The Nineteenth Byte

ATaco

00:01

I love Funky for how ugly it can be.

Destructible Lemon

is there a proof that dodos is turing incomplete?

ATaco

It always halts, which is provable.

Destructible Lemon

because you could increase the length of the tuple? actually now that i think of it, that doesn't work

i was thinking that you could grow the tuple, but you only have a set number of distinct grows that you can use, equal to the lowest number in the current tuple

why is there a file in the dodos repository that just says dodos.py

Neil

00:30

no primality tester in Dodos yet?

Destructible Lemon

not sure that's even possible, neil

Christopher

@Mr.Xcoder you can just send it to me

ATaco

I think it might be possible to prime test, and I want to try.

Dennis

I'm convinced it's possible. Primality tests use only bounded loops.

ATaco

TacO Can prime test, and that has similar mathematical limitations.

Christopher

00:37

@Dennis Dodos?

Dennis

Dodos.

Christopher

Dodos?

Pavel

It's a language

It's not turing complete but actually extremely interesting

Christopher

Dennis can be so useless when he wants to

It is the inner dad in him

or outer?

ATaco

Dados.

Christopher

00:39

Dennis broke me

@ATaco Goatos

hmm that sounds like a esolang :}

Downgoat

@Christopher I worked on a mini OS for a bit called GoatOS (Goatos)

Christopher

:)

Dennis

yesterday, by Christopher

@Dennis I really hate it when people say something and then someone creates a monster

Christopher

@Dennis wait what

Pavel

:O

Christopher

00:41

Sorry butterfly effect

I have a small amount of short term memory loss :/

ATaco

That's how MaybeLater was born.

Destructible Lemon

@Dennis did you get the bounty yet?

Dennis

What bounty?

Destructible Lemon

Mar 8 at 3:03, by Conor O'Brien

CMC: Design a language such that the language is decidable under the halting problem. Make it as generally usable as possible. (I might bounty an impressive answer!)

from what i've heard, dodo is quite impressive

Dennis

I'm not sure what that was referring to. I mean, how do you bounty an answer to a CMC?

ATaco

00:44

Wait, But TacO did that before that CMC.

Destructible Lemon

isn't there a design a language or something?

i'm sure Conor can figure something out

maybe bountying one of your dodos answers

ATaco

Honestly I feel kind of cheated.

But then again, it's not very usable, being a 2D tacit esque language.

Dennis

I'm not very familiar with TacO. Why would it not be TC?

Or rather, how is the halting problem solvable for TacO?

Christopher

shoot i had a question for dennis but forgot

ATaco

TacO has constructs for looping, but the only way one can loop is a finite amount of times, there is no method for looping an infinite amount of time.

Well, it's possible to throw the program into an infinite loop, but that's a bug and is easily predictable.

It's possible to loop through all elements in a list, but it's not possible to, within that loop, append elements to the list causing infinite looping.

Dennis

00:57

What prevents me from using ? to go in a circle?

ATaco

Chains cannot self-reference.

They can cross over eachother, but they cannot reference thesmelves as a side-effect of how I compile.

Dennis

An unmatched " seems to create an infinite loop.

ATaco

Yep, that's the bug.

Dennis

Right.

ATaco

I uh, never got around to patching it.

Dennis

01:03

I must ask: what is a Taccing language and what is Arithmatic?

ATaco

Arithmatic is an obvious misspelling of Arithmetic that i do consistently, and the reason TacO is Tacit is due to the fact that all symbols are functions which takes more functions (chains) as arguments, but programming in TacO does not accurately reflect the thought process one would normally use in a better Tacit language such as APL or Jelly.

Downgoat

Question: so for VSL I am thinking about static inheritance and how that should work. Should static dynamic dispatch be a thing?

What I was thinking is if you have a static method you could call it using Self.staticMethod()

and if that method using that Self.whatever got inherited, Self would then refer to the inherited class

Dennis

@ATaco So taccing = tacit.

ATaco

Yes.

My grammar and such is noticeably bad.

Nick Clifford

01:30

@Downgoat reminds me of the Self type in Swift, although that's generally only used for protocol conformance

Zacharý

01:43

TFW you shave 3 bytes off of your code that you've been attempting for ~1 hour

2

I've been ngn'd

bkul

02:17

I have a dilemma^H^H^H^H annoying situation. I want to design a language, but I don't have any good fresh ideas for a language.

Destructible Lemon

that's not a dilemma

that's just an annoying situation

bkul

fair enough

Destructible Lemon

@bkul i had that issue, but i recently had an idea, and it was based around vague ideas i had, but the main thing that eventually helped me was designing it for a challenge to compile it to bf

a challenge which hasn't been made yet, by the way

@bkul do you have any ideas at all? like, do you want to make an imperative language?

Conor O'Brien

any java gurus in here?

user202729

@cairdcoinheringaahing I know, I often reread the messages and fix spelling error if I have time.

@ConorO'Brien What's your question?

Destructible Lemon

02:29

@bkul I was thinking just now about making a language designed to compile/be interpreted by brain-flak

Conor O'Brien

Are classes in java able to access private variables of other instances of the same class when passed as a parameter?

public class Foo {
    private short x;

    public Foo() {
        x = 3;
    }

    public int compareTo(Foo other) {
        return x - other.x;
    }
}

user202729

I think yes.

Conor O'Brien

why ?

ASCII-only

Yes.

Because Java is bad and does no things

user202729

@ASCII-only ...?

Conor O'Brien

02:30

@DestructibleLemon I've been thinking of a language that compiles to brain-flak too, tell me if you plan on pursuing that

Destructible Lemon

why do you need private variables?

ASCII-only

@ConorO'Brien mostly so copy constructor-y things work

Destructible Lemon

@ConorO'Brien what sort of ideas have you had? I haven't thought of anything specific

user202729

@DestructibleLemon To tell others that "plz dont access this".

Conor O'Brien

@DestructibleLemon all variables should be private by default because ^

Destructible Lemon

02:31

oh ok

ASCII-only

Also it's against OOP but they do expect you to be able to decide whether you should access private variables

user202729

But, they still can if they try. (reflection etc)

ASCII-only

@ConorO'Brien Or protected

@user202729 It's slow, plus if they really want to do that then why stop them

Conor O'Brien

@ASCII-only well that didn't work

Destructible Lemon

ok so, for my brain-flak language, i think i will need to implement at least one thing significantly different from the brain-flak language

Conor O'Brien

02:32

unless it throws a runtime error e_e

Destructible Lemon

for example, having variables rather than a stack as the main data store

ASCII-only

@ConorO'Brien hmm?

Conor O'Brien

@DestructibleLemon my idea of compilation would be to write a convenient-ish language like pseudo machine code, then abstract from there

ASCII-only

@ConorO'Brien no i meant they can be protected if you want subclasses to access them

Conor O'Brien

@ASCII-only oh. so there's no way to prevent cross-class sharing ?

Destructible Lemon

02:33

I haven't even written a quarterstaff to bf compiler yet

ASCII-only

@ConorO'Brien there's a compiler that does that

@ConorO'Brien don't think so

Destructible Lemon

I think i'll publish the challenge this weekend or something

Conor O'Brien

@ASCII-only strange, ok

but cool, now I can forget about getters and setters for a few months

bkul

@DestructibleLemon My most coherent idea is a functional concatenative scripting language but it's kinda wonky

Destructible Lemon

haha i'm not really sure what that means

Dennis

02:38

Tfw you golf 342 bytes off an answer.

Conor O'Brien

:O DODOS DOCS

I know what I'm doing tomorrow

Dennis

And Dodos quine. :)

Destructible Lemon

things to think about when including things in a language: minimalism, not being ridiculously complicated, and interesting mechanics, in reverse order of importance, imo

Conor O'Brien

> The Divide Or Surrender paradigm doesn't such nonsense.

Destructible Lemon

include something if it contributes to the language having interesting mechanics. if not, include it if the language programs get ridiculously tarpitty without it. otherwise, remember that minimalist languages tend to be more elegant, and you can do without an add command if you have a subtract command

Conor O'Brien

02:40

missing word perhaps? on the docs

Destructible Lemon

@ConorO'Brien i was thinking that was like an affectation

like "i think not"

Dennis

I don't remember what I wanted to write, but I think it was allow such nonsense.

ASCII-only

@ConorO'Brien getters and setters are annoying

Destructible Lemon

also i forgot to mention the feel of the language, because sometimes the language being a bit more fully featured contributes to the way it feels (for example, ><>, which could probably do without some of the commands, but the way it feels means that it's better with "unnecessary" commands)

Conor O'Brien

@ASCII-only yeah. I want to write a language which compiles to java that's actually sane

ASCII-only

02:42

I like C#'s "you can do a getter but nobody will know the difference" better

@ConorO'Brien Just use .NET Core :P

Conor O'Brien

I like ruby's attr_reader and attr_accessor etc.

bkul

I think the presence of java causes madness so that might not be possible

ASCII-only

oh look warframe (lotus?) thing

Destructible Lemon

ok so, we've seen languages where the turing completeness is based on quining. what about languages where the turing completeness is based on other stock problems?

ASCII-only

I like C#'s { get; set; } better

Destructible Lemon

02:46

cat for example. no idea how that would work

ASCII-only

because you can tell really easily if there's an accessor and/or mutator

Conor O'Brien

@DestructibleLemon which languages for #1 are like taht?

Destructible Lemon

esolangs.org/wiki/Muriel

idea: language where you run the program on the program text, then do the same again with the output from the program, or something

basically, cheating quine language, i guess

ASCII-only

sure but imo there are already a lot of source-is-data and/or source-replacement languages

Destructible Lemon

hmm

Conor O'Brien

02:59

not as many as bf derivs :p

user202729

That's not nonsense! That just allow the language to be Turing Complete!

Conor O'Brien

XD SO TRUE

Οurous

What about something that rewrites the behaviour of its commands.

Conor O'Brien

there's some bf derivs that do that iirc

Οurous

At an opcode level?

Destructible Lemon

03:00

@Οurous i think one of those exists

user202729

> top 0.70% this quarter

Destructible Lemon

esolangs.org/wiki/Emmental

user202729

Why not just 0.7%?

(unrelated question: anyone else has a Ctrl button on a phone?)

ASCII-only

@ConorO'Brien sure but those are by people that go "oh hey i made an esolang yay"

Conor O'Brien

@ASCII-only I think I have a bf deriv or two, on another note

precursor to simplex: Mericuk

Destructible Lemon

03:09

idea for a language: the data is a single string you can add characters to, but can never remove from

or perhaps that and a minimal accumulator that is used for figuring out what to store in the string and whatever

Dennis

@user202729 I do. I also have a tab and a compose key.

ASCII-only

> compose key

O_o how do you get that

also that would kinda be useful

Dennis

Hacker's Keyboard

DJMcMayhem

03:24

@Dennis Does that support swype or whatever it's called?

ASCII-only

yeah it's called Swype

Dennis

No clue. I don't swype.

Doesn't look like it does.

DJMcMayhem

That's a shame. I use it all the time, and I'd consider it a deal breaker

ETHproductions

Swype is amazing. So much more efficient/easy-to-use

ASCII-only

@DJMcMayhem Solution: switch to Hacker's Keyboard only when you actually need the compose symbols

Mr. Xcoder

05:05

@Christopher ????

Downgoat

05:34

the website my school uses for math has its servers coded in Perl

this is not OK

ATaco

05:50

"I will fail you if you hand in with comic sans"

New Main Posts

06:57

0

Q: N times program for the N-th number

Given an array of positive integers A as the input, generate a program that, when repeated for k times, output the kth(1-index) value of the array. For example, if the array is [1,11], the output should be a program that outputs 1, and when repeated twice, output 11. Code like print(end="1"); in...

ASCII-only

07:28

i wonder if a hackathon for esolangs is a good idea

user202729

07:56

@Dennis Which language are you using? (compose key?)

Nevermind, found it.

New Meta Posts

08:56

1

Q: 404 image is missing on the meta site Page Not Found page

The 404 image is missing in the meta site's Page Not Found page. The main sites' Page Not Found page has that image: codegolf.stackexchange.com/404 But in the meta site it is missing: codegolf.meta.stackexchange.com/404 Screenshot for reference: The meta site's image source is point t...

bug meta

New Main Posts

0

Q: Self-Validating Triangular Checkerboard Program

A checkerboard program is a program where each individual character's ordinal value alternates from even, to odd, excluding the line terminator (which can be any standard line-endings). A triangular program is a program where each line has one additional character than the preceding line. Your ...

code-golf restricted-source source-layout

ASCII-only

10:35

I just went to CR via HNQ, I need a memory wipe now

Ørjan Johansen

@MartinEnder BF with ! extension definitely exists, e.g. my interpreter in Fueue, as well as fungot's implementation in #esoteric on freenode. It's an easy way to handle it when implementing in a language with no file input. (Still, that reads its own source code though. Unless you reinterpret that BF extension as providing a string literal...)

Martin Ender

fair enough, but then the answer should link to one (which also correctly splits on the first ! and ignores additional ones). but reading the source code is the bigger problem.

then again "reading the source code" is kinda fuzzy anyway, because of precisely that "reinterpretation" argument.

"-based Befunge quines and g-based Fungeoid quines aren't really all that different, but somehow we only accept the former.

Dennis

13:15

@NewMetaPosts I think this is perfect. Hopefully by design.

Erik the Outgolfer

@NewMetaPosts dupe

actually, dupe of this (@Dennis and you commented there too :P)

ASCII-only

I wonder where Geobits went

Erik the Outgolfer

inb4 Geobits pops up

ASCII-only

Actually if he was still here graduation meme would be design meme, not sure if that's a good thing

Erik the Outgolfer

13:31

@MartinEnder there is a reason for that, the former source code style doesn't read itself, each character of the string pushes a specific value, its ASCII code, it doesn't read anything, but g does read the source code

+1 for the meta meta irony. — Adám 5 hours ago

@Adám uhh...excuse me, but how is that ironic? PPCG meta is part of the whole PPCG community, so it's normal to ask questions about it too

Poke

@EriktheOutgolfer getting a 404 while loading a 404 page is ironic, bud

ASCII-only

@EriktheOutgolfer sure but it's not often you get meta questions about meta

well, apart from the million about the sandbox of course

Erik the Outgolfer

@Poke hm, maybe he should've said "404 meta irony" instead then...

ASCII-only

13:46

@EriktheOutgolfer Yep, in the same way JS function stringify quining is allowed

Soaku

14:09

24 days in the fanatic badge... Finally SE refreshed the score...

(here, enthusiast, SO fanatic)

It kept to be 6...

New Main Posts

0

Q: what is the easiest / fastest / cleanest looking way to find count of data blocks?

i want to know how many 1024 blocks of data does the full data contains ?, if i have for example input of 2500, then number of blocks is 3 (1024+1024+452), but dividing 2500/3 gives out 2 (and the fraction is omitted) Any simple way of doing it without using if or doing some functions ?

number arithmetic fastest-code

ASCII-only

> fastest-code

J. Sallé

14:26

@ASCII-only well they're not wrong per se, they just didn't read the tag, I guess?

mbomb007

I still have the only "Safe" answer on this challenge:

60

Q: Make your language *mostly* unusable! (Cops' thread)

Inspired by this comment... Thanks to users Step Hen, Wheat-Wizard, and Dennis for helping my solidify the specification of this challenge before posting it! This is the Cops' thread. For the Robbers' thread, go here In this challenge, you are tasked with running some code that makes it so t...

code-golf arithmetic cops-and-robbers

Adám

14:50

@EriktheOutgolfer that the meta fall-back page when a meta page isn't found has an element that isn't found

Erik the Outgolfer

This is a very nice answer. At this rate, it looks like it might end up being the only uncracked answer! — DJMcMayhem ♦ Jul 25 '17 at 16:24

he was right...

DJMcMayhem

@mbomb007 And only two votes, sigh

Erik the Outgolfer

inb4 DJ pops out of...wait, too late :/

DJMcMayhem

Huh?

What did I pop out of?

Erik the Outgolfer

out of nowhere is a phrasal, and, uh, you seem to have a userscript which pings you every time DJ is mentioned, and this contains "DJ" as a substring

11 mins ago, by Erik the Outgolfer

This is a very nice answer. At this rate, it looks like it might end up being the only uncracked answer! — DJMcMayhem ♦ Jul 25 '17 at 16:24

DJMcMayhem

15:04

@EriktheOutgolfer Oh, pop out of nowhere. I thought you were saying pop out of the room (as in leave) so I was confused.

Erik the Outgolfer

bumfuzzled as to how pop out can relate to leaving in any way

DJMcMayhem

"Pops in out of nowhere" is a little bit more idiomatic

PhiNotPi

Is it normal to be able to open up two copies of task manager on windows? Because I did it.

DJMcMayhem

You can say something like "I'm just gonna pop out for a minute" to mean leave.

Erik the Outgolfer

task manager is very weird imo

Poke

15:07

@PhiNotPi i don't think you can normally do it but i've seen it happen if my compy was lagging or something

Christopher

@Mr.Xcoder You said you don't care aout rep after 20k so I sadi you can send it to me :)

Wait so to ping DJ you just have to say DJ?

Or brain-flak

DJMcMayhem

@Christopher Correct

Christopher

wth

@DJMcMayhem that is why if love you being a mod

people go "don't ping a mod for something like that" i go ok I like Brain-Flak

Erik the Outgolfer

there's no guarantee the userscript will be forever though

Christopher

what do you mean

Poke

15:13

the question is whether or not he gets pinged if i talk about Djinns

or adjusting to djinns

user202729

@PhiNotPi No.

PhiNotPi

Anyone here interested in cryptography? Like, classical (pen-and-paper) cryptography.

Poke

sure

why

PhiNotPi

Backstory time: so I'm running a D&D campaign, and I decided to make a couple crypto-puzzles to occupy some people's downtime in-between sessions.

Poke

as you do

PhiNotPi

15:20

(My target audience is literally a bunch of CS majors who have a decent amount of experience... a normal group of people would just figure out a way to bypass the puzzles altogether.)

So I've made 2 puzzles so far. The 1st was easy because I wanted to guarantee that they could solve it.

So I used a Vigenere cipher, but it lasted literally 10 minutes before someone was able to use computer assistance to crack it.

user202729

CMP: Do you remember if Jelly use £ or ₤?

@user202729 Actually, no.

PhiNotPi

So for the second puzzle... I threw in everything I could to make it legitimately difficult. And by "everything I could", I couldn't actually throw too much stuff in because there's a fine line between "hard" and "literally unsolvable."

caird coinheringaahing

@user202729 Yes, it uses £

PhiNotPi

Ciphertext is here: gist.github.com/PhiNotPi/3130ba057c50ccf4e2df95fd55f2de06

user202729

(because on a computer only one can be typed, so I don't really need to remember)

PhiNotPi

15:27

So I guess there's two ways for me to go with this conversation: either (1) challenge TNB to a puzzle. Or (2) tell y'all the complete method I used so we can talk about the best ways to crack it.

user202729

CMP: (1) or (2)?

PhiNotPi

or (3) not enough interest at this time.

caird coinheringaahing

I'd say (1) for a bit, then if no one cracks it, go for (2)

Poke

^

is it supposed to be solvable without the use of a computer

PhiNotPi

TBH it is almost certainly not. Hopefully doesn't require brute-forcing, though.

Computer assistance is what allowed people to crack the Vigenere cipher in 10 minutes.

But I think this puzzle will require a decent amount of thinking and some linguistic-type attacks, it is not enough to just try brute-forcing popular methods (because my exact method is custom although the technique is not).

Phi's Cipher Challenge

Issuing PPCG the same challenge I issued some friends: gist.gi...

Made a room if people don't want to clutter TNB.

But you should first try to figure some things out: what abnormalities exist (in what ways is the text non-random)?, and then try to figure out substitution vs transposition, block vs stream, and what advanced technique may have been used.

New Main Posts

15:40

3

Q: Horizontally Aligned ASCII Art

Your task is to accept as input two "ASCII Art"s, and align each piece of art next to each other horizontally. For example, say you have two strings, "abc\ndef" and "123\n456". You need to align them horizontally to produce the string "abc123\ndef456". I'm calling this "aligning horizontally" be...

code-golf ascii-art

user202729

@NewMainPosts Interesting, but highly suspect dupe.

[Try it online!](https://tio.run/##TVY7kuS4EfVxiryBuv7dJopMEOhKIjkASDbLX0exljxdQ64iZOgWayt0kD1J6yVrVpIzM90DJjJfvg/@/Muvv/71@/v33/7577/95fff/v6nf/1j@P7@pjcaZp@Yxjxzodwzj9R4qIla13mmNYWv5uhAPq9JqfOlKim3nsknwYE6zPKklioPjo70LDnN1HMZI90Dx0Cf6muhVSt3VPpyfzg6oZqmO9W@aEa1Z/Nk5VfyXdZCIW1bcXSmoDx35KV0mfoWueFDX2ZcPXOiLsU0O7qQzHNkan0SoSlLYNoKN6UUNFbK6G1xdCVusUYKXSeVtHDMVLqOF5Je@QdpRgOObvRMtQ@UNK0drpjt0pgnT7ow@hwbkHD0TgmdNlKtAKEln0cqketMrA8bqjBnRx/WSRZqMftIWSqmY891wIxl3j/k6g5vVNNz3ajpVgIAqYCi@RIwQu1SJhae2R0O1MfAOGCIYFntZ/ONEraYKa5cxB2OKBu00hoT8OeRc8En0XfYrMcx7jGrO5xIfMDSiwJOks7nhkvzYwJiIQlxkIZjZ/Lc0EO6T2…

caird coinheringaahing

15:57

ಠ_ಠ @dzaima Why is ^^ even a builtin in Canvas?

dzaima

@cairdcoinheringaahing did you expect an ascii-art modification language to not have it? :p

caird coinheringaahing

It seems weirdly specific

Jelly would be winning an ascii-art challenge for once :(

Sometimes challenge upvotes really confuse me. Could someone explain why this just reached +100?

This is another (albeit more understandable) example

AdmBorkBork

HNQ effect

@Riker Thanks - I guess for some reason I missed that when copy/pasting the updated link.

Riker

16:12

np

I will point out you confused the heck outta me

with no edit history and all :p

New Main Posts

0

Q: Race for the Steward Badge

Race for the Steward Badge If you visit the Steward Badge Page, you will see no one has received one of these badges from PPCG yet. However, there are two users: DJMcMayhem & Martin Ender , that are only a few reviews away from this badge! Challenge Your challenge, is to write a program(or f...

code-golf internet

user202729

@cairdcoinheringaahing Because they are votes.

caird coinheringaahing

Huh?

user202729

Votes are always unpredictable like that.

Jelly flat can be useful

Lembik

16:38

hi all

I am not a good C++ coder... If I wanted to use codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/157980/9206 for a matrix of doubles (ignore the problem of reading in the data) which types do I need to change?

mbomb007

16:59

@EriktheOutgolfer Well, there is another one, but it isn't marked "safe" yet

Mr. Xcoder

TIL str.splitlines() is a thing

Pavel

It's amazing how much my productivity drops the instant I realize I actually have a day to complete this essay I'm writing and not the next two class periods.

I managed to not have tnb open for a full 3 hours today.

caird coinheringaahing

@Mr.Xcoder Same here. Blew my mind

Pavel

I've always know it was a thing but .split('\n') is golfier

Mr. Xcoder

17:14

When you’re not using map, indeed .split('\n') is golfier

caird coinheringaahing

Got to love how those two messages line up perfectly at the end :P

J. Sallé

@cairdcoinheringaahing Pavel's message is 1 character longer

caird coinheringaahing

Q: -File or --file for command line flags?

Mr. Xcoder

--file

Pavel

-f | --file

caird coinheringaahing

17:21

Yeah, thought so. Wonder why Powershell went for -File

Pavel

Because PowerShell was Windows-only for years

Windows has different conventions

J. Sallé

@Pavel s/has different conventions/is stupid/

Pavel

Those are not mututally exclusive by any means

Powershell is actually really nice if you ditch most of the builtin cmdlets and use coreutils

J. Sallé

I was talking specifically about windows, I've absolutely nothing against pshell

caird coinheringaahing

I've been working on an automatic tester for Add++ version support and am learning way more Powershell than I ever expected

Pavel

17:29

Yeah Windows is pretty bad

caird coinheringaahing

Q: Has anyone else read this? If not, you should, it's very funny :P

Lembik

17:44

shame miles doesn't come to chat

could anyone give me a hand translating codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/157980/9206 to work with doubles?

not the input part :)

int *z = reinterpret_cast<int*>(a); is the first thing that needs changing

but what else?

caird coinheringaahing

@Lembik You can invite him to the room

Lembik

@cairdcoinheringaahing oh! I will see if I can work that out

caird coinheringaahing

@Lembik Here you go. Just click invite and select the room

Lembik

thanks! I invited him/her here

Pavel

18:43

I've always wondered what exactly takes up so much space for Mathematica, so I ran du on it and more than half of it is docs

Conor O'Brien

If anyone is interested, I've semi-documented Attache here

Pavel

I also discovered that Mathematica has interfaces for Bing and Google search, for Google Contacts, for Chat, for Flickr, for Yelp, for Twitter, for Fitbit, for SMS, for Dropbox, for Reddit, and a bunch of other stuff

I wonder what it does with all of them

J. Sallé

@Pavel built-ins. Built-ins everywhere.

AdmBorkBork

19:00

It has a built-in to detect if something is a goat. Thus, I'm not surprised anymore by what it has as a built-in.

Pavel

@AdmBorkBork It has general image recognition builtins. One of the objects it is able to recognize, amont many thousands of others, are goats.

AdmBorkBork

Yeah, tis what I said, no? ;-)

New Meta Posts

19:22

1

Q: What happened to my chat room?

Some time ago, I created a chatroom for the Reflections language. Now, I can't find it, and if I click the link on the Reflections page, it's not found. Has it been deleted? Why?

support chat

1

Q: What is code length?

An interesting conundrum has arisen in relation to the bonus I offered for APL solutions to An Ant on a Cube. It's an old challenge that requires a "named function", such as a lambda assigned to a variable: f←{...} - that is 2+ the code length we normally consider valid for most golfing challenge...

discussion

Poke

19:47

AdmBorkBork

A+, that would totally happen in my gaming group

Riker

@Poke reddit thief detected

>:U

Poke

someone linked it to me :]

xfix

20:21

oh wow, Java REPL is a quite good programming language for golfing

i wrote a 5 byte solution to printing 2014 without any digits in a source code

although i suppose the challenge is quite easy so it's not a big deal

AdmBorkBork

Dang, that's quite a bit shorter than the 11-byte PowerShell solution. What is it?

xfix

+'ߞ'

quite boring honestly

AdmBorkBork

Ah, basically the same, except I need to stick a [char] cast inbetween.

xfix

i wonder if using a Tab key is a legit strategy for Java REPL codegolf however

i mean, you can write i[TAB] instead of int, for instance

dzaima

@cairdcoinheringaahing really the ＋ built-in is string append (even JS has that :p), it's just that Canvas treats mutliline strings as multiple lines of strings. As a result, there is no built-in for adding "abc\ndef" and "123\n456" to abc\ndef123\n456 as, while looking at the inputs as multiline strings, it doesn't look pretty. And × is just reverse join, I'm pretty sure many other golflangs have that

xfix

20:28

HashMap is Ha[Tab]M[Tab] (by the way it's cool that java.util is automatically imported)

although i wonder if using REPL keybindings is a legitimate strategy

dzaima

@xfix if you count the language as the editor, I'm pretty sure that should count. After all, Vim is a commonly used language here

IIRC there was a meta post for using editors as languages somewhere too

xfix

it's Java REPL in this case, jshell

|    import java.io.*
|    import java.math.*
|    import java.net.*
|    import java.nio.file.*
|    import java.util.*
|    import java.util.concurrent.*
|    import java.util.function.*
|    import java.util.prefs.*
|    import java.util.regex.*
|    import java.util.stream.*

oh, it imports quite a lot, nice :)

but also not so nice, because it means more conflicts when you tab, oh well

for instance, H[Tab] won't work, because Http classes

New Sandboxed Posts

21:21

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Bees? Inspired by SCP-3045 Write a program that takes the input, extracts all of the words, and looks for the word bee; then: If bee is not detected, pick sections of the text at random and delete them. If bee is detected, add instances of the word bee to the input such that it has significan...

quartata

21:39

Just found out that OS X doesn't have clock_nanosleep, what gives?

isn't it in POSIX

Riker

21:56

@flawr scp-wiki.net/scp-7800-j

flawr

22:22

@Riker hehe:)

ETHproductions

I'm beginning to wonder, are you two friends IRL or do you just like sharing stuff with each other?

quartata

well let's see

they're about 5,800 miles apart

so it depends on your definition of IRL

Conor O'Brien

(for something completely different) what is that avatar

Riker

@ConorO'Brien uncultured swine

ETHproductions

@quartata hey who knows, they could have grown up together or something

quartata

22:27

@ConorO'Brien I changed it to something else Pokemon-related just to annoy you

Riker

it's a pokemon rival :p

Conor O'Brien

like ik what it is but why

quartata

why not

Conor O'Brien

what was wrong with life glider

flawr

@quartata I clicked your avatar and this window thingie exploded

Riker

22:28

> window thingie

ETHproductions

I had to zoom out to 50% to see the big version of the avatar, which completely defeats the purpose of clicking on the small version :P

Riker

ah yes, the german "Winderferthingie"

quartata

@ETHproductions what?

oh

all the rooms

Riker

@ETHproductions only 49 rooms

quartata

sorry

Riker

22:29

but @ETHproductions lol no I do not know any sentient slowworms irl

(assuming flawr is sentient x-files theme plays)

flawr

@Riker maybe you do, but you don't know? :D

Riker

> imagining slowworms stacked into a trenchcoat trying to get into the cinema

5

flawr

XD

On the topic of stacking things: I'm looking for an algorithm to determine the "most isolated point" of a finite set, maybe someone here can help: cs.stackexchange.com/questions/89411/…

</badsegway>

@flawr you know what? I should make a challenge on PPCG if I really want an answer.

5

Riker

@flawr isn't this a form of the taxicab problem?

flawr

googling teh caxicab probelm

Riker

22:36

shortest route that passes through a set of nodes

i.e. bus's route through a set of stops

iirc it's NP complete?

flawr

no idea.

@Riker would this include this particular "edge" from the most isolated point to its closest neighbour?

Riker

I think so

I'm fairly certain the taxicab problem is just a iterated version of your issue

flawr

22:51

added it as a challenge to the sandbox

Riker

@flawr

@flawr interesting to make that fastest-code

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Find most isolated point code-golfmathgeometrygraph Given a finite set S of points in d dimensions, find the most isolated points, that is the point with the greatest distance to its closest neighbours. Or more mathematically, the point p ∈ S that maximizes min {d(p,q) | q ∈ S, q ≠ p}. Detai...

Destructible Lemon

23:17

I think i'll make the cells in the bf dialect for my quarterstaff challenge limited cells. i think it's nearly ready to post when that's done, and i add a little bit more to the sandbox post

Phi's Cipher Challenge

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