have you made your full todo list

lyxal

@wasif no

the todo list is actually more of a running joke

caird coinheringaahing

@Razetime No Patrick, mayonnaise isn't a programming language

lyxal

07:10

@wasif because I mostly get around to doing things relatively quickly

Razetime

@cairdcoinheringaahing Excuse me have you heard of the Mayonnaise programming language

Redwolf Programs

Okay

This has gone from cursed to unbelievably cursed

A single console.log being commented and uncommented is changing the outcome of this program

Unrelated String

classic

Redwolf Programs

It's console.log(lights[i])...it can't modify anything

So this is most likely an issue with V8

I'm going to need somebody else to confirm I'm not going crazy...

gist.github.com/RedwolfPrograms/…

Run circuit.run() six times

Then comment out line 94, open a fresh console, and try it again

It's working for me now :|

Both ways

This is half scaring me and half very annoying

Wait never mind

I just got it backwards

The commented one is the janky one

Do y'all think this is proof enough to post on SO?

Seems to work fine in node

I'm going to try turning my laptop off and back on again, and if it works after that I am politely requesting someone to come stab me in the chest with a fork

Confirmed the weird behavior still happens after restart

pxeger

07:31

hmm

Adám

CMC: fgitw Why won't today's xkcd code work?

pxeger

@Adám ASLR: the museum creators cannot follow the head pointer because it's mapped differently in virtual memory

Redwolf Programs

@RedwolfPrograms Can someone please try to repro this?

It'd be very useful for the SO post I'm drafting

pxeger

am trying

what exactly do you want me to do? I don't really know what the code is supposed to be doing

Redwolf Programs

Basically, when I run this in the Chrome 91 console, and manually run circuit.run() mayebe four times, the behavior suddenly (and unexpectedly) switches from printing 4 true to 3 true, and circuit.lights is not the expected value (false / true for the circuit.lights[x].on values).

Adám

07:36

@pxeger I was thinking something very simply: He uses smart quotes: “Item donation?” (They might even be backwards: ”Item donation?“)

Redwolf Programs

If you run the circuit.run() function a few times by hand, it should switch to 3 true at some point, but only if you have that line commented

pxeger

@Adám uh yeah that too

In Node (also uses V8):

lyxal

@RedwolfPrograms my money is on the fact that because the logging is accessing the physical properties of the pins, it's creating some sort of mini delay that doesn't happen without logging.

pxeger

Try It Online!

lyxal

You are running irl circuitry right?

Redwolf Programs

07:41

No

It's just normal JS doing JS stuff

Simulating a very abstract representation of circuitry

@pxeger The problem with something like TIO is that I think it's a timing issue, so running all of the circuit.run() calls at once doesn't actually let you repro the issue

If someone else here could try it in chrome or firefox's consoles, that'd be the most helpful option

pxeger

How can it be a timing issue? There's no timing going on

Redwolf Programs

As in like something internal

Running it all at once seems to behave differently

pxeger

Always outputs 3 true for me, until the 2nd time after circuit.toggles[0].on = true; when it outputs 4 true

Redwolf Programs

But after that, does it revert back to 3 true?

That's the weird part

Since it changes for me depending on whether line 94 is commented

pxeger

no

Redwolf Programs

07:46

@RedwolfPrograms Compare: all at once vs. one by one

pxeger

- i.sstatic.net/f6tjX.png

Redwolf Programs

Is that the commented or uncommented line 94?

That's how uncommented should look

(Also the number before toggling doesn't matter much, but the number of times after toggling should be high enough to give it a chance to revert, maybe 6 times)

pxeger

no, commented

exact same behaviour (minus the extra console logs) with it uncommented

Redwolf Programs

Thanks!

You're on FF, right?

pxeger

yup, Firefox 90.0b12

Redwolf Programs

07:54

Thnaks. Posting to SO now.

0

Q: Strange behavior in Chrome 91: Logging changing outcome

It's two in the morning and I think my laptop has ghosts in it. I'm sorry for the long MCVE, I spent a while shortening it by about 50% but I think this is the shortest I can get it without changing the logic, which seems to affect the outcome. Basically, when I run this in the Chrome 91 console,...

javascript

Leaky Nun

CMC: given a string, find the shortest palindrome that begins with such string. e.g. (abc -> abcba) and (fghh -> fghhgf) and (pqrq -> pqrqp)

also, is this complex enough to be a main post?

Redwolf Programs

I think we had this exact CMC in a BMG not too long ago :p

And there was a question today or yesterday involving that problem, but it was tips

Leaky Nun

May 27 at 9:01, by Bubbler

in BMG Drafts, 2 hours ago, by Bubbler

Draft: Given a string of odd length "ABCDE", make it a palindrome like "ABCBA". (Replace the second half with the first half reversed)

this?

Redwolf Programs

No

Leaky Nun

chat.stackexchange.com/…

this is the only result

Redwolf Programs

08:06

I remember the CMC very well, just can't find it :/

Adám

I remember it too.

Redwolf Programs

Jun 8 at 16:00, by Redwolf Programs

CMC: Palindromise: given a string S output the shortest palindromic string that starts with S

Leaky Nun

i see

Redwolf Programs

That was a very difficult post to hunt down, I had to search maybe ten things and my wifi decided to slow to a crawl :p

Leaky Nun

what can I say, great minds think alike

Redwolf Programs

08:11

Anyway it's three in the morning here, see y'all tomorrow o/

pxeger

\o

Adám

See you later!

Leaky Nun

CMC: given a string S, output the shortest palindromic string P that contains S as a substring. if there are more than one, output any of them. e.g. abc -> acbca or cbabc or abcba or etc.

Adám

Ooh, that's nice.

Good enough for main, I think.

Leaky Nun

alright, submissions in chat are now closed

Adám

08:14

@LeakyNun ⊢,⊢/⍤⍸⍤(,⍨\⍤⌽≡¨,\⍤⌽)↓⌽ I think.

Leaky Nun

⍤⍸⍤

all I see are little eyes staring at me

Unrelated String

@Adám I feel like I've already seen it

(on main)

Leaky Nun

I see

15

Q: Minimum insertions to make palindrome

Today you will be doing another palindrome challenge! So, your task today is to take a string, and determine the minimum amount of letters required to insert to turn it into a palindrome. For example, let's take the string fishes. In this, case the best way would be to add h if, so the result ...

code-golf string palindrome

CMC: output the following string: abacabadabacabaeabacabadabacabafabacabadabacabaeabacabadabacaba

pxeger

08:33

smells like de Bruijn

Leaky Nun

inb4 it's on main

@pxeger no, it isn't a de Bruijn sequence

Bubbler

abacaba sequence one is about generating exactly that for various input size I think

Leaky Nun

alright

imma just never post CMC's again :P

Bubbler

36

Q: Generate the Abacaba sequence

This challenge is about printing the abacaba sequence of a specific depth. Here is a diagram of the first 5 sequences (a(N) is the abacaba sequence of depth N, upper/lowercase is just to show the pattern, this is not needed in the output of your program): a(0) = A a(1) = aBa a(2) = abaCaba a(3)...

code-golf string sequence

math

@LeakyNun it can get shorter probably, but Vyxal 44 bytes

Leaky Nun

08:34

I mean, even if it's on main, it can still be a CMC right

people just have to... not look at the one on main

Bubbler

True

math

@LeakyNun CMC: Print "Hello, World"

just don't look at the one on main :P

Bubbler

@LeakyNun ngn/k, 16 bytes: {x,y,x}/"abcdef"

Leaky Nun

how on earth does that work

Bubbler

Reduce from left to right, making a new string of (current string, next char, current string)

Leaky Nun

08:37

interesting

pxeger

CMC: biggest pristine NOP (program that does nothing (no output), but doesn't do nothing if any continuous substring of characters are removed (except removing all the characters))

Razetime

@LeakyNun noooo

Bubbler

@pxeger Does erroring count as "doesn't do nothing"?

pxeger

@Bubbler no

Razetime

@pxeger APL: {}

math

08:39

@pxeger pristine?

wasif

@math there is a huge hello world question

Leaky Nun

@pxeger Java, 51 bytes: class Main{public static void main(String[]args){}}

pxeger

@math no longer fulfills the challenge criteria if any continuous substring of characters are removed (except removing all the characters)

5 mins ago, by Leaky Nun

I mean, even if it's on main, it can still be a CMC right

@LeakyNun not pristine; it can be M instead of main

math

@wasif yes, don't look at the one on main (this was a joke question)

Leaky Nun

@pxeger Java, 45 bytes: class M{public static void main(String[]a){}}

wasif

08:41

Well is pristine synonym of irreducible?

pxeger

@wasif sort of

wasif

Pristine sounds better then

pxeger

Pristine means "errors if any substring is removed"; irreducible means "no longer does what it's supposed to if any characters are removed"

Bubbler

Pristine originally meant a piece of code that does something as a whole, but errors whenever one or more chars are removed from it

^^ exactly

wasif

I see it's just like error quines for quines

Python pristine NOP "a"

I hope you can't remove all chars

Bubbler

08:44

no, it can be reduced to ""

wasif

Do empty Java programs error?

Razetime

yes, they do

java hates it when you have no classes

great language

Bubbler

@pxeger Is Leaky's answer valid? Surely it errors when some chars are removed?

wasif

Then I think pristine programs aren't possible with python

pxeger

@Bubbler but you can remove ain from Main and it won't error

@wasif nope; "" is pristine

it's just not very long

Bubbler

08:46

I mean I interpreted your answer as "the program may not error when some chars are removed"

wasif

Can you remove "" from "" lol

pxeger

@wasif there's an exception for the empty program

Bubbler

so erroring sub-programs do not make an answer invalid?

Leaky Nun

so 0 is a possible Python answer

and I guess [] would be a longer one

lyxal

CMC: given two positive non-zero integers n and m, return an n by m array of the first n times m natural numbers. E.g. f(3, 4) -> [[1, 2, 3, 4], [5, 6, 7, 8], [9, 10, 11, 12]]

Bubbler

08:51

@lyxal J, 1+i.

Takes a single argument [n,m]

Leaky Nun

@lyxal Jelly, 3 bytes: ×Rs

pxeger

@lyxal There really ought to be a short way of doing this in zsh using pr, but I can't find one

Adám

@lyxal ⊢⍴∘⍳×/ in APL.

math

Tag suggestion pls? i can't find any except math and code-golf

pxeger

parsing?

Razetime

09:01

@lyxal {x#1+!*/x} in K

math

@pxeger thanks. is arithmetic good?

pxeger

there's not really any arithmetic involved tbh

it's basically a string challenge, more than maths

math

ok, so string, parsing and cg

Razetime

09:15

i doubt there would be that much parsing involved

wasif

Back again

@lyxal how to get non overlapping pairs in vyxal

I mean divide list into n equal non overlapping parts

A username

@wasif 2ẇ

?

Razetime

@math The regex for this would probably be /([\w)])\*([(\w])/g,"\1\2"

math

@Razetime what?

wasif

@Ausername 1..12 to 1-4,5-8,9-12

A username

09:17

Then 4ẇ

wasif

Ok

Razetime

@math do you understand regex

wasif

@Ausername thx

math

yes

A username

@Razetime No

wasif

09:18

@lyxal Vyxal 4 bytes *ɾ¹ẇ

A username

Nice

wasif

Noo

A username

What?

wasif

1 byte longer than jelly

Razetime

@math then it shouldn't be too hard to understand

math

09:21

@Razetime i forgot some basic commands wait a sec

Razetime

lmao what

wasif

@math Sure?

Regex is very hard to understand

math

@wasif i learned it some months ago

wasif

@Razetime sorry

Shaggy

@lyxal Japt, 6 bytes, ×õ òUÌ

Razetime

09:22

@wasif it's a smaller dsl, takes lesser effort since it's mainyl constrained to string matching

Leaky Nun

@wasif I like how my answer represents the entirety of Jelly

Razetime

also there's many, many challenges which benefit from regex, shaggy can confirm since he has like 1.5k answers

wasif

Which language makes the best use of regex?

A username

QuadR / Retina

wasif

Nice

Razetime

09:25

@wasif general purpose I'd say perl any day

wasif

Retina is better (in terms of regex use)

math

@Razetime i can't remember what / if for, nor did i find anything in the docs

Razetime

@math / is the general regex delimiter in most languages

g implies a global match

math

@Razetime ah. not in python, i guess?

Razetime

probably

wasif

09:28

@math python uses strings to represent regexes too

That's the most flexible (I think?)

math

okay, i'll try in JS

A username

JS has a goddamn type just for regex!

wasif

CMQ: Which general purpose language has the largest core (less imports)

A username

Not Python - it needs you to import stuff like randoms and regex...

Definitely not any C-style language

lyxal

@wasif that's what I had

The r flag can be used for 3 bytes

wasif

09:32

Nice!

math

@wasif js?

wasif

@math maybe

Perl I guess

Razetime

Raku

math

@Razetime Shall i still post the question even if it has an easy regex?

Razetime

there a lot of languages which do not have regex

wasif

09:34

@Razetime example?

Razetime

and there might me a more concise solution without regex

Anush

hi all

wasif

@Anush o/

Razetime

@wasif K language

Jelly and 05 don't have it

Anush

still hoping that someone will add answers in C and Julia at least!

wasif

09:35

Jelly doesn't have regex??!!

Bubbler

@wasif Depends on the definition of "core", but Factor can be configured to load every single library in the default installation by default

Razetime

in general purpose it is hard to find languages without regex

A username

How?

On the other hand, pretty much all golfing languages have no libraries at all.

wasif

factor even needs to load kernel that's bad

That has the least core

@Ausername I asked for general purpose langs

Bubbler

@wasif Mathematica?

wasif

09:37

Yes we have the winner Mathemetica everyone else can go home now

Bubbler

You know, it has a built-in to determine if an image is a goat...

wasif

How did I forget that

Razetime

mathematics loads from online, no?

@Bubbler ah yes the orientation of a goat

math

@Bubbler i thought just a built-in to see if an image is upside-down?

Bubbler

@math No, it literally tests if it looks like a goat in the given orientation

Razetime

09:39

nope it also identifies the mammal

wasif

@math detecting a caprine animal

A username

@Bubbler Uh...

wasif

Exactly not goat detection

It is funny that: GOAT -> Greatest Of All Time

Bubbler

@Razetime It does load some data from online (like biology or geolocation), but mathematics part mostly works without internet connection I believe

Razetime

i think matlab might have some contention

wasif

09:42

How about R

Bubbler

R is not even close

Razetime

R still needs imports

wasif

APL?

Razetime

matlab and mathematics can create visualizations and gui out of the box

wasif

It is general purpose

Razetime

09:43

@wasif nowhere near

Bubbler

APL family is pretty minimalistic

wasif

@Razetime you mean mathmetica

Razetime

yeah

Bubbler

It's so hard to spell mathematica correctly :P

Razetime

@wasif APL doesn't have a large stdlib, it prides itself on having a small group of functions which work on a large range of problems

A username

09:44

You mean Mathematicalismisticimania, right?

Razetime

@Bubbler it's hard tot type without typos

New Posts

0

Q: Leave the times out!

Everyone knows, that you can leave the multiplication symbol (\$\times\$, or *) in a*b 23*a (2+3)*a a^(b*c) (a+b)*(c+d) out, but not in 2*3 => you don't want it to be 23 a*23 => most mathematicians just don't do it a^2*b => now it's (a^2)*b, if you remove the *, it's a^(2b) a/2*b => now it's (...

code-golf string parsing

math

^ i'm away for a while, so ping please

A username

@lyxal Does everything need to be either externally sourced or embedded?

AJFaraday

10:33

HI All
Thanks to a long night of sitting up, calming the baby, I'm nearly done with my Thud challenge!
I don't know if this is something we'd do here, but would anyone be able to try an end-to-end run of my answering instructions? Just to check they're right?
https://codegolf.meta.stackexchange.com/a/23556/16824

(It's currently importing from a couple of meta questions, at the bottom, and you could just copy an existing client wholesale to save time)

Sandbox Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Alteration of a challenge that was considered too close to an older quasi-duplicate. ISO Computus algorithm? code-golf? date Your task is to calculate from a signed integer year number provided as sole input the integer number of the calendar week of Easter Sunday as sole output with as few varia...

Razetime

10:54

@AJFaraday sure, I'll try it out

your reference implementation is very helpful

AJFaraday

@Razetime That'd be great, thanks! I'll be on and off here all day if you want to ask questions

A username

@lyxal Sorry about the branch juggling. Git can be a reak oaun sometimes.

lyxal

@Ausername what do you mean by that?

A username

I've mostly got it sorted now.

lyxal

@Ausername you don't need to apologise for that...I myself know that branches can be absolutely painful.

AJFaraday

11:04

@Razetime I'm glad the reference answers are helpful for you. Because it's such a long challenge I wanted to take away as much cognitive overhead as I could.

A username

Does all my JS / CSS have to be embedded / imported?

lyxal

@Ausername no

It can be single file if you want

Oh

Wait

You mean in regards to flask

A username

Just because webserver

Yeah

lyxal

Let me check

There's a way to link files via jinja templates

But I don't remember how

A username

It's fine

lyxal

11:06

stackoverflow.com/questions/46680164/ddg#46680265

That's how

A username

It's fine. I already don't understand any of the {{...}} stuff, and it's only ~200 lines of CSS/JS in the parser.

Razetime

@AJFaraday I suggest the tags king-of-the-hill game board-game javascript

lyxal

@Ausername if there's static files you need linked, I can handle that for you

AJFaraday

That makes sense. Is there anywhere I can add them to the sandbox post?

Razetime

generally people add then in the title using markdown: [tag:tag-name]

lyxal

11:09

@Ausername place the files into a gist and I'll organise the directories and templates

AJFaraday

@Razetime I've put them in to remind me, thanks

A username

@lyxal I suppose main.html is a bit of a mess...

Razetime

@AJFaraday can a single submission be submitted to compete both as a dwarf player and a troll player?

most of the functions seem to work on either side

AJFaraday

@Razetime I'm not sure there could be a client that's worth submitting for both sides. The API is the same for both, but it still needs to make valid moves.

Razetime

I'm sure there's a hacky way to do it, but alright

AJFaraday

11:15

I suppose the short answer is that there's nothing stopping you putting the same code into answers on both questions, but it's unlikely they'd both be able to complete a game :p

lyxal

@Ausername a necessary mess nonetheless

AJFaraday

I remember there being a tag for asymmetrical KotH challenges, but it doesn't seem to be [asymmetrical]...

Razetime

this has all ends wrapped up quite nicely

I like the elo-style points system, but

I think it may be more fair to add +1 to the winner and -1 to the loser

Neil

just stumbled across this pangram: "amazingly, few discothèques provide jukeboxes".

3

Razetime

@Razetime Oh, I get why the points system is like that. It prevents early truces when the opponents have a single point in difference, making the games go on longer

AJFaraday

11:22

So that's based on the actual official rules, where two players play a game, note the points difference, then swap sides and play again. That way it doesn't matter if the same side always wins, the biggest difference wins.

Razetime

@AJFaraday ah this is another solid point

N3buchadnezzar

@Neil Has there been any pangram challenges on site?

Razetime

@Neil is this a pangram in the french alphabet?

Neil

nah, I just chose the accented version from my spelling suggestions

Razetime

ah ok

AJFaraday

11:24

After doing a few test answers, the game is a bit more balanced than it looks. But I'm keeping this idea of ironing out the difference between the sides.

Razetime

@AJFaraday anyway this looks complete and ready to post, kinda surprised not many people upvoted it

AJFaraday

I don't think many people noticed it, to be honest.

@Razetime Would you mind posting an answer to one of the API sandboxes? I'd just like to check my automated importer is working.

Razetime

sure I'll try

A username

I just minified my parser/css and dumped it in there.

Razetime

where

A username

11:28

I mean, it's not like I'm going to be changing it any time soon, and I can always unminify it.

@Razetime main.html

AJFaraday

@Razetime As I say, I don't mind if it's just a duplicate of an existing one, just to see that someone else can do it without issue

@Razetime Dwarf: https://codegolf.meta.stackexchange.com/questions/23642/stack-exchange-api-sandbox-dwarf-edition
Troll: https://codegolf.meta.stackexchange.com/questions/18632/stack-exchange-api-sandbox

Razetime

Yep i found the meta posts already

AJFaraday

@Razetime Sorry, I'm not sure I understood the 'where' question. Was that directed at me?

Razetime

nah it was to @Ausername

N3buchadnezzar

Maybe someone choose not to upvote it as it is a troll question

... I'll see myself out

Razetime

11:32

@AJFaraday When i open thud in the browser and edit the template, it doesn't allowme to move up a line. I can only type characters on the last line.

AJFaraday

@N3buchadnezzar 👏👏👏

N3buchadnezzar

Very nice challenge =)

AJFaraday

@Razetime Ahh, that's a known issue. One I honestly don't know how to fix. github.com/AJFaraday/Thud/issues/3 The workaround is to use Chrome.

A username

@lyxal Why the </br>s?

Razetime

strange. alright.

I can use backspace I guess

good thing i have chrome installed

AJFaraday

11:34

It is mentioned in the question, and I'd like to get it out of the way, but I'm not sure how.

Is that on Firefox, or something else?

Razetime

it was on firefox

AJFaraday

Thanks

N3buchadnezzar

I had same issues on firefox (linux)

AJFaraday

I would have put up a SO question about it, but I wasn't able to make a minimal reproduction of the issue. I'm pretty sure it's frowned on to just link to a git repo and go "what's wrong with this?"

lyxal

@Ausername you mean at the end of the file?

A username

11:36

Yes

@AJFaraday Are you sure the game's fair? The trolls seem to have a huge advantage, and I can just barely beat one of the basic troll ais as the dwarves.

lyxal

@Ausername So that people have a choice whether or not they want to immediately see GEORGE and the Johnvertizsements

A username

Oh true

But why </br> - Ummmm, HTML standards?

AJFaraday

@Ausername So we were discussing this a bit further up, it's based on differences. So losing /less badly/ as a dwarf can still climb the rankings on the dwarf challenge.

A username

Oh ok

lyxal

@Ausername easiest way to space it

A username

11:39

Sure...

AJFaraday

It's less unbalanced than I thought it was :p

lyxal

@Ausername hey don't judge me for being terrible at css and web design :p

A username

Ok

I mean, I have this bit...

So the whole mess is in my fork, which you probably want to clone and have a look at.

I'll surge a static version.

lyxal

put the code mirror and parser into separate files

and I'll incorporate them using flask and jinja templates

N3buchadnezzar

Seemsmy last question (albeit vry simple) was well recieved and got quite a few answers

I am happy!

Razetime

11:48

@AJFaraday I attempted writing a controller but it says I'm not calling a valid move

module.exports = class{constructor(controller, utils){this.c=controller;this.s=controller.side;this.u=utils}
turn(){let p=this.c.pieces()[0];let m=this.c.check_space(p.x,p.y)[0];if(p&m){this.c.select_space(p.x,p.y);this.c.move(m.x,m.y)}else{this.c.declare(1)}}
end_turn(){}}

oh, it's a problem with checking space

A username

Not much point now - Also, the static version is done!

Razetime

hm

now i changed the thing and it still isn't completing a game aaaa

module.exports = class{constructor(controller, utils){this.c=controller;this.s=controller.side;this.u=utils}
turn(){let p=this.c.pieces()[0];let m=this.c.check_space(p.x,p.y).moves[0]||0;if(p&m){this.c.select_space(p.x,p.y);this.c.move(m.x,m.y)}else{this.c.declare(1)}}
end_turn(){}}

AJFaraday

I think you can apply an invalid client and watch the game, and get the errors in the console

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