The Nineteenth Byte

caird coinheringaahing

21:01

I'm waiting for NSP for my new challenge :P

totallyhuman

ok

HyperNeutrino

What should I do about the two answers being identical?

totallyhuman

what are you talking about?

caird coinheringaahing

@HyperNeutrino he answered second, he should delete his

HyperNeutrino

Sure. I'll comment.

totallyhuman

21:03

but you golfed it to the same state

it wasn't originally the same right?

HyperNeutrino

No. Originally mine used lambda*a which was longer, but with the same algorithm.

totallyhuman

ah ok

Poke

good meta discussion, i guess

but i gotta head out

ciao friends

caird coinheringaahing

@Poke o/

HyperNeutrino

I commented and invited the user to discuss it in chat with me if the user thinks I should delete my answer.

totallyhuman

21:05

bye

New Meta Posts

-2

Q: Killing the popcon

To come back to it after over a year. Should we end the popcon? I personally think we should, just like with code-trolling and underhand there was too much bad for the good. We just keep closing them over and over. If there is so much bad for the good why should we keep it.

totallyhuman

well then

289 rep to 5k

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Reverse Maths Cycles Inspired by this Given an array of integers, cycle through +, *, -, //, %, ^, where // is integer division and ^ is exponent, while applying it to the reverse of the array. This may be confusing, so lets work through an example. Input: [1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9] Reverse...

New Main Posts

0

Q: Four In A Row: AI Tournament

Four-In-A-Row AI Tournament Today, we will be playing a Four-In-A-Row tournament. However, it is not us humans playing... instead, we must have our computers battle instead! This challenge is completely in C#. Rules Basic Game Rules If you have never played, there are simple rules. 2 players ...

king-of-the-hill c# ai-player

Anders Kaseorg

@HyperNeutrino codegolf.meta.stackexchange.com/a/10812/39242

HyperNeutrino

21:18

Hm. Alright. Right, I should have remembered that; I've seen that meta post before. In that case, then we should keep both answers :)

totallyhuman

whoa

dennis out golfed in jelly by 9 bytes

HyperNeutrino

:o

well

gg I lost that one lol

ETHproductions

Here goes: stackoverflow.com/q/45337572/4449486

caird coinheringaahing

@ETHproductions its already got more upvotes than I've ever got on SO >.<

HyperNeutrino

05AB1E is so confusing

caird coinheringaahing

21:25

@HyperNeutrino so is Jelly :D

totallyhuman

because you don't do stack based languages? :P

Conor O'Brien

@WheatWizard if you have any more questions, I won't be able to answer them presently. I'm taking a break for myself

Wheat Wizard

I have to leave anyway so good timing :)

HyperNeutrino

@cairdcoinheringaahing Jelly has clearer docs lol

caird coinheringaahing

I have a tab open with JHT in it, that I haven't clicked on in 2 days with about 2000 unread messages in, and I really want to click it :D

Step Hen

21:27

Logic Check, please: what does "Infinite Scrolling" mean to you?

Conor O'Brien

@WheatWizard :D that's kinda neat

caird coinheringaahing

@StepHen a webpage with unlimited side edges :D

I really need to stop ending my messages with :D

Step Hen

OK, say you have a list on a website and it has a feature called "Infinite Scrolling". what now?

ETHproductions

@StepHen A webpage that has a top but no bottom

Step Hen

I've spent a day or two trying to find a feature in this darned framework

caird coinheringaahing

21:28

@ETHproductions or that wraps around?

Step Hen

That would do pagination

ETHproductions

Or a left but no right, depending on the circumstance

Step Hen

And the pagination feature is freaking called Infinite Scrolling

ETHproductions

@cairdcoinheringaahing Hmm, I hadn't thought of that

Downgoat

@ETHproductions You want the ES6 sticky (y) flag if I'm understanding correctly

Step Hen

21:29

When you scroll to the end of the list it has a callback function that triggers and lets you add more to the list

caird coinheringaahing

@StepHen yeah, I understand that

totallyhuman

Isn't 1e8 always 1 ? — sln 2 mins ago

lol

Step Hen

I think I need to just memorize this darned framework's docs, since the guy that made it is not a native English speaker and I keep finding new things I can use, with really weird names

@totallyhuman see that's why you have an e operator :P

totallyhuman

it's not gonna be an operator

it's gonna be another way to represent numbers

ETHproductions

@Downgoat then you're not understanding correctly :P

caird coinheringaahing

21:31

@StepHen I have nothing against non-native english speakers, but I do have a rule that if they can't write comprehensible English, they should get someone who can to do it for them.

And here comes the backlash

Step Hen

@cairdcoinheringaahing Actually, this guy can write English fine, it's just that his vocab probably isn't as big as some peoples, and he's not the best at choosing section titles

His documentation is pretty thorough, once you find it

Downgoat

@ETHproductions can you explain why you need the g flag then?

caird coinheringaahing

@StepHen oh, ok, that's fine then

trichoplax

@cairdcoinheringaahing I guess that depends on whether they are aiming for an English speaking audience. There are plenty of people who aren't

Downgoat

(sorry if in question but I'm not understanding your question)

totallyhuman

21:33

i keep typing onject instead of object >_<

Step Hen

@totallyhuman I always hit enter instead of '

caird coinheringaahing

@trichoplax well, that goes without saying. There'd be no point in writing perfect English for a group of Hindi speakers (unless they spoke English)

ETHproductions

@Downgoat I don't, I just can't control whether the regex has the g flag or not

trichoplax

@cairdcoinheringaahing In that case I don't see why you'd expect a backlash. Writing for any language requires someone who can write that language

Downgoat

@ETHproductions so can't you add a new RegExp(oldRegex.source, oldRegex.flags.replace(/g/g, ""))

totallyhuman

21:35

caird's just adding the write that language well

caird coinheringaahing

@trichoplax I go to a very sensitive school, so anything that doesn't conform to the norm, usually receives backlash.

Downgoat

or you can use exec and extract the match length

totallyhuman

the well is pretty important

ETHproductions

@Downgoat Huh, that... actually works...

trichoplax

@cairdcoinheringaahing Hopefully we're more reasonable here... :)

caird coinheringaahing

21:36

@trichoplax puls, IME, the internet will usually devour anyone who doesn't conform to their ideals :O

ETHproductions

var newregex = RegExp(oldregex, oldregex.flags.replace('g', ''));

caird coinheringaahing

brb, finding the appropriate Family Guy clip

Step Hen

@cairdcoinheringaahing Not really, the Internet is more anybody can talk about anything, but you should expect for it to be argued with

Not that you can't have opinions

totallyhuman

you can't :P

caird coinheringaahing

Found it! youtube.com/watch?v=rSr01ZP1-eY

Step Hen

21:37

More like you're going to find every conceivable opinion

Downgoat

@ETHproductions in that case you'd probably also want to remove the y flag

trichoplax

@cairdcoinheringaahing Certainly people will misinterpret your words and argue with what you didn't actually say

Adám

CMC: Trim leading, extra, and trailing dots: ∙∙∙Programming∙∙Puzzles∙&∙∙∙∙Code∙∙∙Golf∙∙∙∙∙ → Programming∙Puzzles∙&∙Code∙Golf

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám str.strip

TemporalWolf

How much of a change to someone's answer constitutes a new answer? I further golfed an answer from 316B down to 187B, but that's not an easy change to post as a comment.

totallyhuman

21:43

lambda s:re.sub(' +','',s)
import re

caird coinheringaahing

@TemporalWolf post it as a link to TIO

Adám

@cairdcoinheringaahing Changed to dots to avoid built-ins.

@totallyhuman Really?

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám print(input().strip('.'))

Adám

@cairdcoinheringaahing That removes all but one from multiple internal?

@cairdcoinheringaahing Also, which lang?

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám Python, and it removes leading and trailing <argument> from the string

Oh, I didn't see the "extra" part. I can't read >.<

Adám

21:47

@totallyhuman Looks like that only removes all spaces. Can you explain it?

totallyhuman

Wherps

Just pretend there's a space there

DJMcMayhem

@Adám Can they be periods instead of non-ASCII characters?

Adám

OK, so it replaces all multiple spaces with single spaces? That may lead to a single leading and/or trailing space, no?

@DJMcMayhem Yes, or any other char, just not spaces, to avoid built-ins.

DJMcMayhem

Try it online!

Whoops, lol

Phoenix

$><<$_.split('.').join'.'

Uses -n

Actually, $_=$_.split('.').join'.' with -p

Adám

21:56

@DJMcMayhem Nice.

I just invented a new on in APL: 1↓'∙'∘(∊⊣,¨≠⊆⊢)

But as my CXO said, if we show that to people, they'll run away screaming…

Phoenix

Nevermind

New Meta Posts

-1

Q: New challenge idea: Showcase

I think that we should have a new type of "challenge": showcase questions. These questions aren't questions where answers compete for the lowest bytecount, or the best score, they are answers to a specific question that demonstrate interesting or unique features of languages. A showcase question...

discussion new-genre showcase

Phoenix

$_=$_.split('.').reject!{|s|s.empty?}.join'.' with -p

Adám

@Phoenix Ouch.

Phoenix

yep

I think I might want a better method

DJMcMayhem

21:58

@Adám 3 bytes shorter: òÍ^®ü®$ü®®

Adám

@DJMcMayhem I get it, I get it, its a trademark. Sheesh.

ETHproductions

@Downgoat Hmm, good idea

DJMcMayhem

Hehe

Phoenix

$_=gsub(/,+/,',').gsub(/^,|,$/,'')

Uses , instead of dot.

ETHproductions

Though where I'm using it I don't expect anyone to use the y flag

Adám

21:59

@Phoenix Right, dot is bad in regex.

DJMcMayhem

@Adám Really what it is is that ® is a synonym of \. so that . can mean any character and ® means a literal dot.

But it doesn't cost an extra byte each time

Adám

@DJMcMayhem Oh.

DJMcMayhem

@Adám Jelly, 5 bytes: ỴLÐfY

The char it uses is newlines, since you didn't say it couldn't be :P

Adám

@DJMcMayhem Ah, what? Newlines‽ No. I said "to avoid built-ins".

DJMcMayhem

I know, I'm just abusing the rules :P

Here, I'll do a serious one in a second

Adám

22:04

QuadR, 14 bytes:

^∙+
∙+$
∙+


∙

Try it online!

DJMcMayhem

@Adám Serious Jelly answer, 9 bytes: ṣ”.LÐfj”.

Adám

@DJMcMayhem The main part is the same.

DJMcMayhem

ṣ           # Split
 ”.         #   On '.'s
    Ðf      # Filter out all the elements...
   L        #   Where the length is 0
      j     # Join...
       ”.   #   On '.'s

Adám

@DJMcMayhem Oooh, we do explanations in TNB CMCs? Cool. And thanks.

DJMcMayhem

:shrug: why not?

Do you have another one? I'm on a jelly kick :D

Adám

22:09

@DJMcMayhem I'll think. They kind of just pop up.

flawr

@Riker /r/HaveWeMet

Adám

@DJMcMayhem How about this: CMC: Cumulative sum restarting as indicated by given Boolean: 1 0 0 1 0 1 and 1 2 3 4 5 6 gives 1 3 6 4 9 6

DJMcMayhem

Ooh

OK, I'll try it

caird coinheringaahing

Quick question before I go, what is the name of programming which follows this syntax? The entire code is essentially a series of functions like

F = lambda a,b:a+b

Adám

@cairdcoinheringaahing functional?

caird coinheringaahing

22:12

G = lambda a,b: a-b

Print(g(f(10, 20),20)

@Adám I don't think so, I would have heard of examples.

DJMcMayhem

@Adám Jelly, 6 bytes: œṗ+\€F

Adám

@DJMcMayhem Right, partition, cumulative sum each, join.

DJMcMayhem

Exactly

Jelly is beautiful

(when you understand a tiny piece of it and you aren't ripping your hair out)

flawr

@trichoplax I just discovered that you offer a bounty for solving the "pop con problem" but I don't see much of a problem that has not been discussed yet?

Adám

@DJMcMayhem I could actually read that. œxtra functionṗartition+\cumsum (identical to APL)€achFlatten

flawr

22:17

The only reason so many get closed is that these people do not know what it is about and do not follow the recomendatiosn and rules.

DJMcMayhem

Alright, I gtg

ASCII-only

@cairdcoinheringaahing That looks like Python being used functionally, just the Print is a little weird

trichoplax

@flawr I don't see questions being closed as a problem. The problem I'd like to see solved is that there doesn't seem to be consensus on what a popularity contest should be.

Adám

@DJMcMayhem ∊(+\¨⊂) in APL. ⊂ partition, +\ cumsum ¨ each ∊nlist

flawr

@trichoplax In what way? I think the discussions in the beginning of last year were quite fruitful for defining that, we even updated the tag?

Luis Mendo

22:27

@Adám Nice! That could make a good challenge

MATL, 8 bytes: Ysi12XQ!g

Adám

@LuisMendo Main, you mean?

DJMcMayhem

@LuisMendo That output looks wrong

Luis Mendo

Oops, just updated

DJMcMayhem

Nevermind

Luis Mendo

Yes, I meant main

Adám

22:29

@LuisMendo Too trivial, no? Look at the short TNB answers!

HyperNeutrino

@MDXF ಠ_ಠ lol xD

Luis Mendo

@Adám Yes, perhaps a little more complication would be good. Not sure in which direction, though

* 9 bytes

Adám

@LuisMendo How about 2D partitioning?

Luis Mendo

And cumulative-sum along the two dims?

Adám

@LuisMendo Yup.

Luis Mendo

22:32

Sounds good. But I don't like it that in that case you need to specify order of dimensions, i.e. along which to sum first

Ah no, it gives the same result?

Yes, same result. I'm dumb

Adám

@LuisMendo So given a matrix and two Boolean lists, partition horizontally and vertically, and cumsum each box horizontally and vertically, then join.

MD XF

@HyperNeutrino :P I saw it as I was going past and it bugged me

Luis Mendo

@Adám Yup. I think it would be interesting. Not too easy nor too difficult. Just in case, it may be necessary specify where the origin for summation is (at the lowest-index corner)

That is, cumsum along increasing indices

Adám

ok, will do. Give me a couple of mins

Luis Mendo

Are you going to post to sandbox or directly to main? You may need to think about minimum input size. Probably empty-input corner case is not interesting; I'd go with minimum 1x1. Also, the two partitioning Boolean vectors should probably have at least a 1 value

Step Hen

22:43

Holy crap, setting up Github pages is so much easier than I thought

caird coinheringaahing

@ASCII-only yeah I based it off of Python as that's the best example I can think of, but I'm on mobile so the capitalisation of print was my phone's fault

@StepHen how are you discovering this now?

Step Hen

@cairdcoinheringaahing I set one up, because I actually have something I want to put online :P

caird coinheringaahing

@StepHen cQuents?

Step Hen

@cairdcoinheringaahing nah that's in Python, I'm making something, I'll show you when I'm done (not related to PPCG)

caird coinheringaahing

@StepHen I've put all the many languages I've made on GitHub, just because it's easier.

Step Hen

22:45

@cairdcoinheringaahing No I mean github pages as in https://name.github.io, all my programs are on github

Adám

@LuisMendo Straight to Main. Thanks for the tips.

Step Hen

@cairdcoinheringaahing Like this

caird coinheringaahing

@StepHen oh right. Nah I never used that. This is the only thing on my GitHub that isn't a language.

Step Hen

@cairdcoinheringaahing well as I said it's extremely easy to set up, a lot easier than I thought it would be

you literally just name your repo <yourusername>.github.io and include an index.html

and boom

caird coinheringaahing

@StepHen that doesn't surprise me, GitHub is designed to be user friendly

Poll: Should there be a code golf only app, with chat support? (I know there's a Meta post about it, just wanting to know what people think)

Step Hen

22:49

@cairdcoinheringaahing I think there should just be a decent SE chat app

unless one exists and I don't know about it

caird coinheringaahing

@StepHen no it doesn't exist, but I've been behind the feature request since the start

Anyway, I've got to go, bye (don't ping me with "Bye" or anything like that)

totallyhuman

bye

HyperNeutrino

@MDXF ಠ_ಠ :P

totallyhuman

|`÷`|`num, str`|Push the first `length(str) // num` characters of `str`|

can anybody give me a better way to phrase that

HyperNeutrino

Can I get a name idea for a language that specializes in sequences?

@totallyhuman |`÷`|`num, str`|Push the first `1 // num` part of `str`|?

^^

Business Cat

23:00

That's what I was going to say

totallyhuman

oh nice

HyperNeutrino

Also I need to name my language sometime :P

Business Cat

@HyperNeutrino Ceres

HyperNeutrino

Huh. Not bad.

totallyhuman

ok i'm literally looking at dir(requests.Response) for intrnt features >_<

Business Cat

23:02

I should stop naming languages after deities

HyperNeutrino

why xD

@BusinessCat lol true

Business Cat

:shrug:

trichoplax

@flawr Just had a look back through last year's popcon meta posts in case I'd missed anything. I was delighted to see the tag wiki rewrite at the time, but I still feel there is lack of consensus on how to apply it. The objective validity criterion seems to mean different things to different people at different times.

For example, Tweetable Mathematical Art and Images With All Colors both seem to be "draw whatever you like" with the objective validity criterion of "you must meet this strict restriction".

Adám

0

Q: 2D partitioned cumulative sum

Challenge Given a matrix M with r rows and c columns, and two Boolean lists V of length r and H of length c, calculate the partitioned cumulative vertical and horizontal sums. Rules r and c are greater than or equal to one H and V begin with a true value The values in M are within your langua...

code-golf arithmetic matrix subsequence

trichoplax

One of them is closed, the other is open. Ideally we would have a consensus that makes them both closed, or both open, unless there is some reason to consider them different types of contest?

ATaco

23:07

The difference with "Images With All Colours" is that it does have a criteria that needs to be achieved, although realistically, it should be closed, as it's technically just "Do this, but creatively"

totallyhuman

Jelly shall crush that challenge

trichoplax

@ATaco Why is that a difference, since the other also has a strict criterion?

totallyhuman

It has been foretold

ATaco

Although the other restricts you to a byte count, it doesn't restrict you at all to an output.

And realistically, challenges are defined by their I/O, rather than their internals.

trichoplax

Neither restricts what images you can make, or gives any requirement of what they should look like. In both the output can be arbitrary provided it meets a criterion

ATaco

23:10

The second is expected to, atleast, on a theoretical scale, contain every colour if provided a high enough resolution, the first is not given such a restriction.

trichoplax

Fixed code length challenges don't really work because what would make a good length varies so much between languages, but for a language specific contest it just seems like an alternative to code golf

HyperNeutrino

lol what how did I cap

ATaco

Fixed code challenges don't really work because different languages will be vastly different in length.

Say "You must do X in under 5 bytes" and you've obliterated languages like C# and Java.

For no good reason, too.

trichoplax

@ATaco Both the byte count and the colour requirement are trivial to achieve. All of the voting was on what was produced with it (whether because the output was aesthetically pleasing or impressive to achieve)

HyperNeutrino

lol even a lambda in Java would be like s->.. and there are then only two bytes left with which you could only apply a unary operator or return a constant value

trichoplax

23:13

@ATaco Yes that is exactly what I meant - it only works for a language specific contest, like the example

ATaco

Personally, I feel both should still survive in some form, especially the second, but I feel our definition of what makes a good Pop-con contest is incredibly difficult, as it's usually "Do X Creatively"

People like seeing X done creatively, but as it's almost impossible to actually quantify that, it doesn't fit with PPCG.

trichoplax

I definitely agree defining pop cons is still incredibly difficult. That's why I made these comments - in response to flawr asking why I'm offering a bounty since the popularity contest problem has been solved

I think there was a big improvement but it still seems fairly arbitrary which pop cons survive.

Adám

@totallyhuman In the old days, all programmers shouted.

trichoplax

I learned to program at the top of my voice

ATaco

I want to bring up Paint By Numbers, which isn't a well defined PopCon, but one of the best in my opinion.

John Dvorak

23:18

My favorite was the christmas tree one, also just "be creative"

ATaco

This essentially says "Make an image blobby", and that's it, the results are varying levels of sharp, correct colours, and outright unrelated images.

New Main Posts

See above

John Dvorak

Also "rearrange pixels from one image into another" - lots of great answers, but the criteria aren't all that objective.

trichoplax

@ATaco I actually think that one is pretty well defined, and I like that the program has to take input so it's less about the programmer just coding fixed output they find aesthetically pleasing

ATaco

Although outputting a single bland colour is technically valid by the challenge's definition.

totallyhuman

23:21

@NewMainPosts 0/10 edit not funny enough :P

trichoplax

@JohnDvorak That's another one I think is a good fit for the site despite being subjective, precisely because it has to take input and work for a range of different images.

@totallyhuman New Main Posts is very tired today

ATaco

The "Image with all colours" is actually fairly similarly specified, but allows much more flexible output, it's an example of a Bad question that should be good, in my opinion.

John Dvorak

all colors wasn't my favorite but it still was good.

ATaco

Personally, I think "Do X Creatively" shouldn't be frowned upon.

trichoplax

@ATaco I think a variation on that one that required an input image to match to would be interesting too, but as it is it specifically discouraged using a target image (as so many on allrgb.com do), which meant the contest focused on novel ways of generating pattern spontaneously, which I found very interesting too

ATaco

23:24

I keep saying "Personally" and "My Opinion", I'm being very safe with this discussion :P

trichoplax

@ATaco It's such a subjective topic... :P

I'd just like there to be strong consensus one way or another. Then we can either have creative but challenging contests here on PPCG, or if we know we can't we can put effort into setting up something externally

Luis Mendo

@Adám I saw. About to post an answer :-)

John Dvorak

My strong consensus is to keep it here :P

ATaco

Patch the Image is another technically poorly defined Popcon that is still a good question, as food for thought.

John Dvorak

The top-voted answer is a copy/paste from a paper...

trichoplax

23:31

@JohnDvorak I'd love that to be the answer, but I posted the open ended bounty on meta because I would rather either conclusion than no conclusion, as I think the current situation is putting people off writing popularity contests

I like the copy/paste to the dithering contest, with the disclaimer "By the way, I'm the one who wrote this"

31

A: Dither a Grayscale Image

GraphicsMagick/ImageMagick Ordered Dither: magick B2DBy.jpg -gamma .45455 -ordered-dither [all] 4x4 ordered4x4g45.pbm Before complaining about my using an "established algorithm" please read the ChangeLog for GraphicsMagick and ImageMagick for April 2003 where you'll see that I implemented th...

Not copy/paste - I misremembered. Using ImageMagick...

HyperNeutrino

ಠ_ಠ I was outgolfed 31-15 by Jonathan Allan in Jelly :P

totallyhuman

23:49

Should I have two built-ins: split by newline and split by specified string?

ATaco

Three, Split by Spaces is also used a lot.

totallyhuman

Hmm ok

ATaco

RProgN implicitly splits by spaces if no input is given to its split command.

Adám

@totallyhuman Does split by specified string split for each separate char in the string of for occurrences of the entire string?

totallyhuman

Entire string

Adám

23:56

@totallyhuman How about split Hello, there: My world on , :?

Noah Cristino

Hi guys

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