The Nineteenth Byte

Qwerp-Derp

05:00

But how will it process the print("Hello, World!") bit

Destructible Watermelon

it doesn't

Qwerp-Derp

What how

Destructible Watermelon

it just does the task if the hash is right

polyglotting with python

Dennis

Did you look at my "interpreter"? If you run it, the following happens:

$ python3 mython.py
print('Hello, World!')
curses
$ python3 mython.py
print('Hello, World!') # haha, you won't be able to print Hello World
Hello, World!

Qwerp-Derp

Then that's a program

But then that's the solution isn't it?

A polyglot of both

So it's cracked

Destructible Watermelon

05:01

but it isn't actually a puzzle. It's just a lame hash instead of a programming challenge

Qwerp-Derp

And besides, the author has to post the full interpreter anyway

It'll get cracked

Destructible Watermelon

You can't reverse a hash without bruteforce

Dennis

It won't. Look at the interpreter. It contains no hint whatsoever that you have to add a # haha, you won't be able to print Hello World comment.

Destructible Watermelon

the interpreter doesn't have print('Hello, World!') # haha, you won't be able to print Hello World in it, it has the hash of print('Hello, World!') # haha, you won't be able to print Hello World

Qwerp-Derp

Oh

Should I just ban hashes then?

xnor

05:03

I'm actually having trouble imagining what an interesting, successful cop would look like. If you rule out the "cheap" solutions, what can be done?

Destructible Watermelon

making a programming language with restricted source?

Steven H.

Turing tarpits

Destructible Watermelon

like woefully?

Dennis

Even in Turing tarpits, printing hello world is usually easy.

Geobits

Huh, I just got a silver code golf badge :D

3

xnor

05:05

i thought the challenge wasn't meant to be about coding in a tarpit, but about designing a polyglot-proof language

we already have a CnR about coding in inconvenient languages

Qwerp-Derp

Are there even any good answers to this?

This CnR seems like a good idea, I don't want to ditch it...

Ashwin Gupta

@HelkaHomba Ok hold on giving that a go right now.

DLosc

@Qwerp-Derp What xnor said. My thought after reading the challenge proposal is, I would make a language where it's super hard just to write a Hello World program at all.

Qwerp-Derp

Hmm

Argh I don't even know what to do anymore

betseg

05:21

Morning

@DestructibleWatermelon i feel like a...i don't know. What is my program supposed to do if the first input is 0? ;_;

Ashwin Gupta

@HelkaHomba ok I found out the problem. I'm stupid.

1

A: Why are my defined strings printing to the console as undefined?

Well, in your example above, you've incremented z (which I assume was defined earlier somewhere?) after setting the value on your array. So when setting the value on the array, you've set it to complete[5] (or whatever) but you're logging complete[6] which is most likely outside the range of your...

Helka Homba

CMC: Say a 4 letter standard English word that is very uncommon in everyday vernacular. e.g. "aver"

2

DLosc

Do archaic words count? "Hath"

Ashwin Gupta

fun fact: a vernacular region is a region that exists due to people's cultural identity.

Helka Homba

@DLosc Decent

Ashwin Gupta

05:26

please don't ask me why I know that. It really makes me regret my course selections at the start of this year.

Helka Homba

@AshwinGupta Ah. My advice was plainly barking up the wrong tree, sorry :s

Ashwin Gupta

Nah its fine, it was closer then I was.

Besides, you were right that it was an issue with my counter variable.

DLosc

@HelkaHomba What exactly do you mean by "standard"? If it's on Wiktionary, does it count?

Because my next answer is: Euoi!

Ashwin Gupta

now this whole incident has brought one interesting thing to my attention. Why the hell does encodeURIComponent() make 'undefined' into random chinese characters...?

Helka Homba

@DLosc let's say it should be on merriam-webster.com/dictionary and not a proper noun

Dennis

05:32

kith

DLosc

scop

Helka Homba

whit

DLosc

(Also, found coincidentally by misspelling the above: skep. Non-competing, since it's not a word I knew previously.)

hoar

pone

Dennis

I use euoi all the time. :P

Helka Homba

veld

DLosc

05:41

@Dennis You're a Bacchic reveler, then?

ASCII-only

@HelkaHomba Define very uncommon

DLosc

ruth

Dennis

@DLosc Jelly programmer. Handy way to get four vowels. :P

DLosc

Ah, that's right. I knew I'd seen it somewhere lately.

mewl

merl

Destructible Watermelon

@betseg print the setup of your six square side of the board

(also note that if you use a weird programming language in which it is easier for two other inputs, or it is impossible to use one and zero for some reason, you can pick two other inputs)

DLosc

05:54

eyre is a word, though it doesn't mean what I thought it did :P

Helka Homba

Any 4 letter words with 3 of one letter?

Steven H.

Very few people use egal, although most people use egalitarian.

betseg

My six? My four pieces will be placed randomly at six squares?

Steven H.

Lull

Destructible Watermelon

@betseg not randomly; you choose where to place them

Helka Homba

05:58

@StevenH. ooh, nice!

Steven H.

Apparently loll as well, since I had to check my spelling

betseg

@DestructibleWatermelon i mean, i can place them in first four or first six?

Destructible Watermelon

first six

you output six chars, spaces for empty squares

start of my bot

if input()=="0":
    print("q  saf")

Steven H.

And don't forget sass

betseg

Oh i get it now

Steven H.

06:00

or siss

DLosc

epee

betseg

After that you will input full 15 square board right?

Destructible Watermelon

@DLosc wait that's a word

Steven H.

Actually all the vowels for s_ss work, although siss and soss are only in the unabridged dictionary

DLosc

Technically it's épée.

Destructible Watermelon

06:02

@StevenH. sess?

DLosc

syss? :P

Steven H.

Sess apparently is accepted as a synonym for session

I didn't count the quasivowel :/

Destructible Watermelon

weee

ASCII-only

Bibb (unabridged), dodd (legal case)

Steven H.

It's spelled Whee @DestructibleWatermelon

Destructible Watermelon

06:06

shh

shhh

1000000000

qaid

qats

ASCII-only

(clot factor) VIII/(Alfonso) XIII are also accepted by Merriam-Webster, but they aren't words

DLosc

@1000000000 qoph

Wheat Wizard

I have a 3 letter one, "ere"

Steven H.

I've used ere more than once ;P

Wheat Wizard

06:09

I've only heard it used in "Able was I ere I saw Elba"

Steven H.

Ah, I used it in English classes. We'd have to write poetry, and I abused ere to great extent.

Wheat Wizard

I like "woad"

Steven H.

Woad sounds like it came out of Jabberwocky

`Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
  Did gyre and gimble in the woad;
All mimsy were the borogoves,
  And the mome raths outgrode.

DLosc

(Also beth, heth, teth, yodh, kaph, ayin, and resh for good measure.)

ASCII-only

@StevenH. Ctrl+K

Steven H.

06:14

fixed

DLosc

talc

Steven H.

If the CMC was for uncommonly used four letter words, I would have said calc as a joke.

DLosc

calx (no joke)

tuns

Steven H.

kepi

gaby

DLosc

Wow, those are new ones on me.

Steven H.

06:22

You've heard of yoga, of course; have you heard of yuga?

ASCII-only

All of them (there are a lot of common words, but all uncommon words shoul be there): onelook.com/?w=????&scwo=1&sswo=1

DLosc

This probably is more common to people here than to the average population: baud

ASCII-only

@DLosc I don't know it, but I've seen it in Python's curses module documentation

DLosc

yurt is always a fun one (though I have heard it used in a sentence)

bate (not to be confused with bait)

trow

ASCII-only

IDK if craw counts

Wheat Wizard

06:37

ort

DLosc

@ASCII-only I'm pretty sure I've heard people say "sticks in my craw" in conversation.

@WheatWizard You can pluralize it and it'll be four letters, too.

ASCII-only

@DLosc But it might still qualify as very uncommon, depending on how often you hear it

Wheat Wizard

@DLosc I think ort is a material noun. I'm not sure if it can be made plural

DLosc

@WheatWizard I've always seen it in the plural form. (Synonym for "scrap," which is also commonly pluralized.)

Wheat Wizard

moor

DLosc

06:48

Could be common depending on where you live.

Steven H.

Dyke could also be common depending on where you live.

Here in California, it's quite rare.

DLosc

That reminds me: dyne

Steven H.

No relation to dine, I suppose?

(I'm hungry :( )

DLosc

Nope

dirk

Steven H.

spae

Salp

caul

DLosc

07:00

I see your spae and raise you a brae

Steven H.

I see your brae and raise you a dray

DLosc

I see your dray and raise you a shay

Steven H.

I see your shay and raise you a trey

DLosc

I see your trey and raise you a bey. (Wait, that's not four letters. How about beys, then?)

Destructible Watermelon

yo

Steven H.

07:19

You ruined it, watermelon. How could you :(

Destructible Watermelon

:V

betseg

This is totally golf, right?

Destructible Watermelon

?

betseg

4 letter words

Steven H.

Uncommon 4-letter words

Golf is common

CMC: write a quine that will format itself to be copy-pasted into Markup

Destructible Watermelon

07:28

?

wat

Steven H.

Wraps the output in either `` for a single-line solution or prepending each line with four spaces

Destructible Watermelon

thats markdown...

hellotest``

Steven H.

names .-.

Destructible Watermelon

that doesn't work...

`` i ``

Steven H.

i

i = `i`

`` i ``

for a program like that you'd have to prepend the spaces

Self-modifying BF:

....[.>]\0

\0 is the literal null byte

Markdown doesn't work properly in this chat ._>

ASCII-only

07:33

@StevenH. It does

Destructible Watermelon

_='    _=%r;print(_%%_)';print(_%_)

ASCII-only

What are you trying to do

Destructible Watermelon

not sure if that should count with or without a newline

Steven H.

Fixed-space font with space as the first character

 ....[.>]\0
Let's see if this works

Hallelujah

ASCII-only

@StevenH. Assuming it's the multiline message, it's either all code or not code at all

Steven H.

07:35

Ah

ASCII-only

08:09

TIL there's a programming book with Conor in it

New Main Posts

08:37

2

Q: Let's do the Wave!

Input: A string (the wave-snippet) with a length >= 2. A positive integer n >= 1. Output: We output a single-line wave. We do this by repeating the input string n times. Challenge rules: If the first and last character of the input string matches, we only output it once in the total outpu...

GLASSIC

Poll: Have you ever made a homebrew computer? What was the most complicated part?

mınxomaτ

@GLASSIC From what level? Individual transistors? Logic gate ICs? etc.

GLASSIC

@mınxomaτ well, a computer with proper input-output & programming facilities is count as a full computer, if it's not less than

mınxomaτ

That doesn't answer my question.

GLASSIC

@mınxomaτ any level , even if it's mechanical

mınxomaτ

08:48

Well, out of ICs with a very simple VGA controller. The most complicated part was actually getting a program on and of it, and debugging of course.

Similar to this: youtube.com/view_play_list?p=75A1967B78B0D5A4, but much simpler.

GLASSIC

Well, I'm planning to make (or better, simulate) one with few AVRs and some other things with a serial port i/o

Fatalize

09:34

This "Salaries calculator" thing that SO put out is complete garbage

ASCII-only

@Fatalize What

Fatalize

@ASCII-only this

ASCII-only

@Fatalize Why

Fatalize

A developer with 0 years of experience and 0 points in skill would earn according to their thing 68k in France per year

That's more than twice the average salary for that

mınxomaτ

@Fatalize Not the developer on it's own. The developer working for StackOverflow.

Or do you have an accurate salary overview for StackOverflow in/from France?

Fatalize

09:45

There is still no way this is the right number

mınxomaτ

Sure there is.

Fatalize

this is the starting salary of a general practitioner

if that number was real everyone would apply to SO

mınxomaτ

@Fatalize I'm sure they receive a massive number of applications. Just like any other company that pays good.

Fatalize

I work in a big company that pays good

mınxomaτ

Apparently not as good as SO.

Fatalize

09:47

They pay nowhere near as good as this, and it is a much richer company

mınxomaτ

If you have any doubts, just ask SO directly before calling the calculator "garbage".

Fatalize

blog.stackoverflow.com/2016/10/international-salaries/?cb=1

I'm not really the only one noting that it's garbage

besides the US it seems to completely overestimate salaries

mınxomaτ

> “remote developer market” rate, i.e. the salary you would get if you were paid by a US company in USD.

If you apply from Europe, you will probably be working remote.

Fatalize

I don't see how that changes the fact that those numbers are completely unrealistic

mınxomaτ

@Fatalize Really? Then read the quote again.

Fatalize

09:51

The quote says that those numbers are meaningless

ASCII-only

@Fatalize What quote

@Fatalize The one minxomat posted? SO is a US company, you know

Fatalize

And? They wouldn't pay an american developer with 0 years experience 350k

I don't see why they ever would pay a non-american with 0 years 3 times the average salary in their country

Makes no sense

ASCII-only

@Fatalize 350k?

Qwerp-Derp

10:10

Stack Overflow is just a pile of complete and utter crap

Most of the questions are badly formatted, and some of them have extremely broken English and punctuation that I can't understand what's going on

Most answers don't explain what's going on

Steven H.

Fortunately, that legacy does not extend to all other Stack Exchange websites. PPCG has always been consistently high-quality (at least, since I've been around) and I can only point to a few people that have not consistently made being here a great experience.

ASCII-only

@Qwerp-Derp i.e. Most answers are "Use jQuery"

Qwerp-Derp

lol

PPCG is really high quality.

ASCII-only

@StevenH. Yeah, because it's hard to make a good challenge and solution, the bad ones get deleted almost instantly

Steven H.

Java question? Use jQuery! Coding in BF? Use jQuery! Coding in Python? Use ~~numpy~~ jQuery!

Help how do I do strikethroughs with this Markdown

mınxomaτ

10:16

~~test~~

Three dashes (---test---)

Steven H.

There we go

thank ye

Qwerp-Derp

What does gmtime do (time module)?

Augh it's one big paragraph of text

0

Q: strange css position right:0 issue

I have the following code that works for the most part. However not always. I have fiddled with it quite a lot to try get it working with no avail. the issue seems to be intermittent however it definitely reproducible. What this code tries to do is reposition the .menu div to the right or left of...

javascript jquery html css

I can't even read it properly

It's not even a Stack Snippet!!!

Is anyone on?

ASCII-only

@Qwerp-Derp What

Qwerp-Derp

10:36

Flag doesn't work for me

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΟΗʹ

11:36

Anyone know of a good free XML editor for Windows?

Mainly looking for querying support

Microsoft's XML Notepad 2007 is choking on this 41.47MB file :/

(frankly, I'm surprised it even works on Win10)

mınxomaτ

Did you try any other? XML.com has a list: xml.com/pub/rg/XML_Editors

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΟΗʹ

11:52

Yeah, I checked that, but most of those have just 30-day trial periods

mınxomaτ

Oracle has a free one, but that seems a bit bloated to me: sourceforge.net/projects/camprocessor/?source=recommended

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΟΗʹ

Oh well, Microsoft's just stopped choking

Now it's just giving me a bunch of XSL errors, which is fine

Oh no, it died again when I set the find mode to XPath

Lemme try something else

EditiX Lite perhaps?

mınxomaτ

Isn't that paid?

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΟΗʹ

Nope, it seems the Lite version was removed

mınxomaτ

XMLCE is probably the most popular option, but I don't think it has query support.

ΛεγίωνΜάμμαλϠΟΗʹ

11:57

Ima try Oracle's

Anonymous

13:00

I'm a Yearling! :D

quartata

Got mine a couple weeks ago too. I'm a little depressed that I've wasted a year here

Fatalize

400th commit in Brachylog, jeez

Geobits

@quartata Well thanks. I won't mention that I have two then >_>

Anonymous

@Geobits Wow what a loser /s

quartata

Phi has wasted like 5

Geobits

13:09

@Mego Pfft. Says the bird who can't fly.

Anonymous

@Geobits ;_;

Anonymous

Peter has wasted nearly 6, mostly in the Sandbox :P

quartata

Can downvotes levitate?

If not I wouldn't be calling anyone out on not being able to fly ya hypocrite

Anonymous

They hover over people's heads and rapidly descend

quartata

Oh wow

Anonymous

13:12

It's actually quite dangerous to get downvoted. Many lives have been lost to Geobits's voting habits.

Geobits

@quartata 1) Yes, the downvote button has an 'onhover' action, so that answers that 2) Flying is like the main thing birds are known for. A better question would be if I downvote ~~people~~ posts. Which I do.

trichoplax

Can we get a query for "People Geobits hasn't downvoted"?

Geobits

0 results returned

Fatalize

^ 0 results

TimmyD

You've downvoted me? /sad

trichoplax

13:15

Wow. I thought that would take 6-8 weeks

Geobits

@TimmyD Honestly, no idea. I don't pay attention to names much when doing that :P

Anonymous

I downvote garbage. If you've posted garbage, I've downvoted you.

quartata

That's me

Geobits

Anonymous

@Geobits I'm still working on trying to solve your Tetris scrambled code, that I first started working on a year ago

Geobits

13:17

@Mego Good luck. I tried after a couple weeks and had a really hard time, even remembering the general structure.

TimmyD

I've only posted one garbage answer, on Helka's "print the character without using the character" challenge, because I completely misunderstood when I was rushing to finish an answer before walking out the door.

Anonymous

I got maybe 10 pieces placed

Anonymous

@TimmyD I remember downvoting that one

TimmyD

Yeah. That one deserved it.

confusedandamused

Morning everyone :)

quartata

13:19

80-90% of my posts are crap, you've probably downvoted a few here and there

assuming you're doing your downvoting job correctly

@confusedandamused I noticed you've stopped saying how is everyone

Fatalize

@Mego I gave up after placing the first two lines

quartata

We seem to be very good at conditioning people by overusing jokes

confusedandamused

Well - how are you @quartata? Some people didn't reply previously so I changed it up a bit.

quartata

Confused and bemused

confusedandamused

figured as such

Geobits

13:22

I'm not entirely sure I could put it together now without looking at my cheatsheet >_>

quartata

yeah

Fatalize

TIL bemused

which has nothing to do with amused for some reason

Geobits

It does in one of its meanings: to cause to have feelings of wry or tolerant amusement

Fatalize

TIL wry

useful word

Geobits

Like the feeling of watching a toddler try to punch a large man into submission (bemused, not wry)

betseg

13:24

@Geobits have you downvoted this?

I think this is my only downvoted thing

Geobits

I don't think I've ever even seen it.

Would you like me to?

Fatalize

But now that he has though…

betseg

Lol

@Geobits nuuuuuu

Geobits

It always amuses me when people link me to their downvoted posts. So... like this is one of your worst-accepted posts, and you show it to the guy known for downvoting?

betseg

Actually it's the most upvoted

Has downvotes too

Geobits

13:28

I assumed your 33-score answer was the most upvoted.

betseg

Ah true, this is the second

Poke

@Geobits Very surprised no one mentioned jodatime or a simple date format

Geobits

Yeah... I wrote it quickly as a throwaway answer. If I'd known it would become my highest voted on SO I might have done more answers like that. Showing one simple method and ignoring all other (usually better) methods.

I mean, it's not even close. It's over double my next highest :/

Hell, at that point I was still learning Java. I didn't even know about half the ways to play with time/dates.

TimmyD

It's because you introduced a multitude of people to the miraculous % operator.

Geobits

Haha, that must be it. It couldn't be String.format, because that wasn't in the answer until it was three years old and had 50+ score already :P

Poke

13:41

well to be fair java date api sucks until java 8

so what you have there isn't terrible

Steven H.

I've received one downvote overall during my time here, and that was for a pure literal quine as a reward for me not looking up the definition of quine...

Poke

and it's simple to do

Geobits

@Poke I haven't really noticed a difference in votes since I had it as timeString = hours + ":" + minutes + ":" + seconds;, which is objectively terrible.

TimmyD

This is a really neat answer to a somewhat-poorly-constructed question

10

A: What is the most befitting place to drop 'H'itler bomb to score decisive victory in 1945?

The answers already given illuminate the military aspect perfectly and nothing can be added to especially Schwerns post. However, I see one more shot that Hitler could have and that is using the bomb as part of a plot to turn the USA and Russia against each other. This assumes that Russian espi...

Poke

@Geobits At least you didn't mix string concatenation methods? :]

StringBuilder b = new StringBuilder(value + value2);

quality

Geobits

13:59

new StringBuilder(String.format("%02d:%02d", hours, minutes) + ":" + seconds).toString();

Anonymous

@Geobits -1 not enough Factory pattern

Geobits

I guess I should have broken it up a bit more and used append() a couple times, too.

betseg

sprintf(string, "%02d:%02d", hours, mins);

C^

Geobits

Yeah, you can do the same in Java, except it's String.format( instead of sprintf(string,

Please don't take the nonsense above as a practical or useful example :P

Poke

^ for everyone's sake

betseg

14:06

@Geobits the string there means write the result to char *string

Geobits

I know. I knew C before Java ;)

I've forgotten a lot, but the basics are still there.

betseg

I thought that you thought that string meant do a string

Related‌.

Geobits

That question is awkward. Why can't I just love that I hate it?

Poke

You ever just want to punch someone who says "PIN number" or "ATM machine" etc?

2

Fatalize

@Dennis Could you please pull Brachylog?

Poke

14:09

just got an email with "pin code" which is close enough :|

betseg

@Poke Yes.

Geobits

Nope. "ATM machine" is a bit annoying, but punching? You risk getting an RSI injury ;)

Poke

I...

Anonymous

@Geobits eye twitches

Poke

#triggered

betseg

14:10

:|

Geobits

Well, that worked as expected then.

betseg

downvotes every single answer of @Geobits

and doesn't work, got a cooldown

Geobits

Ok, but fair warning: I can do the same to you, and the devs turned off the serial downvoting script for me :P

Anonymous

They also let him see who stars stuff

Geobits

"Service to the community" or some such wording.

TimmyD

14:15

> ~~"Service to the community"~~ "Please stop downvoting us"

Anonymous

@TimmyD Same thing

Dennis

14:27

@Fatalize Done.

@Downgoat Done.

Fatalize

@Dennis Danke

confusedandamused

15:39

If you need a list of strings in c# is it better to use an array of strings or a list of strings?

Poke

"If you need a list ... is it better to use [something that isn't a list] or a list ..."

>.>

Geobits

I think the "best practice" answer would be to almost always use a List, unless you're seriously micro-optimizing.

Not that I always follow that advice, but that's what I hear most often.

Poke

A List class is almost certainly using an array under the hood

Geobits

Especially if it's an ArrayList ;)

Anonymous

@Poke You would be correct

DJMcMayhem

15:49

Wow. My infosec answer is now my highest rated answer of all-time.

TimmyD

90

A: Array versus List<T>: When to use which?

Really just answering to add a link which I'm surprised hasn't been mentioned yet: Eric's Lippert's blog entry on "Arrays considered somewhat harmful." You can judge from the title that it's suggesting using collections wherever practical - but as Marc rightly points out, there are plenty of pla...

Meant to share that one, from Jon Skeet instead.

DJMcMayhem

0_0 he changed his avatar

TimmyD

2 days ago, by Martin Ender

How to save the princess in 8 programming languages

DJMcMayhem

Oh, that's funny. I saw that, but I didn't recognize Jon from it

Transcript for