The Nineteenth Byte

New Sandboxed Posts

00:02

0

Prisoner's dilemma Inspired by the "Mafia" proposal Write a bot that plays the Prisoner's dilemma. King of the hill Payoff matrix: I'm going to make one in paint because it's hard to do in ASCII. Hang on. Rules: Your bot must be a full program, not a function. Your bot must run when the se...

DJMcMayhem

@NewSandboxedPosts oh, that's not beta decay, lol

Eᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏ Iʀᴋ

ikr

I thought it was

no, it's a new user

Conor O'Brien

I did too

sadakatsu

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Pseudoku Cops and Robbers King of the Hill (I know that another user, @NathanMerrill, is proposing a similar contest. I started playing with the idea for this type of contest independently yesterday, but have since chatted with in The Nineteenth Byte. He is currently undecided on the type of p...

I worked on my idea some more and threw together a more formal yet still incomplete proposal.

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Pseudoku Cops and Robbers King of the Hill (I know that another user, @NathanMerrill, is proposing a similar contest. I started playing with the idea for this type of contest independently yesterday, but have since chatted with in The Nineteenth Byte. He is currently undecided on the type of p...

flawr

00:17

@LuisMendo Thanks for all the help!

need to go to bed now0)

Eᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏ Iʀᴋ

night!

Pavel

gn

flawr

@EᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏIʀᴋ Why did you have to post such an interesting challenge so damn late?

Eᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏ Iʀᴋ

beacuse it was 2:10 where I was

sorry

flawr

I should have gone to bed about 3 hours ago...

Eᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏ Iʀᴋ

00:29

go to sleep silly lizard

@flawr you only need 7 hours of sleep, see you in 7 hours :P

Conor O'Brien

@flawr what is a convolution

Pavel

I live on five hours. I function. I also drink coffee.

Conor O'Brien

that's really not healthy

Adnan

@Pavel five hours average?

Pavel

5-6

flawr

00:31

@ConorO'Brien Go read some wikipedia. (Then note that discrete convolution is the same as polynomial multiplication)

@EᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏIʀᴋ I will

Conor O'Brien

@flawr oh, okay

flawr

@ConorO'Brien and we've had a challenge about it=)

Pavel

I can't open this article but I'll link it here in case it shows I'm right.

Conor O'Brien

@flawr oh? By whom?

flawr

@ConorO'Brien guess

Conor O'Brien

00:32

santa?

Adnan

@Pavel between 7 and 9 hours of sleep

I doubt that ~6 hours a day is healthy

but I have also read that it can work for some people

Eᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏ Iʀᴋ

> AOL

> aol.com wants to show notifications

Pavel

Do you guys think that an interesting task would be to find the sum or product of an infinite series? Input would be a string with n and the programs must support the same functionality as for this challenge

Eᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏ Iʀᴋ

Pavel

@EᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏIʀᴋ Are you responding to me or did you just want to share that image?

'cause that was really fast.

Eᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏ Iʀᴋ

00:39

I was responding to the article

Pavel

Oh k

Eᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏ Iʀᴋ

ok since NMP is slow:

2

Q: Should we remove [transcendental-numbers]?

We have a tag transcendental-numbers. It's currently used on only 2 questions, here and here. Both are code-golf and involve approximating 2 transcendental numbers. (e and the Fransén-Robinson constant) This doesn't appear really to add anything to these challenges, 1 is also tagged math and ...

Pavel

Yes

Can we remove hexagonal-grid while we're at it? It seems pointless.

Eᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏ Iʀᴋ

no, it's actually used

Pavel

It's used, by I don't think people go out of their way to find hexagonal-grid challenges

Eᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏ Iʀᴋ

00:42

so?

Pavel

Isn't that the point of tags?

Help people find similar questions? Who searches for hexagonal-grid

Destructible Watermelon

TBH I never search for code golf

Eᴀsᴛᴇʀʟʏ Iʀᴋ

I have personally

Pavel

Huh

Adnan

@Pavel It's also to find duplicates more easily

Pavel

00:45

Good point.

What do people think of my challenge idea? I could also do decision-problem for converges/diverges.

New Meta Posts

2

Q: Should we remove [transcendental-numbers]?

We have a tag transcendental-numbers. It's currently used on only 2 questions, here and here. Both are code-golf and involve approximating 2 transcendental numbers. (e and the Fransén-Robinson constant) This doesn't appear really to add anything to these challenges, 1 is also tagged math and ...

discussion tags

New Meta Posts

01:08

0

Q: For compression-related challenges, should we take steps to level the use of 7-bit and 8-bit character sets?

(Closely related in the original premise, but both the question and its answers go off in a different direction: this meta post.) Something I've noted in many challenges which are fundamentally about storing a large amount of data in the program (e.g. most kolmogorov-complexity challenges with l...

discussion challenge-quality

Destructible Watermelon

@Pavel are you interested in helping me with my koth?

New Main Posts

01:34

0

Q: Escaping the desert

Beth is located at the oasis in the middle of a desert. There are plenty of water in the lake, but unfortunately there are only X buckets each being able to hold Y liters of water. Beth can carry 2 buckets in her hands, but she must drink to survive exactly 1 liter after each KM traveled. She ca...

math code-challenge

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

Hello, fellow golfers. Can anyone asssist me on getting this post from the answer chain "add a language to this polyglot" S.I.L.O.S (or intercal) seems like a powerful way to extend it. Heres what I have so far, let me know if anyone knows how to get it to be valid perl.

# [S.I.L.O.S], 334 bytes

#v`16/"<"6/b.q@"(: ::T): :(22)S#;n4"14"
#>3N6@15o|> ^*ttt*~++~~~%
#=~nJ<R"12";
#[
#`<`|
print((eval("1\x2f2")and (9)or(13))-(0and 4)^(1)<<(65)>>62)or'(\{(\{})(\{\/+23!@}[()])}\{})(\{}\{})'#46(8+9+9+9+9+=!)=#print(17)#]#echo 21#|/=1/24=x=90/
#8 dggi2 ` |1|6$//''25 #>say 27#T222999"26
print 31

[Try it online!]

[S.I.L.O.S]: https://github.com/rjhunjhunwala/S.I.L.O.S
[Try it online!]: https://tio.run/nexus/silos#XU9dT8JQDH3fr7jcatay6OV224U7toVnHnxQ3vjIpiCSmKG4EIxjf30OIZrYNqfJadrT08A@00bJWBr1ePs@khiJKJpQJP5HhMz0AMMikDqQDqT@nRnpcFulYtEty7Jbe…

If anyone can get it to work feel free to post it (no need for cw)

ais523

@RohanJhunjhunwala adding extra text at the end is a bad idea, because several languages care about the last few characters specifically

in general, if a language uses # as comment, the long line (the second-last one) is the best place to put its code (because all the others are commented out)

but you need to find a way to split the language off from the other languages with similar syntax

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

oh, rip.

I was hoping that a language which just ignores the rest could work out well for this.

It worked on hexagony.

But broke perl

ais523

that would also break SMBF and 05AB1E

what sort of comment syntax does SILOS use? if it ignores most things it doesn't understand, you could try putting the print statement nearer the end of the long line

in general in polyglot-writing, you look for spots which few languages care about

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@ais523 the garbage at the beginning would cause the rest not to be parsed

It looks for a keyword at the beginning of each line

ais523

01:42

ah right

in that case, I think print 31 will necessarily break Python 3

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

It does explicitly support c or python style content

ais523

because Python 3 requires an open parenthesis after print

Qwerp-Derp

Hello hello!

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@ais523 i could stick it in a quote literal multiline

ais523

yep, that's the lines I'm thinking along

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

01:43

But it will most certainly break SMBF so there is no chance of this working xD

ais523

although doing that naively would break a number of other languages

it might be possible, but it wouldn't be easy

as for INTERCAL, I've experimented with it before

it's actually fairly easy to slip the INTERCAL code into the program due to a convenient parser bug in C-INTERCAL

the problem is, INTERCAL is really verbose, and it's hard to come within bytecount restrictions

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

s/bug/feature

Qwerp-Derp

@ais523 BTW, a block on hardcoding actually isn't hard

There are plenty of metagolf challenges that block hardcoding, check my "There can be only 1" challenge

ais523

I think that's mostly just due to people respecting the spirit of the challenge

Qwerp-Derp

That's true, but I should probably explicitly state it

Destructible Watermelon

01:46

@Qwerp-Derp could you help me with my koth some more?

Qwerp-Derp

And maybe add an addendum "Downvote all solutions that implement hard-coding, or seeds."

@DestructibleWatermelon What do you need help with

Destructible Watermelon

general stuff again

should flag holders be able to stab, for example

I'm thinking yes probably

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

my .02 dont worry too too much about closing loopholes. Bad posts get automagically downvoted

Geobits

I wish it worked that way.

Pavel

@DestructibleWatermelon Sure

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

01:48

people on this site generally respect the spirit of a challenge

*generally, sadly != always

Destructible Watermelon

Maze battle Koth

making a koth! Please halp

@Pavel @Qwerp-Derp

Qwerp-Derp

I found a -185 post on SO

What

Destructible Watermelon

was it to do with emacs?

Geobits

Must be an answer. The lowest question I see is at -67. Unless it's deleted I guess.

Qwerp-Derp

Actually it was -154

Whoops

-154

Q: Forcing a function to return if false

How can I create a loop that goes back to the beginning stage? My issue is here: int main(void) { midi_start(); program_change(1, 1); program_change(2, 1); t=400; printf("Choose a scale and write the code of it:\n "); printf("C:0\n "); printf("C#:1\n "); printf("...

c

The question is closed though

Geobits

01:59

Ah that's why it wouldn't show up then. Weird.

-67

Q: Javascript performance, conditional statement vs assignment operator

Is there any difference in performance between the conditional operator === and the assignment operator =? I am writing some pre-save hook middleware in mongoose and I am wondering if there is much of a speed difference between: UserSchema.pre('save', function (next) { if (!this.isModified(...

javascript performance

Qwerp-Derp

@Geobits How much rep do you have on SO?

Geobits

-67 and still open lol

Qwerp-Derp

That's the lowest one that isn't closed

Geobits

16,884 atm

I was just looking at the front page, sorted by votes, and went to the last page. I didn't run a search or anything.

Qwerp-Derp

Why couldn't you see the question then? I have 132 rep and I could see it

Also how do you have so much rep on SO

Where there are so many low-quality questions

Geobits

02:02

Some of it is residual. I've got over 400 answers there, but haven't been active in a few years. A bit of rep trickles in from them over time.

So it's just volume. I get about 35 rep/answer there. Most sites the ratio is much different.

Luis Mendo

@flawr Glad I could help! I should have gone to bed a while ago too :-)

Qwerp-Derp

stackoverflow.com/questions/41497798/…

This is the kind of low quality question I'm talking about

I have no idea what the heck he's asking

Geobits

Oh sure. There's a lot of them.

There are a bunch that are good enough to answer, though. They're just not as easy to find.

Or at least that's how it was 3-5 years ago. My last answer was in Feb 2014

Right around the time I joined here... >_>

The easiest way I found to get rep on SO, if that's your goal, was to answer everything you could (that isn't obviously bad).

You never know what's going to end up popular. My highest voted answer there isn't good at all (imo), but it seems good enough.

Also, votes there often come in over time, as people google their problems. It's much different than the (mostly) quick-spikes in rep you get here.

Qwerp-Derp

Most of the questions on SO are either Python or Javascript right?

Also I heard that the review queue is just overwhelmingly big

Geobits

@Geobits Well, mainly ones that don't have good answers already anyway.

Qwerp-Derp

02:15

Like a few thousand

Geobits

Yes the review queue was terrible when I was active anyway.

Qwerp-Derp

Compared to the one or two that occasionally pop up in PPCG.

Geobits

@Qwerp-Derp Any big language will have tons of questions. Java and C# are the other really big ones iirc.

@Qwerp-Derp Much easier to get the review badges there though :P

Qwerp-Derp

Clojure has like 1 or 2 questions every few days

Geobits

I said big language :P

Qwerp-Derp

02:16

Yeah IK, Clojure is tiny

But I'm just saying

Compared to Python's few thousand questions every day

Pavel

People who program in Clojure are generally really experienced.

Qwerp-Derp

I don't think I'm exaggerating there either

Pavel

Python is more used by noobs.

Qwerp-Derp

I just program in Clojure because I like the language and its good syntax

IMHO it's better than Racket and Common Lisp and stuff

And Scala

Clojure is general-purpose right?

What's Racket used for?

Pavel

People who use Clojure know what they're doing.

When was the last time you asked a question on SO?

Qwerp-Derp

02:23

About a year ago I think

And it was a very noob Python question

Geobits

I wish I could delete two of my four questions asked there :/

Qwerp-Derp

What do you personally use for small projects?

Python is my go-to, because it's easy to start up

Geobits

Java, but that's mainly because it's what I've been using day-to-day for the past 7ish years. I spend less time referring to docs in that than any other language atm.

I mainly used C/C++ before that for a few years

Pavel

If it's really small, python.

On TIO.

Geobits

And before that, various strands of basic.

Pavel

02:28

Anything more complicated and I'll use java

Qwerp-Derp

If it's really big, I look for a tool tailor-made to fit it. So if it's a language that I'm making, I might use PegJS.

And therefore Javascript + Node.

For GUI stuff it's probably going to be Processing.

And if it's really really small, like say a challenge about sequences on PPCG, I use Clojure.

Pavel

For GUI stuff I use Python Card

Dennis

@ConorO'Brien Please ping me when/if you write an explanation for your J answer.

Conor O'Brien

@Dennis okay, will do :)

Qwerp-Derp

How do you get Epiphany?

Geobits

02:40

Do basically anything today.

I've gotten it on three sites, but haven't posted a question/answer to any of them.

I believe voting and/or commenting is enough.

Conor O'Brien

@Dennis added explanation

Dennis

That's amazing. Nice work.

Conor O'Brien

02:56

thanks :D

quartata

03:46

Don't know if anyone browses MSE but Shog linked to our election room election night transcript as an example of polite political discussion. Lulz.

Conor O'Brien

link?

El'endia Starman

@quartata Compared to most political discourse, that was quite polite.

quartata

Mobile but it's not hard to find. Check The Bridge or MSE front page

@El'endiaStarman Yeah, there was only one flag!

Pretty good by my admittedly low standards.

El'endia Starman

41

Q: If you're gonna talk Politics, you must respect those who disagree

This is sort of a follow-up to two past discussions: Toward a philosophy of Chat Does the Be Nice policy require SE users to "be nice" to people who are not SE users (e.g. public figures)? Over the past year, there's been an uptick in discussions of politics in chat. JUST LOOK AT THIS CHART! ...

discussion featured chat etiquette

quartata

I'm just happy I've been immortalized in MSE

Conor O'Brien

03:49

@El'endiaStarman ah, thanks

El'endia Starman

@quartata This is your first message in that chat transcript:

in Election 2016!, Nov 8 '16 at 23:54, by quartata

Why are you guys worrying about the vegetables the real fight is in the fruit senate

Quite a thing to be immortalized in connection with. :P

quartata

Awkward.

I say more interesting things later on >_<

Plus fruit comedy is gold

Geobits

in Election 2016!, Nov 8 '16 at 23:39, by Geobits

I want a bag of money.

Still true

H Walters

@El'endiaStarman That's quite an imperative question there

Conor O'Brien

This was mine, I'm pretty proud of it:

in Election 2016!, Nov 8 '16 at 23:33, by Conor O'Brien

Welcome to the US 2016 Apocalypse!

Nathan Merrill

03:56

just found out about king of the hill chess

El'endia Starman

Of all the messages I contributed to the election discussion, this is probably my favorite. (Linked because it only makes sense in context.)

Nathan Merrill

apparently its standard chess, but you also instantly win if your king makes it to one of the center 4 squares

Conor O'Brien

@NathanMerrill that sounds like awesome

El'endia Starman

@HWalters Meta.Christianity has a pretty exclamatory question.

quartata

@Geobits #sitharepeopletoo

What a quality meta comment.

Geobits

04:02

I just liked the irony of "respect other people/groups" paired with "don't be them though".

quartata

Exactly. That's what made it perfect

Nathan Merrill

62

Q: Why was Apocalyptic Defense closed?

That was really disappointing. If this whole Stack Exchange thing is going to be community-driven, then one and only one rule should apply to site proposals: if one of them can fulfill the requirements and clearly show a good community would follow it, then it should be opened, no matter how sil...

discussion area51 close-reasons site-proposal

quartata

That kind of got folded into World Building

Geobits

Yep. Rebranding works :D

mınxomaτ

Running full ubuntu on an SD card: dmitry.gr/…

Geobits

04:07

> How would people survive X event in this world I'm making?

You just have to add the magic phrase.

H Walters

Regarding politics, this looks troubling

Geobits

Oh wow. Each degree handed out costs four suicides. That's impressive.

mınxomaτ

Maybe these states require a thesis as background checks.

Nathan Merrill

tylervigen.com/view_correlation?id=28655

this even has a cause and effect: more people making money causes more people to go to sea world

Geobits

A third-party effect, anyway... the whole recession thing happened then... it's no wonder both luxury items took a hit.

Besides, clearly poli-sci majors have to drive people to suicide as part of their coursework. I'd say the cause/effect is stronger there.

Nathan Merrill

04:18

and guess who uses the most uranium:

tylervigen.com/view_correlation?id=8423

aeronautical engineers

Downgoat

@Pavel thank you for not using python to write OS :P

quartata

Hmmm....

Pavel

Python for small scripts and GUIs, Java for everything else.

quartata

That might be feasible with ctypes and enough assembly glue. Lemme think about it for a bit.

Downgoat

Speaking of languages, I saw a really cool feature called "indirect" enums which seems really cool useful but I can't think of any practical use that can't be solved with structs&unions :/

Nathan Merrill

04:20

@Downgoat swift?

Geobits

@quartata I just hope it keeps up. So far, all five comments are sith-related.

Downgoat

@NathanMerrill yeah

Nathan Merrill

I don't get it. It looks like they are elevating enums to a class

which, you know, defeats the purpose of an enum

H Walters

@NathanMerrill How? (And who?)

Downgoat

If it's the foo(a,b,c) stuff, it's actually a tuple with types a b and c rather than a prototype

Nathan Merrill

04:23

11

A: indirect enums and structs

The indirect keyword introduces reference semantics. You indicate that an enumeration case is recursive by writing indirect before it, which tells the compiler to insert the necessary layer of indirection. From here The important part of structs and enums is that they're a constant size. A...

Downgoat

However in cheddar I think enums should really be like a group of symbols, rather than glorified namespace

Nathan Merrill

I've never programmed in swift, but it seems like their enums are too complicated

I think that Java enums are too complicated. The only think I like about them is that you can declare constant values to attach to them

Geobits

enum ArithmeticExpression {
    case number(Int)
    indirect case addition(ArithmeticExpression, ArithmeticExpression)
    indirect case multiplication(ArithmeticExpression, ArithmeticExpression)
}

That is so... weird.

Downgoat

@Geobits oh pls. Indirect the whole enum in this case

Will look much better

Geobits

Or, ya know, make it a class.

Nathan Merrill

04:25

like, I frequently have a Direction enum, so I do Up(-1,0), Left(0,-1), Down(1,0), Right(0,1)

Downgoat

@Geobits this is primarially for storing just data. A class for something like an AST is overkill but an enum is the better choice

Though swift hasn't really cached on for mainstream development imo :(

Geobits

The example they use it for is clearly not just for data storage:

func evaluate(_ expression: ArithmeticExpression) -> Int {
    switch expression {
    case let .number(value):
        return value
    case let .addition(left, right):
        return evaluate(left) + evaluate(right)
    case let .multiplication(left, right):
        return evaluate(left) * evaluate(right)
    }
}

print(evaluate(product))

Downgoat

Why not?

H Walters

I assume labels in switches require integral constant values here?

Downgoat

A class doesn't seem right because in that case you'll probably have an enum anyway for which operation

Geobits

04:28

Doing it all in an enum seems like stretching the point of enums in the first place.

Downgoat

I thought the same at first but if you really think about it it seems like best solution

and yay I convinced myself :D

H Walters

Seems to allow a more controlled bitmask enumeration definition

Nathan Merrill

enums are not for data storage

they are for readable flags, and iterable options

Downgoat

That is true

Nathan Merrill

I don't see how recursive enums helps you in either of those goals

in fact, how does recursion work?

like, is there a values() function for a enum type?

what happens if I do ArithmeticExpression.values()?

Downgoat

04:31

Yes .rawValues I think

not sure

Nathan Merrill

its it going to give me a generator that infinitely recurses down the addition case?

Downgoat

swift-studies.com/blog/2014/6/10/enumerating-enums-in-swift :/ apparently not great native support

Geobits

Oh geez. That can't be right. Surely...?

Nathan Merrill

the argument in that article falls flat

there's exactly one way to order an enum: the way you list it

Downgoat

Also IIRC you can get all items of an unordered set in swift

H Walters

04:36

That sounds inflexible

Do you mean if I have an enum {bottomleft,topleft,bottomright,topright}, then necessarily this means bottomleft < topright?

quartata

More likely it's because the enum isn't available at run time.

Nathan Merrill

@HWalters oh, I'm not saying it implements comparable

but that when you iterate through it, bottom left comes first

Geobits

Right. You can sort them however you want if you need to, but saying there's no possible ordering to iterate them in by default is insane.

Downgoat

@quartata There is a MyEnum(rawValue:) constructor which takes a index of a enum key and returns an enum object so that can't be the case

quartata

Maybe they just haven't done it yet then? :P

Geobits

04:42

They should get on that. Swiftly.

Downgoat

They do not get break, I am a young goat who can make entire cheese in 1.5year and 100s of smart experienced highly paid dev cannot implement basic feature in like 3 years

H Walters

Okay not knowing Swift... is each defined enumeration in Swift closed for modification, or are they extendable?

Nathan Merrill

each what?

Geobits

@Downgoat What do you mean by "they do not get break" ?

Nathan Merrill

or the function "each"?

H Walters

04:44

Each named enumeration

Downgoat

You can extend for..in loops f that's what you mean

@Geobits I mean they should use do..while so they don't need to use break statement :P

Geobits

Yeah... I was just about to delete that after realizing I read it completely wrong >_>

Nathan Merrill

@HWalters so if you can add another value to an enum?

Downgoat

@HWalters depends what you mean by extendable, like inheritance?

H Walters

No, because that would fail my devils advocate argument...

Downgoat

04:46

@Geobits oh... I thought you were making another pun

H Walters

Like, say, a namespace in C++ is open for extension

Geobits

@Downgoat Not on porpoise this time.

Downgoat

@HWalters so like extension statement?

H Walters

Not sure I care about the semantics (of extending per se)... imagine enum Color {red, green, blue}; enum Color {yellow, violet}; together to mean that there are five colors

DJMcMayhem

I like the newly featured Mother meta post

Geobits

04:49

That seems like it would be prone to accidents.

H Walters

Typically you're list is your list; once you define your enumerators it's complete, but this isn't necessarily the case

Geobits: Probably would be... but it's a possible language design

Geobits

I could see something like Color.addCase(yellow) being a sensible alternative though.

Downgoat

@HWalters You want a Set not an Enumeration then since that kinda defeats the point of being able to enumerate all cases

Nathan Merrill

the biggest problem with adding stuff to an enumeration is switch statements

Geobits

Nah, just default everything :P

H Walters

04:51

@Downgoat This isn't necessarily a set; a set may be a collection of objects. Enumerators would be a collection of literals.

Nathan Merrill

I hate the fact that IntelliJ (and probably Java) throws a warning at me if I don't have a default on a switch statement when I've covered all of the enum cases

Geobits

That's probably customizable. Eclipse doesn't yell at me for that, anyway.

Downgoat

@HWalters a set of strings?

Nathan Merrill

I believe its "all or nothing"

like, never yell at me for not having a default

or do it

H Walters

Downgoat strings are objects

Downgoat

04:53

Sets only really work properly on literal anyway

@HWalters eh in swift liberals are the same as primitive which are all objects anyway

Geobits

@NathanMerrill Weird. Because if you haven't covered them all, it definitely should, since it won't compile anyway. It shouldn't even be a warning in that case.

Downgoat

In Java string is object but not on swift in the same sense

Nathan Merrill

@HWalters the problem with this, is that you have to import the class extending the enum. What happens if I don't import the class? will I only iterate through the 3 colors, or is there a "magic" import that occurs?

@Geobits wait, if you don't have a default, it still compiles

yes?

Geobits

Iff you've covered all cases, it should.

Downgoat

If you've covered all cases

H Walters

04:55

@NathanMerrill That would depend on the overall "linkage model"

Downgoat

Question: If I say "ninja" it'll count as noise. If I delete messages mods will get mad, what to do?

Geobits

@Downgoat You don't need to say anything. We all know you got ninja'd :P

Downgoat

D:

Nathan Merrill

I have intelliJ open, and it isn't underlining:

H Walters

I could conceive of a language that would iterate all five (in which case, all you really even need is something equivalent to a forward declaration); and another that would iterate only the three (the compile-to-object model ala C would suggest this)

Nathan Merrill

04:56

enum A{
        a,b,c
    }
    public void test() {
        A a = A.a;
        switch (a){
            case a:
                break;
        }
    }

@HWalters right, but the problem with the forward-imports is that if you import a package, they could completely modify a bunch of enums without you knowing about it

I'm pretty sure that default isn't needed to compile ever

H Walters

Problem or feature

Nathan Merrill

problem.

Downgoat

@NathanMerrill :O CS teacher say to always use static if you don't use this

Nathan Merrill

@Downgoat I wouldn't say always, and technically, you don't need this to access member variables

Downgoat

I mean technically you're using this, just implicitly :P

H Walters

05:00

Nathan I'm not asking you if it's a problem or a feature. I'm telling you that it would require coding differently and could be exploited to do something useful

Nathan Merrill

doesn't change the fact that its a problem :P

actually, looking at the class I'm editing, I actually have a function that I wouldn't make static even though I could

but it uses the generic type of the class

so, it'd make everything more complicated to write

Geobits

@NathanMerrill Huh, that's odd. I could have sworn it did, but mine acts the same way.

Nathan Merrill

the thing about a Color enum, is that its not a generic "this is all possible colors". You could use it for the pixel color, because there are only three (RGB). However, if you wanted to add "Yellow" (because some displays now have yellow), you really should make a new enum, because you're dealing with a new type of display. Old displays shouldn't ever deal with the case of "Yellow"

and so, I really don't think there's ever a good use case for adding in more enums.

Downgoat

Poll: what would you say is least used? Switch or Do-While

Nathan Merrill

do while

H Walters

05:07

If your operating system has a long list of error codes supported for a generic HAL, it should make new enums when it adds more error codes?

Geobits

Ideally the updated enum would be in the same update that added the new error codes.

Not a new enum.

Nathan Merrill

right. if you are in control of the enum, by all means, make a breaking change to update it. But don't allow a 3rd party to come in and add their own error codes

Anonymous

05:35

@Downgoat Do-while

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