The Nineteenth Byte

1:00 AM

hi im back... wait what the fuck is SE doing... bye...

1:18 AM

I can't find the previous comment that Quintec posted here... where is Quintec back from?

Theoretically shortest possible non-cheating quine program
'q

'x' Push the literals between ' onto the queue.
q Push a quote onto the queue.

If a string literal is not completed, the program flow goes back to the beginning before reading more instructions in. The queue will be implicitly outputted.

I believe 2 bytes is optimal for a non-cheating quine. Please reply to me if you can find a non-cheating quine in 1 byte. (Although I would like to see more 2-byters.)

Jono 2906

meta.stackexchange.com/questions/334248/… - - congrats SE, you've got the most downvoted question on MSE in just 9 hours

4

A _

This question is Sara Chipps' best (and only) question.

Jono 2906

1:39 AM

@A_ I believe this is the second most downvoted question across the entire SE network. Clearly, the way SE has handled this situation isn't working.

A _

This is the first most downvoted question.

Jono 2906

@A_ on MSE, yes, but there's a question on MSO with ~700 down

Anonymous

-735

Q: We’re removing “Hot Meta Posts” from Stack Overflow's sidebar for now; moderators now fully control [featured]

tl;dr: We're removing the "Hot Meta Posts" from Stack Overflow's sidebar while we work on looking at how Meta can better meet its goals. To ensure that moderators are able to bring important posts to the community, we'll be giving them exclusive access to the featured tag. "Featured on Meta" w...

Jono 2906

@Mego that's the one!

Anonymous

Announcements of poorly-thought-through, boneheaded decisions by SE get lots of downvotes

xnor

1:51 AM

Somewhat amusingly, Sara's MSE reputation dropped to 1 as a result of that post.

A _

It is not amusing and sad.

Riker

2:45 AM

108

Q: "Dear Stack Exchange, I am very disappointed in you" - How to construct a strong opening line in a letter?

In light of recent events I intended to write a simple letter of complaint to StackExchange. The obvious thing to do would be to write an opening with the fact such as It came to my knowledge that a long-standing member and moderator of the Writing.SE community, among others, has been dismiss...

non-fiction letter

Quintec

3:31 AM

@A_ i'm literally back from a ~6 month hiatus from codegolf.se, and the first thing i see is SE badly screwing up. not sure what will happen next...

Anonymous

4:22 AM

@Quintec It's all scary and unknown because this sort of thing has never happened on SE before, as far as I'm aware. The future of the network is uncertain. But I'm going to back our community to the bitter end.

Doorknob

5:31 AM

→ 27 messages moved to Trash

@A_ you've been warned before; please stop sending large numbers of meaningless messages in chat

Fatalize

6:47 AM

@Doorknob Reminds me of the Zyabin days…

Fatalize

7:00 AM

@Jono2906 Still don’t undestand why they don’t publish chat messages that led to demotion

They’re chat messages not classified FBI documents

Why the hell does no one take the responsibility to copy/paste the transcript? That’s 107329873943 times more helpful than all those useless "sorry from SE" and "SE is bad REEEEE" posts

Jono 2906

7:23 AM

@Fatalize Me neither. Surely they could post conversations held between SE and Monica with her permission.

@Fatalize Sure would be better.

Fatalize

@Jono2906 some moderators don’t want to, like this guy for instance

Makes you wonder whether moderators are actually siding with regular users, or are just in their own world

Jono 2906

@Fatalize Just omit the posts from any objectors when posting the conversation

@Fatalize the good mods (especially the mods of CGCC) care for regular users

And most of the mods on the SE network would probably be good

Fatalize

Well yes it’s simple, but some moderators oppose to anything from that chat to be published, because it would be break their trust of privacy on that chat room or whatever

as if what’s being said on here was super-duper-confidential

Jono 2906

@Fatalize well, SE has already inflamed the moderator community (to the point of numerous resignations), so I doubt triggering a few objectors would hurt

I mean, it's not like people already are upset with what's happened

Treading on the toes of the few could potentially restore balance across SE

Fatalize

Considering that Monica is ultra-religious, and that the issue is related to transgenders, the only thing not publishing transcripts does is to actually cast doubt as to whether Monica did nothing wrong at all

Ultimately, I do no trust SE (but I already didn’t before this), but now I don’t even trust mods because they’re as non-transparent as SE on this

Jono 2906

7:30 AM

@Fatalize I guess the ball's in SE's court now. Only time will tell what actually happened

Anton Menshov

@Fatalize we believe and operate in that chat on the assumption of privacy.

Fatalize

@AntonMenshov You realize this kind of answer is as useless as the answers provided by SE right?

Anton Menshov

@Fatalize I hope SE users respect it, as it protects both users and moderators .

@Fatalize nope. I do not.

Fatalize

Well you should then. As long as the transcripts are not published, I won’t trust neither SE nor mods on this subject, and I will not care about Monica’s demotion since I have no way of knowing whether it was deserved or not

Anton Menshov

@Fatalize as moderators, we agree to never share anything from this room in public. Both to SE and between each other. I hope, you can understand it, and the expectations of privacy for the verbatim transcripts.

Fatalize

7:39 AM

I don’t understand the point of these privacy rules, but whatever. If mods and SE are so keen on privacy, then discuss the demotion of Monica in private. I don’t see why regular users should care about it since no explanation will be publically given.

Anton Menshov

@Fatalize to care or not to care is the choice you make. The same as whom to trust and why.

Fatalize

You can’t expect from me to blindly follow the outrage of other mods based on nothing.

Anton Menshov

@Fatalize I do not.

Jono 2906

@AntonMenshov, I guess what the real question is, what is the best way for mods and SE to figure out this situation?

Because right now, it seems that the current approach isn't working

Anton Menshov

@Jono2906 I can speak for myself only. We are trying through different means. I shared what I wanted to share in my Meta posts, which are available.

@Jono2906 I am also expecting to see much more from SE on Meta or through other means, as currently, I (personally) am very disappointed at their way of handling the situation.

However, that should not be the transcript from a private mod room. I am certain about that.

...for the aforementioned reasons, and many not-aforementioned.

Jono 2906

7:45 AM

@AntonMenshov Would a reasonable explanation about why Monica was fired be achievable?

Because maybe that would help the situation

Anton Menshov

@Jono2906 I do not know.

Jono 2906

As understanding the cause behind this whole bonanza would allow for more constructive debates

Anton Menshov

@Jono2906 it is a tough matter.

...there are many parties involved. And, as you see from Meta discussion, people disagree even when they know exactly the same facts.

I came to this room to explain about the expectation of privacy of the mod room, that was my main concern.

Jono 2906

@AntonMenshov If it was up to you to solve this mess, what would you do? (Purely hypothetical)

Fatalize

@AntonMenshov So tl;dr if the transcripts were released, we would see that it’s not as clear-cut as the mods crying on meta are trying to make it seem

Anton Menshov

7:50 AM

@Jono2906 I am very close to this position: meta.stackexchange.com/a/334263/383809

at least as a first step.

it would not solve a lot, but that would be a start.

Jono 2906

@AntonMenshov that seems reasonable. Hopefully SE realises this and acts upon it.

Anton Menshov

Again, this is just MY opinion, as a regular user, not even as a moderator.

@Fatalize I have never said or implied that. Neither I did the opposite.

Neil

8:33 AM

@A_ well, it might be if your page numbers go up to 6040, which mine do not...

Jono 2906

@Neil mine go up to 6040

Neil

@Jono2906 oh, I see now, I have 50 questions per page

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8:59 AM

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11:00 AM

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11:42 AM

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A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

This is my first attempt at a full-on King of the Hill challenge which directly pits competitors' code against each other in a live event. I've put quite a lot of work in to trying to make the environment and tournament rules fair, to provide a level playing field. KotH: Bots to play the Grid G...

Doorknob

12:32 PM

@Fatalize publishing the transcripts would be personally harmful to several people. lots of the discussion was very personal and the people who participated did so under the assumption of privacy.

Quintec

"You may discuss this on meta if you have concerns"

Oh the irony

(Regarding meta.stackexchange.com/questions/334248/…)

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