The Nineteenth Byte

Downgoat

00:00

owel there goes all my stacks of hay ;_;

Phoenix

Or you could not buy a Mac

Try building a computer yourself?

Downgoat

but... but... Windows is evil

Phoenix

So put Linux on it.

Downgoat

porblem is Linux is very isolated in terms of support

99% of companies just do Windows + macOS

Phoenix

It's gotten a lot better recently.

Downgoat

00:03

also I have a habit of borking Linux

Phoenix

Actually, given that you already have a mac, there's a utility that converts an existing mac image into an install disk.

You have to make sure your new PC has compatible parts tho.

Downgoat

is microsoft makes windows POSIX compliant they will be like supreme OS

@Phoenix oh u mean like hackintosh

Phoenix

Yes

@Downgoat You can install cmder, which lets you run bash, which is probably all you really need.

Downgoat

@Phoenix I need a full POSIX environment for most of my work

O___O I can get hackintosh for > 1/2 the price wtf

Helka Homba

greater than half the price?

Mendeleev

00:08

Is it OK if I post a very censored screenshot of NSFW text? (All NSFW words and actions are censored)

Downgoat

yeah

Mendeleev

ok

Downgoat

@Mendeleev I reccomend posting external link e.g.: [NSFW: picture of sheep](...)

Phoenix

A hackintosh would cost far, far less than half the price of a mac.

Mendeleev

Not oneboxing it definitely

I was reviewing spam comments on my blog, when suddenly I saw this

Downgoat

00:09

@Phoenix actually pretty near 1/2: 2,600 vs ~1,300

Mendeleev

LIke I mean there's spam, and then there's this

Why do people do this

Phoenix

@Downgoat 1,300 is ludicrous

Nelson Casanova

Hey there

Phoenix

I spent less than that on a PC with 2 RX480s in it.

Downgoat

@Phoenix may or may not be including price of $500 monitor

Helka Homba

00:10

@Downgoat You can build a great Windows PC for under $1300 easily (only 90 of that goes to the OS)

Downgoat

@HelkaHomba s/goes/goats

Mendeleev

@Phoenix You don't even need that. You just need to put on the flash drive and boot it with the CLover bootloader

Phoenix

@Downgoat Link to 2,600 dollar mac in question, please? I want to see it's specs.

Mendeleev

with some kexts in folders

Downgoat

wait @Mendeleev didn't you get Mac on your windows PC?

Mendeleev

00:11

@Downgoat I put OSX on m y 2010 laptop

Newest dev preview (High Sierra)

totallyhuman

Hmm would a challenge to print all the language's keywords work?

Downgoat

@Phoenix this one w/ i7 + 16GB rams

Adám

@totallyhuman define "keywords".

Mendeleev

@Phoenix apple.com/macbook-pro/specs apple.com/imac/specs apple.com/imac-pro/specs apple.com/mac-pro/specs apple.com/macbook/specs

Helka Homba

@Downgoat like half of that price is the display...

Nelson Casanova

00:13

Question!... I've got a challenge that involves making a yymmdd date to be turned into yyyy-MM-dd I'm not sure where can I found a solid specification of when does 610801 turns 1961-08-01 instead of 2061-08-01

Mendeleev

@Downgoat nope nope not even close to any definition of worth it by hardware alone. the display makes up a huge part of it though.

Nelson Casanova

for example

Downgoat

@HelkaHomba Porblem is I can get 27" 4K display for only like $500 (highest price I saw was $800)

Adám

@NelsonCasanova there isn't any. y2k

Mendeleev

@totallyhuman Are you typing or not? It keeps flickering

Nelson Casanova

00:14

@Adám so Im free to define one for the purpose of the challenge?

Helka Homba

@Downgoat I'd wager you don't really need a 4k display.

Adám

@NelsonCasanova yeah, e.g. ±50 from today.

Mendeleev

I want to get an HP Omen 32" 1440p display - would it be worth it?

Nelson Casanova

@Adám coolio!

Downgoat

@HelkaHomba yea but the non-4K imac has integrated graphics and 5400rpm hard disk with i5 and shit specs

Mendeleev

00:15

@Downgoat egpu

Adám

@NelsonCasanova or 1980-2079 (DOS)

Downgoat

through thunderbolt would be way to slow i think

Helka Homba

@Downgoat Then don't get a mac. Get a much more customizable PC

Adám

@NelsonCasanova if dependent on today, you should allow languages to take today's date as an argument if they don't have it built in.

Nelson Casanova

@Adám I like that one, and I can quote it...

Downgoat

00:17

PC don't work because not POSIX and Linux is linux

Helka Homba

and understand that much of world doesn't know what a POSIX is

Mendeleev

@Downgoat Just use linux

totallyhuman

@Adám anything that you can use in the language that the programmer hasn't defined?

Adám

@totallyhuman all valid numbers and strings too?

@totallyhuman is ( a keyword in Python?

Downgoat

I already said to Phoenix but linux is so isolated and like nothing support and so I have to use Rob's plugin to do everything from github and also then I loose continuity and also linux HiDPI support is iffy at best

totallyhuman

00:19

@Adám fair point, that is confusing

Downgoat

also pretty much every Linux GUI I've seen is really unpolished (with maybe exception of elementary OS)

Adám

@NelsonCasanova or 1930-2029 (Microsoft Excel)

Mendeleev

@Downgoat GNOME

It's very polished and has good hidpi support

Downgoat

@Mendeleev I mean I'm not going to doubt that it is polish in term of not borking but UI is not polished

Mendeleev

@Downgoat Umm yeah it is

Have you seen it?

Downgoat

00:21

yes

Mendeleev

OK, rewording that

Have you seen it with the arc theme

Nelson Casanova

@Adám Im gonna go with the DOS range...

Adám

@NelsonCasanova or (today-10)±50 (FileMaker Pro)

Downgoat

@Mendeleev ok no not that :| but idk why all linux font look like comic sans had baby with helvetica

Mendeleev

@Downgoat They don't!!

You can install the same fonts that you're used to

TuxCopter

00:24

Huh, Steam Greenlight closes today

Mendeleev

wot

ETHproductions

:(

Why are they closing it?

Mendeleev

"Steam Direct"

Nelson Casanova

@Adám uhhh... I'll need help with this one... will post on the sandbox in a bit

TuxCopter

Blog article is here

Downgoat

00:25

@Mendeleev oh another porblem: gesture thing to navigate multiple desktop don't exist on linux (there are workspace but those are crap)

Mendeleev

@Downgoat Yeah it does

I can have swipe gestures

Downgoat

:| but where does swiping mouse come from

Mendeleev

Also workspaces wree invented decades before Mac virtual desktops

@Downgoat Trackpad?

user165474

Hello!

Mendeleev

Or you mean

On GNOME super+pgup and super+pgdn navigate workspaves

Adám

00:26

@NelsonCasanova 1920-2019 (SAS)

Downgoat

@Mendeleev I know i used ubuntu before but you had to do like alt+arrow key to switch to desktop and it was super slow

Mendeleev

It shouldn't be slow at all

Downgoat

also I live in sillicon valley so can't be hipster goat without mac :|

Mendeleev

yeah you can

linux is the new mac

Downgoat

pls tel how to install xcode on linux

Mendeleev

00:28

@Downgoat Do you need it?

Also, VMs exist

ETHproductions

@TuxCopter Interesting. So they're switching from gamers voting on what they want to developers deciding that their game will do well enough? Sounds good for the developers, idk about the gamers though

Mendeleev

keep your old mac

Downgoat

@Mendeleev I do have this computer... hm...

ais523

depends on what you mean by "xcode"; if you mean "collection of compilers and basic compilation infrastructure that makes it possible to build things for the platform", Ubuntu's equivalent is build-essential

whereas if you're talking about an IDE, there are plenty of those available too (there isn't an "official" one though)

Phoenix

I'm confident You could get a computer for 300 dollars more powerful than what you have now.

Downgoat

00:30

Question: is there decent Microsoft word equivalent for linux (besides Open Office that look like it is from 2003)

Phoenix

@Downgoat LibreOffice is good

Mendeleev

@Downgoat Microsoft Word on Wine

ais523

LibreOffice is newer and more up to date than OpenOffice.org, although it's derived from it

I personally prefer LibreOffice Writer to Word (although Excel is better than LibreOffice Calc, or at least was last I checked)

TuxCopter

@Downgoat LibreOffice

Mendeleev

Helka Homba

00:30

$300 Budget Gaming PC Challenge - Scrapyard Wars Episode 1a

►

Phoenix

@ais523 Agreed with this

Mendeleev

New version of LO

Downgoat

@Mendeleev :O how you make look decent

Mendeleev

@Downgoat It's the new version

With a setting change

ais523

haha, it has a ribbon?

Mendeleev

00:31

Look up "libreoffice notebookbar"

Helka Homba

@Downgoat Google Docs (if you don't need to be too publishery)

Mendeleev

:37931723

This

Use Google Docs, it's all I use anyway

ais523

alternatively, if you want to be very publishery, there's Scribus, and LaTeX-based word processors

I did my thesis using LyX, which is very good, although it plays in a slightly different space to Word

Phoenix

Also, don't buy something with an i7, you don't need it.

ais523

I'm not sure the concept of "WYSIWYG programming language" even makes sense, but if it did, that would be LyX

Mendeleev

00:32

Get a Ryzen

Phoenix

Well, yeah, ^

Mendeleev

Go to pcpp.co

Get one of their ryzen productivity builds

Phoenix

But in general, don't get a high-end processor unless you're saving on a video card and want the dedicated graphics.

Mendeleev

Not true

Ryzen > i5 by a huge margin and an R7 isn't that expensive for the power you get

An R5 is a i7 equivalent at i3 prices

ais523

huh, I just realised that LyX documents are actually Turing-complete, although probably only because they let you shell out to raw LaTeX if you need to

Phoenix

00:34

I would say R5 and not R7

user165474

:o you can change LibreOffice color scheme?

Phoenix

Yes

You can install firefox themes

user165474

ooo cool

Mendeleev

It's a GTK theme

Not firefox ffs

ais523

wait, there are programs where you can't change the colour scheme?

user165474

00:35

Notepad

Mendeleev

@ais523 this

ais523

even Windows 3.1 let you do that

Phoenix

@Mendeleev But you can install Firefox themes

ais523

Notepad included

user165474

Wait actually? :o

Mendeleev

00:36

@Phoenix Riiight... but that's not what was being cdiscussed

ais523

yes, for some reason I made all the toolbars red when I was younger

Phoenix

ಠ_ಠ

user165474

You were a strange being when you were younger ಠ_ಠ

ais523

I guess I just decided that because the setting was there, I should make use of it

user165474

Also how do I change the color/theme

Phoenix

00:37

Settings

Mendeleev

windows appearance settings or Linux GTK themes

Or Qt, whatever

Phoenix

Tools -> Options -> Personalization

Downgoat

@Phoenix wait what why

Phoenix

@Downgoat Because you aren't gaming on it, you're not compiling industry-level code on it, no need to waste money.

You won't see the performance difference during everyday use.

@totallyhuman I think you need to update your I am Typing

Mendeleev

@Phoenix \

I need to remove caret reply

Phoenix

00:40

<space>^

@Downgoat As for video card, don't pay more than about 100 dollars. Again, you're not gaming on it.

user165474

Survey: Is there a certain set of keyboard shortcuts / bookmarks you perform / open every time you open your browser?

Adám

@HyperNeutrino Why would I close my browser?

Phoenix

If you do that and get mini-atx mobo and case you can get a 600 dollar pc, probably significantly more powerful than what you have now, with new parts.

Even less if you buy used i.e. search Craigslist.

user165474

@Adám good question; fair point

Phoenix

You don't need to buy a monitor either, you already have one lying around.

Downgoat

00:43

@Phoenix I do a lot of video/3D stuff and sometime play TF2

Phoenix

@Downgoat TF2 came out in 2006~

You can play it on integrated graphics.

Mendeleev

@HyperNeutrino Yeah ctrl+shift+t

I have way too many tabs to reopen them every time

user165474

lol

Downgoat

:| I can play on medium graphics on top of line 2012 Mac with about 20 FPS

user165474

I always do <c><enter><Ctrl-T><m><down><enter><Ctrl-T><m><enter><Ctrl-T><m><down><down><ent‌er><Ctrl-T><n><down><enter>

Mendeleev

00:44

@Phoenix just tell him to get a 1050

Phoenix

@Downgoat This is why people don't like Macs

@Mendeleev I'd say RX 460

Mendeleev

eh that's fine too

I have a 2010 top of the line business notebook that handles HL2 beautifully

Not TF2 though, that's too difficult for it

Phoenix

More likely to work with hackintosh given that macs come with AMD cards.

@Mendeleev Even on low settings?

Mendeleev

@Phoenix yeah

Downgoat

@Phoenix my Mac has Nvidia card something 500/600 IIRC

Mendeleev

00:46

Strangely, csgo works well

@Downgoat That's not much

That's just the generation

Downgoat

GTX650 I think

Phoenix

@Downgoat garbage

Downgoat

:(

Mendeleev

DOwngarbage

Helka Homba

not garbage just out of date

Phoenix

00:48

@HelkaHomba x50s are the lowest in their series.

Downgoat

@Phoenix my graphic card is not sheep! :P

Phoenix

It was lame when it came out.

Mendeleev

@Phoenix no, there was x40 too

Phoenix

Oh, really?

Huh

Mendeleev

geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gt-740

And x30

And x10

Downgoat

00:49

Is there list of hackintosh parts researching what will work seem like lot of work

Mendeleev

@Downgoat yes

i think there's one on /r/hackintosh

Helka Homba

@Mendeleev ever been an x90?

Mendeleev

yeah

GTX 690

Phoenix

@Mendeleev Wow, they killed those off.

caird coinheringaahing

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Make a Minecraft Crafting Table Don't you hate it when you can't remember how to craft something in Minecraft? Well, time to remedy that! Task Your task is to take an input, either as a 1D or 2D list and output what item is a result of the crafting table! Input You may take input as either a...

Finally finished it!

Now I go get coffee. Lots of coffee.

Adám

00:50

I just finished my keyboard layout-to-picture program today. Here's how I type all my special glyphs:

Phoenix

Titan XP or bust :P

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám I want to ask why, but I also don't

Adám

@cairdcoinheringaahing Why what?

caird coinheringaahing

why you made/have/making/whatever a custom keyboard with a bunch of random symbols on it

Downgoat

@Mendeleev idea for inexpensive computer: sell hackintosh

Mendeleev

00:53

@cairdcoinheringaahing Nooooo. Radiation hardened, coed bowling, large set of solutions...?

Why not jsut name it code-golf?

@Downgoat Illegal

Downgoat

D:

Phoenix

@cairdcoinheringaahing Those aren't random

Mendeleev

Look up Psystar

Phoenix

Those are APL symbols

Adám

@cairdcoinheringaahing They're not random. They are all the APL primitives (plus a few proposed ones) and all the valid characters for APL identifiers. Additionally some common punctuation.

Phoenix

00:53

@Downgoat Technically building hackintosh is illegal.

caird coinheringaahing

@Mendeleev code golf would require doing all of the rcipes

Phoenix

Apple will hardly sue you though.

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám don't know APL, to me it looks random

Mendeleev

@cairdcoinheringaahing No

Have it be length of code - recipes^2

Adám

@cairdcoinheringaahing Well, English looks like a bunch of random glyphs to someone who has never seen Latin script before.

caird coinheringaahing

00:55

@Mendeleev what about a program that outputted s in 1 byte. Score of 0

Downgoat

Is pcpartpicker good website for hackintosh

Mendeleev

@Downgoat yes

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám fair enough

Mendeleev

@cairdcoinheringaahing Make them have to ou tput the whole name

Phoenix

@Downgoat No real alternative for what it does.

At least no good one.

Adám

00:57

@cairdcoinheringaahing E.g. ⍳ is the Greek equivalent of i, so it is on the i button, and finds indices.

Mendeleev

@Phoenix PC Hound

Downgoat

._. Ok wow this seem complex

How do I know how many fan to put

caird coinheringaahing

@Mendeleev 1) i'm sure there is a language out there somewhere that has a builtin to print sticks or 2) the output format would be too restrictive

Adám

@cairdcoinheringaahing ⌊ rounds down, so it is on D.

Phoenix

@Downgoat 0

caird coinheringaahing

00:58

@Adám are you trying to teach me APL?

Phoenix

Your case will 99% chance come with all the fans you need

Adám

@cairdcoinheringaahing Yes.

Mendeleev

@Downgoat You would usually have the case come with them

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám why?

Mendeleev

He works at Dyalog

Adám

00:59

@cairdcoinheringaahing Because you don't know APL, why else‽ ;-)

caird coinheringaahing

Ah

Downgoat

what is difference between i5-7600 and -7500 cause it's like a $100 difference?

Adám

@Mendeleev I believed in APL before even knowing about Dyalog.

Mendeleev

@Downgoat Frequency

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